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Prine

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
15,724
I mean, they'd have to get at least two more, Sony has Asobi Team left over from Japan Studio, as well as Polyphony Digital, not to mention the residual localisation support staff.

More importantly I have to wonder if any of the folks in Tango feel anything about, just, never selling a console game in Japan again? Not that Evil Within/Psycho Break was any kind of massive breakout hit domestically, but it sold "okay" with around 168,000 units on the PS3/PS4 combo for the first title. If all their projects from now on aside from Ghostwire are Xbox/PC-only, it's hard to imagine any of them having any kind of mindshare or presence at all in Japan itself.
Look at the console presence in general, seems to be on a steep decline, the writing is probably on the wall and moving to PC and Cloud seems inevitable, so I'd assume they'd be feeling hopeful about the situation. They'll have the opportunity to make a big splash in the west and other Asian markets at least
 

IllumiNate

Member
Nov 18, 2018
382
Canada
Pls Phil, give Mikami all the support he needs to make his dream game.

regarding future acquisitions who could be next? Sega? Kojima Productions? 🤔 they definitely need some devs to handle JRPGs and a couple other genres.
Kojima productions? He would never turn his back on Playstation like that. I don't know if you know much about Japanese culture but I'm an expert...
 

BBboy20

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,088
Never have I ever considered in any scenario mainly a Japanese company Sony basically consolidate their console development teams from the Japanese market outside of partnerships with 3rd parties and Microsoft being trying to curtail more support and development projects for Japan.

I don't want to blame Jim Ryan for it but the overall dramatic change in focus seems to have shifted when Jim Ryan became head of PlayStation being a general focus of worldwide support rather than overly western approach.

Now don't get my wrong Microsoft also mainly is western focused as well but they are trying promote and expand growth of their market for a more worldwide appeal.

I just never abided too much of the concept of putting all of one's eggs into a single basket and not have a more balanced approach for all audiences involved, but I digress Sony's western output is their current strength, I just think it's shortsighted to not consider the longer term in this regard.

I guess being owner of both a PS5 and Series X, time will tell which gets library will look more appealing within the next 5 years.
Took the words right out of my mouth.

Also: Mikami changes everything (again) through almost infinite funding is a tempting (and tasty.......and itchy) dream to have.
 

fiendcode

Member
Oct 26, 2017
24,933
If people are keeping count;

Xbox Game Studios
  • Mojang Studios Tokyo (2018)
  • Tango Gameworks (2021)
PlayStation Studios
  • Polyphony Digital (1998) formerly Polys Entertainment
  • Asobi Team (2012)
  • ForwardWorks (2016) mobile R&D only
Nintendo
  • Monolith Soft Tokyo (2007)
  • NdCube Tokyo (2010)
  • NdCube Sapporo (2010)
  • Monolith Soft Kyoto (2011)
  • 1-Up Studio (2013) formerly Brownie Brown
  • Nintendo EPD Kyoto (2015)
  • Nintendo EPD Tokyo (2015)
 

Deleted member 15360

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,477
Never have I ever considered in any scenario mainly a Japanese company Sony basically consolidate their console development teams from the Japanese market outside of partnerships with 3rd parties and Microsoft being trying to curtail more support and development projects for Japan.

I don't want to blame Jim Ryan for it but the overall dramatic change in focus seems to have shifted when Jim Ryan became head of PlayStation being a general focus of worldwide support rather than overly western approach.

Now don't get my wrong Microsoft also mainly is western focused as well but they are trying promote and expand growth of their market for a more worldwide appeal.

I just never abided too much of the concept of putting all of one's eggs into a single basket and not have a more balanced approach for all audiences involved, but I digress Sony's western output is their current strength, I just think it's shortsighted to not consider the longer term in this regard.

I guess being owner of both a PS5 and Series X, time will tell which gets library will look more appealing within the next 5 years.


PlayStation always have gone for the global appeal and what makes you think they are only placing bets on one market?


Japan was the second biggest country to recieve ps5 shipments basis the numbers we have. For Jan and Feb
 
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OmegaDL50

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,707
Philadelphia, PA
PlayStation always have gone for the global appeal and what makes you think they are only placing begs on one market?


Japan was the second biggest country to recieve ps5 shipments basis the numbers we have. For Jan and Feb

The fact that Sony has consolidate their Japanese output into a single studio for one thing, Keep in mind almost predominately all of their recent output has been almost entirely from Western studios.

Japan can receive all of the shipments they want, but that doesn't make the distinction of simply shipped or selling through, and if you visit the Mediacreate and various Sales threads, You know there is a significant difference between the two.
 
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etrain911

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,818
Honestly if MS builds a bigger Japanese presence than Sony, I might consider switching over. Sony consolidating in Japan really bothered me.
 

Deleted member 15360

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,477
The fact that Sony has consolidate their Japanese output into a single studio for one thing, Keep in mind almost predominately all of their recent output has been almost entirely from Western studios.

Japan can receive all of the shipments they want, but that doesn't make the distinction of simply shipped or selling through, and if you visit the Mediacreate and various Sales threads, You know there is a significant difference between the two.

1) they have 3 studio
2) consolidating of studio doesn't mean they won't have external development partnership
3) bolded is bullshit as we get sell through numbers
 

OmegaDL50

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,707
Philadelphia, PA
1) they have 3 studio
2) consolidating of studio doesn't mean they won't have external development partnership
3) bolded is bullshit as we get sell through numbers

Last time I recall Team Asobi is one studio and Polyphony Digital is it's own thing and not part of Japan Studio, don't know where you are getting the 3rd studio from.

As for your second point, sure their might still be external development partnership but people look at Japan Studio and think of merely Knack, Gravity Rush, or The Last Guardian, but recently the elephant in the room when one of this forums favorite games Bloodborne was produced by Japan Studio, that being said the producer is no longer a part of the company, which is likely one the major side effects of Japan Studios contraction into a more consolidated entity. People love to cite Miyazaki and From Software as entirely the credit for Bloodborne's existence but producer Masaaki Yamagiwa being one of the main driving forces which collaborations with From Software with projects such as both Bloodborne and Déraciné for its development, which puts projects such as a potential Bloodborne 2 coming to fruition in a questionable light.

As for claiming what I'm saying is bullshit. I merely pointing out the fact that there IS a distinction between consoles being shipped and being sold through. Especially with the scarcity of PS5s in the wild and it's current demand, which goes back to my point, Japan buying PS5's is all well and good, this goes back to the nature of this thread of studio acquisitions, especially so for Japanese developers making games that target a Japanese market, something Sony recently decided they don't necessarily need outside of 3rd party relations since they are mainly focusing on the strengths of their Western output, which is why I brought up the point of putting ones egg's in a single basket. The consolidation of Japanese studios means they have even less resources to divert to for the purpose of external partnership, as example my case for Bloodborne and Déraciné, which with latest trend of folks continuously bringing up the failures of Gravity Rush, etc, I'd say it's something being very much glossed over or ignored.
 

Shoshi

Banned
Jan 9, 2018
1,661
I think Mikami is dead tired of TEW and want to do something else which I hope Bethesda and Microsoft let them do.

Hang in there everyone at Tango!
 
Dec 21, 2020
5,066
Give me a JRPG and you have me wound up like a gyroscope ready to spin on the tip of a needle...


....yes i said that, they already have WRPGs, now give me a JRPG and you have me sold =D
 

Calvinien

Banned
Jul 13, 2019
2,970
Tango was a great get, if they actually do get SEGA their Japan support will be nuts.
It would also be a weird kind of symmetry with sega starting as an american company, moving to japan, becoming a japanese company and then becoming part of an american company again. Never mind that the xbox is essentially the spiritual successor to the dreamcast.
 

Deleted member 3017

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
17,653
I mean, they'd have to get at least two more, Sony has Asobi Team left over from Japan Studio, as well as Polyphony Digital, not to mention the residual localisation support staff.

More importantly I have to wonder if any of the folks in Tango feel anything about, just, never selling a console game in Japan again? Not that Evil Within/Psycho Break was any kind of massive breakout hit domestically, but it sold "okay" with around 168,000 units on the PS3/PS4 combo for the first title. If all their projects from now on aside from Ghostwire are Xbox/PC-only, it's hard to imagine any of them having any kind of mindshare or presence at all in Japan itself.
Key phrase "is going to have", they certainly don't have more studios in Japan now. I added the "lmao" at the end because I'm not really being all that serious. At the same time, there really is a possibility Xbox will eventually have more Japanese studios than PlayStation, which would be crazy.
 

Shrennin

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,685

I want it to be this too.

It's his dream game and now he has the funds and support to pull it off.

It would also be a weird kind of symmetry with sega starting as an american company, moving to japan, becoming a japanese company and then becoming part of an american company again. Never mind that the xbox is essentially the spiritual successor to the dreamcast.

Of all the Japanese publishers, this one makes the most sense for Microsoft if they were going to theoretically acquire one.

Mainly due to your last point - Xbox was Dreamcast 2 in a way.
 

silva1991

Member
Oct 26, 2017
10,506
It's gonna take a while to get used to the fact that MS will be funding/making AAA Japanese games while Sony possibly does none for an entire gen. Excited to see what they make after the current projects.

It would be hilarious if they also get former Sony Japan talents.
 

Seventy5

Member
Mar 14, 2020
66
Its not hard to see why people would be excited over the prospect of Mikami and Tango getting the full financial backing of MS, same goes for the rest of Bethesda. Phil wants to head down there specifically to engage with him, support him and the devs there. Facilitating devs like this should always be championed.

Their point still stands though. People are cheering on corporate monopolization because it supports the platform they like. People aren't looking down the line, they're just thinking about cheap game pass subs, not realizing that eventually, somebody is going to pay the price for these acquisitions. By my calculations, Bethesda alone cost 500,000,000 full priced monthly game pass ultimate subscriptions. Now imagine the monthly price if MS buys up more of the industry and nobody else can compete. People have really short memories it seems.
 

BBboy20

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,088
Their point still stands though. People are cheering on corporate monopolization because it supports the platform they like. People aren't looking down the line, they're just thinking about cheap game pass subs, not realizing that eventually, somebody is going to pay the price for these acquisitions. By my calculations, Bethesda alone cost 500,000,000 full priced monthly game pass ultimate subscriptions. Now imagine the monthly price if MS buys up more of the industry and nobody else can compete. People have really short memories it seems.
It's just the former instead of the latter. Justify your plastic toy purchase come hell or high water.
 

SoSchwifty

Member
Jan 3, 2020
84
Their point still stands though. People are cheering on corporate monopolization because it supports the platform they like. People aren't looking down the line, they're just thinking about cheap game pass subs, not realizing that eventually, somebody is going to pay the price for these acquisitions. By my calculations, Bethesda alone cost 500,000,000 full priced monthly game pass ultimate subscriptions. Now imagine the monthly price if MS buys up more of the industry and nobody else can compete. People have really short memories it seems.

The industry is too big to be monopolized. MS isn't even close yet. Also, I think people are fear mongering too much. The streaming wars in TV has led to some of the best TV I have ever watched and should only get better as Disney+, Netflix and HBO Max compete. Consolidation is not as bad as everyone is trying to make it seem. Monopolization is bad but we are very far from that especially with Xbox which is the underdog of the industry.
 
Jul 25, 2020
749
The man who once walked out of a Microsoft interview now works for them. I love the irony of some of these decisions 😂 but as long as he's backed and he gets what he needs you never know what he can accomplish.

Kojima productions? He would never turn his back on Playstation like that. I don't know if you know much about Japanese culture but I'm an expert...

You aren't the same person who said the same thing on another forum now are you?
 

Prine

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
15,724
Their point still stands though. People are cheering on corporate monopolization because it supports the platform they like. People aren't looking down the line, they're just thinking about cheap game pass subs, not realizing that eventually, somebody is going to pay the price for these acquisitions. By my calculations, Bethesda alone cost 500,000,000 full priced monthly game pass ultimate subscriptions. Now imagine the monthly price if MS buys up more of the industry and nobody else can compete. People have really short memories it seems.
Cheap subs opens up gaming to more people, there's nothing wrong there and should be celebrated. Outlook looks good all round tbh, and I'm actually astonished how anyone could mark that as negative. And the rest of your response does sound like alarmist hyperbole. MS improving its situation with Japanese content is a positive thing , trying to frame that as a path to an eventual monopoly is a bit dramatic.
 
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Seventy5

Member
Mar 14, 2020
66
Cheap subs opens up gaming to more people, there's nothing wrong there and should be celebrated. Outlook looks good all round tbh, and I'm actually astonished how anyone could mark that as negative. And the rest of your response does sound hyperbolic.
My point was subs are cheap(ish) now but it can't stay that way. Look at Netflix, it's gone up repeatedly. Netflix started spending loads of money for content and had to start passing the costs to consumers. I don't see this going any differently. I don't think people should be cheering on corporations in general, but doing so without considering the long term effects seems extra silly to me.
 

Cyberclops

Member
Mar 15, 2019
1,447
Their point still stands though. People are cheering on corporate monopolization because it supports the platform they like. People aren't looking down the line, they're just thinking about cheap game pass subs, not realizing that eventually, somebody is going to pay the price for these acquisitions. By my calculations, Bethesda alone cost 500,000,000 full priced monthly game pass ultimate subscriptions. Now imagine the monthly price if MS buys up more of the industry and nobody else can compete. People have really short memories it seems.

Bethesda is worth way more than their games being on Game Pass. Sales outside of the subscription are still a thing (especially on steam where Bethesda games sell a tonne) and there's also DLC + microtransactions. Not to mention stuff like merchandise, board games, etc.

Microsoft owns a $7.5 billion publisher and they'll still be worth billions of dollars 10+ years from now. They don't have to recoup that cost. They just have to make enough profit from that investment, and only Microsoft knows what that magic number is.
 

Dreazy

Member
Oct 25, 2018
2,016
User Warn: Acquisition begging
Awesome, now go get Sega, or Fromsoftware so you guys can solidify yourself truly in Japan.
 

nekkid

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
21,823
If they can't acquire another one, this becomes far simpler: they just take advantage of the local talent and expand Tango - maybe adding more studios.
 

BBboy20

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,088
Cheap subs opens up gaming to more people, there's nothing wrong there and should be celebrated. Outlook looks good all round tbh, and I'm actually astonished how anyone could mark that as negative. And the rest of your response does sound like alarmist hyperbole. MS improving its situation with Japanese content is a positive thing , trying to frame that as a path to an eventual monopoly is a bit dramatic.
Are you conflating?
 

VeePs

Prophet of Truth
Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,372

Fabtacular

Member
Jul 11, 2019
4,244
I guarantee Phil & Co have already taken as big a swing as reasonably possible at Platinum Games already.

They're an ideal target because they (1) make zany character-action games of the type that Xbox doesn't get a lot of, and (2) they're so prolific, regularly putting out a game a year.

Alas, I think the fact that a deal already hasn't been made is strong evidence that a deal will never be made.
 

Son of Sparda

The Wise Ones
Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,626
Sega did recently spin their arcade and pachinko sector up into a separate division so xbox could just buy the games sector
No, that's not how it works.

The new gaming division isn't an independent thing that can do what they want (including selling the company to MS). The separation was mostly made for structural and management reasons. They are still very much part of Sammy and just like before, it's unlikely for Sammy to just sell a (big) portion of its organization to another company.
 
Jun 15, 2020
7,125
Their point still stands though. People are cheering on corporate monopolization because it supports the platform they like. People aren't looking down the line, they're just thinking about cheap game pass subs, not realizing that eventually, somebody is going to pay the price for these acquisitions. By my calculations, Bethesda alone cost 500,000,000 full priced monthly game pass ultimate subscriptions. Now imagine the monthly price if MS buys up more of the industry and nobody else can compete. People have really short memories it seems.
Or maybeeeeeee they're not jumping from "a few acquisitions" right to "the doomsday scenerio" in an industry that is multiplying in size every year?
 

Deleted member 68874

Account closed at user request
Banned
May 10, 2020
10,441
People really jumping to "monopoly" the moment Xbox is gearing up to be competitive in the console space. Pretty hilarious imo.
 

Helix

Mayor of Clown Town
Member
Jun 8, 2019
23,814
do we really need a Thread for every single quote Phil Spencer makes? like this could be discussed in a main OT for the Roundtable right?
 

| TrusT |

Member
Apr 19, 2020
1,903
My point was subs are cheap(ish) now but it can't stay that way. Look at Netflix, it's gone up repeatedly. Netflix started spending loads of money for content and had to start passing the costs to consumers. I don't see this going any differently. I don't think people should be cheering on corporations in general, but doing so without considering the long term effects seems extra silly to me.

If the long term effect is a large amount of diverse compelling content then people will be happy to invest in it. What would you rather a platform holder do? Sit and consolodate in an ever expanding market or invest heavily for their userbase?