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Super Smash Bros. Ultimate Review Thread

Vito

formerly Undead Fantasy
Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,955
It needs to get to 94. The evil that is Brawl must be defeated.
 

NHarmonic.

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
3,672
I agree with the online stuff. If online is shitty this definitely needs to be reflected in the scores.
 

mazi

Member
Oct 27, 2017
18,309
roses are red
before you marry someone you should do a dick test
sakurai put a lot of effort into this
 

Soul Skater

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,788
Gamexplain saying the game can be hard to follow is worrying me. I've been watching and I think he's right. All the smoke everywhere after basically every attack seems really distracting.
 

JayWood2010

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,485
Put Banjo in it and Ill give it a 99 ;D

For real though, looking forward to playing this tomorrow. I know some people say its just a port, but in fighting games, even the small changes can make a character feel entirely different.
 

Rhennik

Member
Oct 25, 2017
785
Do we know if you can create Miis from within the game itself, or can you only import them from the OS? I'd rather spend time crafting Miis within Smash, but if that's not possible I might make a few tonight on my system while waiting for the game to unlock 🤔
 

Fedele

Member
Oct 28, 2017
28
Excited for it but the whole LAN adapter thing has turned me off a bit - I will not buy an adapter + spread a long ass cable across my house everytime I wanna play online.

It would be great if Digital Foundry or any other "pro reviewer" (if I can call them that) could give us a deeper look at online over wifi vs LAN including framerate and package losses and drops etc.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,600
If changing speed, lag, and damage values don't count as mechanical changes than I'm pretty sure there's still more changed mechanically going from 4 to Ultimate than from Brawl to 4, the only real mechanics change I can think of off the top of my head between those being tripping being removed, again, this is assuming speed, lag, and damage changes don't count which I think is ridiculous. And honestly the way aerials have been buffed by an insane degree due to how much safer they are now is a waaaay bigger change than the new perfect shield.
There are even more new mechanics to consider, too:

-Airdodging overhaul (only one airdodge per airtime unless you get hit, can do Smash 4 airdodge or directional airdodge)
-Staling defensive maneuvers
-Dash canceling into any move (this is major)
-Short-hop input
-Delayed smash attacks
-Final Smash meter

Plus all the characters-specific stuff, especially the newcomers that play like no other character like Inkling or Incineroar. I'll also say that despite it being just a mode, Squad Strike is an incredible new addition.
If you come across any well-written reviews by and for competitive players that have a precise eye for these mechanical changes and what they mean, but present and interpret these concepts in a way that is accessible to less serious players who might not understand their impact, I would appreciate a link. I have no use whatsoever for media reviews that just go down the feature list with evaluative judgements of liking this thing and not liking that thing, but don't actually tell me anything I can't already see with my own eyes. I want to read about the finer points of design.
 
Nov 1, 2017
428
FL, United States
I can't wait for my copy to arrive. Between suddenly talking to old friends to set up Smash parties to throwing smack talk back and forth with my girlfriend, it's like I'm suddenly back in school again. I haven't looked forward to a Smash release this much since Melee.
 

phanphare

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,549
Excited for it but the whole LAN adapter thing has turned me off a bit - I will not buy an adapter + spread a long ass cable across my house everytime I wanna play online.

It would be great if Digital Foundry or any other "pro reviewer" (if I can call them that) could give us a deeper look at online over wifi vs LAN including framerate and package losses and drops etc.
shit, anyone can answer this for you

like pretty much every online game on the market having a wired connection will be preferable. also like pretty much every online game on the market most people will be using wifi.
 

Boiled Goose

Banned
Nov 2, 2017
7,050
Put Banjo in it and Ill give it a 99 ;D

For real though, looking forward to playing this tomorrow. I know some people say its just a port, but in fighting games, even the small changes can make a character feel entirely different.
No one is seriously saying that or has been saying it since the first direct. Not only have all characters been tweaked or had major updates, it's an entirely new engine with different mechanics.

Plus you know, all the brand new modes including an all new 30 hr plus single player mode.

It's impossible to argue this is a port.
 

srtrestre

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,472
No one is seriously saying that or has been saying it since the first direct. Not only have all characters been tweaked or had major updates, it's an entirely new engine with different mechanics.

Plus you know, all the brand new modes including an all new 30 hr plus single player mode.

It's impossible to argue this is a port.
There was the one poster earlier. Sounded very concerned, too. Very, very concerned.
 

Fedele

Member
Oct 28, 2017
28
shit, anyone can answer this for you

like pretty much every online game on the market having a wired connection will be preferable. also like pretty much every online game on the market most people will be using wifi.
Too many variables from all the players, especially when you consider that Nintendo doesn't rely on dedicated servers but P2P instead.

And I did not talk about the obvious: a wired connection is preferable, no shit - I wanna know about the impact of not going wired. If it's playable, I'll be there. If it's not, I will reconsider. Pretty simple.
 

BassForever

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,056
CT
Funny thing is, some reviews say that Ultimate is "only the best version of Smash", like if the game needs to change lots of things to achieve a bigger scores. The same reviewers gave RDR2 10s, a game that aside from the graphics and some changes to make it more slow and realistic, plays like any R* game from 8 or 10 years ago.

It's hard for me to understand how their minds work.
Different reviewers with different opinions, unless you can find one specific reviewer who gave a score to both games.
 

phanphare

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,549
Too many variables from all the players, especially when you consider that Nintendo doesn't rely on dedicated servers but P2P instead.

And I did not talk about the obvious: a wired connection is preferable, no shit - I wanna know about the impact of not going wired. If it's playable, I'll be there. If it's not, I will reconsider. Pretty simple.
spoilers: it's playable

that's why I said the majority of people will be playing over wifi
 

NotLiquid

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,910
If you come across any well-written reviews by and for competitive players that have a precise eye for these mechanical changes and what they mean, but present and interpret these concepts in a way that is accessible to less serious players who might not understand their impact, I would appreciate a link. I have no use whatsoever for media reviews that just go down the feature list with evaluative judgements of liking this thing and not liking that thing, but don't actually tell me anything I can't already see with my own eyes. I want to read about the finer points of design.
It's gonna be hard to find a review like that given that Smash has overall essentially had the same general surface level "playstyle" ever since Melee, and has only iterated upon it ever since, so many differences will only really be interpreted on a more subtle/micro level that isn't the same way that, say, you can clearly tell the differences between Street Fighter IV and Street Fighter V - you can easily explain the differences between those two to a layman; i.e in SFV, revenge mechanics from SFIV are removed, and instead of focus attacks as a stun/parry option, every character has a unique V-Trigger/V-Skill mechanic that gives them a unique gimmick to employ in combos, mixups or elsewhere. With Smash you're basically playing the same basic formula, so all the tweaks are something you kind of have to put under the scope in comparison.

In layman's terms, if I'd have to describe the difference between the two titles, it's that for one, Ultimate is a much faster game. The game speed is increased, and defensive mechanics such as air dodges and rolls are slightly weakened to prioritize a more aggressive playstyle - though this is somewhat compensated by improving (arguably properly instating) a parry mechanic. On paper that might not seem like much, but many of the more micro changes add up to a game that overall carries much heavier implications for when you get hit and eventually sent off the stage.

Too many variables from all the players, especially when you consider that Nintendo doesn't rely on dedicated servers but P2P instead.

And I did not talk about the obvious: a wired connection is preferable, no shit - I wanna know about the impact of not going wired. If it's playable, I'll be there. If it's not, I will reconsider. Pretty simple.
You absolutely do not want dedicated servers for a fighting game. The issue with Smash throughout the last few years is really just a matter of exceptionally fickle netcode.
 
Dec 4, 2017
1,998
It's true. I know someone somewhere out there is gonna do it. It's too tempting not to clickbait review scores.
Ironically, Smash is one of those highly anticipated games that would be perfectly OK to not review too favourably.
Smash is a perfect example of a game “not for everyone”. A 7/10 to Smash would be much less clickbaity than the same score given to Breath of the Wild. I, for one, never enjoyed Melee and would have dropped Smash completely if not for multiplayer.
 

Thatguy

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,500
Seattle WA
It needs to get to 94. The evil that is Brawl must be defeated.
After watching a few reviews I don't think it will. Too many cite reused assets and not liking WoL. Also I haven't seen any footage or commentary on the online. Does anyone have anything on that? This is to me the #1 thing that could make Ultimate feel like a true upgrade over the WiiU game. So far it just looks like a Deluxe port.
 

FrostyLemon

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,564
After watching a few reviews I don't think it will. Too many cite reused assets and not liking WoL. Also I haven't seen any footage or commentary on the online. Does anyone have anything on that? This is to me the #1 thing that could make Ultimate feel like a true upgrade over the WiiU game. So far it just looks like a Deluxe port.
This view was clearly bullshit back in July, even more so now.
 

mooshie78

Member
Sep 16, 2018
2,322
I really, really regret pre-ordering physical. It shipped today and is scheduled to arrive tomorrow some time before 11pm. So I'll probably be waiting on this all day and night.
Mine's shipped. I imagine it will come by the time I'm home from work (can't leave before 3-3:30 at the earliest).

I'm not too fussed even if it misses tomorrow though. I went physical as I was pretty lukewarm on the 3DS and Wii U entries and wanted the option to sell if I bore of this one. Sounds like the single player content is much better and there's more of it though, so hopefully I'll dig it.

I do hope it comes as I have a lot of time to play tomorrow night through Sunday afternoon as the wife is out of town on business. But I'm also finishing up Libra of Souls in Soul Calibur 6 (damn is the late game stuff there salt inducing) and just splurged on Beat Saber and Tetris Effect yesterday after having a consulting check come in. So I'll be playing a bunch of games this weekend regardless! :D
 

Kabukimurder

Member
Oct 28, 2017
121
I’m pretty disappointed that the game seems to get a pass on the semingly awful online mode. I mean it could be so much more than a couch-game to only play with your friends, and should be judged with that in mind.
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,080
Excited for it but the whole LAN adapter thing has turned me off a bit - I will not buy an adapter + spread a long ass cable across my house everytime I wanna play online.

It would be great if Digital Foundry or any other "pro reviewer" (if I can call them that) could give us a deeper look at online over wifi vs LAN including framerate and package losses and drops etc.
Get a powerline adapter like I did, it's black magic.
 

Thatguy

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,500
Seattle WA
This view was clearly bull**** back in July, even more so now.
I didn't say port. I said Deluxe port. Like MK8D. MK8D added an entire battle mode and included all DLC tracks, plus new characters, plus new karts and wheels and gliders, plus Labo support. Thats a Deluxe port. With Smash, they took the already huge WiiU game, added 6 fresh characters and another handful of returning or echo characters. What else did they do? Spirits and WoL. Thats like a whole new mode, like battle arena for MK8D (except way less liked than MK8D battle arena). Oh and they tweaked the stats for all the moves, to mix up the meta. I watched 4 reviews today and most mentioned the reused assets and lack of freshness. They still like the game, as will I, just as I liked MK8D. But "Deluxe Port" is probably the most accurate way to describe the game.
 

ZiggyPalffyLA

Member
Nov 2, 2017
3,498
Los Angeles, California
Gamexplain saying the game can be hard to follow is worrying me. I've been watching and I think he's right. All the smoke everywhere after basically every attack seems really distracting.
I bought a bigger TV partially for this reason lol. I had so much trouble following my character in any battle with more than 2 people in Smash 4.

I didn't have the same problem in the 3DS version, mainly due to the outlines. I wish this game had that option.
 

skittzo0413

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,602
I’m pretty disappointed that the game seems to get a pass on the semingly awful online mode. I mean it could be so much more than a couch-game to only play with your friends, and should be judged with that in mind.
Online hasn't been enabled for reviewers. It's probably only been live for a couple hours now. Where are you hearing that it's awful?
 

Strakt

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,290
I’m pretty disappointed that the game seems to get a pass on the semingly awful online mode. I mean it could be so much more than a couch-game to only play with your friends, and should be judged with that in mind.
What makes you say its awful? The streams I'm watching look 100% playable; ive seen maybe one match that was bad.
 

mooshie78

Member
Sep 16, 2018
2,322
Do characters unlock randomly?
Yes and no I believe. From what I read in reviews, you can unlock everyone randomly by just playing and beating the "A new challenge approaches" random fights. But you can also unlock specific characters by going down specific paths in the World of Light mode (no idea if you can find them all there, or just some).
 

kvetcha

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,387
I didn't say port. I said Deluxe port. Like MK8D. MK8D added an entire battle mode and included all DLC tracks, plus new characters, plus new karts and wheels and gliders, plus Labo support. Thats a Deluxe port. With Smash, they took the already huge WiiU game, added 6 fresh characters and another handful of returning or echo characters. What else did they do? Spirits and WoL. Thats like a whole new mode, like battle arena for MK8D (except way less liked than MK8D battle arena). Oh and they tweaked the stats for all the moves, to mix up the meta. I watched 4 reviews today and most mentioned the reused assets and lack of freshness. They still like the game, as will I, just as I liked MK8D. But "Deluxe Port" is probably the most accurate way to describe the game.
Remodeled characters, remodeled characters, reworked mechanics. What more could they possibly do? Cel-shade the game?