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SPOILERS - Second Super Smash Bros. Ultimate DLC Fighter Datamined

InASnowBoundLand

InASnowBoundLand

Member
Mar 9, 2018
3,766
Laxoon said:
If it happens, I really hope they use his Doom Eternal look.
qsdtqih7saf11.jpg

Better call backs to the original Doomguy all around with the contrast on the belly armor part and the exposed arms. Love how the grappling hook's arm is different than the rest too. 2016's Slayer was a bit too close to Master Chief in comparison.
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If they're going to go with a modern design, yeah, definitely. I think it keeps some of the hamminess of the 90s look and I like that. But personally, I would just use the classic/legacy design all the way.
 
NotLiquid

NotLiquid

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
34,734
Steve Youngblood said:
But what about Diddy and K. Rool?!?!

*Updates list to say "Being a character form the United States"*

But what about Dark Samus!?

*Updates list to say "Being a character from the United States unless it's an Echo"*

There. Now we've properly codified it.
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I don't think there's anything to necessitate the argument that western characters would be out of place in Smash (outside of Sakurai's own comment about seeing it as a celebration of Japanese gaming properties) but I don't think Diddy and K. Rool are the best examples to use here, the characters were ostensibly co-opted by Nintendo and molded into their own EAD image. K. Rool most notably has a much more sanitized design in the last few games he was featured in, although Smash at least incorporates a texture style more in line with other more "monstrous" character interpretations like Bowser. Dark Samus is also a bit of a cheat given that design-wise the character could easily pass for a recolor.
 
NeonZ

NeonZ

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Oct 28, 2017
9,369
If Doomslayer was really getting added I'm pretty sure we'd get the modern "Slayer" look, and a straight 3d version of the classic look. Both Cloud and Bayonetta had two models. The only question is whether the modern look would be from the 2016 game or from Eternal.
 
mopinks

mopinks

Member
Oct 27, 2017
30,556
NeonZ said:
If Doomslayer was really getting added I'm pretty sure we'd get the modern "Slayer" look, and a straight 3d version of the classic look. Both Cloud and Bayonetta had two models. The only question is whether the modern look would be from the 2016 game or from Eternal.
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I don't take anything for granted after they failed to give me a Beautiful Simon alt
 
kakistocrats

kakistocrats

Member
Oct 29, 2017
101
DKC and Metroid Prime characters are still first-party Nintendo IP. There's a world of difference between characters like Dark Samus and Diddy Kong who are based on existing Nintendo IP and created under the supervision of Nintendo itself and characters like Doomguy and Master Chief from games that were developed and published top-to-bottom by entities outside of Japan.

It's a major reach to suggestion that Nintendo's willingness to include King K. Rool, a character they own, means that they might also be willing to include characters like Doomguy and Steve that have absolutely nothing to do with the Japanese games industry.
 
Gold Arsene

Gold Arsene

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
30,757
kakistocrats said:
DKC and Metroid Prime characters are still first-party Nintendo IP. There's a world of difference between characters like Dark Samus and Diddy Kong who are based on existing Nintendo IP and created under the supervision of Nintendo itself and characters like Doomguy and Master Chief from games that were developed and published top-to-bottom by entities outside of Japan.

It's a major reach to suggestion that Nintendo's willingness to include King K. Rool, a character they own, means that they might also be willing to include characters like Doomguy and Steve that have absolutely nothing to do with the Japanese games industry.
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Sakurai has directly acknowledged Doom before and this DLC was chosen by Nintendo who obviously have their hand in some western development deals.

While I'm not completely sold I don't think it's to unlikely.
 

Deleted member 23212

User requested account closure
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11,225
PlanetSmasher said:
I'm going to scream. Singular examples of "that was gross" are different than a game whose entire identity is built around grimdark, edgy ultraviolence.

This pedantic "well Metal Gear has this" or "well Bayonetta has this" argument ignores the fact that those characters are functional and distinctive without the violence from their games.

Do you people REALLY want a Playstation All-Stars character in Smash? Because that's what you'd get.
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Show me which PSABR game has Doomguy in it.
 
Balfour

Balfour

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Oct 25, 2017
7,532
i assume joker's alts will be similar to this. not exact of course, but most likely referencing the team

grfAf2L.png
 
KtotheRoc

KtotheRoc

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Member
Oct 27, 2017
56,590
Are there really people who think we won't ever see a Western Developed IP getting a playable character in Smash?

(I'd have thought it was Crash Bandicoot first, but we'll see.)
 
Balfour

Balfour

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Oct 25, 2017
7,532
KtotheRoc said:
Are there really people who think we won't ever see a Western Developed IP getting a playable character in Smash?

(I'd have thought it was Crash Bandicoot first, but we'll see.)
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More less that there's no absolute guarantee there will be one in this set of DLC is all

Some say "there HAS to be one right?"

For me, nah. There is nothing to say anything HAS to be coming
 
Balfour

Balfour

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Oct 25, 2017
7,532
molnizzle said:
It would be kinda crazy if Steve never made his way into the roster.
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I never said he wouldn't

Just that there is absolutely no guarantee it will happen or something does or does not change. Like just because of the lack of western character in comparison, that does not mean we are gauranteed one soon
 
PlanetSmasher

PlanetSmasher

The Abominable Showman
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Oct 25, 2017
115,322
molnizzle said:
It would be kinda crazy if Steve never made his way into the roster.
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Would it, though? The only reason we're even talking about Steve at all is because of an incredibly dedicated bullshitter who spent half of last year lying about things and re-updating his story whenever he was proven wrong.
 

Observation Platform

Alt-Account
Banned
Dec 4, 2018
76
Balfour said:
is there any reason it would be specifically Agnes and not literally any other party member in BD/BS? They are all the same character in terms of how they CAN be built
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The game needs better female representation (not for SJ reasons, but for better diversity), and I've always felt that Agnes was the face of the series, but that's just me.
 
molnizzle

molnizzle

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
17,695
PlanetSmasher said:
Would it, though? The only reason we're even talking about Steve at all is because of an incredibly dedicated bullshitter who spent half of last year lying about things and re-updating his story whenever he was proven wrong.
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I dunno what you're talking about there tbh. I don't really follow the Smash rumor mill, only checked in to this thread to see who the DLC character was.

I just think it'd be crazy because Minecraft remains the best selling video game of all time, continues to be hugely popular with kids (even post-Fortnite), and has a massive presence in both Japan and the west.
 
Eolz

Eolz

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Oct 25, 2017
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FR
casey_contra said:
Do we think that Joker will get his school uniform as an alt?
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I can see him getting multiple skins just like other characters. Shulk comes to mind.
edit:
Balfour said:
is there any reason it would be specifically Agnes and not literally any other party member in BD/BS? They are all the same character in terms of how they CAN be built
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It'd probably be more Edea or Tiz. Agnes has more of a supporting role, and is not as important to the series tbh.
Even though they can switch jobs, I feel they all have distinct roles where switching skins wouldn't work well.
 
PlanetSmasher

PlanetSmasher

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115,322
molnizzle said:
I dunno what you're talking about there tbh. I don't really follow the Smash rumor mill, only checked in to this thread to see who the DLC character was.

I just think it'd be crazy because Minecraft remains the best selling video game of all time, continues to be hugely popular with kids (even post-Fortnite), and has a massive presence in both Japan and the west.
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Basically, the reason Steve is even a factor in this thread at all is because there was one "leaker" who continued to insist beyond all rationality that Steve was going to be in the game. First, it was DEFINITELY main cast. Then, it was DEFINITELY "Minecraft will have a stage but not be a playable character". Then it was "oh, he's actually DLC" and so on and so forth. Every time a new thing came out to debunk his "rumors", he changed his story to move the goalposts.

Yet somehow, the rumors continue to persist because that leaker was so prolific and so prone to running his mouth that his bullshit essentially sank into the public consciousness surrounding the game.

Is Minecraft popular? Absolutely. But that doesn't mean it's got a super high chance of being in the game. And honestly, it shouldn't be the criteria. "This character is super popular" would just open the doors to a generic Fortnite character or the PUBG guy or Thanos being in Smash just because they're popular, rather than because they add something meaningful to the roster from a gameplay perspective.
 
Giga Man

Giga Man

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qq more said:
I wouldn't call any leak list without a Gen 8 pokemon a red flag. The leak has a lot of red flags but that's not one of the reasons.

You know what's a red flag? Claiming all the reasons why the characters are included and revealing that they have all these games coming up. How do you even find out *that* much info so cleanly even as a leaker?
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This. It's very doubtful we'll see another Pokemon, but it's even more doubtful these leakers could get away with all this very specific info for distant future events.
 
Berordn

Berordn

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Oct 26, 2017
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PlanetSmasher said:
Would it, though? The only reason we're even talking about Steve at all is because of an incredibly dedicated bullshitter who spent half of last year lying about things and re-updating his story whenever he was proven wrong.
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We've been talking about Steve since Smash 4, honestly. It comes up from time to time.

Verge giving him more of a spotlight helps spur discussion, but it's hardly new.
 
saladdays

saladdays

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Sep 11, 2018
552
Crazy Izanagi said:
Sakurai has directly acknowledged Doom before and this DLC was chosen by Nintendo who obviously have their hand in some western development deals.

While I'm not completely sold I don't think it's to unlikely.
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Exactly. Nintendo has obviously been in some deals with Bethesda and Microsoft related to both of these franchises. Bethesda went far out of their way to get DOOM running on Switch, and pretty well at that. Microsoft set up crossplay between Switch and XB1. It is absolutely not crazy for this to happen, especially because Furukawa had already stated they plan on using Smash appearances as a kind of pull to get games on Switch.
 
molnizzle

molnizzle

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Oct 25, 2017
17,695
PlanetSmasher said:
Basically, the reason Steve is even a factor in this thread at all is because there was one "leaker" who continued to insist beyond all rationality that Steve was going to be in the game. First, it was DEFINITELY main cast. Then, it was DEFINITELY "Minecraft will have a stage but not be a playable character". Then it was "oh, he's actually DLC" and so on and so forth. Every time a new thing came out to debunk his "rumors", he changed his story to move the goalposts.

Yet somehow, the rumors continue to persist because that leaker was so prolific and so prone to running his mouth that his bullshit essentially sank into the public consciousness surrounding the game.

Is Minecraft popular? Absolutely. But that doesn't mean it's got a super high chance of being in the game. And honestly, it shouldn't be the criteria. "This character is super popular" would just open the doors to a generic Fortnite character or the PUBG guy or Thanos being in Smash just because they're popular, rather than because they add something meaningful to the roster from a gameplay perspective.
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Maybe that's why you're talking about him. I'm talking about him because he seems like an absolute no-brainer.

Adding something meaningful from a gameplay perspective isn't the criteria for new characters either. What mechanics does Joker bring? Or Erdrick? We don't know, it could be anything. Because mechanics can be designed around any character. Cloud, Solid Snake, Wii Fit Trainer, etc. weren't added because of the amazing new mechanics they might bring. They were added because they were popular, well known characters. The mechanics come later.

I also wouldn't be shocked to see a Fortnite character, but that franchise is more difficult since there isn't a defined protagonist like there is in Minecraft. I also don't know if Fortnite is as big as Minecraft in Japan.
 
Gold Arsene

Gold Arsene

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Oct 27, 2017
30,757
PlanetSmasher said:
Basically, the reason Steve is even a factor in this thread at all is because there was one "leaker" who continued to insist beyond all rationality that Steve was going to be in the game. First, it was DEFINITELY main cast. Then, it was DEFINITELY "Minecraft will have a stage but not be a playable character". Then it was "oh, he's actually DLC" and so on and so forth. Every time a new thing came out to debunk his "rumors", he changed his story to move the goalposts.

Yet somehow, the rumors continue to persist because that leaker was so prolific and so prone to running his mouth that his bullshit essentially sank into the public consciousness surrounding the game.

Is Minecraft popular? Absolutely. But that doesn't mean it's got a super high chance of being in the game. And honestly, it shouldn't be the criteria. "This character is super popular" would just open the doors to a generic Fortnite character or the PUBG guy being in Smash just because they're popular, rather than because they add something meaningful to the roster from a gameplay perspective.
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Yeah why would Nintendo care about Minecraft?



And if you can't tell the difference in the importance of Minecraft compared to Fortnite I don't know what to tell you.
 
PlanetSmasher

PlanetSmasher

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molnizzle said:
Maybe that's why you're talking about him. I'm talking about him because he seems like an absolute no-brainer.

Adding something meaningful from a gameplay perspective isn't the criteria for new characters either. What mechanics does Joker bring? Or Erdrick? We don't know, it could be anything. Because mechanics can be designed around any character. Cloud, Solid Snake, Wii Fit Trainer, etc. weren't added because of the amazing new mechanics they might bring. They were added because they were popular, well known characters. The mechanics come later.

I also wouldn't be shocked to see a Fortnite character, but that franchise is more difficult since there isn't a defined protagonist like there is in Minecraft. I also don't know if Fortnite is as big as Minecraft in Japan.
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Minecraft doesn't have a defined protagonist either. Steve isn't a character, he's a default skin that basically everyone immediately erases when they start playing. That's pretty much the exact same way it is for Fortnite.
 
Neoxon

Neoxon

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PlanetSmasher said:
Would it, though? The only reason we're even talking about Steve at all is because of an incredibly dedicated bullshitter who spent half of last year lying about things and re-updating his story whenever he was proven wrong.
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To Vergeben's credit, the only things he fucked up on for Day 1 were Isabelle as an echo & the Minecraft boss. But it's clear that his info well is now dry.
 
Balfour

Balfour

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Oct 25, 2017
7,532
Giga Man said:
No green. TRASH!

(Good idea, though.)

EDIT: I see the problem. You have an Akechi color. Strike that shit and put in a Futaba color. SAVED! :D
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Futaba is already in the game under the alias of Inkling. How about Inkling get a Futaba alt insead?

but yeah you're right. fuck Akechi. I just thought the white coat would spice it up after the majority of dark coats. And futaba would have a black coat with geen gloves/undershirt. But hey. fuck akechi
 
Kewlmyc

Kewlmyc

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Oct 25, 2017
26,670
PlanetSmasher said:
Minecraft doesn't have a defined protagonist either. Steve isn't a character, he's a default skin that basically everyone immediately erases when they start playing. That's pretty much the exact same way it is for Fortnite.
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Same with Villager and to a lesser extent, Inkling.

Have Steve be color 1, female default as color 2, and a bunch of alternate designs as color 2-8.
 
saladdays

saladdays

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Sep 11, 2018
552
PlanetSmasher said:
Would it, though? The only reason we're even talking about Steve at all is because of an incredibly dedicated bullshitter who spent half of last year lying about things and re-updating his story whenever he was proven wrong.
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Vergeben said that because it was pretty strongly speculated that Steve would make sense as an inclusion long before that. Source Gaming had been pushing him for a while.
 

Deleted member 896

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I'm going to note a couple of things in advance here. One, when it comes to potential characters there's so many viable choices that I don't expect anyone. Barring rock solid info I think any one choice is a longshot simply because the deck is stacked against any one character winning the near-lottery here. Two, I'm more concerned about what new characters bring to the table mechanically than I am in "my pick" getting in, so it really doesn't matter to me one way or another.

With that aside Steve/Alex from Minecraft is a pick that does strike me as something that in retrospect would seem obvious once announced. Further, I think the people that assume that these characters are too much of blank slates with no personality simultaneously ignore how little that matters for characters already on the roster and also that there are toylines and everything out there right now that kids play with where these ARE established characters.
 
PlanetSmasher

PlanetSmasher

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Kewlmyc said:
Same with Villager and to a lesser extent, Inkling.

Have Steve be color 1, female default as color 2, and a bunch of alternate designs as color 2-8.
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Right. That would be how you would do it, I was just commenting on the fact that "Steve" isn't a character any more than "generic character model" from Fortnite or "guy in helmet" from PUBG is.
 
Charamiwa

Charamiwa

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Oct 25, 2017
6,049
Minecraft has absolutely every criteria going for it. It has history, legacy, relevance absolutely everywhere, it's recognizable, it's iconic, it's fun, it's visually striking. You may not like it, but this is what peak Smash DLC looks like.
 
Camjo-Z

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Oct 25, 2017
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Honestly I'd like to see Steve if only for the sheer insanity a crafting-based moveset could bring.
 
PSqueak

PSqueak

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Oct 25, 2017
12,464
PlanetSmasher said:
Right. That would be how you would do it, I was just commenting on the fact that "Steve" isn't a character any more than "generic character model" from Fortnite or "guy in helmet" from PUBG is.
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Wait, the pool of characters in Fornite don't have names?

I assumed they did because you can tell there is a very defined pool of characters with specific design traits.
 
Neoxon

Neoxon

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Either way, there's little evidence backing up anyone beyond Erdrick (and even he's mostly an educated guess based on datamined codenames & previous rumors). Steve in Smash wouldn't really be my cup of tea, but I've since grown to not hate him as much (but as I said before, it has more to do with most of my own dreams being snapped out of existence).
 
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