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Steams "Competitors"

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Durante

Dark Souls Man
Member
Oct 24, 2017
4,134
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I'd be interested to know how many people give a shit about most of that stuff.
You know, if we can at least move on
from "Steam sucks/is stagnating/needs to step up"
to "Steam is the most feature-rich client for gamers and developers, but some people don't give a shit about most of that stuff",
that would be a massive and very welcome step forward for the discussion.

Can people not prefer Steam but also think that competition is good for them?
I think what shapes the perspective for many PC gamers who have been around for a while is that Steam "competition" has existed (and been praised, since all competition is good!!) for years now, and the actual noticeable effects are as follows:
  • All of them are still missing some great features, and many of them (with the exception of e.g. GoG) show no inclination at all of catching up.
  • You are forced to use them (or just skip some games) only because of exclusives.
  • Some of them have actually been stopped and/or gone out of business, taking your platform features (and sometimes library) with them.
  • Steam has continued to innovate and extend its feature set regardless of the lack of progress its competitors made in catching up.
That's what, as a PC gamer, I've actually observed over the years. The one exception that might be made is that Origin introduced refunds slightly earlier (though at worse conditions and for only a subset of games compared to what Steam did).

So, the vast majority of the effects seem negative -- smaller feature set, less reliable platforms, exclusives reducing choice.
Competition might well be good for me, sometimes, eventually, but so far, ~10 years of experience have shown that most "competition" in this space actually is not (and I'll continue to argue that this is because it's not actually competition if I can't buy the same game on each platform).

Edit:
Just to note while reading through this again: GoG is the only platform that actually tries to both catch up on features (e.g. with Galaxy and the introduction of leaderboards) and offer an actual platform defining customer-facing feature over Steam: only allowing DRM free games.
It's also a platform that doesn't moneyhat exclusives. Coincidence? I think not.
 
OP
OP
brokenswiftie
May 30, 2018
314
0
Then ensure you don't complain about the era of lootboxes and MTX, then.
It's hard for a shitload of developers to turn a profit via Steam, as more and more games get released. There are only so many games that can be promoted heavily on the platform. It's pro-consumer to want developers to make more money...in many cases to even allow devs make a living.
But this needs the assumption that people will purchase the same amount of games with the higher prices. I would say that people would buy fewer games if games cost more, skipping titles that otherwise would have bene sold had there been a sale.
 
Oct 25, 2017
7,968
0
It seems like the premise of the thread is more things = better. I'm not invalidating that some people want some of those things, just that having more stuff does not automatically make it a better option.

The tone of the OP acting like it's some kind of objective measure of Steam superiority kinda rubs me the wrong way.

Can people not prefer Steam but also think that competition is good for them?
That "more stuff" increases the quality of the client.
Factually and objectively.
 
Oct 30, 2017
594
0
I don’t think anyone really disagrees that market competition is good. It’s more the stores that “compete” by locking exclusives behind bad launchers which benefits no one besides that company that are railed against.
I don't like it anymore than anyone else, but if exclusives are one of the few tools in their arsenal to try and poach people then it makes sense to use that particular lever so I can't exactly blame them.

Steam is a long-established launcher with a lot of buy-in already, and given that they have 10+ years on their competitors as far as functionality is concerned they are never going to lose that particular battle---competitors have to do what they have to do in order to get mindshare and marketshare.

Any competitor is going to have an uphill battle and an inferior product at first just because of their headstart, so what should be done? Just say Steam should be it as far as launchers are concerned instead of the de facto default it is now and let it float along without any pressure to innovate. Nothing about current Valve indicates to me that any good would come of that.
 
Oct 26, 2017
4,440
0
Oh I see we've pivoted toward "well... all those extra features Steam added are BAD" now.

you people have lost it
Alright, I'll tell you what, I'll go through the spreadsheet in the OP and let you know which features I think are a net negative and why (this is going to take awhile):

Chat - The chat implementation is poor and the my gaming experience would be better without the "community" overlay. It would be better to have no chat at all or have an implementation like Battle.net where it's a seperate thing entirely. Either way I'll still use Discord because it's the better way to chat.

Curation - This is a big one for me, the lack of curation makes browsing the store page a bad experience

Curators - Trying to replace their curation with "community" curators just clutters up the store pages with recommendations from people that I don't want to see

Early Access - Whew lad, what a shitshow this turned out to be

Marketplace - An avenue for money laundering, market manipulation, and an incentive for devs to implement shitty "drop" systems

Achievements - More distractions from popups

Community Guides - The community is garbage

Community Discussion - See above

Trading Cards - Something that could have been cool but instead turned into a reason for people to idle in games for extra cash, more distractions from popups

User Reviews - Community is garbage redux

Inventory Support - How is this a feature when it's necessary for their broken marketplace? Moreover, the inventory system is ALWAYS broken in one way or another

Anti-Cheat - Can be bad depending on how the Devs and/or pubs implement

MTX Support - Can be bad depending on the game as well

Leaderboard Support - Rampant cheating (despite "anti-cheat") make this a net negative

3rd Party Keys - Just a vector for key resellers to profit off regional pricing

DRM for Devs - Boooooooooooo

Now, these are my subjective reasons for using Steam less over the years. They may not match up with your feelings on these individual features and that's fine. I have other reasons, listed above in other posts, and likely more that I'm not thinking of right now.

You shouldn't be loyal to a storefront because of momentum. Over the years Steam has become bloated with unnecessary features that, in my opinion, makes playing and buying games on the platform more of a chore than is necessary. Small annoyances and inconveniences are all that is needed for me to want to take my time elsewhere because, luckily, there are other platforms that offer storefronts.

They'd go a long way to winning my time and money back simply by curating content and policing their community, but I understand that Steam doesn't NEED my time or money, they got plenty from other people.
 
Then ensure you don't complain about the era of lootboxes and MTX, then.
It's hard for a shitload of developers to turn a profit via Steam, as more and more games get released. There are only so many games that can be promoted heavily on the platform. It's pro-consumer to want developers to make more money...in many cases to even allow devs make a living.
This MUST be a joke post. So Valve is at fault for lootboxes and microtransactions? There are no lootboxes or microtransactions in console games then, right?
 
Oct 25, 2017
123
0
Alright, I'll tell you what, I'll go through the spreadsheet in the OP and let you know which features I think are a net negative and why (this is going to take awhile):

Chat - The chat implementation is poor and the my gaming experience would be better without the "community" overlay. It would be better to have no chat at all or have an implementation like Battle.net where it's a seperate thing entirely. Either way I'll still use Discord because it's the better way to chat.

Curation - This is a big one for me, the lack of curation makes browsing the store page a bad experience

Curators - Trying to replace their curation with "community" curators just clutters up the store pages with recommendations from people that I don't want to see

Early Access - Whew lad, what a shitshow this turned out to be

Marketplace - An avenue for money laundering, market manipulation, and an incentive for devs to implement shitty "drop" systems

Achievements - More distractions from popups

Community Guides - The community is garbage

Community Discussion - See above

Trading Cards - Something that could have been cool but instead turned into a reason for people to idle in games for extra cash, more distractions from popups

User Reviews - Community is garbage redux

Inventory Support - How is this a feature when it's necessary for their broken marketplace? Moreover, the inventory system is ALWAYS broken in one way or another

Anti-Cheat - Can be bad depending on how the Devs and/or pubs implement

MTX Support - Can be bad depending on the game as well

Leaderboard Support - Rampant cheating (despite "anti-cheat") make this a net negative

3rd Party Keys - Just a vector for key resellers to profit off regional pricing

DRM for Devs - Boooooooooooo

Now, these are my subjective reasons for using Steam less over the years. They may not match up with your feelings on these individual features and that's fine. I have other reasons, listed above in other posts, and likely more that I'm not thinking of right now.

You shouldn't be loyal to a storefront because of momentum. Over the years Steam has become bloated with unnecessary features that, in my opinion, makes playing and buying games on the platform more of a chore than is necessary. Small annoyances and inconveniences are all that is needed for me to want to take my time elsewhere because, luckily, there are other platforms that offer storefronts.

They'd go a long way to winning my time and money back simply by curating content and policing their community, but I understand that Steam doesn't NEED my time or money, they got plenty from other people.
hmnn do you even use Steam?



Disable steam overlay, it's been an option since... idk a decade ago? no more pop ups?
 
May 6, 2018
157
0
I don't like it anymore than anyone else, but if exclusives are one of the few tools in their arsenal to try and poach people then it makes sense to use that particular lever so I can't exactly blame them.

Steam is a long-established launcher with a lot of buy-in already, and given that they have 10+ years on their competitors as far as functionality is concerned they are never going to lose that particular battle---competitors have to do what they have to do in order to get mindshare and marketshare.

Any competitor is going to have an uphill battle and an inferior product at first just because of their headstart, so what should be done? Just say Steam should be it as far as launchers are concerned instead of the de facto default it is now and let it float along without any pressure to innovate. Nothing about current Valve indicates to me that any good would come of that.
Prospective customers know that nobody is going to somehow match Steam on day 1, and people aren't expecting it. What is important, however, is what features a new platform chooses to emphasize at their launch, because that sends a message to users about what that platform's goal is. This is why most PC gamers are happy about the existence of sites like GOG and itch.io. Neither of them are really close to matching Steam, but each had their own unique approach that did something Steam didn't. When GOG launched, it emphasized releases of old games (which weren't on Steam at the time) and DRM free releases. itch.io focuses on indie support, hosting free games at no cost, offering developers control over the revenue split, and, crucially, fostering and supporting a community that has a vested interest in seeing the indie scene flourish. In both cases, these stores are competing with Valve by bringing something new and interesting to the table.

But most of these launchers, the ones people complain about? They are neither attempting to compete directly with Valve nor bring anything relevant or interesting to the table. They're cash-grabs. Feature-barren stores and clients that offer nothing to consumers, but lock them in with exclusive titles. That's not competing with Valve, they're just offering their own games on a lesser platform.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,581
0
Columbus, Ohio
I don't like it anymore than anyone else, but if exclusives are one of the few tools in their arsenal to try and poach people then it makes sense to use that particular lever so I can't exactly blame them.

Steam is a long-established launcher with a lot of buy-in already, and given that they have 10+ years on their competitors as far as functionality is concerned they are never going to lose that particular battle---competitors have to do what they have to do in order to get mindshare and marketshare.

Any competitor is going to have an uphill battle and an inferior product at first just because of their headstart, so what should be done? Just say Steam should be it as far as launchers are concerned instead of the de facto default it is now and let it float along without any pressure to innovate. Nothing about current Valve indicates to me that any good would come of that.
I think the point of this thread though is that Valve is the one doing the lions share of the innovation despite their established market advantages. Advantages that will probably continue to exist and grow because they do innovate and no one else does much of anything for me as a consumer.
 
Oct 26, 2017
4,440
0
hmnn do you even use Steam?

Disable steam overlay, it's been an option since... idk a decade ago? no more pop ups?
Sorry, instead of looking into their settings I just decided to stop using it as much so I don't where "disable steam overlay" is or how to enable it.

Also, there's sort of a peer pressure in it, because some people do still contact me via the chat.
 
Alright, I'll tell you what, I'll go through the spreadsheet in the OP and let you know which features I think are a net negative and why (this is going to take awhile):

Chat - The chat implementation is poor and the my gaming experience would be better without the "community" overlay. It would be better to have no chat at all or have an implementation like Battle.net where it's a seperate thing entirely. Either way I'll still use Discord because it's the better way to chat.

Curation - This is a big one for me, the lack of curation makes browsing the store page a bad experience

Curators - Trying to replace their curation with "community" curators just clutters up the store pages with recommendations from people that I don't want to see

Early Access - Whew lad, what a shitshow this turned out to be

Marketplace - An avenue for money laundering, market manipulation, and an incentive for devs to implement shitty "drop" systems

Achievements - More distractions from popups

Community Guides - The community is garbage

Community Discussion - See above

Trading Cards - Something that could have been cool but instead turned into a reason for people to idle in games for extra cash, more distractions from popups

User Reviews - Community is garbage redux

Inventory Support - How is this a feature when it's necessary for their broken marketplace? Moreover, the inventory system is ALWAYS broken in one way or another

Anti-Cheat - Can be bad depending on how the Devs and/or pubs implement

MTX Support - Can be bad depending on the game as well

Leaderboard Support - Rampant cheating (despite "anti-cheat") make this a net negative

3rd Party Keys - Just a vector for key resellers to profit off regional pricing

DRM for Devs - Boooooooooooo

Now, these are my subjective reasons for using Steam less over the years. They may not match up with your feelings on these individual features and that's fine. I have other reasons, listed above in other posts, and likely more that I'm not thinking of right now.

You shouldn't be loyal to a storefront because of momentum. Over the years Steam has become bloated with unnecessary features that, in my opinion, makes playing and buying games on the platform more of a chore than is necessary. Small annoyances and inconveniences are all that is needed for me to want to take my time elsewhere because, luckily, there are other platforms that offer storefronts.

They'd go a long way to winning my time and money back simply by curating content and policing their community, but I understand that Steam doesn't NEED my time or money, they got plenty from other people.
So you made up a bunch of things that say Steam's features are baaaaaad. Go you!
I mean, Guides are bad because "the community is garbage", 3rd Party Keys (which let devs sell their games without paying a dime to Valve) are bad because some resellers (and in very special cases that only involve bigger releases) took advantage of regional pricing to sell them at a cheaper price (in some cases that was also the only way for people from poorer regions to get games at a fairer price, but I guess that doesn't matter), Inventory support is bad because you hate the marketplace, cards are bad because you don't care about them and somehow dislike that others can use them to get extra cash, anticheat is bad because... reasons, leaderboards are bad because there are some cheaters, DRM so devs don't have to pay for an extra DRM is bad because it's DRM, that money laundering stuff about the Market... wow.
And people complain when we complain about the ill informed posts that always pop up in Valve threads...
 
Oct 25, 2017
123
0
Sorry, instead of looking into their settings I just decided to stop using it as much so I don't where "disable steam overlay" is or how to enable it.

Also, there's sort of a peer pressure in it, because some people do still contact me via the chat.
Put steam on offline mode?, block friends? or use the also decade long Friends settings?



I can't... Are you trolling us?
 
Oct 28, 2017
54
0
Sorry, instead of looking into their settings I just decided to stop using it as much so I don't where "disable steam overlay" is or how to enable it.

Also, there's sort of a peer pressure in it, because some people do still contact me via the chat.
Why not just ignore them, that's what I do. Your ignorance to the functionality of steam is not helping your point in why you don't use it.
 
Oct 26, 2017
4,440
0
So you made up a bunch of things that say Steam's features are baaaaaad. Go you!
I mean, Guides are bad because "the community is garbage", 3rd Party Keys (which let devs sell their games without paying a dime to Valve) are bad because some resellers (and in very special cases that only involve bigger releases) took advantage of regional pricing to sell them at a cheaper price (in some cases that was also the only way for people from poorer regions to get games at a fairer price, but I guess that doesn't matter), Inventory support is bad because you hate the marketplace, cards are bad because you don't care about them and somehow dislike that others can use them to get extra cash, anticheat is bad because... reasons, leaderboards are bad because there are some cheaters, DRM so devs don't have to pay for an extra DRM is bad because it's DRM, that money laundering stuff about the Market... wow.
And people complain when we complain about the ill informed posts that always pop up in Valve threads...
Listen, these are my reasons. Like I said, these "features" may be net positives for you but for me it all adds up to a worse experience compared to the Steam of 6 years ago.
 
Oct 29, 2017
4,623
0
Mt. Whatever
Alright, I'll tell you what, I'll go through the spreadsheet in the OP and let you know which features I think are a net negative and why (this is going to take awhile):

Chat - The chat implementation is poor and the my gaming experience would be better without the "community" overlay. It would be better to have no chat at all or have an implementation like Battle.net where it's a seperate thing entirely. Either way I'll still use Discord because it's the better way to chat.

Curation - This is a big one for me, the lack of curation makes browsing the store page a bad experience

Curators - Trying to replace their curation with "community" curators just clutters up the store pages with recommendations from people that I don't want to see

Early Access - Whew lad, what a shitshow this turned out to be

Marketplace - An avenue for money laundering, market manipulation, and an incentive for devs to implement shitty "drop" systems

Achievements - More distractions from popups

Community Guides - The community is garbage

Community Discussion - See above

Trading Cards - Something that could have been cool but instead turned into a reason for people to idle in games for extra cash, more distractions from popups

User Reviews - Community is garbage redux

Inventory Support - How is this a feature when it's necessary for their broken marketplace? Moreover, the inventory system is ALWAYS broken in one way or another

Anti-Cheat - Can be bad depending on how the Devs and/or pubs implement

MTX Support - Can be bad depending on the game as well

Leaderboard Support - Rampant cheating (despite "anti-cheat") make this a net negative

3rd Party Keys - Just a vector for key resellers to profit off regional pricing

DRM for Devs - Boooooooooooo

Now, these are my subjective reasons for using Steam less over the years. They may not match up with your feelings on these individual features and that's fine. I have other reasons, listed above in other posts, and likely more that I'm not thinking of right now.

You shouldn't be loyal to a storefront because of momentum. Over the years Steam has become bloated with unnecessary features that, in my opinion, makes playing and buying games on the platform more of a chore than is necessary. Small annoyances and inconveniences are all that is needed for me to want to take my time elsewhere because, luckily, there are other platforms that offer storefronts.

They'd go a long way to winning my time and money back simply by curating content and policing their community, but I understand that Steam doesn't NEED my time or money, they got plenty from other people.
I don't like things, so they must be bad. The Post. Wew.

I guess you can trash the community stuff all you want, but whenever I need a guide or technical help the community stuff is the first thing I check and it's usually reliable. Not to mention all the not-shit communities that have been able to get a footing and spread, like Final Fantasy Modding, Archi Steam Farm, and Special-K's community. All very helpful people, but it's just so much easier to blanket the entire PC Gaming community as whatever boogeymen suits your current fancy.
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,668
0
Europe
Alright, I'll tell you what, I'll go through the spreadsheet in the OP and let you know which features I think are a net negative and why (this is going to take awhile):

Chat - The chat implementation is poor and the my gaming experience would be better without the "community" overlay. It would be better to have no chat at all or have an implementation like Battle.net where it's a seperate thing entirely. Either way I'll still use Discord because it's the better way to chat.

Curation - This is a big one for me, the lack of curation makes browsing the store page a bad experience

Curators - Trying to replace their curation with "community" curators just clutters up the store pages with recommendations from people that I don't want to see

Early Access - Whew lad, what a shitshow this turned out to be

Marketplace - An avenue for money laundering, market manipulation, and an incentive for devs to implement shitty "drop" systems

Achievements - More distractions from popups

Community Guides - The community is garbage

Community Discussion - See above

Trading Cards - Something that could have been cool but instead turned into a reason for people to idle in games for extra cash, more distractions from popups

User Reviews - Community is garbage redux

Inventory Support - How is this a feature when it's necessary for their broken marketplace? Moreover, the inventory system is ALWAYS broken in one way or another

Anti-Cheat - Can be bad depending on how the Devs and/or pubs implement

MTX Support - Can be bad depending on the game as well

Leaderboard Support - Rampant cheating (despite "anti-cheat") make this a net negative

3rd Party Keys - Just a vector for key resellers to profit off regional pricing

DRM for Devs - Boooooooooooo

Now, these are my subjective reasons for using Steam less over the years. They may not match up with your feelings on these individual features and that's fine. I have other reasons, listed above in other posts, and likely more that I'm not thinking of right now.

You shouldn't be loyal to a storefront because of momentum. Over the years Steam has become bloated with unnecessary features that, in my opinion, makes playing and buying games on the platform more of a chore than is necessary. Small annoyances and inconveniences are all that is needed for me to want to take my time elsewhere because, luckily, there are other platforms that offer storefronts.

They'd go a long way to winning my time and money back simply by curating content and policing their community, but I understand that Steam doesn't NEED my time or money, they got plenty from other people.
wtf is this
 
Oct 26, 2017
4,440
0
I don't like things, so they must be bad. The Post. Wew.

I guess you can trash the community stuff all you want, but whenever I need a guide or technical help the community stuff is the first thing I check and it's usually reliable. Not to mention all the not-shit communities that have been able to get a footing and spread, like Final Fantasy Modding, Archi Steam Farm, and Special-K's community. All very helpful people, but it's just so much easier to blanket the entire PC Gaming community as whatever boogeymen suits your current fancy.
I mean, that's why I used the OPs spreadsheet to go point by point. Of course listing my subjective reasons to disliking Steam's feature bloat currently is going to be a "I don't like things" post. If you'd manage to actually read my post however I went out of my way to point out that just because I don't like them they are not necessarily bad.

But the community is bad

TE="mephixto, post: 15669384, member: 1736"]Put steam on offline mode?, block friends? or use the also decade long Friends settings?

[/QUOTE]

I could... or I could just use other things.

Now that I think about it, it reminds me in a lot of ways of Facebook. A service that I used pretty much every day half a decade ago that's fallen into disuse by me personally because of feature bloat and a garbage community lol
 
Oct 30, 2017
594
0
I think the point of this thread though is that Valve is the one doing the lions share of the innovation despite their established market advantages. Advantages that will probably continue to exist and grow because they do innovate and no one else does much of anything for me as a consumer.
Fair enough. I guess for me nothing they've done as far as innovation has changed my outlook on the store enough that it feels like they're doing much.
 

Hektor

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,886
0
Deutschland
www.patreon.com
Early Access - Whew lad, what a shitshow this turned out to be
There have been multiple hundreds of amazing early access games, but even if you don't care about them, you can literally just disable early access games from ever being shown to you.

Marketplace - An avenue for money laundering, market manipulation, and an incentive for devs to implement shitty "drop" systems
I'd be curios to know how money laundering is supposed to work on the steam store, given that you can't cash out steam wallet.
You're not making much of a case as to how the ability to sell off your microtransactions if you don't want them anymore is a bad thing.

Achievements - More distractions from popups
You can disable them.

Community Guides - The community is garbage
You can literally just ignore them.

Community Discussion - See above
See above.

User Reviews - Community is garbage redux
See above.

Inventory Support - How is this a feature when it's necessary for their broken marketplace? Moreover, the inventory system is ALWAYS broken in one way or another
The inventory system has been around longer than the marketplace as a way to trade items with other players, the marketplace was only created in response to people using said trad function to sell off their stuff on sites like steamtrades.com.

Anti-Cheat - Can be bad depending on how the Devs and/or pubs implement
???????????????????
Better have no anti-cheat then?

3rd Party Keys - Just a vector for key resellers to profit off regional pricing
This is not only factual horseshit as there are hundreds of key resellers that get their keys from the publishers, how the fuck is a completely optional way of getting cheaper games through stores like Gamesplanet a bad thing?





This post has some of the hottest takes ive seen in such a thread thus far, and i've seen many.
 
Oct 31, 2017
3,645
0
Alright, I'll tell you what, I'll go through the spreadsheet in the OP and let you know which features I think are a net negative and why (this is going to take awhile):

Chat - The chat implementation is poor and the my gaming experience would be better without the "community" overlay. It would be better to have no chat at all or have an implementation like Battle.net where it's a seperate thing entirely. Either way I'll still use Discord because it's the better way to chat.

Curation - This is a big one for me, the lack of curation makes browsing the store page a bad experience

Curators - Trying to replace their curation with "community" curators just clutters up the store pages with recommendations from people that I don't want to see

Early Access - Whew lad, what a shitshow this turned out to be

Marketplace - An avenue for money laundering, market manipulation, and an incentive for devs to implement shitty "drop" systems

Achievements - More distractions from popups

Community Guides - The community is garbage

Community Discussion - See above

Trading Cards - Something that could have been cool but instead turned into a reason for people to idle in games for extra cash, more distractions from popups

User Reviews - Community is garbage redux

Inventory Support - How is this a feature when it's necessary for their broken marketplace? Moreover, the inventory system is ALWAYS broken in one way or another

Anti-Cheat - Can be bad depending on how the Devs and/or pubs implement

MTX Support - Can be bad depending on the game as well

Leaderboard Support - Rampant cheating (despite "anti-cheat") make this a net negative

3rd Party Keys - Just a vector for key resellers to profit off regional pricing

DRM for Devs - Boooooooooooo

Now, these are my subjective reasons for using Steam less over the years. They may not match up with your feelings on these individual features and that's fine. I have other reasons, listed above in other posts, and likely more that I'm not thinking of right now.

You shouldn't be loyal to a storefront because of momentum. Over the years Steam has become bloated with unnecessary features that, in my opinion, makes playing and buying games on the platform more of a chore than is necessary. Small annoyances and inconveniences are all that is needed for me to want to take my time elsewhere because, luckily, there are other platforms that offer storefronts.

They'd go a long way to winning my time and money back simply by curating content and policing their community, but I understand that Steam doesn't NEED my time or money, they got plenty from other people.
And to be fair to you, I'm going to go through each of these points:

Chat: No it's not the absolute greatest thing in the world, but it's more than serviceable after the overhaul. And it's optional for the most part. I really don't think it's hurting anyone's experience that much. Like seriously, it's not that intrusive. I literally just checked to be sure.

Curation: Can't really argue with this one. There are people who want curation and people who don't; it's simply a difference in view.

Curators: This ties in with curation.

Early Access: eh... it has its good and bad. Mostly bad... so you get this one.

Community Guides/Discussion: Sorry, but this is lazy reasoning on your part. "Community is garbage, therefore useless." No. There are tons of helpful guides and discussions either for technical issues (what I use it for the most) or gameplay strategies and whatnot. To hand-wave all of that as "garbage" is, as I said, lazy. There's usefulness there whether you like it or not.

User reviews: Ties in with the above. Now obviously there has been abuse of the system for sure, but overall, I still think it gives you a decent barometer of how games are, especially smaller ones where you can't really find much information elsewhere.

Achievements: They are 100% optional. There is literally no reason to complain about them. Turn off the notifications and never worry about them again if they bother you so much.

Marketplace: Again, optional. Money laundering? itaintthatserious.gif Again, you can ignore the drops by turning off notifications. Can't speak about the market manipulation. Can you give examples here?

Trading cards: Yet again, optional. Admittedly, they were way better in the beginning. Now, they're just kind of... there. But again, they can be easily ignored. They're not "hurting" anyone's experience if they don't want to use them.

Leaderboards: Can't speak on them because I don't really use them. Is the supposed cheating any worse than any other platform?

Anti-Cheat/VAC: Come on, you're going to have to do better than that. "Could be potentially bad maybe depending on things" is terrible reasoning. And that's not even unique to VAC; you could say the same thing about anyone else's cheat system.

MTX Support: Just like with the anti-cheat system, this "potential" issue is not unique to Steam. This sounds like a general complaint related to all microtransactions.

3rd party keys: So? It still gives users options to buy outside of Steam while remaining in the ecosystem. Remember, devs can also generate their own keys too and sell them on their own.

DRM for devs: not really sure what your issue is here? Are you saying giving the option to devs to implement DRM is a bad thing? If so, that's not unique to Steam. Every other client outside of GoG and itch.io allows that too. Devs can do DRM-free if they wish on Steam, just fyi.

So yeah, you do have some valid points, especially on the curation part, but most of your complaints are either not unique to Steam (cheat system, drm, etc) or pretty trivial (you're really gonna complain about 100% optional, completely ignorable achievements? come on). Plus you ignore all of the objectively (or subjectively objective) great features that have both improved Steam and PC gaming in general, like the controller API, expanded Linux/MacOS support, Steam Workshop, and others.

Again, I feel like many of your complaints would be solved with a little configuration on your end.
 
Oct 25, 2017
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Community Guides/Discussion: Sorry, but this is lazy reasoning on your part. "Community is garbage, therefore useless." No. There are tons of helpful guides and discussions either for technical issues (what I use it for the most) or gameplay strategies and whatnot. To hand-wave all of that as "garbage" is, as I said, lazy. There's usefulness there whether you like it or not.
Community Discussions are also an opportunity to get answers from developers if\when they participate in them.

I don't often go into the discussions, but when I do, it's a net positive experience for me as I usually get answers to questions, or fixes for problems I'm having (before resorting to another feature - refunding the game).

You know the forum has gone off the deep end when you can't tell sarcasm from unmoderated platform/console warring shitposts in Valve threads anymore.
Yeah that was my bad. I accidentally left my mindless Steam troll comment generator turned on.
 
Oct 27, 2017
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Edit:
Just to note while reading through this again: GoG is the only platform that actually tries to both catch up on features (e.g. with Galaxy and the introduction of leaderboards) and offer an actual platform defining customer-facing feature over Steam: only allowing DRM free games.
It's also a platform that doesn't moneyhat exclusives. Coincidence? I think not.
It's worth pointing out that it would be easy for them to have done so, with The Witcher series and Cyberpunk 2077, for people that are not aware who GOG are.
 
Feb 5, 2018
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User warned: Insulting another poster
Sorry, instead of looking into their settings I just decided to stop using it as much so I don't where "disable steam overlay" is or how to enable it.

Also, there's sort of a peer pressure in it, because some people do still contact me via the chat.
Why are you the way you are? What happened to you in your childhood? What did Gabe do to you?
 
Oct 26, 2017
4,440
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Why are you the way you are? What happened to you in your childhood? What did Gabe do to you?
Gabe made Steam bad for me :( Actually, I ain't gunna lie, I've had a nodule of grudge against Steam since the moment I had to install it to play Half-Life 2

I forgive him tho because he's helped release some of my fav games of all time

Who are you all replying to?

*clicks Show ignored content*

Ah, I see
lol aw man
 
Oct 25, 2017
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I appreciate all the effort that went into the thread, but the people this should help the most just don't care. They're system warriors looking for any reason to attack the competitors to their favorite corporation. They don't care that Valve's open-platform policies, despite being at the top, is unheard of. What they care about is all the reasons Valve isn't another typical platform-holder. They don't roll out AAA hype-fests every year, they don't lock you into restrictive platforms, they don't buy exclusivity, and they don't hold PR conferences. They might as well be alien to the culture that is prevalent here.

Not everyone should be dismissed as such, but that's what the reality of these threads are about.
 
May 6, 2018
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The other Era user understood perfectly what I meant. I am not to blame for your failure to comprehend my post.
Cheers.
No, your post is absolutely confusing, because it came loaded with hidden assumptions. Your claim was, effectively, that unless developers are given a better cut from their distribution platforms, they'll implement more MTX and lootboxes. You're making a fallacious leap in your reasoning though, because you're operating on the assumption that companies need MTX to keep the lights on. However, the companies responsible for all of these MTX-laden games are making record profits. EA, ActiBlizz, Take2, etc etc, are all raking in cash hand over fist. They're seeing better profits than ever before off the backs of fewer and fewer games. The idea that giving them an extra 18% will somehow make them magically stow away their new moneymaking tool is nonsense. At the absolute best, gamers will be given slightly better prices before being taken for a ride on the lootbox-train. In the far more likely case, the publishers will pocket that extra revenue and... that's about it.
 
Jan 15, 2018
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marrec has over 4000 posts in just over a year on ResetEra. It's not his fault he doesn't have time to figure out this newfangled Steam experience and limit the features that he just doesn't like. That'd cut into his posting time.
 
Oct 26, 2017
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marrec has over 4000 posts in just over a year on ResetEra. It's not his fault he doesn't have time to figure out this newfangled Steam experience and limit the features that he just doesn't like. That'd cut into his posting time.
Thats only like, 10 low effort posts a day and I still manage to ignore Steam settings in favor of doing literally anything else with my gaming time
 
Oct 25, 2017
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Alright, I'll tell you what, I'll go through the spreadsheet in the OP and let you know which features I think are a net negative and why (this is going to take awhile):

Chat - The chat implementation is poor and the my gaming experience would be better without the "community" overlay. It would be better to have no chat at all or have an implementation like Battle.net where it's a seperate thing entirely. Either way I'll still use Discord because it's the better way to chat.

Curation - This is a big one for me, the lack of curation makes browsing the store page a bad experience

Curators - Trying to replace their curation with "community" curators just clutters up the store pages with recommendations from people that I don't want to see

Early Access - Whew lad, what a shitshow this turned out to be

Marketplace - An avenue for money laundering, market manipulation, and an incentive for devs to implement shitty "drop" systems

Achievements - More distractions from popups

Community Guides - The community is garbage

Community Discussion - See above

Trading Cards - Something that could have been cool but instead turned into a reason for people to idle in games for extra cash, more distractions from popups

User Reviews - Community is garbage redux

Inventory Support - How is this a feature when it's necessary for their broken marketplace? Moreover, the inventory system is ALWAYS broken in one way or another

Anti-Cheat - Can be bad depending on how the Devs and/or pubs implement

MTX Support - Can be bad depending on the game as well

Leaderboard Support - Rampant cheating (despite "anti-cheat") make this a net negative

3rd Party Keys - Just a vector for key resellers to profit off regional pricing

DRM for Devs - Boooooooooooo

Now, these are my subjective reasons for using Steam less over the years. They may not match up with your feelings on these individual features and that's fine. I have other reasons, listed above in other posts, and likely more that I'm not thinking of right now.

You shouldn't be loyal to a storefront because of momentum. Over the years Steam has become bloated with unnecessary features that, in my opinion, makes playing and buying games on the platform more of a chore than is necessary. Small annoyances and inconveniences are all that is needed for me to want to take my time elsewhere because, luckily, there are other platforms that offer storefronts.

They'd go a long way to winning my time and money back simply by curating content and policing their community, but I understand that Steam doesn't NEED my time or money, they got plenty from other people.
I love how much of your list goes against your previous claims. None of those hinder you playing games, the vast majority of them literally need you to access them on purpose to ever see and others can be turned off with a click. Then you have some of the stupidest possible complaints about anti-cheats or Devs being able to generate keys (I'd love to know how the second one possibly changes your playing experience in any way)

Early Access is pretty damn awesome and has resulted in some of the best games released in the last 10 years. Again, dumbest complaint. Especially when you can literally hide all early access games with a click of a button
 
Oct 25, 2017
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Thats only like, 10 low effort posts a day and I still manage to ignore Steam settings in favor of doing literally anything else with my gaming time
You manage to magically spend your time visiting specific parts of Steam that literally require you to want to go there specifically though, so maybe learn to manage your time and use that time to set settings that would take you less time than the time you used to post this reply?
 
Nov 27, 2018
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You manage to magically spend your time visiting specific parts of Steam that literally require you to want to go there specifically though, so maybe learn to manage your time and use that time to set settings that would take you less time than the time you used to post this reply?
It''s like saying PS4 doesn't have this feature cause I am too lazy to find it.
 

matimeo

UI/UX Game Industry Veteran
Verified
Oct 26, 2017
785
0
List wars do not work. Consumers value things differently. Usually people see a “feature” as a net positive, neutral, or negative. You will note far less neutral because consumers believe if you had time for the feature they feel “neutral” about you could have instead worked on a feature they foresee as a net positive for them.

I still remember when sun roofs in cars were a big thing and my dad saw it as a negative. He once dealt with a rental car with a sunroof that was broken and didn’t close all the way. So for him seeing that feature on the list for a vehicle was a negative. He saw it as another thing that could break and cause considerable damage if it rained.

My youngest brother and his friends do not care about Steam’s social features they all use other apps (making it hard for me to cyber stalk him lol)

They also value content first and foremost and care less about the wrapper. They mostly went from Minecraft to a few games on steam , Destiny (console and PC) and now I rarely see him play on Steam because they all migrated to Fortnite. ( but I swear I’m going to show him how to launch it from Steam so I can continue to cyber stalk him lol)

I only mention this because I find the upcoming generation fascinating and they are the focus for many companies now. Microsoft buying Minecraft was one way of ensuring they had access to the next generation.

Epic has an interesting opportunity to capture the younger market. They don’t have huge libraries anywhere else, they are not into comparing platforms rather they migrate where they can play chosen content with their friends.

Sometimes you are not the target audience because you’re used up goods. Capturing the next generation is where the potential gains are. That’s why you see publishers using part of their advertising budget on influencers and streamers. Time to target the new kids on the block who almost always have a different value system than previous generations.
 
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