Sarah Silverman says she was fired from a movie for an old blackface sketch

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Bitmap Frogs

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Sep 16, 2018
674
If you thought the twitter brigading would only end up hurting the careers of republican supporters, I've got a bridge to sell to you.

Shame... I like her stuff, mostly.

Oh well.
 

skillzilla81

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
3,770
It’s amazing that we’ve created such a community full of people that have never made mistakes in their lives.

Seriously though, she seems remorseful about the situation, and seems to be an ally on the right side of history. But so many people here are content to have this never forget, never forgive attitude. One fuck up, and you are done. Career over. You deserve no chance at a successful life, or form of redemption. Stay out of my sight line, and out of my entertainment.

Give me a fucking break.

People make mistakes, they change, they grow, they become better people. Is that really not allowed anymore?
I'm sorry, is her career over?
 

Lord of Ostia

Member
Oct 27, 2017
13,271
Okay, but that still doesn't mean "cancel culture" is a thing. People are aware she is a human. If she changes or has changed, people will support her. Some won't, but that would be true at any point in history regardless of the internet or social media being a thing. It's not a culture specific to this point in time, you're just talking about general truisms regarding forgiveness.

Can you quote who said it wasn't allowed please? How would another human being even disallow that?
Yeah I never made any claims of a 'cancel culture'. I'm just talking about general forgiveness and empathy.
 

Zelas

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,988
That's not at all what I'm saying.

See my above post, you can hold it against her if you want. That's your option.
Yeah you kind of are. If those affected want to continue to hold it against her it doesnt matter how many times its brought up how much she's changed. Sometimes the consequences of someone's actions last forever no matter how much someone has changed. You are free to do you, but unless you know the scope of the impact there's is no justification for you lamenting the fact that people would still be upset.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,414
Portland, OR
I thought she just meant her career of naturally riskier shock humour.
Of course she did. She just phrased it poorly. She makes it sound like if you aren't doing edgy, offensive humor that could easily be confused with basic bigotry, that's the equivalent of not taking any risks. There are ways to push the envelope without doing blackface. I think she's legitimately remorseful, but the insinuation that her replacement is only there because they played it safe is not the best look.
 

Ashlette

Member
Oct 28, 2017
674
I don't think any number of apologies can take away the fact that she profited from dehumanizing minorities.

And her show, which will outlast her, is forever a source of "entertainment" for racists.

Just disappointed all around.
 

nachum00

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,518
Tropic Thunder was and is still fucked up but no one on this forum is gonna dare cancel Iron Man.
 

Euphoria

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,179
Are all of y’all saying that you make a conscious decision every time you find something humorous?

Or are all of yall saying that writing jokes for a television program is just as unintentional as a sense of humor?

Because those are both ridiculous
I’ve read this entire thread and what I’ve taken from your discussions is that 12 years ago you found skits like that funny. Today you no longer find that funny.

12 years ago she and the other writers found it funny too and made their skit based on what they found funny. Today she no longer finds it funny and regrets making it.


It’s okay that you found it funny 12 years ago and learned from it and regret finding it funny.

It’s not okay that she found it funny 12 years ago and learned from it and regrets finding it funny.



It all blows my mind because at the same time you claim that you can’t control what you find funny.
 

Kilrogg

Resettlement Advisor
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Oct 25, 2017
1,407
Upon reading in more detail, man, she's flip-flopping hard. One sentence you're like "okay, that's weird", the next you're like "good, she's owning up to it", then it's like "CANCEL CULTURE OMG"...

Eeeeh. I guess she doesn't deserve to be "cancelled" (ugh) based on what she said and how old the sketch is... But I won't be entirely surprised if she gets caught saying/doing some new stupid shit at some point.

Regardless, I'll always be wary of people who dig up shit from 10+ years ago done by people who haven't since behaved like complete shitheels (à la James Gunn). Most likely this type of people is just looking for fake outrage to undermine progressive efforts and distract us from the true unrepenting shitheels.
 

theBmZ

Avenger
Oct 29, 2017
999
I'm sorry, is her career over?
You know exactly what I mean. No, her career isn’t over, but there’s plenty of people that I’m sure would be happy for it to be. My post spoke more in a general sense. It was a suggestion of people’s line of thinking in these situations. Can’t believe I actually have to explain this.
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,506
Clefargle’s double standard hinging on the distinction between authorship and mere enjoyment might make sense if the joke was “lol black people are stupid” but that was never the joke in the first place!
 

Bob White

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,130
Regardless, I'll always be wary of people who dig up shit from 10+ years ago done by people who haven't since behaved like complete shitheels (à la James Gunn). Most likely this type of people is just looking for fake outrage to undermine progressive efforts and distract us from the true unrepenting shitheels.
This. A super outspoken woman against Trump who seems to understand how hurtful and stupid doing black face was, will now be eaten alive and shunned by her own.

It's what they fucking want.
 

Clefargle

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,255
Limburg
Yes but you seem to be missing the point. There was a time where both you and Silverman found blackface funny. Now neither of you find it funny, and that's ok for you but not for her. People are taking issue with the pretty obvious double standard.
Im quite a bit younger that Sarah Silverman, RDJ, ect, and at the time I wasn’t educated in the context and history that underlies hurtful stereotypes. They were older than I am now when they worked on these TV/Movie productions. They should have known better. My argument comes down to:

If you weren’t aware of the history and context behind hurtful stereotypes then you probably have no business making comedies with ironic racial jokes.
 

Delphine

Stat Sua Cuique Dies
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Mar 30, 2018
1,006
Regardless, I'll always be wary of people who dig up shit from 10+ years ago done by people who haven't since behaved like complete shitheels (à la James Gunn). Most likely this type of people is just looking for fake outrage to undermine progressive efforts and distract us from the true unrepenting shitheels.

The clarity of this statement is refreshing. This is indeed obviously diversion tactics at play here, and I'm sad to see that it... works.
 

Kilrogg

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Oct 25, 2017
1,407
The clarity of this statement is refreshing. This is indeed obviously diversion tactics at play here, and I'm sad to see that it... works.
Thanks. Believe or it not, me from a few years ago wouldn't have realized that at all, and might even have dismissed it if it had been pointed out to me. It's almost like... people... can... change?

Merci vraiment. J'ai souvent du mal à m'exprimer avec clarté et précision, même en français, donc ça fait du bien de me l'entendre dire pour une fois :).
 

Clefargle

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,255
Limburg
I’ve read this entire thread and what I’ve taken from your discussions is that 12 years ago you found skits like that funny. Today you no longer find that funny.

12 years ago she and the other writers found it funny too and made their skit based on what they found funny. Today she no longer finds it funny and regrets making it.


It’s okay that you found it funny 12 years ago and learned from it and regret finding it funny.

It’s not okay that she found it funny 12 years ago and learned from it and regrets finding it funny.



It all blows my mind because at the same time you claim that you can’t control what you find funny.
You can’t control what you find funny when you’re watching something you didn’t make. I made a funny song once and I listen to it regularly. It’s silly and wholesome and I know I’m gonna laugh because I made it. So I’m in control of what I’m laughing about because I produced a song that I found funny.

This. A super outspoken woman against Trump who seems to understand how hurtful and stupid doing black face was, will now be eaten alive and shunned by her own.

It's what they fucking want.
Eaten alive

Do you hear yourself? How many movies do you think she’s been in? She’s gonna be fine and no one ITT is calling for her to lose all future roles over this. A company chose not to associate itself with someone with a history of blackface. That’s not some injustice, she will find plenty of work. Sarah gonna be fine
 

Slayven

You probably post about me on another board.
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Oct 25, 2017
35,539
Folks racing to talk about "cancel culture" is just a way to shout down conversation
 

kvetcha

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,160
And that's the rub. Silverman's portrayal of blackface is rooted in a history of minstrel shows and taking the humanity away from people who look like me. It's the visual version of calling me the n word.

I can't say the same thing about RDJ in Tropic Thunder. If people want to get mad about Tropic Thunder, then I'm not going to say they can't. But to me, Silverman's representation and Tropic Thunder aren't similar at all.
I appreciate you sharing your perspective with me.
 

Miller

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
949
Just thought I'd chime in with some context here for the ongoing conversation.

The Sarah Silverman Program is based directly on Sarah Silverman's then stage persona -- an ignorant asshole. The character has no job, mooches off of her sister, refuses to contribute to society in any way, and is constantly getting into trouble and "learning lessons" (which usually just further entrench her existing views.) The idea is that the audience laughs at the character, not with her, as she goes out into the world woefully unprepared for any meaningful thought. She houses a homeless man in her apartment in a ploy to divert attention from her sister's boyfriend receiving an award (and drives the homeless man to insanity in the process), she becomes homeless herself after misplacing her keys, she gets imprisoned for licking her dog's ass, she gives birth to a demon... The audience is not rooting for Sarah. Whether successful or not, the point of that character was to laugh at the absurdity of bigotry, not to revel in it or celebrate it. She often likened the show to an absurdist All in the Family.

In her book released shortly after the show's finale, she recounts a story of how she met the guys from Journey and was horrified when they referred to her as (I'm paraphrasing) "the girl that tells the best (N word) jokes." Since then, she has completely changed her shtick. Additionally, yeah, she has spoken at length about how she views her earlier work, and did it without a prompt from any controversy. She has devoted herself to a number of great causes, and has used her platform for good pretty exclusively in the last decade. And furthermore, her analysis of her earlier material is... dead on. She seems to get it. At least, that's my take.

With that said, I can understand why some would choose not to look past it. Just hoping these points contribute to the discussion in some way.
 

Slayven

You probably post about me on another board.
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Oct 25, 2017
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Z-Beat

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,110
Tropic Thunder was and is still fucked up but no one on this forum is gonna dare cancel Iron Man.
He gets called racist throughout the entirety of the movie, and it's revealed that he actually CAN'T shut it off, even when he's aware that it's racist.

That's like getting pissed at Mel Brooks for the 'Springtime for Hitler' thing in The Producers
 

harSon

Member
Oct 30, 2017
3,049
I feel like there's a nuanced debate that can be had about society's desire to publicly drag someone for all aspects of their history for all eternity, and how at times it can be overbearing and too far reaching. There's also a nuanced debate that can be had about comedy in modern times, and what's socially acceptable. As much as I'd love to have those conversations, I'm reluctant to because people like Sarah Silverman make it so damn difficult to sympathize. As soon as I hear bullshit like "Cancel Culture" and "PC Culture," it's difficult to do anything but roll your eyes and continue about your day.
 

Mahonay

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,580
Lancaster, PA
Doing black face for the simple sake of being edgy is still fucking racist. She is deservedly getting called out for it. Being a provocateur does not mean you get to do black face.
 

KHarvey16

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,976
I just can't see both of those twitch threads about mistaken identification of racial slurs and take the statement that "cancel culture isn't real" seriously.
 

Merv

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,845
You can’t control what you find funny when you’re watching something you didn’t make. I made a funny song once and I listen to it regularly. It’s silly and wholesome and I know I’m gonna laugh because I made it. So I’m in control of what I’m laughing about because I produced a song that I found funny.
What did you find funny about the blackface on those shows 12 years ago?
 

RedMercury

Member
Dec 24, 2017
7,831
Folks racing to talk about "cancel culture" is just a way to shout down conversation
It's funny because from that side of the fence, to them it seems like anyone with the opposite opinion can be put in the same convenient box of "well it's a personal failing on their part, they are just outraged, it's not meaningful in any way", but by just throwing "cancel culture!" out there they are themselves not making a meaningful examination and are just parroting something that to them explains everything.
 

Mahonay

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,580
Lancaster, PA
I just can't see both of those twitch threads about mistaken identification of racial slurs and take the statement that "cancel culture isn't real" seriously.
Those Twitch threads are all seeped in weird Twitch culture that is borderline obsessive. The threads about people like Alinity give me GamerGate flashbacks. Not really comparable to this topic about a prominent comedian that has done black face.
 

KidGoku

Member
Jan 6, 2018
583
We should cancel the cast of always sunny too for this shit
LOL, people would have to be straight up dopes to not realize that the characters of that show are ignorant, racist, trash people in like the very first episode. It was shown since day one.

Won't stop me from watching.
 
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metalslimer

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
3,922
This brings up an interesting point about the Its always sunny forays into blackface. They definitely regret their earlier depictions of it but they took an interesting twist with the gang turns black that I felt recognized this. That also brings up the point of is it ok if a character you arent supposed to sympathize with does it and its played for laughs? Theres is a lot of stuff from its always sunny that has not aged very well (you can definitely watch the evolution of American TV on LGBT issues through it) but I definitely do think they usually have some kind of positive message they want to convey through it which is why I dont think they deserve to be raked over the coals for things that have aged badly.

This brings me to the point that I would be far more willing to forgive silverman but that statement misses the point by making it about her being victimized
 

harSon

Member
Oct 30, 2017
3,049
LOL, you would have to be a straight up dope to not realize that the characters of that show are ignorant, racist, trash people in like the very first episode.

Won't stop me from watching.
It's among my favorite shows of all time, but let's be real. They've managed to create a show that is like 98% white in a city that is only 40% white, and for what little non-white representation there is within the show - the character's non-whiteness is a vehicle for comedic punchlines within the given episode.
 

Nepenthe

When the music hits, you feel no pain.
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
5,702
"Sticking her neck" sounds like the actress as daring or provocative as Sarah in her mind. Like black face was fucking experimental in 2007
I would read that as more she was broaching a taboo subject.

So basically, she knew it was some fuck shit and did it anyway.
 
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