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Super Smash Bros. Ultimate Downloadable Contents Discussion Thread 7 | King of Fighters: Dream Match Never Ends - (ERA, ARE YOU OKAY!?)
- Thread starter IntelliHeath
- Start date
- Status
Thanks a lot for posting this. While I definitely would have done something different with the moveset (it should definitely include Arle's signature move Bayoen), I really appreciate the time and effort you put in this. Arle seems to have gotten a lot of support lately (she definitely feels at her peak right now), which is pretty nice.AN ARGUMENT IN FAVOR OF ARLE NADJA IN SUPER SMASH BROS. ULTIMATEYou all got to vote on the picks, & Arle ended up being the winner. So thus, she is the focus of this Argument in Favor of... post. If you want to check out the previous entries in this series of posts, go check them out.
With that said, time to get started.
WHO IS ARLE NADJA?Making her debut in 1989 with the release of Madou Monogatari Episode II (yeah, the second episode came out first), followed by 1-2-3 a year later as its main character. In these games, she was locked in a long battle with a villain known as the Creator that she barely won (with massive injuries). And while her soul was saved, only half of it was saved (not surprising given that it's the Dark Prince, known as Satan in Japan). The other half later became Doppelgänger Arle, who later shows up in Puyo Puyo~n. Speaking of which, the series would then go on to morph into the Puyo Puyo series we know today as of Madou Monogatari: Michikusa Ibun & Puyo Puyo onwards (whose English version refers to Arle as Silvana for whatever reason). While Arle stopped being the protagonist as of Puyo Puyo Fever (Amitie replaced Arle for the role of protagonist in Puyo Puyo Fever, with Ringo Ando later taking up the role in Puyo Puyo 7), she still remained a major character in the franchise.
WHY ARLE NADJA?
While the Puyo Puyo series has gone through a number of protagonists, Arle is very much the original. She has a number of parallels with Terry in this regard, being the main character of her home series & a recurring character in the series that's actually still going today. Though in Arle's case, her series morphed into Puyo Puyo, while King of Fighters was a spin-off series of Fatal Fury that has a different continuity. Granted, there's also Yakuza as far as major Sega franchises left unrepresented in Smash. But with Tetris' recent DLC spirits lowering its chances by quite a lot, Arle could bring us said puzzle game representation (a genre that's generally under-represented in Smash as of now, outside of Dr. Mario).
HOW WOULD ARLE PLAY?
This part was actually pretty tough. I originally went into this wanting to reference Puyo Puyo as much as possible, but then I remembered that Arle has a bunch of magical abilities of her own from the Madou Monogatari games. In the end, I think I may have found the solution. Her smash attacks as well has most of her specials will use each of her elements, with the Puyos factoring into her main gimmick. For example, her up smash would create icicles from the ground around her, & her forward smash would send out electricity. Anyway, here's how her moveset would work...
- SPECIALS
- Standard B: Volcana
- This is basically a lava bullet shot from Arle's hand (you could even have her go Yusuke on us with the Spirit Gun motion). It doesn't look like much, but it can pack quite the punch (think Hero's Bang special). This counts as a fire element.
- Side B: Lwark Woid
- This ability doesn't go that far in range, but it will make the opponent more susceptible to damage for a set amount of time (think Joker's Eiha). This counts as a dark element.
- Up B: Tornado
- This ability creates a tornado pillar that sends Arle upwards. Unlike Hero's Kaswoosh, Tornado is more of a pillar which stays for a second or two (which helps with spacing). This counts as a wind element.
- Down B: Puyo Pair
- This ability sends out two Puyo, the colors of which are dictated by the last two elements you used in battle. You can get the chain effect of adding one metal Puyo (which tags along with the newly-summoned pair of Puyo, thus inflicting more damage) each time if you get matching pairs each time you throw out the attack regardless of the colors (Ex: If you send out two blue Puyos first, then send out two yellow Puyos, you get the chain effect's bonus metal Puyo). Likewise, if you get two of the same kind of pair (Ex: Blue/Yellow, followed by Blue/Yellow), you'll also get the bonus. And if you get two of the same Puyo twice in a row (Ex: Blue/Blue, followed by Blue/Blue), you'll get two metal Puyos on the 2nd set. For reference regarding which attacks trigger which kind of Puyo...
- Fire/Lava attacks result in Red Puyo
- Ice attacks result in Blue Puyo
- Wind attacks result in Green Puyo
- Electric attacks result in Yellow Puyo
- Dark attacks result in Purple Puyo
- Across Arle's smash attacks & specials, you'll have access to each of the aforementioned elements. So to make the most of this ability, you need to keep your previous attacks in mind.
- Final Smash: Cutie
- This Final Smash paralyzes anyone caught within a certain radius & has Arle rain Puyos on them. If you look closely, you'll notice that the Puyos sent out correspond with the past several elements you used in combat. If they chain, you'll get even more damage & knockback.
- UNIQUE MECHANIC
- Puyo Puyo
- This is covered in full in the Puyo Pair special section.
WHAT WOULD BE ARLE'S STAGEI was thinking of going with Puyo Arena, but it would overlap too much with King of Fighters Arena. So instead, I've opted to go with Primp Magic School. You'd fight on top of the campus roof, with the Puyos atop the campus being quite bouncy. This can help you jump higher, but it can also bounce you farther if you're flying towards it at a high velocity. Obviously this stage wouldn't be tournament-legal, but it would be a fun stage for parties. Like with the KoF Arena, you'd have cameos from various Puyo Puyo characters on the roof. And as a bonus, the clock will reflect the time on your Switch.
WHAT MUSIC WOULD ARLE BRING WITH HER?
I'm not super well-versed in Puyo Puyo music, so I'm sure Sakurai would do better than me here. Though given that this is Sega, I'd probably stay within the 10-12 territory regarding the number of songs for Puyo Puyo in Smash (like Bayonetta & Persona before it).
- Puyo Puyo Champions Main Theme
- It's Been a Long Time Since We Passed Through Space Time! [Arle's Theme] (Puyo Puyo 20th Anniversary)
- Final of Puyo Puyo [Mean Bean Machine] (Sonic Mania)
- Ribbit☆Ribbit♪ (Puyo Puyo 20th Anniversary)
- Fever! (Puyo Puyo 7)
- Ringo's Theme (Puyo Puyo 20th Anniversary)
- Dark Arle's Theme (Puyo Puyo 7)
- The Untrained Demon King [Rock Arrangement] (Puyo Puyo Champions)
- 1st Floor (Super Puyo Puyo)
- The Top Floor (Super Puyo Puyo)
WHAT SPIRITS WOULD BE INCLUDED WITH ARLE?
Puyo Puyo has no shortage of characters to pull from. Be it the classic series, the Fever series, or Puyo Puyo 7, there are ton of characters you could use. But for the sake of consistency with the other games, I'll keep it simple with the same 10-14 that most other DLC franchises get.
- Arle Nadja
- Fighter Spirit
- Ringo Ando
- Amitie
- Dark Prince
- Carbuncle
- He also shows up in some of Arle's taunts, like Morgana for Joker & Slime for Hero
- Suketoudara
- Draco Centauros
- Raffina
- Rulue
- Sig
- Klug
- Ecolo
- Witch
- Maguro Sasaki
LONG STORY SHORTI've gone through the whole "We need more women" song & dance in the last two characters, so you know the drill by now (the need for more women on the roster is why these posts exist). But at the same time, Arle would bring some much-needed puzzle game representation to the roster (something that Dr. Mario didn't capitalize on). Granted, we already have 3 Sega characters in the roster. But Arle is diverse enough to set herself apart from the Blue Hedgehogs, Umbra Witches, & Phantom Thieves who would have hypothetically preceded her. She's iconic, she's unique, & she would help expand Smash's spread of genres on the roster (on top of the aforementioned lack of women right now). It's no wonder she's becoming more requested as of recently.
Good music list, but I would definitely include Fun Puyo Puyo Hell and Daihenshin. First one is pretty much a signature theme, and the second is just one of my favorites.
*Screen filling sci fi abomination boss appears*
"Oh crap..."
Trace, the greatest character of our times
So I finally finished the N. Sane Trilogy (and frankly didn't like it much, I do not miss the 90s), and damn if the Crash 3 hub world isn't a perfect Smash stage.
Floating void in the middle of space, giant flat circular platform, surrounded by a bunch of smaller platforms. Big screen behind it for cameos and various warp panels for hazards. A nice prominent place for Coco to hang out. Like, this is the consensus pick for a Crash stage, right? It's gotta be?
Floating void in the middle of space, giant flat circular platform, surrounded by a bunch of smaller platforms. Big screen behind it for cameos and various warp panels for hazards. A nice prominent place for Coco to hang out. Like, this is the consensus pick for a Crash stage, right? It's gotta be?
With how much Sony is advertising Crash. Would he N. Sanely funny to see him in.So I finally finished the N. Sane Trilogy (and frankly didn't like it much, I do not miss the 90s), and damn if the Crash 3 hub world isn't a perfect Smash stage.
Floating void in the middle of space, giant flat circular platform, surrounded by a bunch of smaller platforms. Big screen behind it for cameos and various warp panels for hazards. A nice prominent place for Coco to hang out. Like, this is the consensus pick for a Crash stage, right? It's gotta be?
Yes;So I finally finished the N. Sane Trilogy (and frankly didn't like it much, I do not miss the 90s), and damn if the Crash 3 hub world isn't a perfect Smash stage.
Floating void in the middle of space, giant flat circular platform, surrounded by a bunch of smaller platforms. Big screen behind it for cameos and various warp panels for hazards. A nice prominent place for Coco to hang out. Like, this is the consensus pick for a Crash stage, right? It's gotta be?
In fact, I suggested before that the Time Twister Machine should be his stage and morph throgh some iconic Crash locals as if it was time traveling (think Castle Siege);
And sure, Coco and some other characters should be background elements.
I don't know if I really want this post to die with only two people acknowledging it's existence (probably the only two people to read any of it too), so that's right, i'm shamelessly quoting it.
I felt like the Blaster would be fairly boring on it's own (in Star Allies, it's her basic attack after all) so sprucing it up with the elemental enhancements makes it a more interesting move. Naturally, that also carried over to the mech's Neutral Special, to give the moveset some form of cohesion.
AN ARGUMENT IN FAVOR OF SUSIE IN SUPER SMASH BROS. ULTIMATE
Sorry Neoxon , i'm stealing your format for my own use! Consider this an unofficial installment of "Argument in Favor of…", if you wish. I feel super passionately about supporthing this character, so I want to take this chance to write about them (because I know that nobody else will).
INTRODUCTION - WHO IS SUSIE?
First released on April 28th 2016, Kirby: Planet Robobot was the second major Kirby installment on the Nintendo 3DS. In this title, Planet Popstar is invaded by the Access Ark: the mothership of an intergalactic robotics corporation, the Haltmann Works Company. King Dedede and Meta Knight are defeated as the planet's surface is completely mechanised; setting Kirby up for an adventure in an unfamiliar world. Kirby's journey appears to be straightforward at first, but a new adversary shows her face in the third world, Overload Ocean:
Susie is the secretary and executive assistant of the Haltmann Works Company; tasked with overlooking the harvesting of Planet Popstar's resources. Wishing to remove any native obstacles, she takes on Kirby with her personal mech, the Business Suit. She is forced to flee from the fight after being defeated, but reappears multiple times to pit some new toys against the organic enemy. In the end, Susie disobeys the wishes of President Haltmann and assists Kirby and Meta Knight in destroying a much greater threat, Star Dream.
There's a lot more to Susie as a character beyond her appearance as an antagonist and reluctant ally; Modern Kirby games are known for their shockingly dark backstories/lore after all. I'd consider this section to be spoilers, so avoid it if you wish:
Long before the game's events, Susie happily lived with her father, President Haltmann, who experimented with the abilities of Star Dream: an all-powerful supercomputer with the capacity for granting wishes. A terrible accident occurs during a test on the machine, and Susie is warped into Another Dimension. Haltmann believed that his daughter had died in this accident, and decided to put all of his focus and energy into completing Star Dream in order to revive her. However, these tests on Star Dream had severe negative effects on Haltmann, slowing draining his mental health and his memories. Susie managed to eventually return to her own dimension many years later, but by this time her father had lost his memories of her. Regardless, she was still hired into his company to serve him directly; without ever recognising her as his daughter.
WHY INCLUDE SUSIE?
I feel like I should level with everyone before continuing any further: I don't believe that Susie will be playable in Super Smash Bros. It's far too out there, especially as paid DLC. Even if we receive first-party DLC fighters, and even if a Kirby character is among them, Susie's chances remain slim; and that's an optimistic view. Regardless; as a potential female villain inclusion, I believe Susie is worth discussing. Also: you can't stop me.
So; why Susie over so many other valid options from the Kirby series? With strict competition like Bandana Waddle Dee, Marx and Magolor, it's hard to justify her inclusion. She doesn't win popularity polls, and her game isn't even half a decade old. Yet, despite everything against her, i'm personally drawn to the potential of the character. I believe she has great potential as a fighter in Smash; filling in a niche that the current roster doesn't really fulfil: a mech fighter. Her moveset potential, based on her boss appearances in Planet Robobot, in addition to her playable appearance in Star Allies, presents enough material for a full moveset. She also gets my support for the sake of diversity and representation; the single female villain on Smash's roster sharing that slot with six male villains is pretty embarrassing. No one else will take up the torch, so i'll be the person to give Susie a fair look and shake.
HOW WOULD SUSIE PLAY?
Prior to Kirby: Star Allies, conceptualising a moveset for Susie would've been very difficult. Thankfully, with a playable appearance, I think it's easier to get a grasp on how she would appear as a playable fighter in Smash. In her appearance in Star Allies, Susie was a stance-change character; with the ability to freely swap between being "on-foot" and piloting the Business Suit. I believe that this makes for an interesting and unique Smash moveset; so while this may be an unfeasible way to incorporate the character, especially one lacking in popularity and notoriety, i'll stick with the concept as her main gameplay hook.
MOVESET:
Susie will start each battle outside of the Business Suit, with her moveset predominantly built around this form. As such, i'll cover these special moves first:
Neutral Special: H.W.C. Blaster - A small blaster introduced for her appearance in Star Allies. Her basic shots are a balance between Fox and Falco's Blasters; a moderate speed with some hitstun. However, she can make use of the Elemental abilities from Star Allies to enhance her blaster; accessible by holding down the button and flicking the stick in a certain direction (identical to selecting Monado Arts). There are five variants in total:
Up Special: Transporter - Susie summons her Transporter, a small device with a propeller. This allows her to freely hover in the air for a short amount of time, being able to move vertically and horizontally. The propeller deals a low amount of damage if the opponent is hit from below.
- Blizzard Blaster - Shots are fast ice projectiles that quickly fall to the ground.
- Bluster Blaster - Shots curve upwards with a wind hitbox; best for hitting aerial opponents.
- Sizzle Blaster - Shots become a flamethrower; can be held out until the flame completely diminishes.
- Splash Blaster - Shots travel much further, but with less strength.
- Zap Blaster - Shots bounce along the ground, with added electric properties.
Side Special: Terra Burst - Susie places her Transporter on back, utilizing it as a jetpack. She launching forward at a fast speed and deals damage to any opponents she passes through. The move can be charged up, with three different levels available; each being a tier higher in terms of distance and power. This move serves as a strong horizontal recovery option in terms of distance, but cannot travel diagonally at all.
Down Special: Business Suit Up - Susie summons her Business Suit via a remote, forming around her as she now pilots it. Susie is immune to damage during the middle portion of the animation, but the start-up and end can be interrupted with a hit, cancelling the transformation in the case of the former. Upon summoning the Business Suit, Susie's movement becomes far more restricted. She is slower, larger, much weaker in the air and unable to perform some basic actions like crouching. The Business Suit's attacks are far more powerful, however, and it comes equipped with a brand new moveset:
Neutral Special: Drillbit - Susie fires two drill projectiles from the Business Suit, homing in on targets near her. Like the equivalent Special Move from her regular moveset, this move can also be affected by elemental attributes to alter the properties of the Drillbits. These variants are:
Up Special: Driver Slam - When used on the ground, the Business Suit launches itself high up into the air, before drilling itself down with the screwdriver on the bottom of the mech. This attack has active hitboxes while travelling upwards, and also while drilling downwards. While in the air, the height the suit travels is reduced, but it still allows for a weak horizontal recovery.
- Blizzard Drillbit - Drillbits become falling icicles shortly after launching out.
- Bluster Drillbit - Drillbits perform loops while flying, slower but with more range during flight.
- Sizzle Drillbit - Drillbits explode upon impact, largest damage range.
- Splash Drillbit - Drillbits dive-bomb and release multiple water particles that deal small damage.
- Zap Drillbit - Drillbits produce a tiny lighting strike at the spot of impact.
Side Special: Spin Cycle - The Business Suit spins forward with it's arms extended outward, dealing a heavy amount of knockback and damage, but with far less range compared to Terra Burst. When used on the ground, it can change direction during the duration of the spin; but in the air movement is far more limited, locked to the direction pressed to activate the move.
Down Special: Business Suit Stow - Susie puts away the Business Suit and returns to her regular moveset. She can act early upon exiting the suit, allowing for a quick recovery with Transporter if knocked off-stage. There is delay between being able to summon the Business Suit again, however, so there is a limit to freely swapping between the two forms.
And, finally, just to give it a special mention, Diving Heart is represented through her Up-Throw. Izuna Drop, eat your heart out.
WHAT WOULD SUSIE'S STAGE BE?
There are a few potential concepts that could be used for Susie's stage, though i'm partial to two particular ideas. The area where you encounter her, Overload Ocean, is certainly one potential option. The stage would likely be inspired by Susie's boss arena; an enclosed space surrounded by a sea of water. While the stage could look great aesthetically, especially in HD, it's hard to think of a strong gimmick. They could potentially include the Mech Flotzo enemy from earlier in the world, which would shoot ink blots at the fighters (having a similar affect to the Inkling's ink); as one example.
As an alternative, i'd like to suggest Resolution Road, the second world of the game. Obviously, the main gimmick here would be the Waddle Dee cars coming in from the foreground and background whenever the traffic lights go green; launching opponents if they happen to be hit. We have a few city stages in Ultimate already, but the super cartoony mechanised aesthetic could make it unique. The direct connection to Susie here is weak, but I still think it could make for a fairly interesting stage.
WHAT MUSIC WOULD SUSIE BRING WITH HER?
This is both the easiest and hardest part for me personally; limiting myself to such a small list of Kirby tracks from two whole games is a bummer, but I want to stay true to the fighter being represented here. As a franchise with 40 tracks already, I didn't want to go too overboard with new additions. Even 10 feels like too many, but here are a few suggestions:
- Caught Me Singing (Remix) - Kirby: Planet Robobot
- VS. The Wicked Company - Kirby: Planet Robobot
- Yearning for Yellow (Vroom!) - Kirby: Planet Robobot
- Gorgeous-Go-Round - Kirby: Planet Robobot
- Bountiful Star - Kirby: Planet Robobot
- Crazy Rolling in Money - Kirby: Planet Robobot
- VS. Star Dream - Kirby: Planet Robobot (from Kirby: Star Allies)
- Song of Supplication - Kirby: Star Allies
- Suite: The Star-Conquering Traveler - Kirby: Star Allies
- Butterfly of Judgement: Morpho Knight- Kirby: Star Allies
WHAT SPIRITS WOULD BE INCLUDED WITH SUSIE?
For franchises already included within Ultimate, picking out a full set of spirits is fairly difficult. Because of this, i've imagined something slightly different for Susie's Spirit Board. Instead of being based around new Planet Robobot spirits, i've decided to base her Spirit Board around the Dream Friends from Star Allies. The Dream Palace (pictured above) would be featured in the background, and the board itself would include most of the Dream Friends from Star Allies (excluding King Dedede and Meta Knight; adding new spirits for some Dream Friends). Two extra Planet Robobot Spirits are also included to add some more new content:
And of course, Susie gets a Fighter Spirit too; using artwork different from her existing spirit.
- Bandana Waddle Dee
- Rick, Cine & Coo (NEW; combining their individual spirit battles into a trickier one)
- Gooey
- Marx (available without the need to replay World of Light)
- Adeleine & Ribbon (NEW)
- Dark Meta Knight (NEW)
- Daroach
- Magolor
- Taranza (NEW)
- Susie
- The Three Mage-Sisters
- President Haltmann (NEW)
- Star Dream (NEW)
LONG STORY SHORT
After taking multiple hours to put this together, i've realised just how much I really want to see Susie get in. It's a dream that will never be fulfilled, but I hope this has shined a light onto why I want to see her. I don't have much else to write here, but I hope you enjoyed the read!
Now, to get to those replies:Close enough for me.
I did come up with an alternate moveset exclusively using the mech, but I thought a gimmick like this would make it more interesting and complex. Star Allies gave me the perfect material for two full sets of Special Moves, so I went with it. Realistically though, they would probably stick with the Business Suit.
I felt like the Blaster would be fairly boring on it's own (in Star Allies, it's her basic attack after all) so sprucing it up with the elemental enhancements makes it a more interesting move. Naturally, that also carried over to the mech's Neutral Special, to give the moveset some form of cohesion.
She really wouldn't work as an Alt. Even in N. Sane Trilogy she got many different animations to fit better her personality. If Crash was a character for the base game, she had potential to be an Echo.. but now the best Coco could be (more than just a Spirit) is a background cameo.
I always really liked her design and the idea of a Smash character that can get in and out of their mech is really appealing. That was a fun read btw!AN ARGUMENT IN FAVOR OF SUSIE IN SUPER SMASH BROS. ULTIMATE
Sorry Neoxon , i'm stealing your format for my own use! Consider this an unofficial installment of "Argument in Favor of…", if you wish. I feel super passionately about supporthing this character, so I want to take this chance to write about them (because I know that nobody else will).
INTRODUCTION - WHO IS SUSIE?
First released on April 28th 2016, Kirby: Planet Robobot was the second major Kirby installment on the Nintendo 3DS. In this title, Planet Popstar is invaded by the Access Ark: the mothership of an intergalactic robotics corporation, the Haltmann Works Company. King Dedede and Meta Knight are defeated as the planet's surface is completely mechanised; setting Kirby up for an adventure in an unfamiliar world. Kirby's journey appears to be straightforward at first, but a new adversary shows her face in the third world, Overload Ocean:
Susie is the secretary and executive assistant of the Haltmann Works Company; tasked with overlooking the harvesting of Planet Popstar's resources. Wishing to remove any native obstacles, she takes on Kirby with her personal mech, the Business Suit. She is forced to flee from the fight after being defeated, but reappears multiple times to pit some new toys against the organic enemy. In the end, Susie disobeys the wishes of President Haltmann and assists Kirby and Meta Knight in destroying a much greater threat, Star Dream.
There's a lot more to Susie as a character beyond her appearance as an antagonist and reluctant ally; Modern Kirby games are known for their shockingly dark backstories/lore after all. I'd consider this section to be spoilers, so avoid it if you wish:
Long before the game's events, Susie happily lived with her father, President Haltmann, who experimented with the abilities of Star Dream: an all-powerful supercomputer with the capacity for granting wishes. A terrible accident occurs during a test on the machine, and Susie is warped into Another Dimension. Haltmann believed that his daughter had died in this accident, and decided to put all of his focus and energy into completing Star Dream in order to revive her. However, these tests on Star Dream had severe negative effects on Haltmann, slowing draining his mental health and his memories. Susie managed to eventually return to her own dimension many years later, but by this time her father had lost his memories of her. Regardless, she was still hired into his company to serve him directly; without ever recognising her as his daughter.
WHY INCLUDE SUSIE?
I feel like I should level with everyone before continuing any further: I don't believe that Susie will be playable in Super Smash Bros. It's far too out there, especially as paid DLC. Even if we receive first-party DLC fighters, and even if a Kirby character is among them, Susie's chances remain slim; and that's an optimistic view. Regardless; as a potential female villain inclusion, I believe Susie is worth discussing. Also: you can't stop me.
So; why Susie over so many other valid options from the Kirby series? With strict competition like Bandana Waddle Dee, Marx and Magolor, it's hard to justify her inclusion. She doesn't win popularity polls, and her game isn't even half a decade old. Yet, despite everything against her, i'm personally drawn to the potential of the character. I believe she has great potential as a fighter in Smash; filling in a niche that the current roster doesn't really fulfil: a mech fighter. Her moveset potential, based on her boss appearances in Planet Robobot, in addition to her playable appearance in Star Allies, presents enough material for a full moveset. She also gets my support for the sake of diversity and representation; the single female villain on Smash's roster sharing that slot with six male villains is pretty embarrassing. No one else will take up the torch, so i'll be the person to give Susie a fair look and shake.
HOW WOULD SUSIE PLAY?
Prior to Kirby: Star Allies, conceptualising a moveset for Susie would've been very difficult. Thankfully, with a playable appearance, I think it's easier to get a grasp on how she would appear as a playable fighter in Smash. In her appearance in Star Allies, Susie was a stance-change character; with the ability to freely swap between being "on-foot" and piloting the Business Suit. I believe that this makes for an interesting and unique Smash moveset; so while this may be an unfeasible way to incorporate the character, especially one lacking in popularity and notoriety, i'll stick with the concept as her main gameplay hook.
MOVESET:
Susie will start each battle outside of the Business Suit, with her moveset predominantly built around this form. As such, i'll cover these special moves first:
Neutral Special: H.W.C. Blaster - A small blaster introduced for her appearance in Star Allies. Her basic shots are a balance between Fox and Falco's Blasters; a moderate speed with some hitstun. However, she can make use of the Elemental abilities from Star Allies to enhance her blaster; accessible by holding down the button and flicking the stick in a certain direction (identical to selecting Monado Arts). There are five variants in total:
Up Special: Transporter - Susie summons her Transporter, a small device with a propeller. This allows her to freely hover in the air for a short amount of time, being able to move vertically and horizontally. The propeller deals a low amount of damage if the opponent is hit from below.
- Blizzard Blaster - Shots are fast ice projectiles that quickly fall to the ground.
- Bluster Blaster - Shots curve upwards with a wind hitbox; best for hitting aerial opponents.
- Sizzle Blaster - Shots become a flamethrower; can be held out until the flame completely diminishes.
- Splash Blaster - Shots travel much further, but with less strength.
- Zap Blaster - Shots bounce along the ground, with added electric properties.
Side Special: Terra Burst - Susie places her Transporter on back, utilizing it as a jetpack. She launching forward at a fast speed and deals damage to any opponents she passes through. The move can be charged up, with three different levels available; each being a tier higher in terms of distance and power. This move serves as a strong horizontal recovery option in terms of distance, but cannot travel diagonally at all.
Down Special: Business Suit Up - Susie summons her Business Suit via a remote, forming around her as she now pilots it. Susie is immune to damage during the middle portion of the animation, but the start-up and end can be interrupted with a hit, cancelling the transformation in the case of the former. Upon summoning the Business Suit, Susie's movement becomes far more restricted. She is slower, larger, much weaker in the air and unable to perform some basic actions like crouching. The Business Suit's attacks are far more powerful, however, and it comes equipped with a brand new moveset:
Neutral Special: Drillbit - Susie fires two drill projectiles from the Business Suit, homing in on targets near her. Like the equivalent Special Move from her regular moveset, this move can also be affected by elemental attributes to alter the properties of the Drillbits. These variants are:
Up Special: Driver Slam - When used on the ground, the Business Suit launches itself high up into the air, before drilling itself down with the screwdriver on the bottom of the mech. This attack has active hitboxes while travelling upwards, and also while drilling downwards. While in the air, the height the suit travels is reduced, but it still allows for a weak horizontal recovery.
- Blizzard Drillbit - Drillbits become falling icicles shortly after launching out.
- Bluster Drillbit - Drillbits perform loops while flying, slower but with more range during flight.
- Sizzle Drillbit - Drillbits explode upon impact, largest damage range.
- Splash Drillbit - Drillbits dive-bomb and release multiple water particles that deal small damage.
- Zap Drillbit - Drillbits produce a tiny lighting strike at the spot of impact.
Side Special: Spin Cycle - The Business Suit spins forward with it's arms extended outward, dealing a heavy amount of knockback and damage, but with far less range compared to Terra Burst. When used on the ground, it can change direction during the duration of the spin; but in the air movement is far more limited, locked to the direction pressed to activate the move.
Down Special: Business Suit Stow - Susie puts away the Business Suit and returns to her regular moveset. She can act early upon exiting the suit, allowing for a quick recovery with Transporter if knocked off-stage. There is delay between being able to summon the Business Suit again, however, so there is a limit to freely swapping between the two forms.
And, finally, just to give it a special mention, Diving Heart is represented through her Up-Throw. Izuna Drop, eat your heart out.
WHAT WOULD SUSIE'S STAGE BE?
There are a few potential concepts that could be used for Susie's stage, though i'm partial to two particular ideas. The area where you encounter her, Overload Ocean, is certainly one potential option. The stage would likely be inspired by Susie's boss arena; an enclosed space surrounded by a sea of water. While the stage could look great aesthetically, especially in HD, it's hard to think of a strong gimmick. They could potentially include the Mech Flotzo enemy from earlier in the world, which would shoot ink blots at the fighters (having a similar affect to the Inkling's ink); as one example.
As an alternative, i'd like to suggest Resolution Road, the second world of the game. Obviously, the main gimmick here would be the Waddle Dee cars coming in from the foreground and background whenever the traffic lights go green; launching opponents if they happen to be hit. We have a few city stages in Ultimate already, but the super cartoony mechanised aesthetic could make it unique. The direct connection to Susie here is weak, but I still think it could make for a fairly interesting stage.
WHAT MUSIC WOULD SUSIE BRING WITH HER?
This is both the easiest and hardest part for me personally; limiting myself to such a small list of Kirby tracks from two whole games is a bummer, but I want to stay true to the fighter being represented here. As a franchise with 40 tracks already, I didn't want to go too overboard with new additions. Even 10 feels like too many, but here are a few suggestions:
- Caught Me Singing (Remix) - Kirby: Planet Robobot
- VS. The Wicked Company - Kirby: Planet Robobot
- Yearning for Yellow (Vroom!) - Kirby: Planet Robobot
- Gorgeous-Go-Round - Kirby: Planet Robobot
- Bountiful Star - Kirby: Planet Robobot
- Crazy Rolling in Money - Kirby: Planet Robobot
- VS. Star Dream - Kirby: Planet Robobot (from Kirby: Star Allies)
- Song of Supplication - Kirby: Star Allies
- Suite: The Star-Conquering Traveler - Kirby: Star Allies
- Butterfly of Judgement: Morpho Knight- Kirby: Star Allies
WHAT SPIRITS WOULD BE INCLUDED WITH SUSIE?
For franchises already included within Ultimate, picking out a full set of spirits is fairly difficult. Because of this, i've imagined something slightly different for Susie's Spirit Board. Instead of being based around new Planet Robobot spirits, i've decided to base her Spirit Board around the Dream Friends from Star Allies. The Dream Palace (pictured above) would be featured in the background, and the board itself would include most of the Dream Friends from Star Allies (excluding King Dedede and Meta Knight; adding new spirits for some Dream Friends). Two extra Planet Robobot Spirits are also included to add some more new content:
And of course, Susie gets a Fighter Spirit too; using artwork different from her existing spirit.
- Bandana Waddle Dee
- Rick, Cine & Coo (NEW; combining their individual spirit battles into a trickier one)
- Gooey
- Marx (available without the need to replay World of Light)
- Adeleine & Ribbon (NEW)
- Dark Meta Knight (NEW)
- Daroach
- Magolor
- Taranza (NEW)
- Susie
- The Three Mage-Sisters
- President Haltmann (NEW)
- Star Dream (NEW)
LONG STORY SHORT
After taking multiple hours to put this together, i've realised just how much I really want to see Susie get in. It's a dream that will never be fulfilled, but I hope this has shined a light onto why I want to see her. I don't have much else to write here, but I hope you enjoyed the read!
I really should get around to playing Planet Robobot, honestly
Ah, that would be really cool - snapping to, say, a jungle with a giant boulder rolling by, or a lab full of various electricity hazards. Would be a lot of work for a single stage, but it'd feel appropriately chaotic.
"The Gungeoneer" from Enter the Gungeon, Hero style (with the original 4, though if they went with all 8, I wouldn't complain....). The only thing I'm having trouble picturing is how they'd look, since the sprites in the game look like tiny little Funko Pops, but the moveset has so many options that I want to see them try.
I miss Yuoke.
(also Simon's Amiibo is cool too I guess)
I like it because it really captures the look of Smash's Incineroar being a dude in a high quality suit, which is kind of appropriate for a wrestler.
The effort made here is worthy of applause.
You're right because every character is beautiful in their own way. Thank you!
AN ARGUMENT IN FAVOR OF ARLE NADJA IN SUPER SMASH BROS. ULTIMATEYou all got to vote on the picks, & Arle ended up being the winner. So thus, she is the focus of this Argument in Favor of... post. If you want to check out the previous entries in this series of posts, go check them out.
With that said, time to get started.
WHO IS ARLE NADJA?Making her debut in 1989 with the release of Madou Monogatari Episode II (yeah, the second episode came out first), followed by 1-2-3 a year later as its main character. In these games, she was locked in a long battle with a villain known as the Creator that she barely won (with massive injuries). And while her soul was saved, only half of it was saved (not surprising given that it's the Dark Prince, known as Satan in Japan). The other half later became Doppelgänger Arle, who later shows up in Puyo Puyo~n. Speaking of which, the series would then go on to morph into the Puyo Puyo series we know today as of Madou Monogatari: Michikusa Ibun & Puyo Puyo onwards (whose English version refers to Arle as Silvana for whatever reason). While Arle stopped being the protagonist as of Puyo Puyo Fever (Amitie replaced Arle for the role of protagonist in Puyo Puyo Fever, with Ringo Ando later taking up the role in Puyo Puyo 7), she still remained a major character in the franchise.
WHY ARLE NADJA?
While the Puyo Puyo series has gone through a number of protagonists, Arle is very much the original. She has a number of parallels with Terry in this regard, being the main character of her home series & a recurring character in the series that's actually still going today. Though in Arle's case, her series morphed into Puyo Puyo, while King of Fighters was a spin-off series of Fatal Fury that has a different continuity. Granted, there's also Yakuza as far as major Sega franchises left unrepresented in Smash. But with Tetris' recent DLC spirits lowering its chances by quite a lot, Arle could bring us said puzzle game representation (a genre that's generally under-represented in Smash as of now, outside of Dr. Mario).
HOW WOULD ARLE PLAY?
This part was actually pretty tough. I originally went into this wanting to reference Puyo Puyo as much as possible, but then I remembered that Arle has a bunch of magical abilities of her own from the Madou Monogatari games. In the end, I think I may have found the solution. Her smash attacks as well has most of her specials will use each of her elements, with the Puyos factoring into her main gimmick. For example, her up smash would create icicles from the ground around her, & her forward smash would send out electricity. Anyway, here's how her moveset would work...
- SPECIALS
- Standard B: Volcana
- This is basically a lava bullet shot from Arle's hand (you could even have her go Yusuke on us with the Spirit Gun motion). It doesn't look like much, but it can pack quite the punch (think Hero's Bang special). This counts as a fire element.
- Side B: Lwark Woid
- This ability doesn't go that far in range, but it will make the opponent more susceptible to damage for a set amount of time (think Joker's Eiha). This counts as a dark element.
- Up B: Tornado
- This ability creates a tornado pillar that sends Arle upwards. Unlike Hero's Kaswoosh, Tornado is more of a pillar which stays for a second or two (which helps with spacing). This counts as a wind element.
- Down B: Puyo Pair
- This ability sends out two Puyo, the colors of which are dictated by the last two elements you used in battle. You can get the chain effect of adding one metal Puyo (which tags along with the newly-summoned pair of Puyo, thus inflicting more damage) each time if you get matching pairs each time you throw out the attack regardless of the colors (Ex: If you send out two blue Puyos first, then send out two yellow Puyos, you get the chain effect's bonus metal Puyo). Likewise, if you get two of the same kind of pair (Ex: Blue/Yellow, followed by Blue/Yellow), you'll also get the bonus. And if you get two of the same Puyo twice in a row (Ex: Blue/Blue, followed by Blue/Blue), you'll get two metal Puyos on the 2nd set. For reference regarding which attacks trigger which kind of Puyo...
- Fire/Lava attacks result in Red Puyo
- Ice attacks result in Blue Puyo
- Wind attacks result in Green Puyo
- Electric attacks result in Yellow Puyo
- Dark attacks result in Purple Puyo
- Across Arle's smash attacks & specials, you'll have access to each of the aforementioned elements. So to make the most of this ability, you need to keep your previous attacks in mind.
- Final Smash: Cutie
- This Final Smash paralyzes anyone caught within a certain radius & has Arle rain Puyos on them. If you look closely, you'll notice that the Puyos sent out correspond with the past several elements you used in combat. If they chain, you'll get even more damage & knockback.
- UNIQUE MECHANIC
- Puyo Puyo
- This is covered in full in the Puyo Pair special section.
WHAT WOULD BE ARLE'S STAGEI was thinking of going with Puyo Arena, but it would overlap too much with King of Fighters Arena. So instead, I've opted to go with Primp Magic School. You'd fight on top of the campus roof, with the Puyos atop the campus being quite bouncy. This can help you jump higher, but it can also bounce you farther if you're flying towards it at a high velocity. Obviously this stage wouldn't be tournament-legal, but it would be a fun stage for parties. Like with the KoF Arena, you'd have cameos from various Puyo Puyo characters on the roof. And as a bonus, the clock will reflect the time on your Switch.
WHAT MUSIC WOULD ARLE BRING WITH HER?
I'm not super well-versed in Puyo Puyo music, so I'm sure Sakurai would do better than me here. Though given that this is Sega, I'd probably stay within the 10-12 territory regarding the number of songs for Puyo Puyo in Smash (like Bayonetta & Persona before it).
- Puyo Puyo Champions Main Theme
- It's Been a Long Time Since We Passed Through Space Time! [Arle's Theme] (Puyo Puyo 20th Anniversary)
- Final of Puyo Puyo [Mean Bean Machine] (Sonic Mania)
- Ribbit☆Ribbit♪ (Puyo Puyo 20th Anniversary)
- Fever! (Puyo Puyo 7)
- Ringo's Theme (Puyo Puyo 20th Anniversary)
- Dark Arle's Theme (Puyo Puyo 7)
- The Untrained Demon King [Rock Arrangement] (Puyo Puyo Champions)
- 1st Floor (Super Puyo Puyo)
- The Top Floor (Super Puyo Puyo)
WHAT SPIRITS WOULD BE INCLUDED WITH ARLE?
Puyo Puyo has no shortage of characters to pull from. Be it the classic series, the Fever series, or Puyo Puyo 7, there are ton of characters you could use. But for the sake of consistency with the other games, I'll keep it simple with the same 10-14 that most other DLC franchises get.
- Arle Nadja
- Fighter Spirit
- Ringo Ando
- Amitie
- Dark Prince
- Carbuncle
- He also shows up in some of Arle's taunts, like Morgana for Joker & Slime for Hero
- Suketoudara
- Draco Centauros
- Raffina
- Rulue
- Sig
- Klug
- Ecolo
- Witch
- Maguro Sasaki
LONG STORY SHORTI've gone through the whole "We need more women" song & dance in the last two characters, so you know the drill by now (the need for more women on the roster is why these posts exist). But at the same time, Arle would bring some much-needed puzzle game representation to the roster (something that Dr. Mario didn't capitalize on). Granted, we already have 3 Sega characters in the roster. But Arle is diverse enough to set herself apart from the Blue Hedgehogs, Umbra Witches, & Phantom Thieves who would have hypothetically preceded her. She's iconic, she's unique, & she would help expand Smash's spread of genres on the roster (on top of the aforementioned lack of women right now). It's no wonder she's becoming more requested as of recently.
I'd prefer Lip, especially as I don't think we'd get two "puzzle girls", but Arle is a very strong second choice and I'd love to see her. Great write-up!
I've seen plenty of people call K. Rool very hot, a fact that I like repeating on this forum. I don't think I've ever seen someone call Geno hot. but maybe that is what Tall Lean Geno is supposed to be. "Ironic" since hot Geno doesn't even make sense, since he's flammable. Makes you think.
These were some interesting 45000 posts to read through in line. I don't think I managed to remember anything important. But what a ride! Modelling! Company controversies! Sonic comics! Edgy ads for sane games! Petrification guns acquired through time travel! Minute counting! Hardly noticeable knives! Too bad I couldn't actually write to you from the future while you were arguing about Terry surely getting a Garou costume but very few music tracks, or there being no way to spend 45 minutes on Terry without doing something like Sakurai playing eight matches in a row.
What highlights am I missing?
What highlights am I missing?
Not a problem while in a snow bound land.
I've seen you post this in like three separate Smash threads before. Tell us how you really feel.
Because we can't explain why it's wrong if we can't read itHey, I saw this posted elsewhere but it is impossible to read.
why make a BS theory if it is so blurry?
My theory theory is that this limits this theory to the high elite of internet dwellers who have just the right image enhancement software.Hey, I saw this posted elsewhere but it is impossible to read.
why make a BS theory if it is so blurry?
Otherwise, yeah, what stealthyfrog said.
From a quick glance this seems to suggest some sort of pipeline setup for marketing and using it to eliminate non-solid leaks based on timing. Which isn't the most insane thing I've read today, but Terry doesn't really fit it too well.
i can't readHey, I saw this posted elsewhere but it is impossible to read.
why make a BS theory if it is so blurry?
Ha, I came up with a theory similar to this one before (at least the first part; with the characters being developed three at a time in a continuous cycle). Kinda a stretch to try and include those three characters at the bottom specifically though.Hey, I saw this posted elsewhere but it is impossible to read.
why make a BS theory if it is so blurry?
I've read that before.Hey, I saw this posted elsewhere but it is impossible to read.
why make a BS theory if it is so blurry?
Its prediction is entirely predicated on the idea that two different posts on 4chan are from the same person due to the fact that they both use the same cat picture which, and correct me if I'm wrong, could just be someone else using the same picture to pretend to be them. The first person did seem to be legit.
I did find a bigger version but to say it's not still blurry well....Hey, I saw this posted elsewhere but it is impossible to read.
why make a BS theory if it is so blurry?
it's more two halves that are being put together in an attempt to support each other, they originally did the stuff under the timeline, then came back to it later on for the rule of threes stuff
oh yeah I get that part for sure. That's old news. What's all the nonsense on top though and the bottom?
The bottom stuff is just listing off why KOS-MOS, Reimu, and Ryu 2: Electric Boogaloo are decent choices and the top is guessing that the Smash DLC was made in groups of three and trying to apply a timeline to it through sheer conjecture.
Timeline at the top seems mostly sound to me;
except that, we know Banjo & Kazooie entered some form of early development in December alongside Joker and Hero. I really do feel like Piranha Plant was finished before January (it was in a playable state for QA testers in September, and seemed fairly finalised in the November Direct).
except that, we know Banjo & Kazooie entered some form of early development in December alongside Joker and Hero. I really do feel like Piranha Plant was finished before January (it was in a playable state for QA testers in September, and seemed fairly finalised in the November Direct).
The top part doesn't even make sense. It states that we know the characters are developed in groups of 3. How we know that, I don't know. But then it states that characters are in development for 6 to 8 months and when one is finished, a new fighter is put into development. This suggests that the characters are created one at a time which contradicts the statement saying the are developed in batches of 3.
they work on up to 3 at a time and as they finish they add another to the rotation
plant/joker/hero
joker/hero/banjo
hero/banjo/terry
banjo/terry/#5
unless I'm misreading you entirely
Joker, Hero and Banjo & Kazooie all entered development in December last year.
The main assumption they're making is that they continued with a cycle of three after Joker was completed, and I don't think that's really a stretch.
The problem with Lip is that, as far as I'm aware, she has no international presence for her games.
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