Rumor/Speculation: Market speculates that Sony could buy Take Two (SEE UPDATE IN OP)

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IIFloodyII

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Oct 26, 2017
10,892
Im amazed the thread hasn't been locked yet. This whole rumor, interesting or not, feels like it's based just off of a single assumption or thought. Even if it's cool or major news in the future and the rumor somehow ends up being right, it kind of just feels like this thread is talking in circles
The MS buying EA one was based of literally wishful thinking and it didn't get locked, so nothing new.
 

Jon God

Member
Oct 28, 2017
287
As a PS4 gamer.

Don't do this. Spend more money on making new games, rather than buying existing studios. I don't really see any benefit in this for me.
 

BradGrenz

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,024
This particular rumour isn’t happening, but to look at this a little more generally, Sony beyond gaming is not about keeping its content to its own platforms or formats any more. The whole motivation for their music acquisitions is to make long term licensing coin from other streaming services, for example. Sony sees value in their own platform ownership in games at the moment, obviously, but this wouldn’t necessarily be the orientation, or the sole orientation, if Sony did take on a tranche of big IP in an inorganic fashion like in a ‘big’ acquisition. I think this is all moot with regard to this rumour anyway, but I think that general characterization of Sony guarding its content behind its own formats only, is no longer accurate, and the new CEO seems to be orientating toward a strategy of general licensing of valuable content, in music and movies at least. You have to up a long way back in time and attitudes to find the kind of Sony that was wary of digital music because it wanted to sell CDs... their outlook now is a 180 from that positioning.
Think of it this way, though, Sony has a streaming platform. That alone gives access to a huge number of people even without specific Nintendo or Xbox support.

In addition, Rockstar/2K games would no longer be subject to license fees. If they kept a game PlayStation/PC, the lost sales just on Xbox is probably a wash in terms of revenue because of how much a first party saves in platform splits/fees compared to the same game for a third party on PlayStation/PC/Xbox.

To me there's just too much strategic value to excising Xbox support from big franchises like NBA2K, GTA and Read Dead, compared to any potential sales on Xbox. Arranging a purchase like this at all doesn't make sense if you don't think about the strategic advantage.
 

khamakazee

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,937
Whilst I don't think this is necessarily true, a difference in reception isn't exactly surprising. Whilst both platform holders have had blunders, closures etc, Microsoft's track record of IP, studio and exclusives management in recent years has been especially poor, notably in comparison to Sony and Nintendo. Whether you look at the decline of Halo, Gears, Crackdown, exclusives like Sea of Thieves, certain other titles, Fable, Rare as a whole, Lionhead, Scalebound and so on, and then compare to Sony or Nintendo's recent exclusives and output, it's little wonder many have so much more confidence in Sony's management of studios and IP over Microsoft's.

TakeTwo (TT) under Sony means a lot of people (Xbox gamers) are potentially pushed to invest in a Sony platform in order to play TT games, but games that ultimately are still likely to be really high quality (potentially also with less aggressive microtransactions or GaaS emphasis). A TT under Microsoft however might lend to a greater chance of TT putting out worse quality games altogether, which to many is potentially worse.

That and lots more people own a PS4 over an Xbox One in the first place, hence another reason there could be less pushback to one over the other.
Yet it is Microsoft who will continue to put the games on PC, Sony who knows. Also be careful what you wish for, a powerful Sony has already displayed it's reluctance to play with others. So the more they pull ahead of Nintendo and Microsoft the less likely they will listen to developers wishes on things like crossplay and more chances they strike exclusive deals with third party.
 

nib95

Member
Oct 28, 2017
11,280
  1. The Xbox division has been increasing revenue recently.
  2. So you think Ms lacks confidence in xbox after they just made the single biggest yearly investment in first party?
  3. The acquisitions I stated are not even that big, apart from square.
  4. We already know MS want to turn things around with everything they have been doing, like gamepass, BC, enhanced BC, the X1S +X1X and the studio acquisitions.

You really think Xbox will just sit down, take it and die, after all the work and investment they have put in?
1.) Revenue is not the same as profit. According to Thurrott, up until 2017 the Xbox had never been profitable. I don't know how much truth there is to that, or if that's now changed, but without figures on Xbox profit, we simply can't know. Nadella's use of language wasn't entirely specific. They're certainly making a lot of acquisitions of late, plus building new studios, infrastructure, R&D etc, so the investment and capital spend can't exactly be cheap, thus further off-setting that revenue.

Thurrott said:
Gaming is “growing profitably”? Wait. What?

One of the dirty little secrets of Microsoft’s Xbox/gaming business is that it has never actually turned a profit. So I was curious to hear Mr. Nadella utter these contorted words last night: “Our gaming business is now more than $9 billion, and growing profitably.” So. $9 billion is revenues, not profits. So growing means that revenues are growing. And growing profitably means … what? That the business is “becoming profitable”? Or is it just growing revenues positively? Was this a misstatement? What does that mean? Here’s my guess. He means usage and engagement are growing. Because I can state this with certainty: Microsoft’s gaming business is not profitable. In fact, it’s undergoing a digital transformation of its own.
https://www.petri.com/paul-thurrotts-short-takes-microsoft-earnings-special-edition-7

2.) I think Microsoft is giving Xbox another big push, but it's impossible to gauge confidence till we see the fruits of this newfound labour. None of the acquisitions of recent months have been close to as large as the ones we're now discussing, hence we're talking about an entirely different level of investment and risk. There was that titbit recently about how Game Pass is underperforming, so again, if there's any truth to that, this new found push and investment could still end up being short lived.

3.) They're still considerably bigger than any of the recent ones Microsoft has made.

4.) Yes, that much is clear, but how much risk and investment they're willing to put in or take before they start seeing profit and results is an entirely different thing altogether. You're not talking about acquisitions in the tens or even hundreds of millions, but billions, hence it's a different level of risk. Xbox's track record in recent years or generations hasn't exactly been the greatest, so it isn't going to be the easiest thing to sell to investors and shareholders, many of whom who probably already lack confidence in Xbox versus some of the competition.
 
Dec 4, 2017
4,727
Brazil
I never thought in my youth that this day would come but I could not care less about games from Take Two. i hated GTA 4, Hated GTA 5, did not enjoy RDR. If I can't buy their games it would not impact my life :S
To think that to me, until PS3, Metal Gear Solid and GTA were a must buy for every console that I owned.
 

JusDoIt

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,194
South Central Los Angeles
Ordinarily I'd dismiss this but given that Google and, I'm assuming Amazon, are going to enter the gaming space soon I think there's a chance (however slight) that this is Sony shoring up their IP catalogue to do battle against the Silicon Valley titans when it comes to who can launch the 'Netflix of games' first.

We've already seen it with Netflix paying big money for Ryan Murphy and WarnerMedia cutting a similar big money deal for Greg Berlanti. Yes those aren't the same things but it does show the importance of talent and IPs when an incumbent industry leader finds itself potentially going head to head with the near bottomless pockets of Silicon Valley's big players.

What if/when Apple, a trillion dollar company or thereabouts, decides to launch a streaming games platform too? Sony will need everything at it's disposal to fight and potentially owning the GTA and Red Dead properties could be a real game changer as the 'streaming wars' start to heat up.
Interesting point about a move like this being less about stifiling console competition and more about warding off a Big Tech invasion of the market.

(Still don’t believe it’s true, but it makes sense)
 
Feb 10, 2018
14,045
Looks like I missed the fun. It's weird coming to huge "news" like this after it's been debunked.


You make a valid point, but isn't there some kind of rule against Japanese companies being acquired? I'm sure I read that somewhere. Insomniac don't want to be bought and Spider-Man and Ratchet & Clank are both their most successful games to date by far. PlayStation fans could definitely lose out on lots of great content to play without an internet connection, but perhaps Sony will allow these Xbox games to be accessible on their console. Or will hell freeze over first? Not sure.

To be honest, the investments they've made into first-party are substantial but still relatively small when looked at in isolation. Given what Playground Games and Undead Labs do for Xbox, it was only a matter of time before they were acquired even if Xbox wasn't in a position where they needed to make the moves they have. These acquisitions happened in a burst fashion so that Xbox has content lined up for next-gen and for Game Pass "per quarter", and that amplifies the impact. The chosen studios are pretty smart purchases as a lot of them punch above their weight to provide great games, but it looks as though they were chosen because of their size. MS could have purchased bigger studios but why they didn't? It feels like bigger purchases were out of their grasp. We just found out that The Initiative plans to stay small after the dialogue that it was to be a "AAAA" thing. It's definitely not a certain that MS could be in a position to react with humongous acquisitions, just like Sony being in the position to acquire Take-Two is not really certain.
Isomniac don't want to bought? Source?
And your point about MS acquisitions being relatively small is factualy incorrect no platform has made the same yearly 1st party investment as MS have done in the last 20yrs or possibly in all time.
The initiative saying they want to stay small and agile needs more context I mean Naughty dog are small and agile compared to other devs.
The initiative is founded on talented people with experience working mainly on 100-300 people teams, so I would say the initiative will evolve into a 100-200 person team. It would be abnormal to hire the people they hired for a 30-50 ppl team, the 20 or so people are producers, lead designers, recruiter, directors etc they still have to hire the artists and coders which make the bulk of a studio.
The "AAAA" was mentioned on some job listing, I would not read to much into it.
 

Dr. Caroll

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
8,111
I wonder if the tone would change if it was Microsoft who was rumored to pick them up instead.
Yes. The important thing to remember is that 2K/Take Two possess a number of game series of great interest to PC gamers. Even BioShock, which was System Shock, but heavily simplified for the console market, has its roots in PC gaming. Not to mention heavy PC-focused hitters such as Civilization or XCom.

If Microsoft purchased 2K/Take Two, life would go on as usual because MS are 100% dedicated to PC gaming to the point of making the astonishing decision to put Halo MCC on Steam, their competitor's storefront. Sony? Sony's support for PC has always been extremely, extremely spotty. The moment Sony is involved with a game, the PC version either gets a long delay or disappears forever.
 

jelly

Member
Oct 26, 2017
10,497
Maybe the Houser's are retiring and it's time to cash in for mega bucks. Still think if they are for sale you would have quite a few other offers.
 

Dr. Caroll

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
8,111
It's funny, isn't it
See...
Yes. The important thing to remember is that 2K/Take Two possess a number of game series of great interest to PC gamers. Even BioShock, which was System Shock, but heavily simplified for the console market, has its roots in PC gaming. Not to mention heavy PC-focused hitters such as Civilization or XCom.

If Microsoft purchased 2K/Take Two, life would go on as usual because MS are 100% dedicated to PC gaming to the point of making the astonishing decision to put Halo MCC on Steam, their competitor's storefront. Sony? Sony's support for PC has always been extremely, extremely spotty. The moment Sony is involved with a game, the PC version either gets a long delay or disappears forever.
 
Feb 10, 2018
14,045
Maybe the Houser's are retiring and it's time to cash in for mega bucks. Still think if they are for sale you would have quite a few other offers.
It also goes against what PlayStation have done in the past.
Sony's first party has been built over decades buying studios sparingly and building some studious from the ground up.
 
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nycgamer4ever

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
861
If Rockstar wasn't apart of Take Two, I could see it. But since they are, this is a laugh.
Why? If it was 130 a share it would be roughly 14B. It would be much
Man, Sony REALLY didn't like Agent being in development hell.

This would be a really interesting acquisition. I would definitely love SIE making TakeTwo less nefarious with their MTXs, and giving studios like Hanger 13 a second chance.
When you sre rolling in cash and doing well IS when you sell a company if profit is what you want. Selling when you are doin
cheaper to buy just Rockstar.
What the...

This seems... dumb? For Take Two. Not necessarily Sony.

Why would Take Two want to do this?
14B reasons.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,126
I mean it's possible. Sony is going to get their next influx of cash from Days Gone, Death Stranding, Ghost of Tsushima and TLoU II so they will be worth at least a couple of billions more in the next 2 years.
 

Mega1X

The Fallen
Jun 4, 2018
213
Let Sony buy Take 2, Microsoft will just counter by purchasing something even more valuable and money making than Take 2.

Nintendo ;)
 

Ffog

Member
Feb 5, 2018
213
If this happened I wonder if Sony would treat GTA like Microsoft has treated Minecraft. GTA isn't GTA if it's just Spider-Man in cars
 

funky

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
7,174
You know how Activision seems like they are in a real weird spot right now and have nothing in the pipe to replace the slowly declining COD money train?

What if their solution is to be bought out / merged with someone?
 

nycgamer4ever

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
861
As always with these rumours: a first party buying a publisher makes little sense for two reasons. Firstly because Sony is already a publisher so there's a huge amount of duplication. Secondly, Take Two is instantly significantly devalued the moment they make their games PlayStation exclusive.

And really, it's all about GTA. And it's a really expensive way of getting GTA.
Take two has alot of ips and no one is talking about making any games exclusives. It's very likely that for an acquisition of this magnitude many of the top games will stay multi to make it worth it.
 

Nolbertos

Member
Dec 9, 2017
1,181
Didn’t EA or someone else offer more per share to make a hostile takeover?? I can’t see Take two selling unless its 50% or higher of Take two’s current market share to let Sony buy them out. Rockstar’s properties alone are worth its weight in gold.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,126
well maybe they will force rockstar to care about their other franchises like Max Payne, Bully etc. and not only GTAO like in the good days.
 

risq_au

Member
Oct 11, 2018
2,290
I don't think Sony would allow the games to be published multiplatform, they have been a lot less receptive to doing things with competitors unlike Microsoft and Nintendo.
 

Servbot24

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
19,555
Mar 9, 2019
238
Yes. The important thing to remember is that 2K/Take Two possess a number of game series of great interest to PC gamers. Even BioShock, which was System Shock, but heavily simplified for the console market, has its roots in PC gaming. Not to mention heavy PC-focused hitters such as Civilization or XCom.

If Microsoft purchased 2K/Take Two, life would go on as usual because MS are 100% dedicated to PC gaming to the point of making the astonishing decision to put Halo MCC on Steam, their competitor's storefront. Sony? Sony's support for PC has always been extremely, extremely spotty. The moment Sony is involved with a game, the PC version either gets a long delay or disappears forever.
They haven’t even released it yet on PC but are 100% dedicated?

Jlawokay.gif
 
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