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Star Trek Discovery - Season 2 |OT| Exploration is logical

Window

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,011
I'm with SlipperyFishes here, yeah I agree they could jump anywhere else to gain more time to come up with something but Michael's mum already observed many futures and she said trying to protect the data will always end up as a failure. And yeah as sooperkool says, at the moment Control is fixed on the Discovery and Michael, if the Discovery simply jumps to the Andromeda galaxy or whereever Control might do whatever it takes to get there. With Discovery out of time, I'm not sure it has enough conscious yet to figure out time-travel by itself.
What I'm saying is they could use the spore drive to jump in time instead of needing to acquire a time crystal (and dooming Pike in the process) + build a special suit. It's the exact same plan, just the mechanism by which to jump in time is different. Anyway, doesn't matter.
 

Skyfireblaze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,810
What I'm saying is they could use the spore drive to jump in time instead of needing to acquire a time crystal (and dooming Pike in the process) + build a special suit. It's the exact same plan, just the mechanism by which to jump in time is different. Anyway, doesn't matter.
Ah now I get you. Yeah you are right and ultimately it doesn't matter but I guess it boils down to: "The time-suit is already proven, time-jumping with the Spore Drive only happened once by accident and had grave side-effects so we go with what works."
 

crazillo

Member
Apr 5, 2018
1,860
Stuttgart, Germany
My personal predicition: They go to the 29th century and meet that starfleet temporal ship with Captain Braxton that once recruited Seven of Nine for fixing the timeline. They ultimately manage to keep Control from reaching the 22nd century and the show ends after season 3. I also think they will have to eliminate the Discovery from the timeline.

I think Discovery is fine overall but I NEVER warmed to Michael. The plot advancing rather than having individual episodes is a must today. Season 2 started pretty well and has felt more 'Trek' overall. But as for Michael... She's basically always allowed to let her emotions win over logic in important situations with disastrous consequences. I can't count the number of times she had tears in her eyes. She needs windshield wipers.
 

KarmaCow

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,869
And I guess that Control is doing nothing while it can't find Discovery? No, it is going to continue to amass power and take over Starfleet.
The current plan is to abandon Discovery in the future and letting the Enterprise by itself deal with Control and its fleet of ships. It's not even like the Enterprise will be able to surprise Control either, they need to fight off Control to let Discovery jump to the future. How is that a better plan than just keeping Discovery out of reach, maybe using it to get help, just like they did in the last episode?
 

Carn

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,004
The Netherlands
I suppose meanwhile, Starfleet ‘in the past’ might classify all knowledge of Disco and it’s crew. That maybe might tie up why nobody ever talks about Michael thereafter. And since Disco was their only working spore drive prototype, I guess that’s how that tech disappears.
Classify, of maybe even delete, to be sure to avoid a future repeat. And having related characters under expres orders to 'just never mention it again'. That would be very hamfisted but I guess it works.
 

sooperkool

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,159
The current plan is to abandon Discovery in the future and letting the Enterprise by itself deal with Control and its fleet of ships. It's not even like the Enterprise will be able to surprise Control either, they need to fight off Control to let Discovery jump to the future. How is that a better plan than just keeping Discovery out of reach, maybe using it to get help, just like they did in the last episode?
Because once again we have a reasonable belief that keeping Discovery in this time leads to the death of all life. Some chance of that not happening is better than zero chance. Where do they get hello from? Control has cut off communications, Why is this so hard to comprehend?
 

Skyfireblaze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,810
And like we’re seeing today, the Federation can just lie about it and refuse existence/use media to cover it up. Repeat the lien often enough it becomes the truth. On DS9 there’s nobody alive that could honestly say they were there to refute the official story.
Yeah, the Federation will want to avoid anyone knowing that they might almost have been the cause of all life ending because they were careless with an AI.
 

KarmaCow

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,869
Because once again we have a reasonable belief that keeping Discovery in this time leads to the death of all life. Some chance of that not happening is better than zero chance. Where do they get hello from? Control has cut off communications, Why is this so hard to comprehend?
What happens after Discovery maroons itself a few centuries in the future and Enterprise is destroyed as it holds off a fleet of S31 ships? No one else is aware that Control exists and like you said, it is capable of taking over the rest of Starfleet. Even ignoring the fact that Control can bide its time to just get to Discovery the long way, it's still an existential threat as evidenced by all its actions in pursuit of the sphere data.
 

sooperkool

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,159
What happens after Discovery maroons itself a few centuries in the future and Enterprise is destroyed as it holds off a fleet of S31 ships? No one else is aware that Control exists and like you said, it is capable of taking over the rest of Starfleet. Even ignoring the fact that Control can bide its time to just get to Discovery the long way, it's still an existential threat as evidenced by all its actions in pursuit of the sphere data.
So let's do that we know doesn't work because we don't know if the other option doesn't work? That makes no sense.
 

KarmaCow

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,869
So let's do that we know doesn't work because we don't know if the other option doesn't work? That makes no sense.
What is lost by taking a moment to just warn Starfleet or anyone else in the Federation or even the Klingons about the self aware and driven (but not """conscious""") AI that exists before effectively killing themselves?

I get what the writers are trying to do making it seem like they are running out of time and need to hurry to raise the stakes but they just showed that Discovery can easily buy time with the Spore Drive. They even justified why they didn't jump away when the crystal needed more time but that just highlights how useful it would have been to use it before taking the spore drive offline.
 

SolidSnakeBoy

Member
May 21, 2018
560
So let's do that we know doesn't work because we don't know if the other option doesn't work? That makes no sense.
My take is that seemingly time traveling is fairly easy to do. They literally time traveled with Discovery by accident. Right now they are using schematics for a suit that control could acquire from Section 31 data and a time crystal that is being defended by monks. How can we say that Control won't reach them in the future? To this day leaving the Galaxy is impossible by Starfleet. They can time travel by just slingshot ring around a sun to rescue whales! I don't see how this data is safer in the future than far in the now.
 

Window

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,011
My take is that seemingly time traveling is fairly easy to do. They literally time traveled with Discovery by accident. Right now they are using schematics for a suit that control could acquire from Section 31 data and a time crystal that is being defended by monks. How can we say that Control won't reach them in the future? To this day leaving the Galaxy is impossible by Starfleet. They can time travel by just slingshot ring around a sun to rescue whales! I don't see how this data is safer in the future than far in the now.
I just watched the ToS episode where they did this a few days ago and having just googled it, turns out they do it again in the fourth film?
 

sooperkool

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,159
My take is that seemingly time traveling is fairly easy to do. They literally time traveled with Discovery by accident. Right now they are using schematics for a suit that control could acquire from Section 31 data and a time crystal that is being defended by monks. How can we say that Control won't reach them in the future? To this day leaving the Galaxy is impossible by Starfleet. They can time travel by just slingshot ring around a sun to rescue whales! I don't see how this data is safer in the future than far in the now.
Slingshot sound the sun technique have been invented yet.
 

SolidSnakeBoy

Member
May 21, 2018
560
Slingshot sound the sun technique have been invented yet.
My point is that it is not particularly difficult . Hard to believe that the smartest AI in the universe that is playing 10D chess with Discovery can't figure out how to time travel from its existing data. Star Trek 4's method is almost comical given the effort that its taken Discovery
 

Happenstance

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,010
United Kingdom
I think as fans we just tend to over think this stuff. You know the reason Control hasn’t figured out how to timetravel, because it hasn’t. That’s kind of the beginning and end of it.
 
Oct 28, 2017
1,100
All the shorts on Netflix show as either 0mins or 1minute in length for me. Once you start playing them, it is the full-length.

But I agree - Netflix dropped the ball with them; they were given no exposure, but this could be down to the fact that they only appeared on Netflix once Season 2 dropped.
 

StallionDan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,134
Since Control can just take over ships, why did the Control in Airiam not just take over the Discovery and kill everyone like it has been doing elsewhere?
 

Hellers

Member
Oct 27, 2017
519
What happens after Discovery maroons itself a few centuries in the future and Enterprise is destroyed as it holds off a fleet of S31 ships? No one else is aware that Control exists and like you said, it is capable of taking over the rest of Starfleet. Even ignoring the fact that Control can bide its time to just get to Discovery the long way, it's still an existential threat as evidenced by all its actions in pursuit of the sphere data.
I'm pretty sure the Klingon fleet is going to show up during the fight next week. That's probably what Ash was talking about to Pike towards the end.
 

Muzzymate

Member
Oct 27, 2017
130
Ohio
I'm pretty sure the Klingon fleet is going to show up during the fight next week. That's probably what Ash was talking about to Pike towards the end.
Undoubtably. Somehow, even with Discovery leaving for the future, Section 31 under Control has to be dealt with. They seem to be able to cause a heck of a lot of trouble already, even without the sphere data. The Enterprise won’t be able to take down 30-some ships by itself.
 

Chiaroscuro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,458
Since Control can just take over ships, why did the Control in Airiam not just take over the Discovery and kill everyone like it has been doing elsewhere?
You can say that was because what infected Airiam was a probe virus from future Control, not Control itself or a current manifastation from it. It could be limited in what it could do. But yeah, writing.

Another thing that bugged me is that everyone was cool in going back to Discovery after they learned that Sphere data was messing with its systems to the point of activating shields and more. I would not trust a ghost ship in battle!

Plus time travel is really an easy option in Star Trek universe... easier than just flight to Andromeda or somewhere really distant with the spore drive out of reach of Control.

Undoubtably. Somehow, even with Discovery leaving for the future, Section 31 under Control has to be dealt with. They seem to be able to cause a heck of a lot of trouble already, even without the sphere data. The Enterprise won’t be able to take down 30-some ships by itself.
Yeah, the Klingon fleet probably will be the answer to deal with the remaining Section 31 fleet under Control. But that isvreally strange considering that Enterprise is there and how the next TOS Klingon encounters will be.
 

Lidl

Member
Dec 12, 2017
1,097
What a terribly schmaltzy episode. Mixed with some unintentionally funny scenes like the one where they show us the remaining season 3 cast (the crew members who decided to stay with Burnham).
 

Volimar

volunteer forum janitor
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,562
A klingon fleet aiding starfleet vessels would be big, even if it's to save the galaxy. If it happens it's kind of a shame because that's a lot of goodwill that will have been pissed away by the time Kirk lands on Organia.
 

Dougald

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,770
I just watched the ToS episode where they did this a few days ago and having just googled it, turns out they do it again in the fourth film?
Not just the fourth film, they do it again later in the series just to fuck up 1960s earth while doing 'research'

The only explanation for the timeline not being a total shitshow (beyond the fact Trek is just a TV show) is Spock taking those formulae to his grave.
 

KarmaCow

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,869
I'm pretty sure the Klingon fleet is going to show up during the fight next week. That's probably what Ash was talking about to Pike towards the end.
Well something has to come save the Enterprise from being annihilated, so yeah I can see that happening. I do wonder if they'll try to explain how they make it in time though.
 

Pluto

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,318
My prediction for the finale is that Michael's vision of the future becomes true, Leland/Control boards Discovery and starts killing everyone but because she knows about it from the vision she's able to get into the suit and becomes responsible for the signals adding the last two to save everyone (including the Enterprise). Instead of Discovery being taken to the future she's abandoned and only the crew goes into the future (for some reason) and they are reunited a thousand years later.
 

Window

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,011
Heh. I loved in this one how Sarek and his wife were randomly just a hop away when they needed to be, while Enterprise spent 10 hours trying to catch up.

I love this show though.
lol yeah I kinda found that amusing too. Very contrived but I guess they can explain it away with "Vulcan mind powers" (which seem to have no specific boundaries to their capabilities).
 

Schlorgan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,225
Bountiful, Utah
Finally started watching the show and I like it, but it's impossible for me to look at Stamets and not see Alan Tudyk and it's a little distracting. xD

Also, Pike is great.
 
Last edited:
Oct 25, 2017
4,453
The Ocean
Heh. I loved in this one how Sarek and his wife were randomly just a hop away when they needed to be, while Enterprise spent 10 hours trying to catch up.

I love this show though.
I don't think so. I think that it took as long as it needed to, but we're not seeing time represented well with those scenes. Sarek was on a beach, but we don't know if that was 1 day, 2 days, a week ago.
 

Entryhazard

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,764
My take is that seemingly time traveling is fairly easy to do. They literally time traveled with Discovery by accident.
Actually aside oddities (mistakes) like the sun slingshot, reliable timetravel is not really available with the known technology up to the Voyager era at least. Accidental time travel and spontaneous temporal phenomena in general are indeed common enough to the point that the Starfleet has rules in place for such occurences, but intentionally going to a specific point in time is possible only with some specific temporal focus already in place (Data's head in TNG or a time traveling klingon in DS9) or long lost technology possibly relying on a resource which rarity edges on uniqueness like the time crystals or other extreme limitation. By the time reliable time travel technology is available (around 5 centuries from the current point star trek's story) several big factions already have it resulting in being like nukes in the real world (mutual assured destruction) so it's rarely employed blatantly by such forces.
 

Pluto

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,318
I don't think so. I think that it took as long as it needed to, but we're not seeing time represented well with those scenes. Sarek was on a beach, but we don't know if that was 1 day, 2 days, a week ago.
We also don't know where Discovery was relative to Vulcan, it's possible they jumped much closer to it allowimg Sarek and Amanda to show up and leave before the Emterprise caught up to them.
 

Happenstance

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,010
United Kingdom
Still though, I thought it was a really awkwardly slotted in scene. Almost like they realised too late that it won't make sense going forward to see these characters again so they needed a goodbye.
 

Tukarrs

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,616
I caught IGN's Star Trek podcast with the designer of the Disco Enterprise set. They put in a lot of work, and she was very evasive about the future of the set. I'm pretty sure they have future plans for it.
 

Window

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,011
I don't think so. I think that it took as long as it needed to, but we're not seeing time represented well with those scenes. Sarek was on a beach, but we don't know if that was 1 day, 2 days, a week ago.
If the scene on the beach was 1 day or 1 week ago, how did Sarek know where the Discovery would be located ahead of time to begin his travels? (Yeah I know - Vulcan mind powers).
 

Teiresias

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,577
I'm not sure how I feel about the prospects about the setup for Season 3 at this point. Seems like a heavy-handed way to just to appease people that are too hung up on wanting ironclad explanations for why there aren't Spore Drives or mentions of Michael in earlier Treks.

I'd also completely forgotten until binging the last three episodes (I've been marathoning GoT prior to S8), that Janeway had totally stolen a Klingon time travel device that was able to drop her wherever and whenever she wanted to be in the series finale. Sort of ties in I suppose, particularly since she seemed to be getting from a very sketchy Klingon House that would believably not be abiding by the rules of Time Crystals.