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Should Persona 5 Royal remove the problematic stuff in this new version?
- Thread starter ImNotAFroot
- Start date
Yes.
What I don't understand is how the devs don't realise how the LGBT representation and jokes undermines whats always seemed to be themes of the Persona series. A group of people that feel unwelcome by society, taking off the mask of society and getting those around you to accept who they are.. it's always part of Persona. By mocking LGBT Persona 5 just completely flops on its thematic front. 'Be true to yourself! Unless your this... Or this....'. 'Rise together through society's constraints!!! Oh no not you you're just a joke and defs not welcome'. Like, it isn't just problematic, it actively ruins the narrative and motifs it tries to ride on.
What I don't understand is how the devs don't realise how the LGBT representation and jokes undermines whats always seemed to be themes of the Persona series. A group of people that feel unwelcome by society, taking off the mask of society and getting those around you to accept who they are.. it's always part of Persona. By mocking LGBT Persona 5 just completely flops on its thematic front. 'Be true to yourself! Unless your this... Or this....'. 'Rise together through society's constraints!!! Oh no not you you're just a joke and defs not welcome'. Like, it isn't just problematic, it actively ruins the narrative and motifs it tries to ride on.
If they don't want to remove the problematic gay dudes because of the clear homophobia, they should at least still remove them because they literally don't fit into the rest of the game.
They were just wheeled in and out a couple of times and didn't lead to anything worthwhile. P5 definitely needed to trim some fat and if P5R is gonna add even more they better cut some stuff for the sake of the game's quality. THIS SHIT SHOULD BE THE FIRST TO GO.
Honestly don't have much hope for the Ann stuff changing because that would require Atlus to change it on purpose.
They were just wheeled in and out a couple of times and didn't lead to anything worthwhile. P5 definitely needed to trim some fat and if P5R is gonna add even more they better cut some stuff for the sake of the game's quality. THIS SHIT SHOULD BE THE FIRST TO GO.
Honestly don't have much hope for the Ann stuff changing because that would require Atlus to change it on purpose.
What new girl outfit? The one in the short teaser we barely get to see?
There's the official render too. I'm personally fine with the outfit.
Anyway, yeah they should remove the homophobic stuff at least but...I've got a feeling those two NPCs will re-appear at the new year event in P5R.
Um, I wasn't trying to imply otherwise? I've made that very same point about the japanese LGBT+ community multiple times in the past, I was just responding to the context of western players trying to forward complaints to Atlus USA so the japanese offices can become aware of them (i.e they probably don't care what we think). Maybe I should have been clearer about this in my initial post by saying they've been ignoring the japanese LGBT+ community's complaints for years now too, and that the best thing to do in regards to this situation is to try and elevate their voices where possible (as I've seen multiple activists suggest).
Apparently there was a new P5R trailer that flew underneath my radar.
Do we have any word about western release yet?
Well, friend, there's a whole thread about P5R! Sadly here we're looking at a 2020 release. |:
here's the thread
Yes. Editing is good and exists for a reason. If Atlus proper is too bone-headed to fix their mistakes, then at the very least, the localization team should step in and fix their mess.
2020? But the entire game is already localized! How long could it take them to localize whatever's new which can't possibly be that much, right?
I have no idea why, they might be re-recording everything to accomodate the new character. Just hoping they can get the same English voice actors for the new stuff too.
Persona is simply too scared of alienating its core audience to actively engage with the themes it wants to address. Business, at the end of the day, trumps all.
I remember reading this article from 2 years ago which addressed the problems I had with Persona 5 and it's characters. I feel it's relevant again now that Royal has been announced.
https://waypoint.vice.com/en_us/art...rginalized-underdogs-without-queer-characters
https://waypoint.vice.com/en_us/art...rginalized-underdogs-without-queer-characters
Oh God, sorry! >.< I'm dumb. I apologize for calling you out and I thank you for calmly explaining that. >__>
When it comes to Persona 4, playing through it as a queer teen and slowly realizing that Kanji's story is *not* a story about accepting your queerness, in fact, that the director was clearly homophonic, was fucking heartbreaking. Like watching a car crash in slow motion. I don't even understand how can you weave a story about accepting yourself and fighting against the society's constraints and just pour this amount of ignorance and hatred into it.
I've become so edge about Japanese games since then, that I when I realized what The MISSING is *truly* about I was shocked and felt racist for not expecting a queer story from Japan.
Of course they should! Persona 5 has very little outright awful content to remove... It could be done with absolutely no one even realizing it was there to begin with if they hadn't played it before. This is a very very easy win for them, so I look forward to seeing how they screw this up and somehow make it worse (I'm guessing it'll be a beauty pageant and a trans woman will be one of the contestants and she'll be shamed off the stage)
They should, but like many here how Atlus handled Catherine: Full Body does not fill me with a lot of confidence.
Yup. P5 is maddening on how it doesn't understand its own core theme, or refuses to understand it in the name of tropes.
Man, certain people have it bad in society, huh? Haha, gay men are sexual predators! Also, isn't it funny your friend is being harassed by them? Leering at our female friend is ok because we aren't a teacher in a position of power, I guess? Oh wait, teachers dating students is A-Ok!
Like, what they hell are you trying to say when your message goes all over the place?
Should they? Absolutely! But the question for them will not be "Should we?" but rather "Do we have to?" and, in that regard, not toning them down likely won't reduce critical reception or sales so I'm doubtful that they'll do it
You're saying "but think of the overpriced merchandise sales!".
They absolutely should because I won't be buying it otherwise. But I doubt Hashino is the only one to blame at Atlus. I have a feeling there's a boy's club there that shares Hashino's garbage, regressive views and it's going to take a lot of work and a hit to the bank account -- and perhaps only with Sega's intervention -- to clean house there.
Those are three different issues, though. I don't think a thread asking if Atlus should remove the Kawakami romance from the game for being "problematic" would have everyone saying yes.
This is what's so frustrating about Ann. A femme fatale is supposed to have agency and control, but they insisted on making Ann submissive at every turn.
Yeah... fanservice dollars are more important than the core theme, that much is clear.
I still can't get over how tacky that looks. Like, if you just have to do a sexy figure, "chick and motorcycle" can be done so much better.
They undercut Ann's character for the sake of embarrassment being "cute". I mean, Makoto already takes the "embarrassed about outfit" slot, so the need to repeat it with the femme fatale is not only dumb, it's redundant.
Yes the two gay characters should just be removed its offensive and it serves no point.
However.....
2/3rds of the people in this thread or more with buy P5R.
There is nothing offensive about Kasumi's outfit. A gymnast in a leotard is just crazy!
I think everyone agrees that P5 had content we might not have all agreed with, however its the best selling game in the history of the franchise so......
However.....
2/3rds of the people in this thread or more with buy P5R.
There is nothing offensive about Kasumi's outfit. A gymnast in a leotard is just crazy!
I think everyone agrees that P5 had content we might not have all agreed with, however its the best selling game in the history of the franchise so......
Right??
It pisses me off soo much that a modern set story with a modern plot is totally wasted on the goobers writing their ironically shitty opinions into character arcs that try to challenge it.
I had kind of hoped the thread was bumped because Atlus West was going to somehow be able to remove it, but I figured it wasn't realistic. :(
They have a chance to mess around with the localization again but I doubt it
Yeah, but even then I have a hard time seeing how they change it to not be awful given what's still happening on screen (the guys chasing after Joker and Ryuji).
