So, is toothpaste and mouthwash a scam?

Saad

Member
Oct 27, 2017
218
I actually just got back from my cleaning. Hygienist asked about my cleaning routine, etc. Took x-rays. Dentist looked at my teeth. No cavities, no whatever, and to be fair. I've been pretty lax. I basically stopped flossing years ago, i'll brush once a day, but lightly, and rarely use mouth wash. Gums were 3mm and lower, very little build up below bottom retainer, etc. No issues were brought up. Maybe I should see a new dentist.
I think i read somewhere that 50% of your dental health is genetic, the other depends on your hygiene.

Although i like to brush my teeth twice daily with flouride toothpaste, i don't believe it's significantly has any benefit different than fluoride water.

^ a paper on the benefits of flossing
 

Sibylus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,219
Brushing with dry bristles is a great way to perform the same action less efficiently while increasing the chances of fucking up your gumline.
 

Polioliolio

Member
Nov 6, 2017
3,001
You know what IS a scam? When you see Crest toothpaste for example. You're looking at all the options on the wall of crest toothpastes. And despite all the box variation, they have the exact same ingredients. How is one better at deep gum cleaning and the other is some other thing when they have the same ingredients?? And that's just within crest. Now compare to 5 other brands.. what a mess. Is there really a difference? Who knows, they want your money.

I want to live in a society where science identifies the healthiest most effective toothpaste, and 50 different products and the waste that go into producing them are narrowed down to a single product and then maybe one or two variations for flavor. Same with vitamins and supplements. That whole industry is mostly a scam. Blast that down to a handful of products useful for someone who needs them.
 

Redowl

Member
Oct 30, 2017
321
New York City
I have mouthwash that I barely use. I just brush twice daily with my electric toothbrush and floss before bed. No cavities and haven't had a checkup in years. Mouthwash is definitely a scam.
 

Sandstar

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,433
Well, what are the studies and benefits of these? All it seems is toothpaste fluoride your mouth. That is if your country fluorides the water for you. Can't you use generic mint to freshen your breath?












 

thepotatoman

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,444
Denver
Soap is a scam too. If you wash your clothes regularly and have a quick shower every so often, you'll be golden.

A lot of the so called necessities like soap, toothpaste, toilet paper are just capitalist scams.
This is just capitalist propaganda to get poor people to settle for less and to not think about your impact on your fellow people.

Soap, toothpaste, and toilet paper for all is the true position of the proletariat.
 

sapien85

Member
Nov 8, 2017
3,242
I didn't use toothpaste enough as a teen and my teeth are shit now. Also not every state or country has fluoride in water.
 

Triscuitable

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,035
Brush and floss, you weirdo.

Mouthwash is floor cleaner. No, seriously, use it on your kitchen floors and counters. Mix it half-and-half with water in a spray bottle, and your surfaces will clean up super easily and smell amazing.
 

Lashes2ashes

Member
Dec 18, 2017
410
Roseburg Oregon
I actually think flossing is more important than brushing (but obviously you should brush). I don't really have any data to back this up, it just feels like it's doing more for my mouth hygiene.
You might want to do some research on that lol. Most of the claims dentists use for flossing have no science to back them up at all. Outside of getting food particles out from between teeth flossing is pretty much worthless.
 

QisTopTier

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,097
Brush your fucking teeth unless you want to move onto dentures earlier in your life or die from a gum disease that creeped up to your brain
 

Terrell

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,126
Canada
Why can't you people be normal for just one fucking week? Man, y'all really try your hardest to not act like normal fucking people that don't lack common sense or basic hygiene, huh?

I use toothpaste, mouthwash and floss and I don't fucking care if any of that shit is scientifically backed or not, because I have not once in my life had any cavities or any other dental problems & my dentist is always in awe when she sees how healthy my mouth is compared to many others so I'm not gonna stop using any of that.
Consider for a moment that your fastidious oral cleaning may play a bigger part in that. You could be in a situation where you're brushing so well that a dentist legit can't tell the difference, as opposed to the slapdash technique used by others just to say they brushed their teeth, in the same way someone says they "did the dishes" because they're in the dishwasher but didn't run the dishwasher correctly/at all.

But as one of the articles in this thread said, it's a supremely low-risk and high reward situation to floss, so even if it has a "hygiene halo" despite no scientifically-verified efficacy, then you do you.

Mouthwash, though, as people have suggested, is absolute overkill and has much larger associated risks to frequent use, so you'll probably want to ditch it in spite of the "hygiene halo".

Additionally, since it was also mentioned in the thread, aside from the hair-growing areas of your body that accumulate and trap sweat and bodily waste materials, soap seriously disturbs skin pH by stripping off lipids and oils and dermatologists have been advising against using it frequently across your entire body for the better part of 2 decades or so.
Warm water, soap only in the excretion-trapping areas of the body and proper exfoliation techniques for everything else are what are recommended by physicians in that field for regular hygiene. Hell, they even recommend shampoo for every 2nd shower, at best, because it can damage your hair in the same way (conditioner was originally a solution to a problem shampoo created, as it dried out your hair). The studies have been done there and dermatologists are very clear about the "hygiene halo" there being of greater damage than good, so your feeling "icky" about the idea of not lathering your whole body in soap at every shower opportunity is largely irrelevant.
 

ElephantShell

10,000,000
Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,679
What I realized when I got older is that I used to put way too much toothpaste on my brush. Like, the amount that they show on the box is a lot, you really don't need that much on there.

Also seems like most people think not using toothpaste = not brushing your teeth. I think the question is how much worse is it to just brush your teeth with a brush and water vs with a brush and toothpaste.
 
Last edited:

Muffin

Member
Oct 26, 2017
7,460
Mouthwash helps prevent mouth ulcers for me. Got them every month at some point, with mouthwash like once every 3-6 months.
 

Biteren

Member
Oct 29, 2017
565
take it from a guy who had like 5 root canals and 2 molar extractions

Brush your DAMN teeth!!!!
 

Raiden

Member
Nov 6, 2017
1,207
Yes, you just uncovered the scam of the century, congratulations.

Toothpaste like all products involve fancy marketing that targets you to want to buy their specific version of that product.

Just like water and other essential products. Inform with your dentist if you must but please, keep brushing your teeth and keep drinking water.
 

ByteCulture

Banned
Nov 1, 2017
706
OK. My drinking water already has fluoride in it. All it seems toothpaste has going for it is the fluoride and the fact that it uses abrasive silicone to scrape your teeth. Mouth wash is just a burning sensation that "kills" germs.

Do these actually provide any tangible, long term benefits regarding overall mouth health?

Edit for those unable to disassociate toothpaste from brushing: This is not about NOT brushing your teeth. This is about TOOTHPASTE. Do you NEED to brush your teeth with it?
If you want to feel good for doing nothing, you can always buy mouthwash but it wont help you with your teeth problems.

My dentist always say "FOcus on real toothpaste if possible and dont buy normal stuff in supermarkets" and he alsos says that "mouthwash" isnt that effective. Most time i buy toothpaste from supermarkets anyway but sometime i go to pharmacies and get something else.

But Toothpaste & Floss is the way to go.
 

Fatoy

Member
Mar 13, 2019
1,473
I think i read somewhere that 50% of your dental health is genetic, the other depends on your hygiene.
I take good care of my teeth these days, but historically I wasn't the best about doing so; I avoided the dentist for the best part of a decade after having an impacted wisdom tooth extracted in hospital and having a nasty recovery where I had to pull my own "dissolvable" stitches out. When I finally worked up the courage to go back, all I needed was a scale and polish. And to date I still have zero fillings, and that extraction is my only dental work.

I got lucky in the genetic lottery when it came to teeth. But I lost on the other spin: baldness.

My best friend, on the other hand, takes meticulous care of his appearance and his teeth, but he's had something like 8 root canals and has a ton of fillings. He's been told he just inherited "crumbly teeth". But he won the hair lottery, so I guess we're about even. Plus, he can probably get dentures a lot easier than I can get a hair transplant.
 

Rand a. Thor

Member
Oct 31, 2017
9,487
Greece
You know, since we are talking about oral hygiene something I haven't seen mentioned here that everyone needs to use are interdental brushes. I had plaque build up and after the cleaning, my dentist sjggested them to me. Been using em for 4 months now alongside floss and brushing, and trust me when I say they are godly. I'm serious, the sore gums are a bit of a pain but my teeth jave never been cleaner. And along with using ice cold water my gums also haven't been stronger, my dentist was even surprised how fast my gums healed after the fact even if the receded area is permanent.
 
Oct 28, 2017
72
Abrasive force/friction is required to remove plaque. Hence flossing. Not with a water pick (that's good in addition to normal flossing, but not a replacement).

Toothpastes benefits are this. Flouride, technically if you get it in your water it's actually better than the toothpaste itself. The other benefit is fresh breath, some have some ability to kill germs. But generally it's just the plaque removal from brushing.
you are mostly correct. but i wouldn't go as far as to say that "abrasive force" is needed. in fact, most tooth brushes, including soft ones are far too hard and abrasive. the vast majority of people brush too hard, which actually can cause recession, bone loss, and loss of tooth structure on the front surfaces of the teeth. use an extra soft toothbrush, and be thorough, but DO NOT BRUSH HARD. 45 degree angle / \ on the top teeth and \ / on the bottom teeth, smooth circles and involve about 1mm of gum tissue, but again, DO NOT BRUSH HARD. spend a good two minutes doing this. regular toothbrushes are only inferior to electric due to the operator of said toothbrush not doing it correctly, nor for the appropriate amount of time.

alternatively use an electric tooth brush that can (a) tell you if you push too hard, and (b) time you to make sure you do it for 2 minutes.

As for toothpaste, in my opinion it is a adjunct to brushing and flossing. tooth paste will certainly help make your breath smell better, if it has fluoride in it it will certainly help with cavity prevention, but it is not an analog to soap, at all. brushing without toothpaste is, in most cases, almost as good as brushing with a toothpaste, but everyone is different.

going to the dentist is essential because it's basically impossible to get all of the plaque removed from your teeth with brushing and flossing, you always leave things behind, and the plaque calcifies and sticks to the teeth, and at that point is not easily removed (ie, you need your hygieniest to scale it off). calculus ("tartar") harbors bacteria and exacerbates the process of gingivitis occurring, this can then transition to something far more nefarious where you lose the bone that holds your teeth in.

there are like 10 factors that can lead to tooth decay, and the same can be said for periodontal disease. genetics, the makeup and amount of saliva you produce, how hypotonic it is, the pH of your mouth, medical conditions and medications, the typical microbiota that are in your mouth, the makeup of your enamel and how strong it is, the anatomy of the teeth and mouth and the alignment of the teeth (ie. orthodontics is not just for looks). how well you brush and floss, how often you go to the dentist. notice that only a few of those factors can even be controlled or taken into account. this is why unfortunately we have to be reactive to problems in many cases rather than proactive. especially when most dental problems (cavities, gingivitis and periodontitis) come with NO SYMPTOMS whatsoever.

TL DR; mechanical removal is far more important than ttoothpaste (brushing, flossing), but fluoride toothpaste is a good idea


oh yeah, i'm a dentist btw
 
Last edited:

Aztechnology

Community Resettler
Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
7,962
you are mostly correct. but i wouldn't go as far as to say that "abrasive force" is needed. in fact, most tooth brushes, including soft ones are far too hard and abrasive. the vast majority of people brush too hard, which actually can cause recession, bone loss, and loss of tooth structure on the front surfaces of the teeth. use an extra soft toothbrush, and be thorough, but DO NOT BRUSH HARD. 45 degree angle / \ on the top teeth and \ / on the bottom teeth, smooth circles and involve about 1mm of gum tissue, but again, DO NOT BRUSH HARD. spend a good two minutes doing this. regular toothbrushes are only inferior to electric due to the operator of said toothbrush not doing it correctly, nor for the appropriate amount of time.

alternatively use an electric tooth brush that can (a) tell you if you push too hard, and (b) time you to make sure you do it for 2 minutes.

As for toothpaste, in my opinion it is a adjunct to brushing and flossing. tooth paste will certainly help make your breath smell better, if it has fluoride in it it will certainly help with cavity prevention, but it is not an analog to soap, at all. brushing without toothpaste is, in most cases, almost as good as brushing with a toothpaste, but everyone is different.

going to the dentist is essential because it's basically impossible to get all of the plaque removed from your teeth with brushing and flossing, you always leave things behind, and the plaque calcifies and sticks to the teeth, and at that point is not easily removed (ie, you need your hygieniest to scale it off). calculus ("tartar") harbors bacteria and exacerbates the process of gingivitis occurring, this can then transition to something far more nefarious where you lose the bone that holds your teeth in.

there are like 10 factors that can lead to tooth decay, and the same can be said for periodontal disease. genetics, the makeup and amount of saliva you produce, how hypotonic it is, the pH of your mouth, medical conditions and medications, the typical microbiota that are in your mouth, the makeup of your enamel and how strong it is, the anatomy of the teeth and mouth and the alignment of the teeth (ie. orthodontics is not just for looks). how well you brush and floss, how often you go to the dentist. notice that only a few of those factors can even be controlled or taken into account. this is why unfortunately we have to be reactive to problems in many cases rather than proactive. especially when most dental problems (cavities, gingivitis and periodontitis) come with NO SYMPTOMS whatsoever.

TL DR; mechanical removal is far more important than ttoothpaste (brushing, flossing), but fluoride toothpaste is a good idea


oh yeah, i'm a dentist btw
Thanks, a mod should sticky this.