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2016 absolutely destroyed me and my faith in good things happening to this country, so I don't know how y'all do it.
but, what do y'all think is a realistic timeline for progress happening in this country?
Lets say BEST case scenario Bernie Sanders wins the primary, how many Senate or House candidates would you say are on the ballot 2020 that DemSoc's would be happy to vote for?
but, what do y'all think is a realistic timeline for progress happening in this country?
Lets say BEST case scenario Bernie Sanders wins the primary, how many Senate or House candidates would you say are on the ballot 2020 that DemSoc's would be happy to vote for?
Welcome new people!
Normal at this point really. Debate tonight should be interesting.
Normal at this point really. Debate tonight should be interesting.
Comrades!
I see plenty of reasons to be hopeful locally and globally, and you don't even have to look to Sanders for them. Socialism is having a moment, but more than that, people are more angry, desperate, and engaged than they have been in a long time. The climate crisis and the neoliberal order's failure to tackle it is only going to amplify that.
But what candidates are gonna do anything about it?
I feel like we might WANT it a lot, but who's running?
Whoever can (AOC might be up for it?), but politics, as it always has been, is decided first and foremost on the streets. Kings, let alone risk-averse bureaucrats fear unrest more than a vote.
no I mean like for congress and state elections
and honestly, politics are decided at the voting booth.
Again, as many possible (that'll mostly be social democrats by sheer weight of numbers, but I'm hopeful that more demsoc types and even more leftward will feel good to do it, if nothing else it's a good place to promote and build from).
Outwardly, yes. But the street is far too overlooked and oft discounted.
That's one of the axiomatic distinctions, isn't it. There's more power there than anticipated.
User Warned: Antagonizing, Encouraging Inter-Community Feuds
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man warren was thiiiis close *gestures with fingers* to being a viable chance for the first post-Fighter Pass Smash DLC but then she went and blew it
you feel indifferent to see it folks
you feel indifferent to see it folks
This is a really good video that I think nicely explains why leftism is so appealing to many people of color, and also touches on how white leftists can act insensitive towards the issues that specifically affect minority leftists. This would be a good video I think for the newbies in this thread.
Under communism, there will be no tiers.
To not let everything be jokes:
I'm not American but I hope Bernie wins.
By the way, why does so many people call not-Republicans 'the left'? I'm fairly sure Democrats aren't left leaning...
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Few people in the US are able to make the distinction between the centre-left, and the actual left.
democrats that are on the right of warren are considered right wingers to europe and latin america
They also aren't a majority of the party anymore.
The Progressive caucus is like 2x bigger.
Also this.
Though center left would still be left leaning. Just not left/far left.
What strategy?
This whole thing is stupid from both sides. And it all started from a Bernie pamphlet that wasn't even a big deal until he lied about it.
For no reason. Which bothers me very much.
She rebooted her campaign using Sanders as a launch pad. I mean, surely you see this right?
Ok?
I mean, they are competing. I wasn't mad at Sanders trying to grab her voters either. Someone's gotta win.
She smeared him as a sexist in response to his volunteer team using mild and factual critique of her while canvassing. You see what I'm getting at here?
To be fair, the media and others made those responses. She simply responded to something she herself did not leak.
And at no point did she call him sexist. To be frank, this whole goddamn thing is stupid and beyond either candidate.
Focus on beating Biden please.
"Bernie said a woman can't be president, but also he's my friend, but also I won't discuss this."
Either she doesn't realize what she's doing looks like she's trying throw him under the bus while smiling and playing nice, or she doesn't care. She then turned the question around into a "well, women can win elections better than men can" #girlboss moment, but it comes off as incredibly transparent and I can't see it helping her numbers at this point.
If she wants me to believe she thinks of Bernie as her friend, it's not working.
Come on man. Her campaign went to the press to leak the statement to the media for the sole purpose of implying Sanders said something sexist.
She released a statement confirming what her campaign leaked and refused to go into more detail both in the statement and in the debate tonight.
She doesn't have to call him sexist, she's letting the subtext do it for her. And it is stupid, and it's beneath her, or so I thought. I agree with you on one thing though. We should be focused on beating Biden. And we would be, if Warren didn't pull some stupid shit.
And the funny thing? If she actually wins the primary off of this shit, Trump is going to use this in his "Warren is a fraud" narrative. He's going to beat her over the head with "You screwed Bernie over with your lies" thing over and over again. Constantly reminding demoralized Sanders supporters how it should have been Bernie up there, but that dang Warren screwed him over. At this point, we all better hope that Warren doesn't win this primary, because she's completely alienated die hard Sanders supporters.
And if you're right? If she didn't mean for any of this to happen? Well, she didn't try to make it any better. The outcome is the same whether this was intentional or not and she only has her rebellious staff to blame.
If ya'll stay home(if she wins) because of this stupid thing you're not very good progressives or leftists.
You'd be literally taking your ball home and letting a fascist enabling mad man stay in charge.
I'd like to hope ya'll are better than that.
We're talking percentage numbers. You nor I know how many people are staying home on election night. What I can tell you for certain is that I'm not donating a single dollar to Warren in the general, I'm not canvasing for her, I'm not phone banking for her, and no one else on Sanders side will. I can guarantee you that.
For both of our sakes, for the country's sake. We better fucking hope Sanders gets the nomination.
idk maybe Warren and her staffers just ran a mediocre campaign that peaked in October but cracked under the slightest pressure and was completely unable to expand past window shoppers and well off white liberals with no interest in class politics. I'm not going to treat her with kid gloves anymore if she wants to go hard like this.
I live in a guaranteed blue state but I'll end up voting unless Uncle Joe says he's gonna capture everyone under 30 and hunt them for sport. (Biden would probably lose to Trump btw.)
I live in a guaranteed blue state but I'll end up voting unless Uncle Joe says he's gonna capture everyone under 30 and hunt them for sport. (Biden would probably lose to Trump btw.)
It doesn't really matter who I vote for in the election because I'm in a deep blue state. I will be voting regardless though so most likely yes. But it's not me you have to worry about. It's the non voters that Bernie's courted, it's the hardcore Bernie fans who feel betrayed and will continue feeling betrayed as Trump brings it up over and over. It's the young people who say "Fuck it, my guy didn't win so fuck politics".
I'm not representative of the people who won't vote unless it's Bernie, so I can't tell you what they'd do. But it's a large number of people.
But even if you don't need those people, you've still lost ALL of Bernie's grassroots movement. The strongest enthusiastic grassroots movement in history. So goodbye small dollar doners, goodbye canvasing network. Again, I hope for your sake and mine, and the country's that Bernie Sanders wins this nomination or I really do believe we're looking at 4 more years of Trump.
I'm not representative of the people who won't vote unless it's Bernie, so I can't tell you what they'd do. But it's a large number of people.
But even if you don't need those people, you've still lost ALL of Bernie's grassroots movement. The strongest enthusiastic grassroots movement in history. So goodbye small dollar doners, goodbye canvasing network. Again, I hope for your sake and mine, and the country's that Bernie Sanders wins this nomination or I really do believe we're looking at 4 more years of Trump.
This whole thing served to disillusion me about Warren. I still don't hate her, but I'm not as keen to defend her so much. The initial leak might not have been her, but boy does she sound like a hypocrite when she says "I have no interest in discussing a private conversation" when she apparently talked all kinda shit about it to her staff for them to leak in the first place. And her weak public response screams of her trying to save face at Bernie's expense.
Presumably, the idea of the truce they had was to defeat the radical centrist/conservatives field. Instead Warren's campaign risked taking Bernie down with to the potential benefit of Biden. Like, it's not the time to fuck around. We have to turn this country around hard and endangering that effort is pretty shitty.
Presumably, the idea of the truce they had was to defeat the radical centrist/conservatives field. Instead Warren's campaign risked taking Bernie down with to the potential benefit of Biden. Like, it's not the time to fuck around. We have to turn this country around hard and endangering that effort is pretty shitty.
I've been too passionate I think in some election discussions. The election circus isn't itself important in accomplishing what needs to be done. Education, motivation, organization are more critical to improving just outcomes. There are movements to build and campaigning in elections are a means to that end I think.
This whole thing just comes off as desperate and Warren's perfectly fine with what comes across as a smear, towards someone she has said she considers a friend. It's absolutely ridiculous that she refuses to provide context on what was said, she's just going with the implication that Bernie is sexist. If this hurts Bernie enough that he cannot win against Biden, I really worry about how this all will shake out because Biden is going to suppress voter turn out by a lot.
I understand that, but I also view removing centrists and conservatives from the levers of power as one piece of that puzzle. Grass roots stuff is that much more potentially effective when people in power sympathize with it.
"Is Sanders a sexist or is Warren a liar?" (note the framing) is something I heard on the radio multiple times today. In Australia. Posters in the socialism thread on a videogame forum, or even on twitter, are not the ones who have made this a big story.
Suppression was the wrong word, Joe Biden is incredibly uninspiring, I am skeptical of his ability to mobilize voters.
Biden is old and tired and a little bit senile. He has no exciting policies. He has pre-written narratives that the GOP can exploit with ease. And he's an asshole. Good luck getting that dude into office.
Oh I was gonna say ya'll are just being silly that's the GOP's special curve ball.
Yeah...I don't disagree. He's not exciting at all; he's plain oatmeal for people who think mustard is too spicy.
I thought he meant suppressing votes or something not boring.
Yes he's boring.
Yeah I got you. He's gonna lose against Trump too. Or maybe barely squeak by. Really a 50/50 imo.
Let's hope for Sanders!
No I think Biden will win.
In fact, I'd argue he would be the best shot at "winning" and helping the Senate too. He'd just suck from a policy and progress perspective compared to Warren/Bernie.
You got a lot of faith in an old man that voted for the Iraq war, defended it for the entirety of the war, championed the 1994 Crime bill, hung out with segregationists that he still admires to this day, and has no new ideas and is constantly sleepy with a crack head son who abused his position to get free money. But sure, if he gets nominated, lets hope he wins!