I watched episode 1 but I've just had a lot more interesting media to watch the past few days before episode 2 - the first episode seemed decent enough but it just didn't make me super eager to watch episode 2.
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Samba: Ms Marvel has lowest US viewership debut of MCU Disney+ shows BUT is a hit with Gen Z & draws more diverse audience
- Thread starter AHA-Lambda
- Start date
It is not a gotcha, it is a call for introspection. Which will naturally raise people's defensive shackles, of course. I appreciate your effort in writing all of this!
I think the cast, especially the kids, are fantastic. And the story is fine so far. Can't wait for episode three
I remember lots of people asking for the return of adult Peter Parker. I didn't like Tom Holland's Peter Parker, it was too kiddy. I much prefer Tobey Maguire's and Andrew Garfield's Peter Parker.
What? Teen coming of age is one of my favorite genres, but there's a difference between Disney Channel high school and a show like Sex Education. The demographics they're made for are completely different. Ms. Marvel seems more like a tween show, and that's great, there should be good content for that age group.
I really don't get why Spiderman keeps getting brought up as it really is a bad comparison. Next ppl will be comparing Ironheart to Spiderman and any other relatively new unknown teen.
So far, the only MCU TV shows I've really liked have been WandaVision, Hawkeye, and Ms. Marvel, which coincidentally had the 3 least popular opening weeks of the lot. I thought Loki was okay but was disappointed it wasn't better, dropped Falcon & the Winter Soldier after one episode, dropped What If after one episode, and never bothered to watch Moon Knight (I was on the fence, but then I saw the scene with the guy speaking completely gibberish and the show calling it Chinese and decided to skip it).
Of the 2 shows I like that have finished, I thought WandaVision had higher highs and lower lows, while Hawkeye started good and slowly got better as it progressed.
Ms. Marvel has a fun cast, great visual design (reminiscent of Mitchells vs. the Machines), the matter-of-fact depiction of Muslim life is interesting, and the couple of brief action scenes so far have been decent. Looking forward to seeing where it goes. If it keeps this level of quality through the entire run, it could take the #1 slot for me.
Oh and I'm in my 40's.
Of the 2 shows I like that have finished, I thought WandaVision had higher highs and lower lows, while Hawkeye started good and slowly got better as it progressed.
Ms. Marvel has a fun cast, great visual design (reminiscent of Mitchells vs. the Machines), the matter-of-fact depiction of Muslim life is interesting, and the couple of brief action scenes so far have been decent. Looking forward to seeing where it goes. If it keeps this level of quality through the entire run, it could take the #1 slot for me.
Oh and I'm in my 40's.
Same for me. This is how Disney tried to sell it to me, and why I didn't watch it (at least yet). There's also the fact that June is packed with tons of new seasons for shows I was waiting for, so it went really low very fast in my priority list...
I actually liked the trailer for the series as someone not deeply familiar with Ms. Marvel outside of the Avengers game (not a great game, but I liked her role in it). Unfortunately as a show it's just been absolutely mediocre. It may be my least favorite MCU show so far. The low viewership seems deserved.
Yeah, there is a distinction there that a lot of people miss. For example, I think among Marvel fare, Cloak and Dagger and Runaways are their most blatantly "aimed at a younger demographic" shows, but both have some pretty edgy content - drugs, sex, that sort of thing. Content that you don't usually even get in the PG-13 movies. There's wide gaps between children's shows, "young adult" shows, teen shows...
But, on the record, as someone that had the "is this a Disney Channel show?" concerns before the show actually came out: it's not really aiming at that level. It's not overly goofy, it doesn't avoid complex interpersonal drama, its writing is solid, its content is authentic and not watered down. It's appropriate for children, the same way most MCU content is, but it's not aimed at them to the exclusion of wider demographics. It is solidly in the same "young adult" category as the MCU Spider-Man movies in content and tone.
So yeah, I think marketing let them down a lot here.
I haven't seen any of the marketing so I don't know how they present the show (which possibly speaks in part to what's going on) but having seen the first two episodes I didn't find either of them to be especially heavy in the 'high school drama' component. It's there, but it doesn't feel like the focus. At work currently so can't watch the trailer posted above, but from the description it doesn't sound like it's doing the best job conveying what the show is. You could make Chucky look like a teen drama too, very easily. Just because a story is about a teenager doesn't mean people of all ages can't readily engage with it.
Overall I have to say I find it really charming. I love that it's actually got more visual flair than you see in most Marvel stuff (although the TV shows have been pretty solid there compared to the movies weirdly enough). Stories that simultaneously say 'here's a role model for a demographic that doesn't have one' and 'you can choose to idolize anyone, even if they aren't the same as you' are pretty rare. Same too with stories that say things like 'it's totally okay to not have your future figured out' which while they usually are about teens, it's not like that same message can't be impactful for adults.
I lived in Manchester England for years, and it had a large Muslim population. Heck, the part of Manchester I lived in is now majority Muslim (wasn't quite there when I lived there, but was getting close). I don't know how accurate to US Muslim communities the show is, given that it's written by an English Muslim, but it's really recognizable as the place I called home. I know these people, as they were my friends and neighbors. That's going to be pretty uncommon here in the US.
People need to learn to parse the difference between 'racism helps explain why this show isn't as popular' (which it blatantly does) and 'if you don't like the show you must be racist'. Because no. But... plenty of people disinterested are going to be disinterested or against the show for exactly that reason. It's the same stuff we saw with The Last Jedi. Yes you don't have to be a misogynist not to like the film... but if you try to claim it's not a big reason why that film saw so much online backlash, you have your head completely in the sand.
Overall I have to say I find it really charming. I love that it's actually got more visual flair than you see in most Marvel stuff (although the TV shows have been pretty solid there compared to the movies weirdly enough). Stories that simultaneously say 'here's a role model for a demographic that doesn't have one' and 'you can choose to idolize anyone, even if they aren't the same as you' are pretty rare. Same too with stories that say things like 'it's totally okay to not have your future figured out' which while they usually are about teens, it's not like that same message can't be impactful for adults.
I lived in Manchester England for years, and it had a large Muslim population. Heck, the part of Manchester I lived in is now majority Muslim (wasn't quite there when I lived there, but was getting close). I don't know how accurate to US Muslim communities the show is, given that it's written by an English Muslim, but it's really recognizable as the place I called home. I know these people, as they were my friends and neighbors. That's going to be pretty uncommon here in the US.
People need to learn to parse the difference between 'racism helps explain why this show isn't as popular' (which it blatantly does) and 'if you don't like the show you must be racist'. Because no. But... plenty of people disinterested are going to be disinterested or against the show for exactly that reason. It's the same stuff we saw with The Last Jedi. Yes you don't have to be a misogynist not to like the film... but if you try to claim it's not a big reason why that film saw so much online backlash, you have your head completely in the sand.
I love the series so far and I'm not too worried about it. Social media and the internet has shown that, even if a piece media fails initially there's always chances for people to come back and breathe new life into it. There's been a lot of great shows, albums, films.etc fell under the radar upon release only to find an audience and get their flowers later on. As long as Ms. Marvel maintains it's quality then I can see the same happening here. For one, The Marvels come out next year. If Iman kills it in that film, then I can see a lot of folk coming back to the show and regretting not giving it a chance.
This show really has it all for chuds to have it in their sights:
Like, I'm pretty sure adults can enjoy literally any piece of entertainment they want to, regardless of who it's aimed at.
- Woman as the lead
- Young woman as the lead
- Young woman of color as the lead
- Young woman of color as the lead with her South Asian family
- Young woman of color as the lead with her South Asian family who are all Muslim
Like, I'm pretty sure adults can enjoy literally any piece of entertainment they want to, regardless of who it's aimed at.
I'm in the same boat. Too many other shows dropping at the same time are taking up my limited viewing time. I think a lot of people are the same way which I think explains in part the low numbers.
I've watched with my Mom and Brother. We've enjoyed both episodes and look forward to the rest. Kinda Scott Pilgrim like in the presentation. Just a fun show to watch.
Don't forget that she's a huge fan of Captain Marvel. That's gotta be like 2 or 3 strikes in and of itself for those people. lol
I have to say I'm not much into the MCU or the Avengers (although I watch it because my friend is very much into it), but I have to say I LOVED the first 2 episodes.
I always preferred the mutant side of Marvel and Spiderman growing up in the 90's, always found it more relatable. Maybe this is similar in that aspect
I think this is what makes the show work for me tbh, was just talking about it with a friend.
I always preferred the mutant side of Marvel and Spiderman growing up in the 90's, always found it more relatable. Maybe this is similar in that aspect
I think this is what makes the show work for me tbh, was just talking about it with a friend.
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Not only is the character a big fan of Captaib Marvel, but the actress is a big fan of Brie Larson in real life. They're basically trolling the incels at this point.
Our Family Loved the hell out of this, felt like a mishmash of Scott Pilgrim, The Red Panda movie and Edge of Seventeen. The Family stuff definitely hit a bit home (Korean here), so I totally connected with this.
For some people...yes, it is the best MCU show for them.
Yep, it dropped into very competitive "time slot". It looks intended for younger audience. It's an unknown (relatively speaking) character and the show doesn't have the star power of Moon Knight.
Also, didn't they change the power set from the comics, so some fans might be upset about that?
I'm sure everyone is aware it can still fall apart (like Ranking of Kings!!!!), but they're really just saying the first episode was better realized than any other individual episode of other Marvel shows.
Out of curiosity, what was wrong with Captain Marvel? Saw it in the theaters and thought it was good but not great Marvel movie. There wasn't anything particularly bad about it though.
Some people just being upset at female lead? If so that's just weird since Wonder Woman (first movie) was pretty popular (and also, good but not great comic book movie).
Brie Larson said:
"I don't need a 40-year-old white dude to tell me what didn't work for him," using "A Wrinkle In Time" as an example. "It wasn't made for him! I want to know what that film meant to women of color, to biracial women, to teen women of color."
So, obviously, rage ensued among the usual figures. Had nothing to do with the actual movie.
Kind of bittersweet!
I am glad it is drawing a diverse audience but I think everyone should give it a chance.
Really fun show
I am glad it is drawing a diverse audience but I think everyone should give it a chance.
Really fun show
The difference is tone, it doesn't help that Kamala seems to be written much younger than 16. Compare it to the Stargirl show which is another teenage girl super-hero show. Stargirl is supposed to be younger than Kamala but you don't get the feeling it's intentionally aimed at teenagers like Ms Marvel is. IIRC Stargirl opens with the JSA being murdered, Ms Marvel opens with an animation sequence which made me feel 200 years old.
Interesting, didn't follow any of that, but yeah I can see it triggering some people for whatever reasons.
This reminds me of the review of Turning Red that said they couldn't relate because it was about a female, asian teenager.
Y'all telling on yourselves.
Plus she's not traditional "eye candy" so to speak. I think a lot of people are fooling themselves if they say people don't watch "teenage dramas" for the eye candy, it's what the CW is built on, and this show purposefully avoids that (which is great).
Doesn't really feel like there's much of a draw for this show. Content and direction wise it's pretty good, but it's also a bit of a bore so far, and doesn't really have the hooks that previous shows had. I wasn't even aware that it had started airing until episode 2 was already out so it seemingly got buried by Obi Wan a bit. Even on the Disney+ app it didn't seem super clearly advertised.
Maybe this should have been released after The Marvels, rather than before?
Maybe this should have been released after The Marvels, rather than before?
In an ensemble film like the Marvels, there wouldn't be very much time to devote to Kamala Khan's family. And the thing is, her character is her family, so switching the introduction would cripple her characterization. Besides, Ms. Marvel is one of the best and most visually interesting projects to ever come out of the MCU so it's perfectly fine at standing on its own. Even if the audience is smaller at the beginning, it'll only grow if the quality manages to hold up.
If they used this style of trailer for any show with a teen girl or boy of any race/religion as the lead, I'd be put off. The trailer is clearly aimed to attract a much younger demographic (and by all accounts, that's a good chunk of the demographic they have attracted..which is fine, as I assume that was the idea).
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Yep, still waiting for someone to explain me how the ultra dealbreaker of a trailer that makes it look oh so childish
is different from this:
And so far the only thing I'm getting is "You see it's different because I like Spider-Man".
You're not very subtle
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Watched ep 3 on my lunch break. I think what I want is this show with no superhero stuff. Just Kamala's family, church, friends, etc. The characters and casting all are great and her family cracks me up constantly. Every action scene I'm just thinking, get me back into the mosque or around the dinner table.
I mean I'm Indian American and have been dying for something like this for years (any South Asian American content tbh); I relate to so many of the family dynamics in the first couple episodes down to the subtle ways the family communicates with one another.
But honestly, the trailer did make me and my wife feel like this was really 'childish' compared to other Marvel movies/shows. The episodes didn't do much to change my mind on that either. That's fine, though, I can be a bit of a sucker for high school drama stuff lol.
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Brand loyalty and familiarity with the character. People are way more likely to take a chance on a new Spider-Man show or movie, whereas Ms Marvel is largely unknown. If the trailer doesn't resonate for whatever reason, aside from the MCU association, there's not much appeal to a viewer who has never come across the character before.
If you're asking what the difference is between the two trailer you posted, one is for the world's most popular superhero's long awaited MCU debut movie, and the other is a TV show about a relatively unknown superhero. It's really not a fair comparison.
Brand loyalty and familiarity with the character. People are way more likely to take a chance on a new Spider-Man show or movie, whereas Ms Marvel is largely unknown. If the trailer doesn't resonate for whatever reason, aside from the MCU association, there's not much appeal to a viewer who has never come across the character before.
If you're asking what the difference is between the two trailer you posted, one is for the world's most popular superhero's long awaited MCU debut movie, and the other is a TV show about a relatively unknown superhero. It's really not a fair comparison.
They're actually doing what people wanted and are doing a lot to define the world the story lies within. Everything about Kamala's family, her friends, her education, her religion, it's not being half assed or left to be assumed, it's fully developed and fleshed out and becomes the cornerstone of the show, rather than it just being yet another super hero story. It's what every single one of the other netflix shows failed to do. It's really great.
There's still time for it to fall on it's face like most of the other shows do but...it's batting 1000 right now.
