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Star Citizen no longer offering refunds to backers after 14 days

RedRum

RedRum

Newbie Paper Plane Pilot
Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,365
http://cogconnected.com/2018/07/star-citizen-supporters-can-no-longer-receive-refunds/

Anyone who backed Star Citizen, which has received an insane amount of crowdfunding, can no longer ask to be refunded by developer Cloud Imperium Games (CIG). Although standard means of asking for refunds were removed through the Star Citizen's June 6, 2016 Terms of Service (TOS) update, CIG stopped issuing them completely in December 2017.
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Since December 2017, CIG has been ignoring all refund demands. One backer went so far as to take CIG to court, and apparently lost, claiming that the judge did not want to hear anything about the Terms of Service's (TOS's) "conscionability or lack of consideration."
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Here's the reddit post of the person who took them to court: https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen_refunds/comments/8ynrel/i_lost_in_court/

As my case was in small claims, there were no lawyers, CIG/RSI sent someone to represent their interests, but I dont wish to name them, as some people aren't so civil on the internet.

In mediation, CIG/RSI would not agree to refund the portion of my account not covered by the arbitration agreement.

Though lawyers aren't permitted, CIG/RSI lawyers drafted and submitted statements that were permitted.

The judge declined to hear anything about the conscionability or lack of consideration in the TOS.

Despite the top sentence on the TOS, CIG/RSI successfully argued that the arbitration clause should be applied to transactions even before the clause existed.

CIG/RSI repeatedly argued that there is a playable game and that funds have been earned, but the judge did not rule that either.

Following application of arbitration clause to transactions outside covered dates, court orders matter to arbitration, case is dismissed without prejudice.
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[Mod Edit: Edited title to resolve some confusion]
 
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Deleted member 44371

Banned
Jun 1, 2018
4,523
SantaC said:
No surprise here. I feel bad for anyone that backed this game
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Why? Its the most fun I had with any game in the last few years. This year its finally shaping up to be an incredible experience

edit: wow this thread is toxxic. im not even going to bother. im happy i donated 500 euros because its the best thing ever.
 
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Lucifersam597

Permanently banned for usage of an alt-account.
Member
Jun 28, 2018
314
Worlds biggest gaming Panzi scheme. Can't believe people fell or this
 

Deleted member 2254

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
21,467
Regardless of what you may think of Star Citizen, denying by default any refund on digital content is scummy. What if you mistakenly buy something? What if the game does not run on your PC? Bullshit.
 
BasilZero

BasilZero

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
36,343
Omni
Damn , I know someone who paid $300 for a ship lol


Still cant believe he spent that much on a ship for a game that isnt even fully released.
 

Holundrian

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,154
Should be made clear which country this judgement is from. Going to assume that this probably wouldn't hold up in the EU? (might not be true though)
 

rusty chrome

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,640
Scam Citizen. Yikes @ whoever backed this. To think there's people that pay hundreds for some in-game ship lmao.
 

Stardestroyer

Member
Oct 31, 2017
1,819
marzoo said:
Why? Its the most fun I had with any game in the last few years. This year its finally shaping up to be an incredible experience
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I thought people wanted a complete game not something designed to string them along? This is how and why Ponzi schemes work, they give you enough to keep you happy and string you long enough to eventually fail. I am not saying that Star Citizen is a ponzi scheme but it does have all the symptoms of one, with the only ingredent missing is a guy named "Chris Steally". It would be like trusting a guy name made off.

marzoo said:
What about people who pay thousands of dollars for lootcrates and keys?
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What about them? This isn't about them. "whataboutism'

In any case unlike Star Citizen backers, lootcrate players have a higher chance of getting what they want at some point but more importantly lootcare players (adults) know going in what to expect. Star Citizen backers are not even close to getting the full product they were promise to get years ago.
 
TemplaerDude

TemplaerDude

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,204
I think the worst thing about this scam is the people who are trying very hard to convince others it isn't a scam.
 
brandonbrb

brandonbrb

Banned
Nov 7, 2017
115
You can refund in the 14 days after you buy the gamepackage, later is part of TOS and the law goes with CiG, i dont see the problem here.
 
Nacho

Nacho

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,114
NYC
marzoo said:
Why? Its the most fun I had with any game in the last few years. This year its finally shaping up to be an incredible experience
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Yeah I'm really confused why there's a sizeable movement for refunds. It looks like most people enjoy this game and it's actually coming out. I'm all for refunds for backing games that don't come out, or refunds for games bought and they turn out unplayable, etc. But blanket refunds, especially for backing things that you of course can't know if you'll actually like in the end... idk if I can get on board with that.

I'd love for someone to explain to me whats wrong with this and why refunds are deserved. I'm honestly just probably missing info right?
 
OP
OP
RedRum

RedRum

Newbie Paper Plane Pilot
Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,365
marzoo said:
Why? Its the most fun I had with any game in the last few years. This year its finally shaping up to be an incredible experience

edit: wow this thread is toxxic. im not even going to bother. im happy i donated 500 euros because its the best thing ever.
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The thread wasn't made to sling trash at the game. However, despite you and a plethora of other people enjoying the game, don't you think it's also fair for people to receive refunds and in a timely manner?
 
DAREALGUMMY

DAREALGUMMY

Member
Oct 25, 2017
484
untitled_1_1a1jjx.gif
 

Karasseram

Member
Jan 15, 2018
1,358
Dodged a bullet again. Sorry but I have zero confidence in crowdfunding seen this shit happen way too many times to risk any money on something like this.
 
Muad'dib

Muad'dib

Banned
Jun 7, 2018
1,253
kikiribu said:
Scam Citizen. Yikes @ whoever backed this. To think there's people that pay hundreds for some in-game ship lmao.
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If it's a scam then it's the dumbest scam I've ever scene with the scammers actually working on the game, with daily updates, weekly videos and have stars like Mark Hamil put on their name on it.

I hate Star Citizen threads, they only bring out the same old lame "scam" reactions.

The game is playable, I don't think you're entitled to a refund after 14 days of playing.

Sony refuses any kinds of refunds on PSN, guess Sony are a bunch of scammers...
 
Daitokuji

Daitokuji

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,602
A similar thing is going on with Richard Garriott's Shroud of the Avatar game. Massive kickstarter based on nostalgia and hype for a beloved franchise, it goes into development hell, they keep selling in game items for real money, many people get wise to the ruse and start criticizing it but there are plenty of others who are too invested both emotionally and financially and support the clusterfuck that the game has become.
 

VectorPrime

Banned
Apr 4, 2018
11,781
Must watch for anyone who is curious about how fucked this "game" is



TLDR: it didn't start as a scam but boy fucking howdy did it become one.
 

Observable

Member
Oct 27, 2017
946
I never backed the game, but I've been following its development once in a while just to see where its at. I still have hope, it seems to be improving quite a bit. Often in game/app development there's a point where it goes from being a broken or bad performing mess to suddenly working more and more like it's supposed to.

I just hope that they'll hit this point later this year and not further down the line; as an outsider it seems like its always on the point of breaking down with all the negativity around it.
 
Xita

Xita

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
9,185
Uh so if there was any doubt anymore that this is a scam then there's this lol
 
Evolution of Metal

Evolution of Metal

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
6,960
brandonbrb said:
You can refund in the 14 days after you buy the gamepackage, later is part of TOS and the law goes with CiG, i dont see the problem here.
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ToS were altered after the pre-order/pledge was made. If refunds were a part of the policy at the time of transaction, then nobody would expect them to be invalidated by the later change of ToS. CIG have no right to cancel the refund policy which was the official agreement at the time of purchase.

CIG should also not pretend that the current version of SC is what the customers paid the money for, so they should not stop anyone from requesting a refund. Locking people into the ship pre-orders like that is just not fair until CIG officially launches the game.
 

alexlf

The Fallen
Nov 1, 2017
740
Que people not reading that refunds are actually still offered, just time limited, and instead dropping one off shitposts about how they just KNEW it was all a scam all along and then leaving the thread.
 
Velocity:Design:Comfort

Velocity:Design:Comfort

Banned
Nov 23, 2017
4,302
Muad'dib said:
If it's a scam then it's the dumbest scam I've ever scene with the scammers actually working on the game, with daily updates, weekly videos and have stars like Mark Hamil put on their name on it.

I hate Star Citizen threads, they only bring out the same old lame "scam" reactions.

The game is playable, I don't think you're entitled to a refund after 14 days of playing.

Sony refuses any kinds of refunds on PSN, guess Sony are a bunch of scammers...
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Whataboutism, corporate defense and shilling, and desperate justification of your own purchase when this is not about you personally all in the same post. Impressive.
 

Deleted member 224

Oct 25, 2017
5,629
alexlf said:
Que people not reading that refunds are actually still offered, just time limited, and instead dropping one off shitposts about how they just KNEW it was all a scam all along and then leaving the thread.
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So anyone who crowdfunded the game years ago can quickly and easily get their money back?
 
Velocity:Design:Comfort

Velocity:Design:Comfort

Banned
Nov 23, 2017
4,302
alexlf said:
Que people not reading that refunds are actually still offered, just time limited, and instead dropping one off shitposts about how they just KNEW it was all a scam all along and then leaving the thread.
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And yet there is still Zero justifiation for time limiting it except for reasons and appealing to the law with no concern for a business operating ethically.
 
DOBERMAN INC

DOBERMAN INC

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,993
I'm at the point now that my curiosity is outweighing any feeling of being scammed, It's like being tricked into a crackpot plan and after 20 insane revisions you just kind of want to see how it plays out.
 
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