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Spider-Man 2018's webswinging is concerning as a Spider-Man 2 fan
- Thread starter Lady Bow
- Start date
It looks so off I'm fully expecting them to correct it before release. No way they're going to release it like that, especially after all the fan backlash.
How do you swing in an arc from that speed with only a few feet of space beneath you?
You don't, you crash into the building, which is why it was important in Spider-Man 2 to get good at web swinging if you wanted to get around as quickly and as stylishly as possible.
That's the funniest part.
It's like half of the people in here haven't watched any of footage now available after E3. There is some automation in there, but you have a ton of traversal options, and they all work seamlessly. In order to gain speed you still have to chain them together, and you can still sort of lose it with poorly timed swings. On the flip side of that, you can release higher to elevate your swinging as well but you take a speed hit. Still canned physics and animations, but it looks fun, and is quite intuitive design wise.
Like SM2 I imagine it's much funner to play than watch. You can also upgrade your swing speed, so I assume other traversal options will be upgradeable as well.
I go back and play Spider-Man 2 on a yearly basis. The physics are still fun to mess around with but pretty much everything else about the swinging does not hold up. The camera is too far away from Spider-Man. The animations are stilted. The physics, while generally "realistic", can lead to a lot of bumping into buildings and awkwardness. Even for someone who has played the game for hours on end. The webs were very rigid in their behaviour in Spider-Man 2. While I can see that Insomniac's version of web swinging has a lot of failsafes in place, I think it's worth the trade off from a playability and an immersion standpoint. Spider-Man is graceful and superhuman. If you want to feel like Spider-Man, Spider-Man is going to need to do some of the work. He should be able to send his webs out at crazy angles or at just the right moment to make sure he doesn't hit the ground. It might not be as challenging as Spider-Man 2 but it looks better, keeps your momentum going constantly, and it feels more like Spider-Man.
Spider-Man 2 isn't going anywhere. You can always go back and play around with those physics if you really want to. I think Insomniac's game will nail the feeling of being Spider-Man far better than Spider-Man 2 because of the shortcomings I mentioned. Insomniac's game has webs that attach to buildings (which hasn't REALLY happened since Ultimate Spider-Man, even if the devs claimed otherwise), a close camera to give you a sense of vertigo and speed, the ability to parkour and wall run over any obstacles, the ability to zip to specific perch spots, and the best animations for all of these actions that have ever been in a Spider-Man game. Many of these things were found in past Spider-Man games but they've never been combined together and they've certainly never been this polished.
Spider-Man 2 isn't going anywhere. You can always go back and play around with those physics if you really want to. I think Insomniac's game will nail the feeling of being Spider-Man far better than Spider-Man 2 because of the shortcomings I mentioned. Insomniac's game has webs that attach to buildings (which hasn't REALLY happened since Ultimate Spider-Man, even if the devs claimed otherwise), a close camera to give you a sense of vertigo and speed, the ability to parkour and wall run over any obstacles, the ability to zip to specific perch spots, and the best animations for all of these actions that have ever been in a Spider-Man game. Many of these things were found in past Spider-Man games but they've never been combined together and they've certainly never been this polished.
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That's what I'm saying. The person I responded to literaly said: "we were expecting him to swing forward like in Spiderman 2".
You don't. You crash to the ground, which is what would happen in Spiderman 2 (or, depending on your speed and direction, start running on the ground while holding the line, which was very cool). The reasoning that physics must be altered so that the player can't mess up is frankly ridiculous and utterly worrying.
Swing forward and hit the building mid-swing in that particular case. Please don't be disingenuous when you know full well what I mean.
Ok this makes way way more sense. I'm speaking from the same mindset and thought you were, somehow, expecting that swing to complete successfully.
I didn't though. If I understood we both shared the same perspective I wouldn't have been responding as though we didn't.
Nothing on here should ever be confused with 'all the fan backlash'.
oh yeah, easily
a lot of the multi plat games got completely different entries on the handheld side
also there were spider man games before the PS1 game
This is part of it too
The game has to find the correct attach point for the web (not many nearby), and then create a swing based on where you're heading / that point, and the player is initiating that swing very close to a rooftop.
There's a lot of things at play there along with taking player input into account.
God helps us if Insomniac or whatever studio listens to ERA for constructive feedback, especially in this nostalgia fuelled thread.
This is pretty much exactly what I thought when seeing that GIF.
edit: Don't know why I can't get rid of this stupid broken GIF link.
There have been some well reasoned and supported arguments In this op and thread...
But seeing this on the first page.... Is a really strong argument for sm2018, that's very likely going to be impossible for someone to overcome for me.
I'm fairly confident any "fan backlash" is basically just a handful of people, respectively, compared to those who really, really enjoyed the traversal. It's highly unlikely to have any significant changes at this point.
Because that's how it works.
Really. It's fine. Spider-Man is fine and fun and all is right with the world. I could swing all day in that game.
This isn't lying. The point at which you release in the swing is momentum based.
Confirmed by MHWilliams, only furthering my belief that this game will be fantastic.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eaTGfI6PUrM (deals with a little bit of everything)
Just watched this and I am just so much more hyped from his footage. Is it September already? :)
Just watched this and I am just so much more hyped from his footage. Is it September already? :)
If he didn't take a breathalyzer test after playing, I'm not buying it.
This all sounds great to me, can't wait to experience it myself in a few months.
I think that's what I liked the least from what they've shown, the combat a la Batman were it seems like the enemies are taking turns to get their assess kicked and Spider-Man just seems to be able to hover in the air for no reason. Also that attack by which he shoots web in all directions and suddenly takes out a whole bunch of enemies in the bat of an eye looks really unsatisfying and lazy way of dealing with enemies.
The combat seems like how Spider-Man fights in the comics. The hovering in the air is just them making for some combat juggling.
In any other game or brand but spider man, i totally want to do it all manually. Full control.
Id want a trigger and a reticle on the far side of the screen for each side, one in the center that's controlled by the right stick, and the control stick press for firing both webs at the analog sticks reticule, (left reticule for left hand, right for right hand, and analog stick controlled center reticule for a double web shot) and if I don't hit the building, I'm aiming for i'd splat, and if I dont pay attention to where I anchor and what side I shoot out my web, I might splat myself into a building.
I also might prefer this is an alternative 'pro' control mode even in a spider man game.
But I don't think most people would like watching spider man constantly splatter himself doing the spider hero equivalent of tying his shoes.
He's spider man, this shit is like walking to him.
Doesn't Spidey shoot out webbing to maintain his air time? I thought that was proven in a gif made from a Game Informer video during their Spider-Man coverage month.
damn, are people really asking them to change the swinging and strictly make 2 again? i don't see anyone suggesting, but instead an intense reaction guarding conversation here...
I think there's room to just discuss the similarities and differences between either mechanic in a design sense. For instance, I think the point brought up about losing momentum is an interesting one, but likewise the consideration of where you're swinging and how to react when faced with a building wall is a cool thought. Streamlining and fantasy fulfilment vs player challenge/mastery
I think there's room to just discuss the similarities and differences between either mechanic in a design sense. For instance, I think the point brought up about losing momentum is an interesting one, but likewise the consideration of where you're swinging and how to react when faced with a building wall is a cool thought. Streamlining and fantasy fulfilment vs player challenge/mastery
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I wouldn't give up what Spider-Man 2018 is for Spider-Man 2. That game doesn't hold up outside of the swing physics and piledriving criminals off of tall buildings. The former only felt good after being fully upgraded and the latter is being explicitly avoided in this because Spider-Man can't murder people.
Yup, this definitely seems to be the collision here.
If I'm not the one who's actually doing it with my own skills, the fantasy fulfillment is hollow and patronizing.
You asked me "what fan backlash". I linked you to fan backlash. This isn't the first time the subject has been breached, to the point people are expressing exasperation that it keeps being brought up. I don't have the patience or time to entertain whatever you deem to be "appropiate quotas" for backlash.
God damn.
Maybe it's just the gif but I love the warped perspective on the buildings as Spidey swings past .
The way you mentioned it made it seemed like there was some groundswell of fan backlash or something going on which couldn't be further from reality.
you can release the web by letting go.
or you can press X to jump off of it, you have options and choices
Yes, they say as much with less words in the Gameinformer "How web swinging works in Spider-Man" video.
This is an experienced Spider-Man, they don't want him to faceplant regularly, but instead keep his flow and momentum through the city going. It's too bad for players expecting a higher skill ceiling for traversal, but as you say, the more accessible traversal mechanics are meant to facilitate smoothness and predictability of movement while engaging in the combat and activities the game has to offer. So you're right that ot's a conscious design decision and not a failure of execution. Having watched the Playstation Access 26 minute footage from last week a few times now, i have to say i'm fully on board with what they're doing.
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Sorry but I can't fathom how you can think anyone (not just me, anyone else in this thread) was asking for Spiderman to switch velocity to a 90 forward dash short of you never having played Spiderman 2.
In fact what you're describing is precisely what he does in the 2018 game and why it looks so off.
Dude let it go. The game is made, the way traversal works is a design decision. They're not changing anything just because some vocal minority who've never played the game refuse to take off the nostalgia goggles.
Skill trees aren't coming back to diablo 3 either.