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Would Dixie Kong make in Super Smash Bros. Ultimate


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Weiss

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,159
With custom moves seemingly gone, I'm gonna make a "bold" prediction here: Medusa will be in this game as a "half" echo (like Dr. Mario is to Mario) of Palutena, with different specials.

Palutena's custom moves contain some pretty different stuff from her regular moves that could easily be made to fit Medusa. Heavenly Light and Celestial Firework could easily be visually reworked into something that fits her theme, Exposive Flame could fit without even changing anything, same for Rocket Jump as her Up Special (cool idea for this one: she pops her head off from her body, using that one-eyed form that she has and then grows a new body after the jump is complete). For her regular attacks she can just use Palutena's regular attacks since she's also been depicted with a staff.
I think the issue with a Medusa Echo is that she'd arguably have to be balanced against the rest of the roster instead of just Palutena like the other Echoes.
 

MondoMega

Member
Jan 10, 2018
11,984
Sydney, Australia
Chrom and Dark Samus have tons of different/altered animations for moves.

For example, for moves where Roy reversed his grip on his sword (like his neutral attack and forward tilt) Chrom holds the sword regularly. He also has a few other slightly altered moves (like Up-Smash doing three hits instead of five). Dark Samus has A LOT of altered animations to give her a more floaty and monstrous appearance; she also only goes into the Morph Ball when using Down-B, unlike regular Samus.
 

memoryman3

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,143
He said he had a few to choose from for new games for dlc. That probably meant corrin, inkling, elma, and maybe a pokemon like sceptile, or captain toad or something. Skipping inkling was a good move in hindsight, but elma should have been the one.
Inkling needed this game to fully realise their ink mechanic. Although Bayonetta is quite a complex fighter when you think of it...
 

yuoke

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,093
Where do you make these assumptions from in the video? Absolutely nothing dictates that.

Anything is possible when it comes to Sakurai, who literally showed off 5 new additions last week.

With 4 months until release, I have very little doubt in my mind that we are still in for a few surprises.

Reckon at least 4 more newcomers by release with several Echo fighters to accompany them.
I mean sakurau said there are a few new ones left, before k.rool
 

Raspyberry

Member
Oct 25, 2017
477
I think the 66 other characters that are already in the game while also having the ability to change to a female variant for a a good portion of them. Also the other part of the roster that does have a lot of female characters. The problem with the game's industry is often times they might not even have the option for female characters to begin with and Smash already has done alot to accommodate that. To say Smash Ultimate has poor female representation is absolute hyperbole and quite frankly a crock of shit.
Well said. Smash has quite a lot and way more than most other games available. It's a shame that some are picking a fight over something that they've shown to actually care about and actually consider.
 

Dragnipur

Banned
Feb 27, 2018
741
User warned: backseat modding
I think the hypothetical roster with only one primarily female newcomer speaks for itself.
Can you move on to something else? You've derailed more than half of this thread. We don't know what the roster is, stop acting like there won't be any new female characters. We don't know yet. Save your bitching for if the final roster doesn't please you, and we should be able to speculate about Geno/Skull Kid/Isaac without you making the topic about female representation.
 

Bluewind098

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,935
Having characters with so-called moveset potential like Elma or Dixie and passing them over for male characters that aren't particularly relevant or popular in the large scheme of things is a conscious decision.
We don't even know if he's even passing on characters like Elma. That's what makes this entire conversation frustrating because this is all entirely hypothetical. You're gearing yourself over a possibility that's set in stone and even having it color your perception of the game. Yes Smash Ultimate has a newcomer pool that's more geared towards fans and it's making the representation a bit skewed especially with speculation claiming that characters like Geno and Skull Kid are playable that could leave making the gender ratio even more out of balance but Sakurai's memo has been to fill his games up with as much content as possible. That's why characters like Dixie, Isabelle, Medusa, and Impa would most likely be Echoes because they would be better fit as Echoes to save the resources needed to put in as many characters in the game. If Skull Kid, Geno, and Issac could be echoes and the other 4 are unique fighters is something that is possible. However the four I mentioned would absolutely fit as Echoes anyway and the other 3 would probably not fit as Echoes as they have more unique properties that it's not likely to begin with.

Ask any person about Smash Ultimate if they would rather have 10 characters with unique Dixie Kong or a 15 character roster with Skull Kid, Issac, and Geno with Echoed Dixie Kong, Isabelle, and Medusa guess what most people are going to pick.
 

ned_ballad

Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,375
Western New York
So Dark Samus' three taunts seem to be

- Float up, cover herself in energy (From the Meta Ridley vs Samus segment)
- Float up, cover herself in energy, while doing a spin (From the intro of her fighter profile trailer)
- Land on the ground and look around defensively (From the section at the end of Echo part of the Direct when she's against Samus)

From watching her footage.
 

Mark1

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,481
I mean sakurau said there are a few new ones left, before k.rool
But its not dictated if he refers to both newcomers amd Echo fighters. Who knows with Sakurai, he's a known troll.

I read it as more of a reference towards newcomers

No one expected so many to be revealed after his comments at E3. He certainly shocked everyone last week xD
 

NeonStars

Member
Feb 23, 2018
850
How many differences does she need to have before you guys admit the "perfectly represented" Dixie isn't a simple copy/paste of Diddy's moveset with a new recovery?
I’m not saying Dixie is a copy and paste, but considering the amount of effort that went into an echo like Dark Samus to make her differentiated from Samus, the same could be done for Dixie while still being considered an echo.
 

memoryman3

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,143
It has less than every other major fighting game other than MvCI and FighterZ. It has less than LoL.
  • Peach
  • Daisy
  • Rosalina
  • Jigglypuff
  • Lucina
  • Palutena
  • Samus and Zero Suit Samus
  • Zelda and Sheik

Other female fighters
  • Pichu
  • Pikachu/Pikachu Libre
  • Wendy
  • Pokemon Trainer (Leaf and Ivysaur)
  • Inkling
  • Robin
  • Corrin
  • Miis
  • Ice Climber Nana
That's not even counting the fact that many fighters do not have a gender.
 

SieteBlanco

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,878
Can you move on to something else? You've derailed more than half of this thread. We don't know what the roster is, stop acting like there won't be any new female characters. We don't know yet. Save your bitching for if the final roster doesn't please you, and we should be able to speculate about Geno/Skull Kid/Isaac without you making the topic about female representation.
And people should also be able to talk about Dixie without 5 posters jumping at how she is just not worth it and she is just "Diddy with a drag".
 

yuoke

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,093
The phrased used was "perfectly represented." I'm not saying a Dixie echo isn't possible. What I am saying is it a simple copy/paste of Diddy's moveset with a new recovery isn't her being "perfectly represented."
That's fine, it wouldn't be perfect, but it would be more than just literally diddy with a ponytail.
 

Clov

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,056
It has less than every other major fighting game other than MvCI and FighterZ.
If I'm remembering right, they have 21 playable female characters so far (including characters with selectable gender, 22 if we count Ice Climbers, who are a male and female team). Could it be better? Yes, and I hope it continues to improve.
 

TheDinoman

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,875
Playable female characters in Smash include:

Peach
Daisy
Rosalina
Zelda/Sheik
Samus/ZSS
Dark Samus
Palutena
Lucina
Bayonetta
Wii Fit Trainer
Inkling
Pokemon Trainer
Pikachu
Villager
Robin
Corrin
Wendy
Nana

Also all three Mii Fighter types can be made female.

So that's like, over 20 female reps in the game.
 

Dragnipur

Banned
Feb 27, 2018
741
And people should also be able to talk about Dixie without 5 posters jumping at how she is just not worth it and she is just "Diddy with a drag".
Yes, but you're doing the reverse of that as well. If you feel frustrated that people are doing that to you, can you see how others are frustrated when you do it to them?
 

SieteBlanco

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,878
Playable female characters in Smash include:

Peach
Daisy
Rosalina
Zelda/Sheik
Samus/ZSS
Dark Samus
Palutena
Lucina
Bayonetta
Wii Fit Trainer
Inkling
Pokemon Trainer
Pikachu
Villager
Robin
Corrin
Wendy

Also all three Mii Fighter types can be made female.

So that's like, over 20 female reps in the game.
Compared to 59 male reps, though.
 

Weiss

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,159
Can you move on to something else? You've derailed more than half of this thread. We don't know what the roster is, stop acting like there won't be any new female characters. We don't know yet. Save your bitching for if the final roster doesn't please you, and we should be able to speculate about Geno/Skull Kid/Isaac without you making the topic about female representation.
Representation in games is important and deserves to be talked about. Siete isn't derailing the thread by bringing up these complaints.

I'm happy with the roster. I'll be happier if Geno's in, but I'm happy now. Meanwhile they aren't okay with it and want to express the problem of characters like Dixie, Isabelle and Elma getting snubbed for nostalgia picks like K.Rool (who for the record was my other most wanted character).

Nothing's stopping anybody from discussing Geno/Skull Kid/Isaac, it's just that some folks here are tired of that being the only discussion and dominating the thread.
 

nicolasacmf

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
747
I think the issue with a Medusa Echo is that she'd arguably have to be balanced against the rest of the roster instead of just Palutena like the other Echoes.
That's why I said "half" clone. Ideally, she'd be like Dr. Mario, Falco or Wolf in that she would share some traits with Palutena, but would be mostly a new character.
 

DecoReturns

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,197
Isn’t Jigglypuff referred to as female in Smash?

Or was that just the anime? It’s been a while since I’ve see the show to be honest.
 

Raspyberry

Member
Oct 25, 2017
477
  • Peach
  • Daisy
  • Rosalina
  • Jigglypuff
  • Lucina
  • Palutena
  • Samus and Zero Suit Samus
  • Zelda and Sheik
Other female fighters
  • Pichu
  • Pikachu/Pikachu Libre
  • Wendy
  • Pokemon Trainer (Leaf and Ivysaur)
  • Inkling
  • Robin
  • Corrin
  • Miis
  • Ice Climber Nana
That's not even counting the fact that many fighters do not have a gender.
Thanks for saving me the time. Plus well probably have Isabel as well. It's really sad to see when someone is misrepresenting an issue just to push their agenda.
 

KtotheRoc

Member
Oct 27, 2017
17,391
That's fine, it wouldn't be perfect, but it would be more than just literally diddy with a ponytail.
This is what people (such as yours truly) took umbrage with.

Dixie is literally just Diddy in drag. Give her a new Up-B and some visual flair and you’re golden.
People act as if she’s some completely unique character from Diddy. I’ve played the DKC games. She’s Diddy but hovers. She effectively replaced his role in DKC 3. Their moveset is otherwise identical.

Give her a new Up-B, change the peanuts to gum, different taunts, maybe make her grab with her hair, change her victory animations to feature her guitar. Perfectly represented.
I'm not saying Sakurai can't make Dixie as echo fighter work. I am saying "do we really want to agree with a poster who said she is Diddy in drag with a new Up-B"?
 

Dragnipur

Banned
Feb 27, 2018
741
Representation in games is important and deserves to be talked about. Siete isn't derailing the thread by bringing up these complaints.

I'm happy with the roster. I'll be happier if Geno's in, but I'm happy now. Meanwhile they aren't okay with it and want to express the problem of characters like Dixie, Isabelle and Elma getting snubbed for nostalgia picks like K.Rool (who for the record was my other most wanted character).

Nothing's stopping anybody from discussing Geno/Skull Kid/Isaac, it's just that some folks here are tired of that being the only discussion and dominating the thread.
There's a difference between discussing female representation (which is perfectly okay) and attacking other users that want Isaac/Geno/etc. in.
 

PK Gaming

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,489
I really don't think so. In terms of making a good game, every single character can be made interesting as a fighter so having one female unique newcomer wouldn't be a mechanic thing that will make the gameplay better.
I think it's fair to want either, especially since the situation is too nuanced to make the unique female newcomer a 100%, no brainer option. Not that I wouldn't want the latter to happen at all, considering I want Dixie, Mythra and Elma (not some of the others you mentioned though, like Primarina. Hard pass.)

Skull Kid in exchange for only one female newcomer is absolutely in no way a fair exchange.
It's not an exchange, this isn't a hostage situation and it's not straightforward. Arguments can be made for both sides.
 

Weiss

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,159
Isn’t Jigglypuff referred to as female in Smash?

Or was that just the anime? It’s been a while since I’ve see the show to be honest.
I dunno if Jigglypuff has been specifically gendered in Smash but they've always been female coded.

That's why I said "half" clone. Ideally, she'd be like Dr. Mario, Falco or Wolf in that she would share some traits with Palutena, but would be mostly a new character.
I dunno if Sakurai's doing semi-clones like Wolf and Lucas for this game, which is a shame.

Thanks for saving me the time. Plus well probably have Isabel as well. It's really sad to see when someone is misrepresenting an issue just to push their agenda.
A lot of those characters are either gender picks or avatars, though.
 
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