Still a common trope, unfortunately. Violence too, women slapping men in the face is seen as something inoffensive, because of the sexist belief that women are weak and men must be strong.
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Sexual Assault of Men as Comedy (Pop Culture Detective Video Essay)
- Thread starter EdibleKnife
- Start date
Literally the whole movie is about this though. Didn't watch the video - I'll check it out soon
Great video, really enjoyed what messages it conveyed through its examination.
As a member of the LGBTQ+ community I never thought about how stuff like this has been very subtlely feeding into anti-gay sentiment for decades and decades. It's just so common that it goes unnoticed and people don't latch on to what is really being said or happening when this is allowed to go on.
I'm a firm believer that it needs to change now.
As a member of the LGBTQ+ community I never thought about how stuff like this has been very subtlely feeding into anti-gay sentiment for decades and decades. It's just so common that it goes unnoticed and people don't latch on to what is really being said or happening when this is allowed to go on.
I'm a firm believer that it needs to change now.
Yeah, that is the one that stuck in my mind. I never really thought how fucked up this was until that movie tbh.
I had just never really examined it before because it was 'normal' in comedy.
Like haha he got raped but she's hot so it's ok.
I'd have to watch this again, but I'm pretty sure the punchline to that scene was that he happened to be in the one stall at the perfect time that someone was looking for a consensual sexual encounter. I don't think anyone actually got assaulted.
I don't know, the movie actually treats that situation fairly seriously, and I thought the joke was that his friends are idiots and DON'T take it seriously.
I don't remember it well, but isn't the joke that Mark is a spineless, terrible person and ends up in that exaggerated situation out of a fear of confrontation?
I interpreted it this way as well. I think the joke worked both ways given the casting of Aniston, but ultimately the film is very clearly empathetic to his character.
I'm slightly uncomfortable about making judgements which conflate these fictional comedies with opinions on real sexual violence. Or judgements which ignore the power gap between genders when considering how this might affect victims differently.
Also people respond to uncomfortable situations in different ways, if guys want to use humour to deal with the idea they could be sexually assaulted, I don't think I have a problem using humour as an in-road into those issues. But the obvious homophobia ("drop the soap") should be condemned.
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He basically wakes up to find Natalie having sex with him without his consent (he was asleep).
Yeah I think a lot of this has to do with the fact that most men never experience the fear of being sexually assaulted. It basically never is a concern for me in my life. So it is easier for somebody with that position in life to view male-victims of sexual abuse as some sort of absurdity to turn into a joke.
Bumping this because of Brawly Likes to Brawl's other thread on it
Just putting aside how overlooked rape against men is, it's unreal to see how many different examples they used in this that poke fun at rape against men. It's disgusting, quite frankly.
Andrew Bailey made a very powerful video on this very subject. Since I'm here, figured I might as well post it.
Just putting aside how overlooked rape against men is, it's unreal to see how many different examples they used in this that poke fun at rape against men. It's disgusting, quite frankly.
Andrew Bailey made a very powerful video on this very subject. Since I'm here, figured I might as well post it.
In hindsight, I should have put a "heavy shit" warning, because that video is some heavy shit if you're not ready for it
Never heard of this guy but that's incredibly powerful and moving. Thank you for posting.
Apparently he's a comedic writer/performer of sorts. I don't know much about him, but I saw it years ago on GAF and it really stuck with me.
OP
OP
Thank you for posting this! I remember watching this video back at the old place and it really is the pure essence of how tragic and sick this media pattern is.
One of my favorite book series, The Wheel of Time, has a main male character that is raped. All of his friends that are around him, mostly women, think it's hilarious and never even attempt to try to understand how he feels. Because the series has a lot of gender role reversal, it's interesting to me how upon re-reads how absolutely uncomfortable I am reading it. Now I'm pretty sure the author did this intentionally, but man is it still uncomfortable.
And that Wedding Crashers scene is like some Gone with the Wind reversal where Vince Vaughn's character suffers through all this shit and then ends up with the woman who does it to him at the end. It's really fucked up.
And that Wedding Crashers scene is like some Gone with the Wind reversal where Vince Vaughn's character suffers through all this shit and then ends up with the woman who does it to him at the end. It's really fucked up.
The media and real life. It's a vicious cycle. The media jokes about rape against men, boys/men watch it and laugh and take lessons away from it (the lesson being that "being raped makes you less of a man"), then they go on to pass that message on to other men who perpetuate the asinine stereotype.
Toxic masculinity can burn in the deepest pit of Hell.
I've heard The Wheel of Time is a great fantasy series, and "gender-role reversal" is a damn good sell. Would you recommend it if I were looking for a book with some non-standard male and female characters in fantasy?
Absolutely. However, I can't recommend it without mentioning the criticisms that are leveled against the women in the series. They were written by Jordan, the main author, along with consulting from his wife. They can be trite, stereotypical, irritating and have constant 'tics' like pulling on a braid, smoothing out their dress, etc. One of my favorite characters, Nynaeve, has incredible growth throughout the series. There's a particular scene in the middle of the series which really hits home for me as someone who can struggle with my own temper at times. These things are noticeable but do not hamper my enjoyment of these characters.
Also when I say gender-role reversal, I'm specifically talking about the fact that many of the groups of people are matriarchal. This isn't really a spoiler, all of the magic wielders in the beginning of the series are women for an obvious reason that is revealed almost immediately.
I should also note that the series is 14 books long (with an additional prequel of sorts called New Spring). If you aren't a voracious reader, it will take you some time.
On the comical side, here is the island where many of the women who can wield magic are organized:
Notice anything?
I'm 10 minutes in and this is a tough video to get through. It's calling out some uncomfortable truths.. extremely well done so far. It's insane how many examples of the "don't drop the soap" line exists across media, even in very recent stuff. And that's just one example.
We all gotta do better.. not just folks writing entertainment. Lots of old movies/shows in here I loved when I was younger with some disgusting rape jokes that went over my head at the time.
We all gotta do better.. not just folks writing entertainment. Lots of old movies/shows in here I loved when I was younger with some disgusting rape jokes that went over my head at the time.
It's one of my favorite fantasy series but it definately comes with flaws. The way Jordan writes women is actually one of the biggest for a lot of people. They all tend to be incredibly stubborn, petty, single minded and downright stupid a lot of the time. They also look down on men constantly and berate them all the time. People make the argument that it's realistic for a society that's been dominated by women for centuries but for the average reader it can definately get grating when almost all the women act this way.
I'd definately give it a chance if that sort of thing doesn't bother you. Keep in mind though that it's 14 books long and there's a fuck ton of filler.
Yeah When I read the series it grated on me a bit but once I changed over to thinking that Its pretty much what women had to put up with way back when with dudes so flipping it makes sense when society heavily favors the other gender. I had little to no problems with it after that because I was an avid reader of history and a hilarious portion of it is made by petty dudes checking each others Egos so I have no doubt if the gender was flipped it would be petty women checking their egos and changing history.
The same prison-rape joke over and over and over again. It's mind-numbing and groan-inducing. Also, "Get Hart" is the worst piece of trash imaginable.
I think of that scene from time to time. It's just stuck in my head as like "really, that's the outcome to that?" He's literally raped by his ex girlfriend and they're like "oh well, guess he didn't manage to go 40 days without sex", she wins the betting pool, and heads toward the typical romcom final act where we have to get the couple back together.
"You were raped Mark"
"No I wasn't, she didn't put anything in me"
"Nobody said anything about bum rape Mark, just normal rape"
I give it a pass because it had one of my favorite hockey icons.
But honestly, the extended cut ruins many of the film's scenes, most notably this one. The original version just comes across as a jab at the cruising community, continued in There's Something About Mary.
I love this YouTube channel. It's extremely informative on topics that I thought I knew and others that makes me question our media choices. This one in particular is interesting and seeing all of those "jokes" back to back shows me how problematic and hackney they are. But, if I were to be completely honest, The Wonderful World of Gumball one made me chuckle inadvertently.
I got around to seeing this, and it's very eye-opening to how much of a problem this actually is. It's telling I'd become so numb to this I've stopped thinking anything of this even as a man who's been sexually assaulted before, but seeing it side-by-side in such overwhelming succession from countless sources together really was sickening and I think I'm going to become far more aware of when I see this creep up now.
It's insane how much this stuff gets put to the side and ignored.
Even on this forum, this post has been up for over a week and there's not even 2 full pages of discussion on it.
Even on this forum, this post has been up for over a week and there's not even 2 full pages of discussion on it.
Pop culture detective always makes me think how utterly fucked up vast amounts of our media/entertainment are as soon as you barely scratch the surface.
It makes me feel ashamed for having enjoyed a lot of those movies without noticing or questioning these highly questionable elements.
That even something as seemingly innocent as Paddington is t free of it just highlights the pervasiveness of the overall problem.
It makes me feel ashamed for having enjoyed a lot of those movies without noticing or questioning these highly questionable elements.
That even something as seemingly innocent as Paddington is t free of it just highlights the pervasiveness of the overall problem.
That was my take as well. Had a feeling that would be the case.
No one cares about male victimisation. Most 'progressive' gaming and yet few are willing to confront this societal shortcoming because men are not the right type of victims.
It really is sad this often falls to the wayside, with no one side truly championing this.
You have many """""progressive""""" types saying something to the effect of "well, it's different if you're a male". Like who gives a shit if some of the dynamics are different, sexual assault is sexual assault.
Then you have you have the MRA/redpill types, who you'd you think would be all over this considering the amount of times they've unironically used "BUT WHAT ABOUT MEN HMMMMMM" as a gotcha, pretty much going "rofl fucking pussy couldn't defend himself" or "I'd let her rape me, don't be a f**".
Just sad bullshit, all around.
You have many """""progressive""""" types saying something to the effect of "well, it's different if you're a male". Like who gives a shit if some of the dynamics are different, sexual assault is sexual assault.
Then you have you have the MRA/redpill types, who you'd you think would be all over this considering the amount of times they've unironically used "BUT WHAT ABOUT MEN HMMMMMM" as a gotcha, pretty much going "rofl fucking pussy couldn't defend himself" or "I'd let her rape me, don't be a f**".
Just sad bullshit, all around.
It's really striking to see so many examples laid out back to back to back like this. I've noticed a lot of these over the years, but never really realized how ubiquitous the trope is in media. It's disturbing how many people thoughtlessly make prison rape jokes, even around here. The underlying idea is incredibly toxic but seems baked into a lot of people's fundamental ideas about masculinity and morality.
Sansa in GoT getting raped? Outrage. Someone getting their dick cut off in the same show? Hilarious (apparently).
That Get Hard clip reminded me that there's often also a racial component to these jokes, the "big black guy in prison". I think it was in the new True Detective season too, though it was used as an intimidation for the suspect (oh seems like this was used in the video). No doubt many people watching still found it funny too.
Also when it comes to prison rape, many people don't really even see it as a problem. It's part of the "punishment" for them, they see it as deserved.
Also when it comes to prison rape, many people don't really even see it as a problem. It's part of the "punishment" for them, they see it as deserved.
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They were intended to be sick, offensive jokes. They weren't particularly funny, it's fair to say they were terribly misjudged and outright trash, but that's not a crime. Each instance needs to be judged on context and intent.
Otherwise it's a slope that leads to censorship of comedy tackling any difficult or sensitive subject.
It's generally not a good idea to use thread replies as a barometer for the importance of a topic. That's a very simplistic and reductive way of looking at forum dynamics.
A thread like this doesn't really invite the kind of superfluous one sentence hot takes the way current events/pop culture threads do. I reckon most realize that this is a serious topic but don't really have anything insightful to add.
I finally watched this and... I kinda want to throw up.
I don't understand why this is such a pervasive thing. I don't understand why so many people will go to their graves defending this "comedy." I will never understand why it's so hard to have empathy for survivors and not keep normalizing this kind of shit. I can't imagine how difficult it must be for male victims to have to deal with this kind of stuff in so many forms of media. Hell, fucking Spongebob made a prison rape joke. Fucking hell.
I don't understand why this is such a pervasive thing. I don't understand why so many people will go to their graves defending this "comedy." I will never understand why it's so hard to have empathy for survivors and not keep normalizing this kind of shit. I can't imagine how difficult it must be for male victims to have to deal with this kind of stuff in so many forms of media. Hell, fucking Spongebob made a prison rape joke. Fucking hell.