Running ERA |OT| Off the couch into a new ERA

dralla

Member
Oct 27, 2017
684
I'be been lurking here for a while, but looking for some shoe advice.

I underpronate which has led to my fair share of rolled ankles. I usually tape my (right specifically) ankle for my runs to give a little extra support. I've been in Gel Nimbus 18's for the past 2.5ish years. They were pretty good shoes and I was mostly happy, a little stiff though.

I went to the local running store and went through current state of my shoes/ankles/etc. Tried on a few different pairs he pulled for me and settled in some Omni ISO 2's. Shoe felt super comfortable and fit my foot well.

....Then i ran in them. The shoe itself felt really great and my body responded pretty well, except for my ankles. Waves of intense inside ankle pain for the duration of the run (8 miles). That was about 7 hours ago and i'm still sore on the inside part of my ankle.

I tried doing some searching online and.....these are showing up more as overpronation vs. underpronation, which would make sense given the inner ankle pain.

Does this sound right? Did the guy sell my the wrong shoes? Am I already dead? I'm going to try and call over after the weekend and see about returning if that's the case.
Yea, Omni ISO are stability shoes for people who overpronate. Underpronation (or supination as some people call it) is not nearly as common so it's possible the person you spoke with confused the two. I'd return them ASAP since stability shoes are the worst thing a supinator can wear. You'll wanna stick to neutral running shoes that encourage a more natural footstrike. You might wanna check out the New Balance Fuellcell Rebel. The outer part of the midsole flares outward creating a wide base for you to land. It really encourages a neutral footstrike. I don't know if they'll work well with supination or not to be honest but I can't think of another shoe that has the flared out midsole that gives extra protection to the outside of the foot, so it might be worth it to give them a shot.
 

Fisico

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,370
Paris
What a terrible experience you had going into a shoes store, shoes are supposed to be enablers and don't get in the way, not hurt you while running, sorry you had to go through that :(
Next time you go into a store, especially if it's for the purpose of buying a new pair, ask them to do a test to check the way you run, almost every running store should have a treadmill and the proper software to do that.
 

Duebrithil

Member
Oct 25, 2017
292
I think you are better off going to a podiatrist to study your footstrike and possibly getting orthotics (or doing the wet test to see how you land your feet). In any case I think dralla's advice is sound: getting some natural and flexible running shoes means they won't get in the way of you running (and agree more with the use of orthotics) and your ankle's will suffer less. Personally I feel that the higher the platform of the shoe the more my ankles suffer, especially on tight turns.

In terms of flat-ish shoes with low drop and not too much platform I'd recommend the Topo ST-II (or ST-III), the Saucony Type A8 or perhaps the Altra Escalante. The Saucony Kinvara are also advertised as natural running but a 23/19mm platform might be too thick.

And as always strength exercises for your calves and knees might help a bit.
 

MMBosstones86

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,049
Thanks everyone for the replies. Im super disappointed in the experience as well. Especially since shoes aren't exactly cheap 😂

Since the replies were consistent....why would you recommend natural/neutral shoes vs. something specifically for supination?

I've done a little research, but am still pretty ignorant about the differences.
 

dralla

Member
Oct 27, 2017
684
Thanks everyone for the replies. Im super disappointed in the experience as well. Especially since shoes aren't exactly cheap 😂

Since the replies were consistent....why would you recommend natural/neutral shoes vs. something specifically for supination?

I've done a little research, but am still pretty ignorant about the differences.
As far as I know they don't make shoes specifically for supination. I was browsing slickdeals earlier and they have a pair of Mizuno Waverider's on sale and in the comments, multiple people commented they supinate and the Waverider's work really well for them - https://slickdeals.net/f/13353301-mizuno-men-s-wave-rider-22-running-shoe-57-60-ac-fs?p=130182226#post130182226 - I've worn Waverider's before and they're firm, too firm for some people, but they might be worth looking at.

---

Injuries suck. Especially when they're not serious and totally preventable. It makes you want to power through them even more but I think I'm gonna take a few days off :( I went on a park run this weekend and I've never run on this specific trail before. The trails in the area are usually dirt and/or gravel so my road shoes usually suffice. About 4-5 miles in it got real rocky and the rocks were doing some damage on my left foot. The cushioning on my road shoe is pretty soft and did not hold up well on the bigger rocks. I finished at a little under 7 miles but by the end I was limping a bit because it hurt to put pressure on my left foot. I feel fine for the most part now, but I tried a very short test jog last night and it felt the pain kick in. I'm sure I'll be fine in a few days but it's frustrating. The trail itself was great though. There's two lake parks near me and there's a trail the connects them, so you can do a nice loop between the two. You get to run underneath a highway in a tunnel at once point, which is cool (and a little scary since you can't see very well). Will definitely go back but will wear proper shoes next time.

That being said I've ramped up my miles over the past month or so and have seen some serious improvements in performance. I was predominantly running in the 5K range four times a week. Starting end of July I decided to up the miles and add long runs into my weekly plan. The majority of the mileage being slower paced. I honestly couldn't believe how quickly I noticed a difference, how much easier runs have become. Now I do three or four runs at 4-6 miles (last week all were a bit over 6)and then one long run, the longest so far being 10.5 miles. Not only is feeling the aerobic improvements satisfying, but I've come to really enjoy running longer and slower milage, especially in parks where I can enjoy the views and being in nature. The 10.5 mile run wasn't too difficult either. My legs were getting sore but aerobically I felt great. I think I might be able to run a half-marathon. Best of all, when I went out for a quick 5K a couple weeks back, I ended up getting a PR by about thirty seconds. So I guess it's true, at least for me, that you get faster by running slower.
 
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MMBosstones86

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,049
As far as I know they don't make shoes specifically for supination. I was browsing slickdeals earlier and they have a pair of Mizuno Waverider's on sale and in the comments, multiple people commented they supinate and the Waverider's work really well for them - https://slickdeals.net/f/13353301-mizuno-men-s-wave-rider-22-running-shoe-57-60-ac-fs?p=130182226#post130182226 - I've worn Waverider's before and they're firm, too firm for some people, but they might be worth looking at.
I went ahead and picked them up, should be getting them today. Thanks! We'll see how it goes.

Big race on Sunday. Starting to get a cold. FML. Anyone raced with a cold?
Race? no. I've ran w/ a head cold before and other than an abundance of mucus, was relatively normal. As long as your breathing isn't impacted, you'll probably be ok. Good luck!
 

Duebrithil

Member
Oct 25, 2017
292
Big race on Sunday. Starting to get a cold. FML. Anyone raced with a cold?
Yup. Did a HM once with a cold and didn't enjoy it very much, started to feel my throat was sore and I wasn't breathing properly so I had to slow down a bit. Nothing too serious mind you, but just the right amount of unpleasantness.
 

pbsapeer

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,793
Cheers everyone. Trying for a PB on Sunday so want to be at my best. Fingers crossed I can stem the cold.
 

ruxtpin

Member
Oct 30, 2017
279
Anyone here sign up for a second marathon on a whim, that occurs 3-4 weeks after a marathon you’ve been training for? Doing the MCM and the Philly marathon is in November a few weeks later. Wondering if I could do the MCM and then try for an easy Philly several weeks later (maybe with one additional 20 mile run in between races).
 

pbsapeer

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,793
Congratulations! And more than a minute under 40, that's a very good time! How was your cold, did you manage to get it under control for the race?
And with a cold too. Nice one 👍
Thanks all.
Managed to stop the cold. Took some sudafed and lemsips over the last couple of days to get it out of the system. Had some aches last night but felt good this morning.
 

Duebrithil

Member
Oct 25, 2017
292
You'd think that if teaching a pet not to jump on people or chase after them barking and growling is too much work having the animal leashed would be standard. How wrong you'd be. Three times today in a 30 minute run.
 

DagsJT

Member
Oct 29, 2017
631
Been training for months to get ready for a half marathon this weekend, only to just now get an email saying it’s been postponed to a later date. So frustrating.
 

pbsapeer

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,793
You'd think that if teaching a pet not to jump on people or chase after them barking and growling is too much work having the animal leashed would be standard. How wrong you'd be. Three times today in a 30 minute run.
Don't generally mind dogs too much, but when you're out for a run it's so annoying. It's why I avoid parks most weekends.
Been training for months to get ready for a half marathon this weekend, only to just now get an email saying it’s been postponed to a later date. So frustrating.
No way which one were you entering?
 

DagsJT

Member
Oct 29, 2017
631
Don't generally mind dogs too much, but when you're out for a run it's so annoying. It's why I avoid parks most weekends.

No way which one were you entering?
EHM in Warrington. People are fuming, understandably. Train tickets and hotels booked for some people and they can’t get refunds.

They’ve mentioned postponing but then we’re getting into winter and clashing with other races.

Not good at all.
 

pbsapeer

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,793
EHM in Warrington. People are fuming, understandably. Train tickets and hotels booked for some people and they can’t get refunds.

They’ve mentioned postponing but then we’re getting into winter and clashing with other races.

Not good at all.
Seems really poor and to leave it so late too... That's really bad. Did they give a reason?
 

DagsJT

Member
Oct 29, 2017
631
Seems really poor and to leave it so late too... That's really bad. Did they give a reason?
Not really, it’s all a bit woolly and vague.

“This message is to inform you that due to us not being able to guarantee all the necessary components to deliver a safe and fun race weekend experience, we are having to postpone this weekend’s races and associated activities to a weekend later in the year”

They’ve said they’ll have more information on Thursday which makes you wonder what they’ll know on Thursday that they can’t say today. And why did they leave it so late to cancel? Surely they must have known longer ago than 6 days before the race that they had issues?

Crazy.
 

pbsapeer

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,793
Not really, it’s all a bit woolly and vague.

“This message is to inform you that due to us not being able to guarantee all the necessary components to deliver a safe and fun race weekend experience, we are having to postpone this weekend’s races and associated activities to a weekend later in the year”

They’ve said they’ll have more information on Thursday which makes you wonder what they’ll know on Thursday that they can’t say today. And why did they leave it so late to cancel? Surely they must have known longer ago than 6 days before the race that they had issues?

Crazy.
Hmm clearly they couldn't get a road closed or something right? Like surely that's the only risk to safety right??
 
Oct 27, 2017
797
I need some help, already have an appoiment scheduled for next week about it, but wanted to get some opinions.

About 6 Months ago i was doing some squats and on the way down i heard/felt a crack in my leg and it gave out completely, fell to the ground. After a few minutes i was able to walk on it and left the gym. Since then i spent a good 2 months testing it every so often but it would always hurt to walk/run and my leg just didnt feel stable. I finally just gave in and stopped physical activity altogether for a good month. I visited a doctor about it they did an MRI of my knee and examined the leg and said it was fine..... I resumed the gym, initially wasnt able to walk or run that much at the gym because my leg felt unstable. Im now at the point where i can run for as long as i usually ran before the injury (6 miles every other day), however when i start running and when i stop running theres a rush of pain and its hard to walk, it goes away after a few minutes of exercising, but immediately comes back when i sit and rest. I have constant pain at night when im laying in bed, its to the point where i need to be in a specific position to avoid any pain. In the mornings the pains gone, ive stopped all activity since i booked my doctors appointment with a sports specialist.

My feeling is that i have a stress fracture that I just havent given enough time to heal because i hate not exercising. Anyone have prior experience with something simlar?

EDIT: Should mention the pain is localized to my tibia.
 

hyouko

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,009
Finished Reach the Beach in NH with my team from work yesterday. Overall, it was a pretty great experience - cheering on teammates in the middle of the night, sleeping under the stars, and seeing great White Mountains scenery as we went. Was my first time doing a race this big / long; the 8-mile leg I did was technically the longest race I have run all by itself. I averaged just about 8min/mi.

We did hit a few challenges. One of our teammates broke his foot the night before the race, and we had to scramble to find a replacement - the guy who jumped in crushed it, though. I think the associated Ragnar app needs some work, as it is super reliant on an internet connection that may not exist up in the mountains. Everything ultimately worked out, though!
 

DagsJT

Member
Oct 29, 2017
631
Was there any update about the English half cancellation?
Only that they’re really sorry about it all and they promise to have an update next week. It’s all a bit rubbish really. I can only think some legal stuff is happening in the background and they’re limited in what they can say until something has been signed off.

With EHM being cancelled, some runners from my local club decided to do a 13 mile run anyway so I took part and just ran it at my zone 2 HR pace, treating it as an extended long training run.

13.7 miles, 2 hrs 30 mins of running time on the legs so I’m happy enough with that. The pace was on the lower end of what my VDOT easy pace should be but once I get these races out of the way, I’ll start marathon training. Then I’ll need to decide whether I want to use HR or VDOT to guide my easy pace.
 

pbsapeer

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,793
Only that they’re really sorry about it all and they promise to have an update next week. It’s all a bit rubbish really. I can only think some legal stuff is happening in the background and they’re limited in what they can say until something has been signed off.

With EHM being cancelled, some runners from my local club decided to do a 13 mile run anyway so I took part and just ran it at my zone 2 HR pace, treating it as an extended long training run.

13.7 miles, 2 hrs 30 mins of running time on the legs so I’m happy enough with that. The pace was on the lower end of what my VDOT easy pace should be but once I get these races out of the way, I’ll start marathon training. Then I’ll need to decide whether I want to use HR or VDOT to guide my easy pace.
Nice one. Still good to get out and do the run anyway!

I had read a rumour that the holding company who owned the organisers had gone into administration back in June / July. Wonder whether they just kept trading and had no intention of doing the race after all.
 

lush

Member
Oct 26, 2017
687
Knoxville, TN
Decided to get back in to running finally after a year or so of slacking off/opting for my bike. Grabbed a pair of Brooks Ghost 12s and I've been doing 3 miles after work with some intense east TN hills. Damn it sucks getting your fitness back but boy does it energize the hell out of you afterwards. Now if only the heat would go away, still in the mid 90s nearing the end of September.

Anyways, hello running OT.
 

Arttemis

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
2,837
I've been running 1 to 3 miles six times a week before working out to get back into shape, and the runs themselves are enough to exhaust me before I even lift a weight. A decade ago, I used to run 10 mph for long stretches, sprinting 14 mph, and 8 mph was a cooldown speed. Now, I'm having to slow down after two minutes at 8 mph, and can barely sprint 12 mph for thirty seconds. I know it took two years of hard work to get to that point ten years ago, but I've been going pretty intensely for nine months so far and feel like I've barely improved despite losing 25 lbs.

A recent change of running on an incline gave me some hope, as running a straight-away made me feel as light as a feather after a mile uphill. Doing that for a week hasn't really translated into any noticeable changes, yet.
 

Petrapan

Member
Oct 27, 2017
160
I've been running 1 to 3 miles six times a week before working out to get back into shape, and the runs themselves are enough to exhaust me before I even lift a weight. A decade ago, I used to run 10 mph for long stretches, sprinting 14 mph, and 8 mph was a cooldown speed. Now, I'm having to slow down after two minutes at 8 mph, and can barely sprint 12 mph for thirty seconds. I know it took two years of hard work to get to that point ten years ago, but I've been going pretty intensely for nine months so far and feel like I've barely improved despite losing 25 lbs.

A recent change of running on an incline gave me some hope, as running a straight-away made me feel as light as a feather after a mile uphill. Doing that for a week hasn't really translated into any noticeable changes, yet.
10 mph is really, really fast for long stretches. That would be 18:35 for a 5km. Are you sure the treadmill was calibrated correctly back then?
 

Rei Toei

Member
Nov 8, 2017
626
Curious if anyone else runs better on an emtpy stomach. I do, at least, in the morning. I've been tracking my runs with Garmin (Forerunner) and NRC over the last couple months, both time/speed and how I felt during running, and consistently I have my best times in the morning and (usually) feel better too - on an empty stomach. I usually run between 15-18 km, 12 km/hour if I run in the morning.
 
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Fisico

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,370
Paris
10 mph is really, really fast for long stretches. That would be 18:35 for a 5km. Are you sure the treadmill was calibrated correctly back then?
I'm betting on km/h instead of mph, running 1 to 3 times a week with long stretches at 10mph doesn't seem very likely unless you're doing another very high cardio kind of activity on the side.
Now sprinting at 12mph being hard for more than thirty seconds a decade later I can believe that if the aforementionned values were indeed km/h.
 

Fliesen

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,905
I'm betting on km/h instead of mph, running 1 to 3 times a week with long stretches at 10mph doesn't seem very likely unless you're doing another very high cardio kind of activity on the side.
Now sprinting at 12mph being hard for more than thirty seconds a decade later I can believe that if the aforementionned values were indeed km/h.
yup, 10 mph is already crazy fast and 14 mph is 2:39 min / km.
 

Duebrithil

Member
Oct 25, 2017
292
yup, 10 mph is already crazy fast and 14 mph is 2:39 min / km.
I sometimes hit 2:49 min/km when I'm doing those ultra-short ultra-fast sprints. If those numbers are right mad respect for him, those are some intense paces.

I've been running 1 to 3 miles six times a week before working out to get back into shape, and the runs themselves are enough to exhaust me before I even lift a weight. A decade ago, I used to run 10 mph for long stretches, sprinting 14 mph, and 8 mph was a cooldown speed. Now, I'm having to slow down after two minutes at 8 mph, and can barely sprint 12 mph for thirty seconds. I know it took two years of hard work to get to that point ten years ago, but I've been going pretty intensely for nine months so far and feel like I've barely improved despite losing 25 lbs.
I think you're doing great: you've kept with your training for nine whole months and you've lost weight along the way. With the base you have now you can begin to add some more speedwork into your workouts be it X/X min fartlek, accelerations at the end of a workout, progressively faster runs or interval training.

A recent change of running on an incline gave me some hope, as running a straight-away made me feel as light as a feather after a mile uphill. Doing that for a week hasn't really translated into any noticeable changes, yet.
Give it time, you'll reap the rewards of hill training soon enough :)
 
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pbsapeer

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,793
Curious if anyone else runs better on an emtpy stomach. I do, at least, in the morning. I've been tracking my runs with Garmin (Forerunner) and NRC over the last couple months, both time/speed and how I felt during running, and consistently I have my best times in the morning and (usually) feel better too - on an empty stomach. I usually run between 15-18 km, 12 km/hour if I run in the morning.
Ehhh not generally. My fastest runs are after I've been up for 3 hours and had a bowl of cereal and some gels before a race. But all my training is pretty much on an empty stomach, except for long runs where I have some energy gels
 

Arttemis

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
2,837
I used to run sub-six minute miles, and low 13 mins for two miles back then. I was hoping to reach a 2 minute half-mile, but never got much below 2:30. I'm fairly certain the treadmills I used at my University were accurate. I also ran on a quarter mile track and an exactly 3/4th mile stretch of road behind my apartment. My definition of long distance is 5 miles, though, which I've rarely even reached. I am and always have been in awe at running enthusiasts who willingly keep going. I think I've gone around 8 mi only twice; I was almost always limited to a couple miles.

Rght now, I feel like I'm giving my all to get a 7:20 minute mile. I utterly dread the thought of running 3 miles, but I guess I need to just push through and keep going beyond that, even if it's a trod of a pace.

I sometimes hit 2:49 min/km when I'm doing those ultra-short ultra-fast sprints. If those numbers are right mad respect for him, those are some intense paces.



I think you're doing great: you've kept with your training for nine whole months and you've lost weight along the way. With the base you have now you can begin to add some more speedwork into your workouts be it X/X min fartlek, accelerations at the end of a workout, progressively faster runs or interval training.



Give it time, you'll reap the rewards of hill training soon enough :)
Thanks! I have never even heard of a fartlek, before, so I'm eager to try all these new things. My old habits were never anymore sophisticated than interval sprints once a week. I've not really done much of anything this year beyond attempting to just hold the same speed for as long as I can, so I imagine anything different will be more effective. I'll try something new out tonight when I go running!
 

El_TigroX

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,916
New York, NY
Anyone else having issues with Nike Run Club app? Since the recent update, distance and GPS are all fucked, and it's causing me some serious headaches gauging longer mileage....
 

Avengers23

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,882
It turns out that I hate running at night on NYC streets. I might have to transition to morning running for work week running.
 

dralla

Member
Oct 27, 2017
684
It turns out that I hate running at night on NYC streets. I might have to transition to morning running for work week running.
The shorter days suck. I run after work but it's getting more difficult with the diminishing daylight. I don't like running when it's dark out so I'm not sure if I'll start running in the morning before work and lose an hour of sleep or start running on a track (which are lit up) after work.
 

pbsapeer

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,793
Running in the morning is the best IMO. quite difficult where I live as the roads are rural and not street lit. Often they are without paths so had to run on the road. Earlier morning is much better for this as there are far fewer cars, just have to make sure you're as visible as possibly. I have reflective armbands that flash red which help but have been thinking about getting a head light so I can at least see the road.

Also running at dark sucks because cunt dog owners don't pick up their dog shit.
 

pbsapeer

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,793
Got a weird pain in my inside right leg. Sort of underneath the calf muscle but not as low as my ankle bone. No clue what it is ATM. Currently not a problem when running but can feel it when going up and down stairs. I'm guessing it's muscular as when running it's warmed up. Anyone experienced this?
 

DagsJT

Member
Oct 29, 2017
631
Got a weird pain in my inside right leg. Sort of underneath the calf muscle but not as low as my ankle bone. No clue what it is ATM. Currently not a problem when running but can feel it when going up and down stairs. I'm guessing it's muscular as when running it's warmed up. Anyone experienced this?
Achilles?