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Squadron 42 Beta has been delayed by another 3 months

WarRock

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,031
"No one at Origin had much time to bask in the rapturous reception accorded to Wingleader at the 1990 Summer Consumer Electronics Show. Their end-of-September deadline for shipping the game was now barely three months away, and there remained a daunting amount of work to be done.

At the beginning of July, executive producer Dallas Snell called the troops together to tell them that crunch time was beginning in earnest; everyone would need to work at least 55 hours per week from now on. Most of the people on the project only smiled bemusedly at the alleged news flash. They were already working those kinds of hours, and knew all too well that a 55-hour work week would probably seem like a part-timer’s schedule before all was said and done.

At the beginning of August, Snell unceremoniously booted Chris Roberts, the project’s founder, from his role as co-producer, leaving him with only the title of director. Manifesting a tendency anyone familiar with his more recent projects will immediately recognize, Roberts had been causing chaos on the team by approving seemingly every suggested addition or enhancement that crossed his desk. Snell, the brutal pragmatist in this company full of dreamers, appointed himself as Warren Spector’s new co-producer. His first action was to place a freeze on new features in favor of getting the game that currently existed finished and out the door."

oof
 

Jiraiya

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,658
I can kinda see both sides, This is crazy how much it's delayed and what should have been out by now

BUT

A game of this scale and scope has never been done before not even close. There are going to be some unexpected roadblocks
Well... Star Citizen seems to be the example of why a game of this scale and scope hasn't been done before. Most developers would want to actually release it.
 

Rumpestump

Member
Dec 8, 2018
183
No.

Also here's a trailer for a 800 dollae ship that they just released.

The real sad part is people buying these ships actually believe other players will be on them like in those trailers having a blast. At most it will happen in big role playing spender orgs that will take turns playing captain.

Every other scenario they will sit alone in their 300 meter yachts with no one in them except maybe some AI.

No one wants to party on your boat Gatsby.
 

Tulipunaruusu

Member
Oct 13, 2018
70
If Steam took your money in exchange for something whose alpha only showed up 5 years later, I'd probably call their refund window a bit short
Alpha 2.0 happened at the end of 2015 and with big leap at the time in terms of game space. Arena Commander's space dogfighting combat mode was released in middle of 2014.

Surely Steam Greenlight has had projects with far less enjoyment and game experience provided. At least Star Citizen provided a passion for a while which truly was what people were seeking when crowdfunding this space heroine. Before they turned to refunds or just kept waiting as there was nothing else like it in this space to lure their senses away.

Squadron 42 then has to stand in comparison to the nostalgic feeling that one top experience of the 1990's brought in this type of game to people which adds extra difficulty to the already quite challenging task.

From what I gather ending a crowdfunding campaign with current day AAA game product is very rare if we take in example Shroud of the Avatar, System Shock 3, Descent: Underground and Shenmue III as examples of trying to reforge something that originally was very enticing.

I am not certain if the vanduul design in example works in a way that brings out the emotion from their dialog and interaction as with kilrathi which I guess were bit stolen from the kzinti at least appearance-wise. Hopefully Chris Roberts has learned something from the awful kilrathi in the horrible Wing Commander movie. Well they haven't shown them speaking properly yet so maybe.

At least Squadron 42 has something new to wonder about in the combination of planet technology and interactive huge ship experience tied fairly seamlessly. The return of space war campaign I have truly missed ever since my first Wing Commander experience in Prophecy ended on a cliffhanger. It was around 20 years ago so I wouldn't say it has been that long of a wait for Squadron 42 since 2013.

Meanwhile I enjoy the drama, various twists for either good or to bad and for example the upcoming Citizencon stream. The weekly news cycle of Star Citizen is experience that not many games can provide so it ain't like you couldn't do anything that has personal value with Star Citizen already.
 

Klyka

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,551
Germany
The real sad part is people buying these ships actually believe other players will be on them like in those trailers having a blast. At most it will happen in big role playing spender orgs that will take turns playing captain.

Every other scenario they will sit alone in their 300 meter yachts with no one in them except maybe some AI.

No one wants to party on your boat Gatsby.
That many players on a ship like that wouldn't even work with all the lag, performance issues etc... that would come from that.
But wait,I forget, Star Citizen is future tech. My mistake /s
 

Matt

The Terror that Flaps in the Night
Moderator
Oct 24, 2017
2,455
LOL at using strong language to deflect that ppl here whine constantly about game delays and never consider the relationship between meeting deadlines and crunch. It's not just a few thread titles, but maybe you're new.
I genuinely find this argument to be offensive.

CIG absolutely has crunch, and the dev time of this project has absolutely nothing to do with safeguarding the health and wellbeing of their employees. To say otherwise is both patently false, and a gross corruption of the actual issue of crunch within the industry.
 

Acinixys

Member
Nov 15, 2017
525
This game is more of a meme than DayZ

It's just an infinite beta

CD Projek Red has made 2 massive games in the time it's taken these guys to release 30 pretend spaceships and 1/4 of a flying sim
 

sweetmini

Member
Jun 12, 2019
779
I had not seen a development update in... forever... (used to be another dude... i think i remember there was a dudette as well... in 2014... )
i connected to the site and watched the last dev update.


The server streaming is in its infancy.... man their talk about ingame ships prices and evaluating some goals as 6 months grinds and longer are depressing... they'll adjust based on telemetry to keep the grinding times long for "long term goals" to keep the meaning, god those online games are not for me... i m all for the SP side of things. buuut i am out of topic, this is SQ42.
They have reorganized to a "staggered" development scheme, and it seems they focus heavily on sq42 now and PU features that benefit SQ42, leaving the rest more on the side.
 

Fularu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,346
Alpha 2.0 happened at the end of 2015 and with big leap at the time in terms of game space. Arena Commander's space dogfighting combat mode was released in middle of 2014.

Surely Steam Greenlight has had projects with far less enjoyment and game experience provided. At least Star Citizen provided a passion for a while which truly was what people were seeking when crowdfunding this space heroine. Before they turned to refunds or just kept waiting as there was nothing else like it in this space to lure their senses away.

Squadron 42 then has to stand in comparison to the nostalgic feeling that one top experience of the 1990's brought in this type of game to people which adds extra difficulty to the already quite challenging task.

From what I gather ending a crowdfunding campaign with current day AAA game product is very rare if we take in example Shroud of the Avatar, System Shock 3, Descent: Underground and Shenmue III as examples of trying to reforge something that originally was very enticing.

I am not certain if the vanduul design in example works in a way that brings out the emotion from their dialog and interaction as with kilrathi which I guess were bit stolen from the kzinti at least appearance-wise. Hopefully Chris Roberts has learned something from the awful kilrathi in the horrible Wing Commander movie. Well they haven't shown them speaking properly yet so maybe.

At least Squadron 42 has something new to wonder about in the combination of planet technology and interactive huge ship experience tied fairly seamlessly. The return of space war campaign I have truly missed ever since my first Wing Commander experience in Prophecy ended on a cliffhanger. It was around 20 years ago so I wouldn't say it has been that long of a wait for Squadron 42 since 2013.

Meanwhile I enjoy the drama, various twists for either good or to bad and for example the upcoming Citizencon stream. The weekly news cycle of Star Citizen is experience that not many games can provide so it ain't like you couldn't do anything that has personal value with Star Citizen already.
I’m honestly at the point where I have to wonder if you’re part of the PR team
 

Tulipunaruusu

Member
Oct 13, 2018
70
CD Projek Red has made 2 massive games in the time it's taken these guys to release 30 pretend spaceships and 1/4 of a flying sim
Well CD Projekt Red was an established game studio with resources to begin with and CIG was all but that while shaping in to their current day form in 2014-2016. When they had money to in example to establish a new studio in Frankfurt around names that brought you Crysis 3 and Ryse.

Finding and hiring hugely accomplished devs wasn't ever a crowdfunding promise but something that was stumbled upon later on thanks to Star Citizen prototype demo receiving support from Crytek in around 2011 and space ships turning out to be a resourceful hobby. Which doesn't place one of the greatest things to ever happen to Star Citizen into the realm of anticipated outcomes when the productiong began using Cryengine in North America in two small studios with the idea of creating a small, intimate studio culture.

But I wouldn't say that Witcher 3 in example had an open world that would have had any different factions to interact outside missions similar to Knights of the Old Republic or Skyrim.

Maybe Witcher 3 was huge in cut scene based content but truly exciting in the experience of going through that world? I thought in that regard it was your regular day Ubisoft game with repetitive content points. I've had no temptation to return to tha restrictive open world design after enjoying all the mission content since it was bit boring to experience even when going to get another mission.

Squadron 42 has you launching off a huge space fregatte, that you can traverse, with your fighter and wingman charactera to fight space war campaign. I wouldn't underestimate the thrill in that in comparison to a fairly passive game in Witcher 3.

Surely a new firm's first game cannot be expected to challenge +90 Metacritic AAA-production but AAA production with fairly unique and new experience either wasn't very likely outcome to begin with. For a studio that had very little except dreams and ships to sell.
 

Profanity

Member
Oct 28, 2017
289
Well CD Projekt Red was an established game studio with resources to begin with and CIG was all but that while shaping in to their current day form in 2014-2016. When they had money to in example to establish a new studio in Frankfurt around names that brought you Crysis 3 and Ryse.

Finding and hiring hugely accomplished devs wasn't ever a crowdfunding promise but something that was stumbled upon later on thanks to Star Citizen prototype demo receiving support from Crytek in around 2011 and space ships turning out to be a resourceful hobby. Which doesn't place one of the greatest things to ever happen to Star Citizen into the realm of anticipated outcomes when the productiong began using Cryengine in North America in two small studios with the idea of creating a small, intimate studio culture.

But I wouldn't say that Witcher 3 in example had an open world that would have had any different factions to interact outside missions similar to Knights of the Old Republic or Skyrim.

Maybe Witcher 3 was huge in cut scene based content but truly exciting in the experience of going through that world? I thought in that regard it was your regular day Ubisoft game with repetitive content points. I've had no temptation to return to tha restrictive open world design after enjoying all the mission content since it was bit boring to experience even when going to get another mission.

Squadron 42 has you launching off a huge space fregatte, that you can traverse, with your fighter and wingman charactera to fight space war campaign. I wouldn't underestimate the thrill in that in comparison to a fairly passive game in Witcher 3.

Surely a new firm's first game cannot be expected to challenge +90 Metacritic AAA-production but AAA production with fairly unique and new experience either wasn't very likely outcome to begin with. For a studio that had very little except dreams and ships to sell.
Okay you've addressed ("addressed") The Witcher 3. Cyberpunk?
 

Tulipunaruusu

Member
Oct 13, 2018
70
Okay you've addressed ("addressed") The Witcher 3. Cyberpunk?
I don't know when they have probably shown less of the overall current day Cyberpunk 2077 game experience than what was central to Squadron 42's hour long vertical slice demo...

I am hoping there are at least factions on the map this time around which are reactive to the player character and to their environment even when there isn't a mission going on.

If it is like Witcher 3 in most regards then Squadron 42 may end up being a more reactive RPG game world than one following the very passive nature of W3. You could guess Cyberpunk 2077 being revied +90 Metacritic with Squadron 42 exceeding perhaps 80+.

I wouldn't say it is very fair comparison when getting SQ42 even into the AAA-air would be a huge accomplishment given the tendency of reimagined classic game crowdfunded game projects more often landing into AA space and flying quite low in excitement.
 

Man God

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,225
I did stumble onto this article:












This was written in 2015. 4 years ago. A time some people claim development had barely started, and it was already at the stage where we had interviews on feature creep, missed dates, and mismanagement.
Four years is about as long as a AAA title takes to make besides a couple of exceptions.
 

inguef

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
11,307
I had not seen a development update in... forever... (used to be another dude... i think i remember there was a dudette as well... in 2014... )
i connected to the site and watched the last dev update.


The server streaming is in its infancy.... man their talk about ingame ships prices and evaluating some goals as 6 months grinds and longer are depressing... they'll adjust based on telemetry to keep the grinding times long for "long term goals" to keep the meaning, god those online games are not for me... i m all for the SP side of things. buuut i am out of topic, this is SQ42.
They have reorganized to a "staggered" development scheme, and it seems they focus heavily on sq42 now and PU features that benefit SQ42, leaving the rest more on the side.
They really set the standard for progress updates though, can't hold that against them.
 

Flutter

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,293
Spending the last week reading about Star Citizen and...

There's just so many things that are wrong with it. Feature creep, crazy delays, taking advantage of whales... I've read people in this forum rave about being able to enter a planet that's filled with cities from orbit and entering buildings, ONLY to find out that you can only land on 4-5 landing spots on the entire planet, with only one building or so that's available, that's only sparsely filled with NPCs. Not to mention you are walled off from flying to most of the areas on the planet.

Look at this Star Citizen thread from 2013.

 

Gamechanger87

Member
Oct 25, 2017
574
I don't know when they have probably shown less of the overall current day Cyberpunk 2077 game experience than what was central to Squadron 42's hour long vertical slice demo...

I am hoping there are at least factions on the map this time around which are reactive to the player character and to their environment even when there isn't a mission going on.

If it is like Witcher 3 in most regards then Squadron 42 may end up being a more reactive RPG game world than one following the very passive nature of W3. You could guess Cyberpunk 2077 being revied +90 Metacritic with Squadron 42 exceeding perhaps 80+.

I wouldn't say it is very fair comparison when getting SQ42 even into the AAA-air would be a huge accomplishment given the tendency of reimagined classic game crowdfunded game projects more often landing into AA space and flying quite low in excitement.
Star Citizen has raised and essentially spent $230M. That’s with no marketing spend which typically skyrockets these projects. It’s the most expensive game ever made is 5 years behind plan and the only thing that ever seems to get closer and not delayed is the next $800 ship to fund development.

This game will never release because there is no reason to release. They will get paid in perpetuity as long as they continue to convince people to give them money for ships in a non existent game.
 

Mechaplum

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,765
Alpha 2.0 happened at the end of 2015 and with big leap at the time in terms of game space. Arena Commander's space dogfighting combat mode was released in middle of 2014.

Surely Steam Greenlight has had projects with far less enjoyment and game experience provided. At least Star Citizen provided a passion for a while which truly was what people were seeking when crowdfunding this space heroine. Before they turned to refunds or just kept waiting as there was nothing else like it in this space to lure their senses away.

Squadron 42 then has to stand in comparison to the nostalgic feeling that one top experience of the 1990's brought in this type of game to people which adds extra difficulty to the already quite challenging task.

From what I gather ending a crowdfunding campaign with current day AAA game product is very rare if we take in example Shroud of the Avatar, System Shock 3, Descent: Underground and Shenmue III as examples of trying to reforge something that originally was very enticing.

I am not certain if the vanduul design in example works in a way that brings out the emotion from their dialog and interaction as with kilrathi which I guess were bit stolen from the kzinti at least appearance-wise. Hopefully Chris Roberts has learned something from the awful kilrathi in the horrible Wing Commander movie. Well they haven't shown them speaking properly yet so maybe.

At least Squadron 42 has something new to wonder about in the combination of planet technology and interactive huge ship experience tied fairly seamlessly. The return of space war campaign I have truly missed ever since my first Wing Commander experience in Prophecy ended on a cliffhanger. It was around 20 years ago so I wouldn't say it has been that long of a wait for Squadron 42 since 2013.

Meanwhile I enjoy the drama, various twists for either good or to bad and for example the upcoming Citizencon stream. The weekly news cycle of Star Citizen is experience that not many games can provide so it ain't like you couldn't do anything that has personal value with Star Citizen already.
I’m now taking preorders for a new version of Go. Because the last game was released thousands of years ago you will totally understand that this new game will take approx 200 years for the beta version.
 

bounchfx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
927
Muricas
Star Citizen has raised and essentially spent $230M. That’s with no marketing spend which typically skyrockets these projects. It’s the most expensive game ever made is 5 years behind plan and the only thing that ever seems to get closer and not delayed is the next $800 ship to fund development.

This game will never release because there is no reason to release. They will get paid in perpetuity as long as they continue to convince people to give them money for ships in a non existent game.
really seems this way. If it's going to be more profitable to continue to fleece people and lead them on then that is where the resources will go. It seems like they make pretty barebones progress while putting lots of effort into continuous marketing of new, supremely expensive ships targeted specifically at whales. I would love to be proven wrong and have the game come out as advertised when I backed it years ago but at this point it's more of a passing curiosity to catch up on every six months.
 

Dreams-Visions

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
15,315
Miami, FL
really seems this way. If it's going to be more profitable to continue to fleece people and lead them on then that is where the resources will go. It seems like they make pretty barebones progress while putting lots of effort into continuous marketing of new, supremely expensive ships targeted specifically at whales. I would love to be proven wrong and have the game come out as advertised when I backed it years ago but at this point it's more of a passing curiosity to catch up on every six months.
good to see you, bounch!

hope all is well with you.
 

fanboi

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
3,365
Sweden
No because so many other crowdfunding games have been funded and released in the same time frame. But it will certainly be a cautionary tale that I think we can all look forward to jschreier 's inevitable post-mortem on, no matter how this story ends.
Yeah, I would hope that is the scenario, since some of my most loved games are KS and crowdfunded.

And yes, a post-mortem would be awesome, either way.
 

Tulipunaruusu

Member
Oct 13, 2018
70
Why pay for astroturfers if hardcore fanboys will do it for free!
I think it is bit unnecessary to be labelled a fan boy when I have given plenty of negatives in Chris Roberts and Star Citizen also in order to create new viewpoints. If you would like to discuss them counterarguments might be more beneficial for everyone. Since I do not see why bashing something should be the highlight of all discussion when there is more interesting stuff in the ever humane side where people and projects have rather multifaceted nature instead of being bad or good in all. Star Citizen almost weekly gives out info flow that you can do something with. From that you can at least create new viewpoints or expand the old ones if you have nothing else do with the game.

For example in recent Finnish Star Citizen discussion of shaping out alternative development paths for Star Citizen I suggested whether not (with the hindsight of all the current day info of the enormous selling power of ships and the marketing buzz that dreams which are just around a corner create) abandoning any plans of doing a single player campaign game would have been the most efficient choice in the end of 2012. When in example you could have Arena Commander take Squadron 42's place as something to play while you wait for Star Citizen. You could play with your ships at least and have a fairly focused test bed.

You wouldn't need AAA single player game production standards in all to make a dent in game space which was in 2013 beginning to be fulfilled with Elite: Dangerous and No Man's Sky coming from development studios that weren't just beginning to shape out in the early years of 2013-2015 but were pretty much in full swing.

Arena Commander could then have besides combat mode a couple, ever now changing smaller game space missions. Wing Commander: Prophecy in example had simulator mode mission where you fought off Kilrathi attacking your (passive except turrets) big hub ship like in the Star Citizen prototype demo video.

The beginning of bigger multiplayer game (whatever that would be with the resources and vision shaped out by then) would be when vanduuls launch their attack on Vega. Or that would be the dream sold at least whether it would ever come to fruition given the rather modest starting points in Cryengine-hostile Northern America while the fates of Star Citizen and Crytek were tied together ever since the 2011 prototype demo and video created with the support of Crytek.
 

Bansai

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,641
No.

Also here's a trailer for a 800 dollae ship that they just released.

When at the end the: "It's not a ship..." ... ... ... "it's a lifestyle" popped up.

Legit my first thought was "of course it's not a ship, it's a render".

btw. this trailer is very well made, no wonder they need to delay everything when they waste their time and resources on something like that
 

Tulipunaruusu

Member
Oct 13, 2018
70
When at the end the: "It's not a ship..." ... ... ... "it's a lifestyle" popped up.

Legit my first thought was "of course it's not a ship, it's a render".

btw. this trailer is very well made, no wonder they need to delay everything when they waste their time and resources on something like that
Well they most likely wouldn't have those resources without doing any ship sales or commercials which fuels the development upkeep with tens of millions of dollars yearly.

The ship in question is flyable already?
 

wsbceo

Member
Apr 29, 2019
38
Please DOJ look into this studio for fraud. Everyone wants to blame feature creep but there’s no progress at all. It reads like such a scam.
 

Flutter

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,293
Well they most likely wouldn't have those resources without doing any ship sales or commercials which fuels the development upkeep with tens of millions of dollars yearly.

The ship in question is flyable already?
It is. That ship is actually out. The reason why they made the trailer is to celebrate the launch.

Apparently the ship's shields is so powerful that it took a ship with the best firepower 12 minutes of continuous firing to deplete the shields.

Pay to win baby.
 

sweetmini

Member
Jun 12, 2019
779
It is. That ship is actually out. The reason why they made the trailer is to celebrate the launch.

Apparently the ship's shields is so powerful that it took a ship with the best firepower 12 minutes of continuous firing to deplete the shields.

Pay to win baby.
Nha, you could always sell a planet driller weapon that pierces through this baby in a couple seconds a bit later ;)
Might have an increase in your insurance fees when it releases as well.
 

Lt-47

Member
Dec 1, 2017
51
When at the end the: "It's not a ship..." ... ... ... "it's a lifestyle" popped up.

Legit my first thought was "of course it's not a ship, it's a render".

btw. this trailer is very well made, no wonder they need to delay everything when they waste their time and resources on something like that
Ships have very little to do with the slow ass dev speed.
Tech is and always as been their biggest problem. They can pump out ships and fancy trailers all year long if they want because that what artist are for(and it brings them money obviously). They however can't just throw every single employees at their many programming roadblock because that's not how management works.