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Take-Two CEO says Midnight Suns was a critical success, but not a commercial one

Benzychenz

Benzychenz

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 1, 2017
15,368
Australia
Doing a Midnight Suns game before there's a Midnight Suns MCU flick was also a bad idea.

The audience for Marvel comics fans that actually know what Midnight Suns is isn't even a fraction of the MCU audience.
 
JaxiPup

JaxiPup

Member
Dec 23, 2017
674
Massachusetts
Its really not all that shocking, is it? A card based brawler/ dating sim with marvel characters is the epitome of niche, an extremely hard sell to Xcom fans, and cape fatigue is in full force.

Sincerely hope this doesn't impact Xcom 3, or anyone's jobs for that matter, but this was written on the wall from the start imo
 
y2kyle89

y2kyle89

Member
Mar 16, 2018
9,465
Mass
Everyone saying "the cards sunk it" but I think the "Not-battling date the Avengers" part of the game is what's keeping the people away. Or just keeping me away.
 
ThatMeanScene

ThatMeanScene

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
9,839
Miami, FL
I skipped it because of the genre. I didn't like the art design either, tbh. I like Marvel movies and comics but I'm not typically interested in Marvel media outside of those two. For example, I still haven't played the Spider-Man games.
 
chrominance

chrominance

Sky Van Gogh
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,543
It's on my list for sure, I just didn't want to get it at launch because I was already buying a bunch of games during that time due to sales.
 
Solid SOAP

Solid SOAP

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 27, 2017
8,206
Too bad, the game seems good and I can see myself buying it on Steam at a discount.
 
mreddie

mreddie

Member
Oct 26, 2017
43,912
I have to wonder if the card system was to blame or was SE Avengers that big of a flop?
 
Soap

Soap

Member
Oct 27, 2017
15,151
The writing was on the wall, but at least there is positivity in some respects. I do think an d-men sequel would probably sell better simply because of the x-men brand, people being more aware of the quality of the first game and a big mutant push by marvel in the coming years.
 
cowbanana

cowbanana

Member
Feb 2, 2018
13,648
a Socialist Utopia
I was turned off by the cards and watching the dreadful social interactions in a couple of reviews. I don't hink I'll ever play this. And to be honest, this kind of Marvel game doesn't do anything for me. I'm more into game that focus on a single hero, like Spider-Man. Or a well knit group, like Guardians of the Galaxy.
 

mrmoose

Member
Nov 13, 2017
21,134
Now I'm kinda wondering how MUA3 did and why there's not a similar-playing non switch exclusive version of that game on the other consoles...
 
medyej

medyej

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,409
The worrying thing is that Take Two and other publishers might take from this the idea that tactics games don't sell and ignore that XCOM 2 did 10x the numbers that this game did.

The game is good but there was just too many red flags to the tactics crowd over the run up to the game, not the least of which is the card system which still a ton of people aren't sold on. Then the high price.
 
Rover

Rover

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,412
The card system feels like a very natural extension of Firaxis's strategy gameplay (it's all boardgame-ish mechanics anyway). If you like modern XCOM or Mario Rabbids, this game is a similar style; don't let the cards scare you away.

But I'm the opposite and I find the non-battle parts to be a complete slog. I wish you could just keep playing battles and not bother with the "RPG" part.
 

Valus

Member
Nov 21, 2017
1,084
I didn't even realize this was a card game. Thought it was a turned based strategy game with heroes. RIP, guess I'll pass on it. Really not a fan of card games or deck building stuff.
 
Tovarisc

Tovarisc

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,389
FIN
grandmedjey said:
The worrying thing is that Take Two and other publishers might take from this the idea that tactics games don't sell and ignore that XCOM 2 did 10x the numbers that this game did.

The game is good but there was just too many red flags to the tactics crowd over the run up to the game, not the least of which is the card system which still a ton of people aren't sold on. Then the high price.
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Tweet makes it very obvious that he isn't ignoring strong performance of Firaxis games.
 
RedHeat

RedHeat

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,681
mrmoose said:
Now I'm kinda wondering how MUA3 did and why there's not a similar-playing non switch exclusive version of that game on the other consoles...
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The last figure they gave was 1.5 million back in 2021. The reason why it's not on other consoles is because Nintendo paid to make it.
 
Won

Won

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,424
Price is what kept me away, but I also just think it is a really weird mix of IP and game concepts that I just don't feel appealing.
 
TeenageFBI

TeenageFBI

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,218
I really like the game. Too bad about the poor sales.

Looking forward to XCOM 3 at least!
 
eyeball_kid

eyeball_kid

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,215
SirKai said:
I think this direction sealed the game's fate. They really needed to find some way to package the mechanic without any "cards" imagery or terminology because assuming it's some kind of deck builder or card battler is such a logical (and unwelcome, for a lot of folks) conclusion, and hearing the devs or fans talk in circles about how the game doesn't actually play like a card game was never going to undo even a fraction of the apathy that the word "cards" instilled.
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I'm definitely one of those that bounced off at the mention of cards. I've seen some gameplay footage and lurked in the OT a bit, and it seems still tactical enough to be enjoyable, but I'm not going to take a chance until it goes on sale basically.

Benzychenz said:
Doing a Midnight Suns game before there's a Midnight Suns MCU flick was also a bad idea.

The audience for Marvel comics fans that actually know what Midnight Suns is isn't even a fraction of the MCU audience.
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This is also true. I grew up reading Marvel in the '80s and '90s, but I had never heard of Midnight Suns. And the heroes who star in this weren't necessarily my go-to comics. If this had been a New Mutants game or something, I probably would have picked it up day 1 despite the card aspect.
 
cvbas

cvbas

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,164
Brazil
I do hope it has legs.

It's truly a fantastic game and I say that as someone who cares very little about Marvel. It's also weird how attached people get to the "card game" thing. It plays *nothing* like 99% of the card games out there, but I'll also admit that the marketing did a poor job with the whole thing.
 

Fishook

Member
Dec 20, 2017
808
I am enjoying it even though I not a fan of deck builders, but it feels like I am playing a F2P mobile game with stuff unlocked, with all the cosmetics and friendship stuff.

If it wasn't by Firaxis or have a Marvel license I wouldn't touch it with a barge pole.
 
Soupman Prime

Soupman Prime

The Fallen
Nov 8, 2017
8,549
Boston, MA
Einbroch said:
I really think "gamers" (take that term to mean what you will) just aren't super interested in AAA Marvel games unless they're Niche-Man. We're seeing it time and time again.

For whatever reason, it doesn't cross-over to this sphere.

Plus the release date sucked.
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Well I don't know about that. I would've loved the game if it were an action rpg or something like Ultimate Alliance or anything not like XCOM. I tried playing XCOM before and I'm just not into games like that, could be the case for a lot of other people.

I'm sure Wolverine will do great and maybe that Cap/Black Panther game.
 
Anno

Anno

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,950
Columbus, Ohio
I think there's a significant audience for turn-based tactical combat games. Certainly on PC, but also probably on console. I just don't think much else about the game taps into what that audience is looking for.
 
BlueStarEXSF

BlueStarEXSF

Member
Dec 3, 2018
4,499
I think it's a mixture of the price and the release window not being right. The holiday has too much competition at a lower price. Also, the idea of increasing game prices across the board is dumb. Obviously, the biggest brands will be fine but the lower end AAA games are finding themselves suffering in sales for it. I think it's a trend we'll keep seeing in the future unfortunately. The race for bigger budget games is dumb and has always been dumb as it encourages the homegenization of games to minimize risk.
 
Ricker

Ricker

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,980
Beautiful Province of Quebec.
I didnt think people in general hated card games on Consoles...its too bad because yes there's cards but the way they use them doesnt make it a ''Card'' game per say and they should of marketed the game a little better in teaching people that...
 
404LinkNotFound

404LinkNotFound

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,555
Einbroch said:
I really think "gamers" (take that term to mean what you will) just aren't super interested in AAA Marvel games unless they're Niche-Man. We're seeing it time and time again.

For whatever reason, it doesn't cross-over to this sphere.

Plus the release date sucked.
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No they arent interested in SRPGS with card mechanics which is a niche within a niche lol
 
BDrummer1606

BDrummer1606

Member
Oct 27, 2017
713
god, I hate people calling this a "card game." All the cards do is provide moves. Literally only 8 cards per person. Plus the game is so much more. Like a combination of Persona/BioWare.

Back on topic, hope this game does well in the long term.
 
Anth0ny

Anth0ny

Member
Oct 25, 2017
46,761
Marvel vs Capcom
GOTG
Avengers
Midnight Suns

Gamers ain't having Marvel unless it's Spidey.
 
Yerffej

Yerffej

Prophet of Regret
Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,457
Soupman Prime said:
Well I don't know about that. I would've loved the game if it were an action rpg or something like Ultimate Alliance or anything not like XCOM. I tried playing XCOM before and I'm just not into games like that, could be the case for a lot of other people.
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This is probably overall why it didn't sell. The card system and X-Com structure is probably a major turnoff for the average player. Maybe X-Com lovers want what's on offer without the cards...or the Marvel skin isn't their cup of tea. I'm into cards and X-Com style but am kinda over Marvel, so while I want to play it (especially on the Deck) I can wait for a deeper discount.

BDrummer1606 said:
god, I hate people calling this a "card game." All the cards do is provide moves. Literally only 8 cards per person. Plus the game is so much more. Like a combination of Persona/BioWare.
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But isn't it the randomness of how those cards are doled out per round that would turn off someone? If it was cards as an aesthetic choice and you always got what you wanted, they could have just had a menu for attacks.
 

mrmoose

Member
Nov 13, 2017
21,134
RedHeat said:
The last figure they gave was 1.5 million back in 2021. The reason why it's not on other consoles is because Nintendo paid to make it.
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Oh I get why it wasn't ported, more wondering why we don't get a similar game that goes deep into the Marvel characters even a fraction of what the mobile games like Future Fight do. Like I would pay for that (again). Heck if you do another X-Men Legends I'm there.
 
Lemony1984

Lemony1984

Member
Jul 7, 2020
6,675
Hardly a surprise when it was selling for 50% off a couple weeks after launch. Great game though. It' s a bummer to see it fall short and Marvel Snap presumably making a billion dollars a day.
 
Liam Allen-Miller

Liam Allen-Miller

Member
Nov 2, 2017
6,795
Shibuya
I do strongly agree that it'll have a long tail. The Marvel angle will keep sales spikes happening perpetually as MCU media releases, and once the game gets price adjustments like the modern X-Com titles did that combination of factors will be really healthy for it IMO.
 
Zukkoyaki

Zukkoyaki

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,250
Such a shame because they game is excellent.

Marketing was awful for it though. Felt like every time it was shown it would only be a weird CG trailer showing like demonic versions of Marvel characters that didn't tell anything about the game. Plus the actual gameplay previews did a horrific job of showing what the turn based component is actually like and didn't highlight the social aspect much at all. Just look at everyone still calling it a card game. That's so far from what the game actually is.
 
Jogi

Jogi

Prophet of Regret
Member
Jul 4, 2018
5,442
Played the trial and enjoyed it quite a bit on xsx. Text is stupid small though and they really need to enable you to change the text size.
 
Sulik2

Sulik2

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
8,168
This will be a long tail game, word of mouth and sales will keep it moving IMHO. its a tremendous game that doesn't really play like anything else. People will keep finding it for years. It was a terrible release date too.

I keep seeing people saying nope it has cards. But seriously its a tactics games where the abilities are cards, not a card game with tactics. I know that doesn't make a whole lot of sense without playing it, but its really not a card game/deck building like how most people think of card games. There is a lot of movement and non card combat and ability stuff.
 
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