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Shadowbringers is better than your favorite FF

TheMrPliskin

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,797
Class balance is worse than ever.
Easily the worst aspect of SHB that negates whatever merit the story has.

Don't just take it from me either, last time I checked it was the consensus in game.
Why would that detract from how good the story is?

Class balance is entirely irrelevant to the story and also entirely irrelevant to about 98% of the playerbase. Plus the balance in ShB is pretty decent at the moment.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,027
Not really? The tanks are quite balanced and so are the healers now. DPS has a few balance issues but it's nothing major outside of Ninja being too weak and DRG/MNK being a little too strong. Either way any job composition can beat any content if the players are good enough. It's still more balanced than WoW.
Yep, I don't hear anyone complaining anymore. There was some rumbling when Shadowbringers first came out, but that seems to have mostly subsided.
 

Wispmetas

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
2,598
Will finish ARR tomorrow and buy Shadowbringers expansion.

Still have a long way to go, but I'll get there! This is already my favourite MMO, this just gets me hyped for whatever is to come.
 

LukarWuff

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,020
I need to push through to Heavensward. I'm in the post-base game patches atm and it's an absolute slog, just like most of the base game was. :/ Hope it's worth it.
 
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Oct 27, 2017
3,027
Complete newb here, but can you play FF14 and it's expansions offline? I'm shit at mmorpgs and with two small kids I can't dedicate enough time to justify an online pass. I'll maybe finish it over a year.
You have to always be online to play it. That said the time you're actually playing with other people isn't much unless you want it to be. You have to do some mandatory story dungeons which take about 20 minutes and some trials which are single boss encounters which go by pretty quick. Shadowbringers itself can almost entirely be played without other people. There are only three fights that require other people.
 

TheMan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,992
I'm at my first level 49 quest, only at lvl 46 though. I'm nearing the end of the base game slog and the story was picking up a bit, but now I've gotta grind to finish the last bit. Takes a bit of willpower, honestly, especially with Control, Gears, and now Greedfall on m plate.
 

Giudecca

Member
Oct 27, 2017
308
Was in holminster switch. leveling my ....5th (?) job to 80 when we had a sprout... which is odd because you lose sprout status when you have a certain amount of hours and get past heavensward.

Clearly, the player bought a skip for everything. Didn't know how to play their job, and didn't even know the basics of the games' mechanics. Never dodged an aoe, never spoke to anyone even when i was being friendly and addressing them directly (a serious problem with lots of sprouts). And i just thought to myself, how is it fun to play a dungeon and die 15-17 times and be down for most of every bossfight because you never learned the basic attack indicators...
To be fair, they could be playing on a PS4 where typing on the keyboard takes forever and don't want to hold the game up in dungeons.

Yeah, people can hook up a USB keyboard, but most people don't know this.
 

Marow

Member
Oct 25, 2017
406
I really want to link some music from Shadowbringers because it's outstanding, but unfortunately it seems virtually all videos have spoilers in them >_>'
 

Apollo

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
2,636
Class balance is worse than ever.
Easily the worst aspect of SHB that negates whatever merit the story has.

Don't just take it from me either, last time I checked it was the consensus in game.
I guarantee you that class balance has been waaaay worse in the past. And even then, you could still clear any content with any job. People are way too focused on what job composition is absolutely optimal, ignoring that even if some jobs aren’t as good... they’re still good enough.
 

Lunatic

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,042
Okay, how the heck can a XIV expansion be THAT good?

I wouldn't mind playing it but I am in no way starting with a fresh MMO at this point. Maybe I'll just watch a let's play or something. Does anyone have any good ones to watch?

Skill-up did a playthrough of the entire game + expansions for his review recently. it's all still in his past broadcasts.
 

Ashlette

Member
Oct 28, 2017
758
People who are looking for a difficulty curve would disagree. The game's main story path (dungeons, bosses, etc.) is ridiculously easy and stays that way for the entire run.
 

Keasar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,512
Skövde, Sweden
It is damn fuckin' good.

And to all the people commenting on the monthly payment, if paying a monthly fee made the other Final Fantasies nearly as good as FFXIV I'd be much more into them.
 

Augemitbutter

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,380
you can play it as a single player service game, but this game is still trying to be an mmorpg you know. Why compare it to offline FF all the time? I get it, the story is good when you've followed the game for 5+ years and everything is fresh on your mind. Just don't trick and bait people with this nonsense. Many people are not going to like endless online filler.

i have a max ninja and white mage. the combat is brain dead boring. i raid with friends in between destiny 2. combat is boring as fuck.
yes, the combat is way too easy. Only a tiny amount of content is more demanding. Most of it is attend to win.
 

antitrop

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,534
Colorado Springs, CO
People who are looking for a challenge would disagree. The game's main story (dungeons, bosses, etc.) is ridiculously easy.
I can promise you I at least died more times getting to Level 80 than I did finishing any other Final Fantasy game.

By probably a pretty significant margin, too. I don't know what you would consider challenging or difficult for a Final Fantasy game, but I had more trouble learning and getting through 14 than anything like the 3 or 4 DS remakes or the original NES/Famicom games.

Dodging AOEs and figuring out mechanics while keeping up proper rotations isn't the easiest shit in the world, I dunno. Actual reaction time and reading of tells are required. I think it deserves more credit. That you even have to think about where you're standing is a level of mechanical complexity that most other games in the series don't even attempt. Most FF games have no more thought to positioning than "Front Row or Back Row".
 
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DNAbro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,217
you can play it as a single player service game, but this game is still trying to be an mmorpg you know. Why compare it to offline FF all the time? I get it, the story is good when you've followed the game for 5+ years and everything is fresh on your mind. Just don't trick and bait people with this nonsense. Many people are not going to like endless online filler.



yes, the combat is way too easy. Only a tiny amount of content is more demanding. Most of it is attend to win.
why compare literally any game ever. Why do people do GOTY lists?
 

Chromie

Member
Dec 4, 2017
811
This is Yoshi P's and Masayoshi Soken's magnum opus. And every other person on the XIV team. I unironically believe this game is better than the single player titles in the series as of the latest expansion. Everybody should play it. Everybody. This is possibly the best FF ever. Something something slog before Shadowbringers. Just play the game. Play it and know it pays off in spades.

Yes, better than
VI
VII
VIII
IX
X

Fight me. It's that good. One of the best games of the generation and contender for best FF of all time. How's that for a comeback story?
so it’s not better than XII? Good to know.
 

Phoenixazure

Member
Oct 27, 2017
509
you can just pay 1 month and play it like its a singleplayer game like me, ill be back for the next expansion again and again
It’s funny cause the main producer himself says the game is designed in a way for you to unsub and come back after a few patches/expansion comes out. Hell he joked in e3 that Shadowbringers should hold you over until the FFVII remake comes out
 

Calvarok

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,042
i watched someone play through it and it didnt seem that great tbh. putting aside the awkward mmo emotes used for most cutscenes, it just seemed like a v standard jrpg story. not that it seemed bad, but i dont get the excitement people have about it.
 
Oct 27, 2017
895
I'd place it in the top 5 somewhere, though I'll wait for the rest of the 5.x content to know for sure. Some of the best stuff in Heavensward came during the patch cycle, after all.

Something like

1. IX
2. VI
3. Shadowbringers
4. XII
5. VII

I'd probably put Heavensward at like 6, too, as each expac is really like a full game.
 

Critch

Member
Dec 10, 2017
686
Okay? if you want to put it on your goty list no one is going to stop you. Just don't fall for simple brand names.
The brand name has nothing to do with why its good. It's got a ton of fan service, true, but the music, story (Post ARR), art...IMO, its certainly better than the majority of FF games, especially in the last few years. Best MMO currently running period.

Been hilarious and a bit sad watching the hoopla about WoW Classic at the same time as people complaining about having to go through the story in FFXIV. The worst FF ever gets is ten times better than that.
 
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OP
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Zen

Zen

Member
Nov 1, 2017
3,478
Speaking of ARR, I can pinpoint the level and the part of the story where it clearly kicks up a notch and that's right after the horrendous series of quests around level 30 to 34 that have you running about for no particularly good reason across a long map, which everyone hates. I should probably do a playthrough on an alt just to see how long it would take me to reach this point. Before this, the story is setting up the main cast and the conflicts Eozea is facing, which is why if you're looking to be thrown into action it will be slow. The latter half of ARR is honestly great and the job questlines have good stories as well, some featuring characters that will be prominent later.

When ARR first launched a lot of people were singing the story's praises not unlike today. So as far as story is concerned ARR isn't a horrible slog. It's the quest structure that's the culprit. The dev team learned from that and subsequent expansions have considerably less quests to get through and more cutscenes (and CG prerendered sequences).

That being said. You need to be able to push the fear of missing out mentality away and enjoy the game for what it is, not for what eventually comes. Yeah the thread title is hyperbolic, but that's me being a big dumb fan of the thing. I love the game because when I started playing I already enjoyed the presentation of the cutscenes and dialogue, and the cast grew on me. If you're playing to rush towards the expansions then you deny the game any level of investment in the cast and narrative that they all stem from. Basically if you dislike reading, dislike the prose of the characters, or dislike that cutscenes aren't always fully animated and voiced and demand that kind of presentation from your gaming experience, then you will have a hard time enjoying XIV's story and cast. And if you completely despise the combat system, then you will also have a hard time enjoying the game.

And on the topic of combat- it isn't push the right buttons in the right order over and over. It's push the right buttons in the right order in the best situation while dodging a huge area of effect zone attack while setting up your resources for the next attack phase while breaking the tether the boss just put on you and another person that would kill you both if you don't break it soon enough. Or it's keeping your tanks healed and proactively guarding them from the attack the boss is telegraphing, or keeping them alive through a huge pull of monsters that would chew through them if you aren't prepared. Or it's keeping enemies off your party and shielding them with a skill when the boss fight isn't going so well and it shoots off an attack that might otherwise wipe the party. There's a lot of situational skills and playstyles supported by different jobs and wringing it down to pushing buttons in sequence is disingenuous. Combat at lower levels is simplistic compared to higher level combat, but that seems like RPG 101 if anything.

ARR is a good game. It wouldn't have succeeded if it weren't. There are parts of it that are annoying to get through, and I believe this is because of the quest structure and number, which are slated to be addressed at some point in the next year or so with a revamp of the base game content. The story is very good. The cast are good. If you absolutely hate the combat, or the presentation of the cutscenes, or hate having to read, then yeah, this game probably isn't for you. That's not going to stop me from yelling about it being the best FF, because it is. Yes it's hyperbolic, but I'm not even downplaying or attacking the other FF titles. It really is just that good, and it's because it has taken the time to set up the world and characters that are in it, and has grown and challenged them many times already before this expansion. Shadowbringers is payoff for all of that in massive, massive spades.
 

MochaKoffee

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,116
I haven’t played it but I’m still going to conclude that Tactics is better.
Yeah, actually. I would still put Tactics over it, personally.
There's some cool Tactics fanservice in there from that time they had Matsuno write some raids, though.


Can I skip ahead to Shadowbringers if I've never played the base game before?
You can, but you shouldn't. The story builds upon itself from the very start, and it'd be like jumping to the last third of a book.
 
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Apollo

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
2,636
Can I skip ahead to Shadowbringers if I've never played the base game before?
If you pay, then yes you can. I wouldn’t recommend it if you’re looking for the best FF story since you won’t have any attachment to the characters, but if you just want to get cool armor and play the endgame, go for it.
 

trimon

Member
Oct 25, 2017
206
Thanks for the answers. I will need to find a way to fit this into my life. Or maybe just youtube it, I dunno if that's a good idea.
 

Saikyo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
800
Yeah, sure, you just need to pay the game+subs and throw away 70 hours to get to the "good parts" (when in that time you can finish 2 jrpgs already), no thanks...
 
Oct 25, 2017
9,061
North Carolina
Better than most for sure. Hopefully they really do cut down the 2.0 slog in a big way because 3.0 is fantastic, 4.0 is good, and 5.0 is beautiful. I want people to experience it because its worth it, but not with 2.0 in its current form.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,476
I bought into the hype, preordered, liked what I was playing, or the idea of it and the possibilities of where it'd take me, but it (vanilla, beginning of the game) became boring after a while and a bit of a chore to think about booting it up. Then I got a message about my subscription ending which I honestly didn't realize I had to keep paying for (just took me by surprise, I don't disagree with it) and that sealed my will to discontinue for a while.

Heard about a condensed version/patch of the vanilla campaign being talked about which would help me get back in. I really want to play the good stuff.