Ok so what you're saying is that we can't actually measure how liked a movie was by people?If all online scoring is uselss, then you can't really see if people liked it or not.
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'Star Wars' Chief Kathleen Kennedy's Lucasfilm Deal Extended for Three Years
- Thread starter Spectromixer
- Start date
I'm liking all the new movies under Kathleen Kennedy so far so this is good news for me.
But that also means I have to deal with seeing more thinly veiled sexist comments towards kathleen kennedy and more hot takes about how x movies has "bad writing" or "plot holes" without further explanation to support the criticism.
But that also means I have to deal with seeing more thinly veiled sexist comments towards kathleen kennedy and more hot takes about how x movies has "bad writing" or "plot holes" without further explanation to support the criticism.
That's my point. It's an unreliable and useless measurement in determining public opinion or fan opinion. The differences in scores is enough to exhibit this.
Well I gave you the proof you asked for but lets agree to disagree then.
You keep using that word. I don't think it means what you think it means.
It does, you just don't agree with it, that's all.You should ask yourself why the IMDB score of TLJ is closer to the prequel trilogy than it is to the original trilogy.
The prequels were very popular with the general public so I am not sure what your point there is.
They got strong CinemaScore ratings which is the audience rating tracker studios pay for any rely on and they did great box office numbers.
TLJ got great reviews, strong ratings from all the real audience trackers, and great box office.
That is pretty damn strong proof TLJ was popular and well liked.
There is a reason studios rely on and pay for CinemaScore and not read RT user scores you know.
Here is a little secret if TLJ was this audience splitting disaster you think it is Kennedy wouldn't have her contract renewed.
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Anyone denying her past successes is intentionally being a bit of an idiot. I don't even like The Force Awakens or The Last Jedi but I do like Rogue One and Solo quite a lot and I can appreciate that the other two were huge financial successes.
So she's kinda doing amazing, isn't she? Pretty par for the course for her, I think.
We are talking about the general audience and fans here.Isn't this how this debate started?How many people pariticpate in the Cinemascore survey?
I think Kennedy's only poor decision so far is greenlighting Solo. It actually ended up being a pretty good movie IMO, but it was a movie that nobody really asked for or wanted, plus it went ridiculously over budget when Ron Howard came in to pretty much reshoot the entire movie. I think as a producer she should have known it as an incredibly risky movie from the jump, even before the well-documented production troubles.
Otherwise her record as a producer, not only with Lucasfilm but for her entire career, is pretty much unassailable. I'm greatly looking forward to Ep.9, the D&D series, and the Johnson trilogy.
Side note, for maximum lol, JJ should take over Lucasfilm when Kennedy retires.
Otherwise her record as a producer, not only with Lucasfilm but for her entire career, is pretty much unassailable. I'm greatly looking forward to Ep.9, the D&D series, and the Johnson trilogy.
Side note, for maximum lol, JJ should take over Lucasfilm when Kennedy retires.
Wasn't it greenlighted before Lucas even sold Lucasfilm to Disney?
Which is so crazy. Her track record is already insanely impressive and it just keeps getting longer.
Solo began under George Lucas. It was one of the first projects to start of the new era. Lucas hired Kasdan to write it.
Did Feige get this amount of shit after incredible hulk/ iron man 2/ Thor 2 or AOU?
Im guessing not.
Im guessing not.
I don't know. Maybe? I'll still count it in the L column for her though since she would have had the power to put it on ice/prioritize other projects.
The only reason Kennedy does (and despite the fact she has a much longer much more successful track record than Feige to boot) is because she is a woman. Period.
It's not really comparable because of how different the scale and timeline of movies is. With Marvel, there are many different stories within that universe. Iron Man 2 and Hulk were bad but neither movie had a powerful impact over the future of the franchise. Meanwhile some Star Wars fans feel like a story they love has been systematically destroyed for the sake of yearly revenue. Star Wars films don't take place on as grand a scale as Marvel films do. One bad movie has a tremendous impact on not just the next, but the future of the franchise due to how it's set up.
The thing is it is safe to say those who feel that way are a niche that no one should really waste time worrying about. For such a long franchise that's has been around 40 years there are going to be people hot and bothered about every film that is released no matter what it is because it can't recapture how they felt as a kid. Some ranted about TFA because Rey was a "Mary Sue", some ranted that Rogue One was too much a nostalgia fest, some ranted that TLJ didn't have "their" Luke, some ranted Solo was too by the books and safe.
Doesn't matter what the film is a small but loud base is going to complain no matter what. Makes no sense to try and address them because there will ALWAYS be an angry hardcore group no matter what the film is because it is going to be impossible to meet everyone's locked in ideals of what a SW film should be.
Him doing his own original thing and not being able to mess with OT characters may turn out well
this franchise has survive "attack of the clones", it will be fine.
Now to be fair, Star Wars by anyone would have made bank. Her goal had to be much more than that. Obviously Disney thanks she can succeed.
Eh, Cinemascore is generally unreliable as well. But money speaks and all of the Disney Star Wars films barring one anomaly made bank.
Yeah, Prequels are the bottom of the barrel but people like to pretend those don't exist and I'd go as far as to say that ROTJ was a pretty mediocre film with a few good moments. There was 5 mediocre to awful Starwars films (Counting Clone Wars) before Disney but somehow it's Kathleen ruining Starwars. She's delivered the third biggest film in history, TLJ was the biggest film last year beating Beauty and the Beast and a Spinoff/prequel managed to pass a billion. People say her goals needed to be better but how do you beat that record? and it's only been three years.
Unless somethings changed, I thought they were making two different trilogies as acknowledgement they need to expand beyond a single story.
Considering none of those films were nearly as divisive and Feige was doing something as unprecedented as putting together the MCU and pulled it off before Thor 2 and AoU - I'd say it's hardly a comparable situation at all. People tend to be more forgiving to what's new and unfamiliar.
With Star Wars, there's a tried and true formula, or at least a notion thereof. People know what they want out of a Star Wars film, even a bad one. To them TLJ was like going to a restaurant and getting your order mixed up.
Sometimes that's a good thing, but to a lot of people TLJ just wasn't a good movie, never mind a good Star Wars movie.
I get what you're implying but you're off base. No one has gotten more shit out of making bad Star Wars than George Lucas himself. There are plenty of other names I can think of that get ridiculed and I think it doesn't have much to do with gender and everything to do obsessive pop culture fandom.
This is lazy and just poisons the well. You're not arguing anything in good faith whatsoever. Kathleen Kennedy will never not be resented for being a successful woman so long as she lives, but that doesn't mean all criticism against her is rooted in sexism is ridiculous.
Granted, there's an unfortunate overlap with sexist and bigots and even the alt right, which makes it uncomfortable to side with any of these people, but fans can still have problems with Kennedy's stewardship of Star Wars and be none of those things. I don't know why you feel you should be allowed to group them together.
That was never a point I was making. I was saying that online scores are useless, yet you keep changing the subject after providing a weak argument as to why we should trust online scoring for.. Anything.
You haven't provided a shred of evidence, let alone proof.
So how do you determine if the audience liked a movie if online scores are "useless"?What you're saying doesn't make any sense.
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A lot of people have been able to scapegoat Ike Perlmutter and the former Marvel Creative Committee as to blame for the duds of phases 1 and 2. Which is not to say they weren't a net negative on those movies, but Feige had his share of blame there too.
I don't know if you remember this, but after Iron Man 2 came out there were people saying the franchise needed to rebooted already. :lol
How well the movie did in the box office is the most powerful indicator. Go take a look at the prequel's budget and earnings and ask yourself if you think people liked them.
Go take a look at TLJ's budget and earnings and ask yourself if people liked it.
There's also the CinemaScores, which while they aren't perfect, are developed with a formula that is trusted by the industry. And the prequels all got As, as well as TLJ.
Whereas online user reviews vary wildly and aren't trusted by the industry as a serious indicator of how well liked a film is.
I guess the transformers movie must be the best movies ever made then.Cinemascores are crap.There's not enough people that vote in them.So the best way to tell how a movie is viewed by most people are online scores.I get that you don't like admitting it but that's the truth.
"Most people". You think most people who watch a Star Wars movie go online to submit a user score?
This is no better method available of measuring how limed a movie was than online scores.Tell us if there is a better one.
Or take them seriously? I can review any movie how I want to and I didn't even have to see it.
I'll ask you again.You got a better method that we don't know about?
Not when those online scores are very clearly bombed by people with way too much freetime. If you actually look at the audience RT "reviews" its a bunch of low effort screaming and spamming from the usual suspects.
That is not indicative of the majority of audience members, because the majority of audience members have better things to do than go online and whine that a space fantasy movie didn't have realistic physics or too many women and those are the people you're trying to paint as an accurate representation of the average movie goer.
Plenty of people have problems with the film for whatever reason. But a system that can be so easily gamed is not an accurate representation of statistics. Its why a great deal of surveys are still done over the phone.
I have to repeat myself .There is no better alternative as of now.
It doesn't matter if there is a better method if online scores are ABSOLUTE FUCKING GARBAGE
You keep saying that but online scores have been pretty accurate for me.
No. I am telling you that I dont even bother with user score rating because I think they are fundamentaly thrash.
In the case of TLJ people use the RT audience score because it fits their narrative that the movie was disliked by most.
They've been proven to be spammed with bots and fake reviews so they're worthless.
You're entitled to your opinion but most people like online scores.I can say the same thing about you, so let's agree to disagree.
Also quite a few fans who disliked TLJ gathered a movement and went to trash its review score. So factor that in...
Yep. Every movie made so far was approved by George before the Disney purchase.
-George wanted to make a new trilogy and use the success of the first movie as a way to get people interested in buying LF and let them handle the last 2 films. We even see ideas of his episode VII in the current VII and VIII.
-Rogue One's plot was originally going to be used in a live action Star Wars show.
-George wanted Kasdan to come in for VII and Kasdan had an idea for a Han Solo stand-alone. They made a deal and you can connect the dots from there.