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Sea of Thieves boasts highest debut for Rare game since NPD started tracking in 1995

Oct 25, 2017
2,056
I like SOT, but I'm surprised it did so well.

hopefully it makes them support the game faster, i'm waiting for a discount before I start playing it again.
 
Oct 28, 2017
62
You did it again. If you look at facts... The industry is telling you this isn't true. Simple as that. The majority of successful games released are not half baked.
If you look at the selected facts you choose to pick, sure, although: a) that doesn't negate my point in any way at all since I never said half-baked launches were the norm and b) it's not as simple as just stating that, as I explained:

I'm not disputing that the majority of games are complete. However in less than 2 years (NMS was August 2016) there's been 3 high-profile half-baked games going to market and being very successful. Prior to that, none that I can think of to that level of success. The industry is going through great change: rising dev costs, publishers having to find more income streams through DLC and experimenting with various income models and this is yet another new way of addressing those cost issues.

As I said - why wouldn't publishers look at that and think there's something in that to de-risk the massive (and increasing) costs of development? I believe that's a dangerous precedent for us gamers, although I'm heartened to hear that people are enjoying SoT.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,970
As you can read in this thread, my issues aren't related to error messages at all. And yes, I've reached out to Microsoft several times already.

Yeah, to tell you the truth I'm not a fan of your agenda here. I understand your concerns and you have every right to voice them but when your beliefs constantly trickle into every Xbox article or every Windows article or any topic about games that have to do with either it just disrupts the discussions going on. I really don't see why Rare should be punished because they work for Microsoft just because you forecast what may happen in the future and the impact Windows has on other parties. To say Sea of Thieves lacks content and other issues is fine but to continually take pot shots at Windows store is kind of being picky just because. The game is actually running very well, especially compared to other titles that rely heavily on online play.
 
Feb 5, 2018
1,671
Well done to you - but given that enough people bought the retail version for it to be at number 2, you're not representative of a significant number of people, unless there are a huge amount of those that did trial it first. No Man's sky was a runaway success and so was PUBG. It would be somewhat odd if publishers didn't look at those successes and pause for thought - why spend many millions polishing a game when you can send it out to market half baked, see who bites and then commit the remaining dev cash only if it's a success. It massively de-risks the rising costs of AAA development.
But Bluehole and Hello Games keep supporting their games. They didn't stoped because success, they kept adding and fixing their games because success. You can think that "incomplete" games can be succesful is bad or undeserved, and that's fine, but the true is that being succesful and also facing criticism tends to make developers do the effort to try to get better.
 

Yoshi

Banned
Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,047
Germany
I mean don't get me wrong, congrats to them (finally out of kinect hell) but isn't for a service based game more important how it does down the line? I know 6 people who all got it on launch, already planning to stream it and who's going to play with whom in a crew the next few weeks, all stopped playing 2 days after launch (They didn't go with gamepass, afaik). On Twitch right now it has roughly 1.500 viewers. I really hope they can bring some significant content fast enough.
Well, if a service game is sold for full price and sells very well, but has a horrible player retention quickly, it shouldn't be a problem, as long as the studio gives it up quickly enough. Because then it is not much more costly to make than a standard game and if it sold more or the same as a standard game would have, financially, everything is fine. To me, personally, the ideal situation would be good to very good initial sales, completely cratering right after and super-low player retention immediately (ensuring Rare's future, but Sea of Thieves' lack thereof). However, user numbers doubled from a million to two millions quickly and it is still played a lot, right? So I guess this is just both, a great sales success and a great success as a service.

And I still hope they bring Banjo back one day...
I wish as well, but hope is lost.
 
Oct 29, 2017
203
UK
User warned: Console Warring
I'm not surprised at all...having a captive audience with nothing else to look forward to will drive sales.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,537
If you look at the selected facts you choose to pick, sure, although: a) that doesn't negate my point in any way at all since I never said half-baked launches were the norm and b) it's not as simple as just stating that, as I explained:

I'm not disputing that the majority of games are complete. However in less than 2 years (NMS was August 2016) there's been 3 high-profile half-baked games going to market and being very successful. Prior to that, none that I can think of to that level of success. The industry is going through great change: rising dev costs, publishers having to find more income streams through DLC and experimenting with various income models and this is yet another new way of addressing those cost issues.

As I said - why wouldn't publishers look at that and think there's something in that to de-risk the massive (and increasing) costs of development? I believe that's a dangerous precedent for us gamers, although I'm heartened to hear that people are enjoying SoT.
Ok
 
Oct 28, 2017
2,824
Sea of Thieves will do well over time as well. It will drop next month but probably pick back up in May with the content drop and the weekly events will help it as well. It's definitely a long haul type of game. I'm happy for Rare with the accomplishment and looking forward to the content drops throughout the year. Weekly events with 6 major content drops (May, June, July...which has been said on the podcast, don't know when the fall one begins) for the rest of the year will definitely keep people interested in the game and will flesh out the content concerns that many have. I think it will continue to sell and bring in more gamepass customers, especially with other gamepass games dropping in the coming months.
 
Oct 28, 2017
2,741
We don't need them for that, anyways. The new Killer Instinct, as well as Retro's two Donkey Kong Country games, show that all we need for these old franchises is talented new blood that understand and respect the source material.
But who's going to do a new Banjo-Kazooie game that isn't (for the love of god) Playtonic?
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,970
I'm not surprised at all...having a captive audience with nothing else to look forward to will drive sales.
Meanwhile in the real world 9 out of 10 games on NPD show PS4 gamers playing titles available on other platforms, so why wouldn't Xbox One owners also be playing a lot of those titles? Oh wait, they are. It's hilarious to see these attempts to portray the Xbox One having nothing to play when they get a bunch of new games each month and also BC titles.

To me it's awesome to see Rare have a hit title because it means they will indeed keep supporting it. I stopped playing but will renew Game Pass when State of Decay 2 comes out.
 

Foxbat

Banned
Member
Mar 24, 2018
37
Lol. I read the title, clicked on it, and said to myself "Let's see how salty this gets". Didn't even let the first page load, and just went straight to page six.

Was not disappointed. A Sea of Salt indeed.
 
Oct 29, 2017
482
Are we not counting Kinect Sports games as "full titles" because of reasons? They were also the most successful games for Rare in a long time, especially the first one.
I think I don't have to explain why I'm not counting that.
It was release software for a peripheral that failed miserably. It wasn't marketed as a game by rare but by Microsoft Studios. Besides that it doesn't come anywhere near the usual stylistic charm or subject matter that Rare is known for.
 
Oct 28, 2017
2,824
I think I don't have to explain why I'm not counting that.
It was release software for a peripheral that failed miserably. It wasn't marketed as a game by rare but by Microsoft Studios. Besides that it doesn't come anywhere near the usual stylistic charm or subject matter that Rare is known for.
So because it didn't fit your category as a title by Rare...so basically nothing. Ok.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,477
I think I don't have to explain why I'm not counting that.
It was release software for a peripheral that failed miserably. It wasn't marketed as a game by rare but by Microsoft Studios. Besides that it doesn't come anywhere near the usual stylistic charm or subject matter that Rare is known for.
It didn't fall . It was huge on the 360.
 
Jan 13, 2018
3,290
Do we have any solid numbers?

I don't know if Rare's best selling game was under 100K or 100 million. Don't we need numbers for context and congratulations?
I have no idea about their Nintendo games, but I believe Kinect Sports had the strongest first month sales out of their Microsoft games. It did 323K in its first month.


I think I don't have to explain why I'm not counting that.
It was release software for a peripheral that failed miserably. It wasn't marketed as a game by rare but by Microsoft Studios. Besides that it doesn't come anywhere near the usual stylistic charm or subject matter that Rare is known for.
A huge WTF to all of those, but hey, knock yourself out.
 

m23

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,005
I think I don't have to explain why I'm not counting that.
It was release software for a peripheral that failed miserably. It wasn't marketed as a game by rare but by Microsoft Studios. Besides that it doesn't come anywhere near the usual stylistic charm or subject matter that Rare is known for.
You think Kinect on 360 failed miserably?
 
Oct 28, 2017
9,997
I think I don't have to explain why I'm not counting that.
It was release software for a peripheral that failed miserably. It wasn't marketed as a game by rare but by Microsoft Studios. Besides that it doesn't come anywhere near the usual stylistic charm or subject matter that Rare is known for.
kinect failed on the X1
kinect was forced as part of the X1 because it was wildly successful during the 360
 

ghostcrew

Spooky
Moderator
Oct 27, 2017
6,708
United Kingdom
I think I don't have to explain why I'm not counting that.
It was release software for a peripheral that failed miserably. It wasn't marketed as a game by rare but by Microsoft Studios. Besides that it doesn't come anywhere near the usual stylistic charm or subject matter that Rare is known for.
As of 2013 Kinect for Xbox 360 had sold 24 million units. That's twice as many Kinects as there are Switch consoles in the world. I wouldn't say the peripheral failed miserably... Kinect Sports was a massive game.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,957
The Danger Zone
I bought the game for 60 while a lot of my friends/xbone owners ive met played it using game pass.

I can safely say the sales are undeserved. Havent played it in a while especially with other games out right now.

May Rare swiftly get content updates out or theyre going to put these sales to waste.
 
Oct 27, 2017
4,598
Dance Central did even better than Kinect Sports, and both Xbox 360 Kinect Sports games did really well, selling 8 million copies.
That's right. I even had that game lol
DC actually was good for the Kinect. It actually worked decently.

When you mention those sales, no wonder MS put all their eggs into the Kinect basket. They really thought they had gold with this gimmick.
 
Jan 13, 2018
3,290
That's right. I even had that game lol
DC actually was good for the Kinect. It actually worked decently.
Yup, and so did Kinect Sports, it was one of the best Kinect games. In fact, I've experienced more issues with Kinect Sports: Season Two, although that still performed well most of the time, especially compared to some lower grade Kinect software.
 
Oct 29, 2017
482
Sold units are not the same as a successful periphery.
Most of the Kinects were sold in bundles and lord knows the quality of games released specifically for it was sub par (Yes, that is an opinion).

Back on the Rare subject. It's just my opinion that a range of sports mini games can hardly be called an IP.
It's not what I would judge Rare on when it comes to "best new IP".
 
Oct 27, 2017
634
Good to see that SoT did well, but man I'd be lying to say I wasn't disappointed. Hopefully the planned content will actually be good to reel me back in. Still rooting for Rare though, I feel like they can bring this back. Time will tell.
 
Oct 26, 2017
5,284
I haven't had a problem getting a four-person crew among friends at any point since launch, and there are more people I know playing it now than the first two weeks. It's exciting seeing that it's a broader success. The game structure not being about blocking playability or zones based on how long you've been on the hamster wheel is absolutely core to why people in my circle have been engaged by it.
 
Oct 27, 2017
4,422
How interesting. A game that was made available on the game pass right at launch and it is also one of Rare's biggest game debuts as well? I wonder if this means that the plan with game pass was onto something and how other future MS games that follow this may be just as successful? or if it was just fans who were that interested in the game itself. Either way though, kudos to Rare on their success and hopefully they will continue to support the game and add more stuff in.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,583
Portland, Oregon
But they did. It's common knowledge that they're not interested in going back to their old IPs if they can't do something new with them, and that's completely in line with their legacy of constant innovation and reinvention. Besides, the series that their old fans want them to return to - without making any significant changes to them, of course - are now 15-20 years old.
Yes they did, you just didn't like it as it wasn't "Banjo Tooie but different yet fully the same". Or "Conker's exactly the same, yet also different.".

Rare never really got a fair chance, for goodness sake just after they were bought the rumours were already :"Nobody of old Rare still works there, most sticked with Nintendo! HAH, MS bought a shitty shell!". Even though back then that was far from the truth.
A remake of Conker, a mediocre PD game, and a Banjo game that barely even resembles the gameplay of the old games doesn’t exactly scream “trying” to me. I don’t think that anybody can deny that they should’ve done a whole lot more with their IPs these last 15 years.

Where’s a proper Banjo platformer? Where’s an actual Conker sequel? Where’s Perfect Dark? Not every sequel or franchise revival has to be radically different from the originals.
 
Oct 28, 2017
9,997
A remake of Conker, a mediocre PD game, and a Banjo game that barely even resembles the gameplay of the old games doesn’t exactly scream “trying” to me. I don’t think that anybody can deny that they should’ve done a whole lot more with their IPs these last 15 years.
Yeah. They should never have listened to people wanting endless sequels and focused entirely on new ips. Thats how we got kameo and viva piñata.
 
Jan 13, 2018
3,290
A remake of Conker, a mediocre PD game, and a Banjo game that barely even resembles the gameplay of the old games doesn’t exactly scream “trying” to me. I don’t think that anybody can deny that they should’ve done a whole lot more with their IPs these last 15 years.

Where’s a proper Banjo platformer? Where’s an actual Conker sequel? Where’s Perfect Dark? Not every sequel or franchise revival has to be radically different from the originals.
But 15-20 years is an awful long time in this industry. I'm sure you'll have excuses, but Yooka-Laylee was basically Banjo, and it didn't set the world on fire. In fact, many peope complained about it feeling archaic.

I mean, I really feel for fans of old games, I would also love to get faithful sequels to MDK or Little Big Adventure or Gabriel Knight, but in today's market they just wouldn't fly as high profile releases, not without some significant changes.
 
Oct 26, 2017
5,284
If Kinect for a 360 was a failure then feck knows what to make of VR sales.
So I'm about 90% sure that standalone Kinect sales were over 8 million at one point. Even barring that, someone insisting that the Kinect (360) was a retail failure isn't particularly worth listening to. Those units and a lot of the games flew off shelves in a way that showed people were happy with what they were playing. The first Kinect Sports sold 3 million standalone units as of the time the sequel launched, and the franchise total was past 6 million by september of the next year. Dance Central moved 2.5 million by 2011, which the sequels blew past within their first years on the market (I don't have data confirming that last assertion about the sequels, for the record).
 
Oct 28, 2017
9,997
But 15-20 years is an awful long time in this industry. I'm sure you'll have excuses, but Yooka-Laylee was basically Banjo, and it didn't set the world on fire. In fact, many peope complained about it feeling archaic.

I mean, I really feel for fans of old games, I would also love to get faithful sequels to MDK or Little Big Adventure or Gabriel Knight, but in today's market they just wouldn't fly as high profile releases, not without some significant changes.
i would want a sequel to twinsens odyssey, screw you