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Terminator: Dark Fate |OT| (Spoilers) No fate but what Jim & Tim make

UltraMagnus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,158
Does anyone else think that Dani Ramos was miscast? I enjoyed the movie, but that actress was not selling me for what she was supposed to represent in the future.
It's weird because I felt in the first half of the movie she was quite strong, and then just fizzles out and fades away in the second half.

The "party" becoming a party of 4 once Arnold is added I think made it too big. It would have been even worse if Jon Connor was tacked on on top of that I suspect.
 

BWoog

Member
Oct 27, 2017
16,732
Just saw it. I liked it but it had its flaws. Again, like everyone says, best Terminator movie since T2 but that's not difficult.

How on earth did they do that flashback scene? All the actors looked real (Arnold's face looked like it was just transfered to a muscular guy, that I could see).

You know what a really good twist would have been? Mackenzie Davis wasn't a augmented human at all, but simply a Terminator sent back by Skynet to attempt to ensure its original future versus Legion's.

It was great seeing Linda Hamilton back and Arnold was pretty solid.

Dani just....wasn't good.
 
Oct 28, 2017
16,723
I went in with no expectations and I was pleased it wasnt a total bomb. It was a retread of T2 but it was the best version of a retread it could be. Would I ever watch it again? No.

Like the new Star Wars, everything felt unnecessarily concerned with the previous films. T800, Sarah, the damn messiah plot. There isnt room to do anything new but it's clear they didnt want to.


Diego Boneta and Gabriel Luna are hot though. My guapo.
 

carlosrox

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,870
Vancouver BC
T2 showed the future war in the same vein as T1.
What was different in 2? And Battle Across Time for that matter.

Nah, not quite. The general look was the same but T1 was still darker.

The way 1 showed it was a lot more hopeless and bleak.

------

Terminator needs Brad Fiedel. Can't believe he was only involved with 1 and 2. The music in both is great. If one thing remained pretty consistent between 1 and 2 it was the excellent music. I still prefer 1 but mainly cuz I think the T800 and T1000s themes were a notch below T800 theme in 1.
 
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Noisepurge

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,449
First hour was good, second hour was a waste of time. forgettable soundtrack, good terminator effects though.
Wish they would have left Arnold out of this one entirely, him being there is entirely pointless.

Was great to see Linda Hamilton again though, and Mackenzie Davis was really good.
 
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OP
VorpalNonsense
Oct 25, 2017
5,447
You know what a really good twist would have been? Mackenzie Davis wasn't a augmented human at all, but simply a Terminator sent back by Skynet to attempt to ensure its original future versus Legion's.
Competing AIs could be a legitimate story thread going forward. Skynet developed early in the 90s due to time travel shenanigans, but 25 years later there are now AIs in development all over the world. Is Legion really the only player in that game?

However I'd prefer a smaller more horror focused movie, and I'm not sure how to reconcile such lofty worldwide ideas into a more personal story like that.

Maybe if there was a common central thread running through each of these competing programs that allowed the movie to avoid the globetrotting and focus on a single aspect. Maybe some sort of hidden relation between them and Skynet. A single person, even. Who knows?
 

TheRealCanadianBros

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
915
The people who are irate about John getting killed in the movie...I don't know what to tell ya cause I thought it was the most meaningful thing they could have done with the character at this point. When you look at John Connor as a whole, I do not know what else they could have done with him. We had three movies prior to this where they barely did anything with John: a reluctant leader haunted by a future that almost did not happen/Grim-dark foot solider forming his resistance against Skynet/Leader of the human resistance in the first 20 minutes only to then become the villain.

Despite John's death, his presence weighs heavily over the entire movie and influences a lot. His death is the sole reason why the T-800 is able to obtain freedom from its programming, is able to form consciousness and guilt for it's actions. He learns about life and the human experience. Carl comes to understand the ramifications that it's actions had on Sarah; Carl took away her only reason to live which was for John. Carl gives Sarah something to fight for because of the impact John's death had on Carl. Because of John's death, Carl sends the coordinates of new Terminator arrivals, giving Sarah purpose. John's death is literally what prevents the Rev-9 from being successful. If it wasn't for his death, Carl would not become humanized, would not send Sarah on her crusade, would not lead to saving Grace/Dani.

Sarah's life is a miserable tragedy. She is the reason why judgement day was prevented and what does she get for doing so? She's on the run from the entirety of the US. She has no family, no one to confide in, no one will believe her. When she tells Grace/Dani about her accomplishments, there is no recognition for it, because the universe finds a way to right its self. There will always be a critical point in history where the height of human hubris costs them the world. Her face in that moment hurt me so much, but that didn't kill me like the Cabin scene did.

What broke me was was the conversation Sarah has with Dani after Sarah is denied her revenge. She laments that she never have a proper mother/son relationship with John because they were always on the run, because she was always so hard on him, training him to be a military leader. She doesn't have a photo of him and she's forgetting his face. This is a person who's life was thoroughly destroyed by circumstances that she had no control over. She lost her chance at a normal life, she is burdened by knowledge of a future that she can't escape. She lost the two most important people in her life. She drinks herself to sleep, she lives with regret and it has been so long that she is getting to a point where she won't be able to remember her child's face.

There was meaning and purpose in John's death which not only thrusts the movie forward but also serves to further develop both Sarah and the T-800. I think people forget that John was never the hero, it was always Sarah. She was always the emotional core and the glue that held these movies together. This movie has so much heart to it and I'm happy that Sarah was the focus, not John. Linda Hamilton's presence gives the movie legitimacy.

I was very much on the fence leading up to this movie, but I genuinely enjoyed it and I'm happy it exists. Everything made sense to me. I thought the action was on point. The movie was tonally like T2. It did not resort to stupid shlock comedy or made a mockery out of its characters like T3 and Genisys. Grace was great as the next Kyle and Dani could use a little more work as the next leader. Rev-9 was fantastic and my greatest worry about the movie. A proper follow up to the menacing T-1000.It sucks that the movie is bombing, I hope positive word of mouth can change that. If they do not end up making a sequel, I'm more than content with this being the bookend to T1 and T2.

The movie is over two hours but feels like a 90min movie. Very lean, fast paced and easy to follow. It wastes not a single minute.


4.5 Draperies out of 5.

-------------------------------
And on a side note:
MY CPU IS A NEURAL-NET PROCESSOR, A LEARNING COMPUTER. THE MORE CONTACT I HAVE WITH HUMANS, THE MORE I LEARN.

If a machine, a Terminator can understand the value of human life, maybe we can too.

THE READ ONLY is NON-CANON.

T1) You see the T-800 learning and mimicking human behaviour.

T2) You slowly see Uncle Bob learning how to be more human-like in T2 and begins to understand the value of human life. Sarah's lines at the end of the movie literally retcons what Kyle says in T1 about Terminators not having pity or remorse.

TDF) Carl is the natural evolution of the T-800 across three films. Don't feed me that shit that it doesn't make sense for a T-800 to grow a conscious.
 
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-JD-

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
3,070
We just got out of this. I have a lot of thoughts that I’ll share once we get home but first impression is...I really liked it. Genuinely, opened armed embrace of this weird mutant of a Terminator story.
 

Scullibundo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,186
I don’t have a HUGE problem with what they decided to do with John, so much as how they went about it. It felt so perfunctory and quick and I still can’t get over how cheap/flat the whole scene looked. Nevermind the scene prior with the Terminators walking out of the ocean lol.

Felt like something that legit could have come out of The Sarah Connor Chronicles (that’s not a good thing).
 

JB1981

Member
Oct 28, 2017
10,417
I don’t have a HUGE problem with what they decided to do with John, so much as how they went about it. It felt so perfunctory and quick and I still can’t get over how cheap/flat the whole scene looked. Nevermind the scene prior with the Terminators walking out of the ocean lol.

Felt like something that legit could have come out of The Sarah Connor Chronicles (that’s not a good thing).
They looked better in T3
 

inguef

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
13,432
I don’t have a HUGE problem with what they decided to do with John, so much as how they went about it. It felt so perfunctory and quick and I still can’t get over how cheap/flat the whole scene looked. Nevermind the scene prior with the Terminators walking out of the ocean lol.

Felt like something that legit could have come out of The Sarah Connor Chronicles (that’s not a good thing).
I liked how sudden it was. It was shocking to me, so it didn’t come across as flat. It was also the single most impressive visual effect of the whole movie.
 
Oct 28, 2017
16,723
I thought the SFX were in trouble when the Rev9 did his first super jump in the factory. It was Black Panther tunnel fight rubber man animation. An effect without any weight to it.

I think that was the only one that jumped out at me. The rest looked fine to my eyes.
 
Oct 31, 2017
1,516
Remember how horrifying this scene was?

Yea, this kinda Terminator movie is DEAD

This scene will never be topped, never. Not even T2 was able to match this scene. I remember watching this as a kid and being truly terrified. Until they bring back that feeling to the Terminator movies, Hollywood will keep failing. It’s best just to let the franchise die, modern Hollywood can’t recreate the tension of this scene.
 

MoosetheMark

Member
May 3, 2019
186
Remember how horrifying this scene was?

Yea, this kinda Terminator movie is DEAD

Goddamn that music sting when Reese and Sarah make their escape...

The Terminator is godlike. It’s the perfect scifi short story. The script is so tight and self contained, there’s barely a second wasted. So much cool lore and details for us to think about and chew on...T2 was awesome but the first one never needed a sequel.
 
Oct 28, 2017
16,723
Seeing Sarah now was pretty powerful, especially after her confessing she's been at war so long she's forgetting the best parts of her life. You think about her in T1 with her perm, teeny bopper attitude and pink scooter and then see what's become of her now.

Her story is so agonizing it almost reads like a Greek tragedy. But it looks like it might not be for nothing. Grace repeats John's line about fate which I choose to believe Sarah tells Dani who tells her soldiers. So Sarah's influence on the future is still strong.

I think this should have been the emotional core of the movie. More Sarah's story with Dani being an extension of it. But with a franchise they're always looking to setup the next one and Sarah won't be the face of that franchise (seems nobody will be now).
 

Fercho

Member
Nov 3, 2017
2,868
Saw it today......didn't like it.

Movie feels lifeless. Too fast, without proper character development, you don't give a shit about the characters at all, also the blonde girl and Dani are terrible actresses.

It didn't helped that this movie shits on T2 in the first 5 minutes for no reason at all. Legion? WTF is that? At least try to do something new dude, fucking boring shit.

James Cameron needs to stop fucking around and write & direct a Terminator movie or just leave the franchise alone. I don't know how he allowed the franchise and universe he created go to shit like this.
 

Neece

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,541
Can they please just try and make another horror slasher Terminator film. Go low budget and don't worry about it making a billion dollars.
 

carlosrox

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,870
Vancouver BC
Can they please just try and make another horror slasher Terminator film.
They've already fucked up so many times though. It seems to be the main reason this one has done so poorly. Genisys in particular was clearly just way too fucking stupid. It really just shouldn't have existed. I think it did irreparable harm to the series. It didn't help that this one seemed to borrowing some ideas from it and doubled down on adding humor to another old T800. The last movie JUST did that.

This is franchise fatigue at its very best.

T3 did well for itself and aside from (once again) a silly tone, and a rushed/pointless feeling, it was good. I think a better cut of the movie would do wonders.

I don't even have a problem with Salvation, it just didn't do anything special.

Genisys is the one that is just fucked and ruined the series for me.
 

carlosrox

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,870
Vancouver BC
Make Arnold the villain again. Make him intimidating and scary. Shock the audiences with a brutal return to form starring Arnold.

Arnold/the T800's Joker.

No fucking aging T800, this is simply a model meant to look like an older man. Problem solved, no more stupid fucking old man Terminator shit. No one gives a fuck about a Terminator who ages. No one gives a fuck about a Terminator being a surrogate father.

No one. gives a FUCK. about an Old Terminator.

No fucking idea why they did the same thing twice in a row. NO MORE.
Arnold just happens to be a Terminator with an old skin OKAY?? That's all that needs to be said.

Make it take place wherever/whenever you want, but DO NOT include modern sensibilities, stupid out of place jokes, quips, or whatever in it.

Make it dark and disturbing, bring back Brad Fiedel. Take honest inspiration from the first movie and the first movie only. Fuck the spectacle, fuck the comedy, and fuck the new characters that are just gonna get retconned, recast, etc.

Whether it should even be about the Connors/Kyle Reese, I don't know.

Ps. That was a lot of F bombs. Deserved!
 
Oct 28, 2017
16,723
Make Arnold the villain again. Make him intimidating and scary. Shock the audiences with a brutal return to form starring Arnold.

Arnold/the T800's Joker.

No fucking aging T800, this is simply a model meant to look like an older man. Problem solved, no more stupid fucking old man Terminator shit. No one gives a fuck about a Terminator who ages. No one gives a fuck about a Terminator being a surrogate father.

No one. gives a FUCK. about an Old Terminator.

No fucking idea why they did the same thing twice in a row. NO MORE.
Arnold just happens to be a Terminator with an old skin OKAY?? That's all that needs to be said.

Make it take place wherever/whenever you want, but DO NOT include modern sensibilities, stupid out of place jokes, quips, or whatever in it.

Make it dark and disturbing, bring back Brad Fiedel. Take honest inspiration from the first movie and the first movie only. Fuck the spectacle, fuck the comedy, and fuck the new characters that are just gonna get retconned, recast, etc.

Whether it should even be about the Connors/Kyle Reese, I don't know.

Ps. That was a lot of F bombs. Deserved!
For a studio looking for tentpole franchises it's not going to pin one on a 72 year old man. This film was meant to close the book on SkyNet/John/T800 for good. Even if they made the movie you described this time it doesn't look like people would have gone to see it. The franchise's audience seems to have moved on. Paramount needs to move on too.
 

UltraMagnus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,158
Maybe they could do the de-aging thing to allow Arnold to play the villain, I mean they did do it in Genysis. But I doubt it, think the franchise is dead.
 

catashtrophe

Member
Oct 27, 2017
344
UK
Watched the movie on friday and like others have said its the best sequel after T2 which is not a high bar.

I pretty much enjoyed it as i kinda just switched off but there was no need to kill Connor, they could have just showed him and sarah working at a supermarket or something as they have become irrelevant.

Also if Skynet sent other Terminators to different locations why not send more T-1000 models?

I could go into it more but not fussed, it was a decent watch
 

-JD-

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
3,070
Grace was probably my favorite part of the film. Admittedly I'm a little biased because Mackenzie Davis starred in one of my top 5 favorite tv shows ever (Halt & Catch Fire), but this being her first real action hero movie, she fits the role really really well and handles all the fights convincingly. And I like her character. She's the Kyle Reese without all the time loop progeny shenanigans, and her vulnerability when she goes over her limit is a good way to ground her some. It's obvious Davis put a lot into her role. It's a bummer that this movie is a flop because I was hoping that this would be her launching pad for bigger things.
 
Oct 26, 2017
751
Watched the movie on friday and like others have said its the best sequel after T2 which is not a high bar.

I pretty much enjoyed it as i kinda just switched off but there was no need to kill Connor, they could have just showed him and sarah working at a supermarket or something as they have become irrelevant.

Also if Skynet sent other Terminators to different locations why not send more T-1000 models?

I could go into it more but not fussed, it was a decent watch
The T-1000 was an experimental prototype, T:SCC aside there was only ever one of them. Between T1, T2 and Dark Fate it builds the image of Skynet desperately throwing everything it has back in time all at once while the resistance are kicking down the doors once the war’s already ended.

As for John and Sarah working at a supermarket...

 
Oct 25, 2017
799
Can someone here do me a huge solid, I donno if it's going to be possible at all but... I have a South American friend in Venezuela named Daniella, and sure enough her close circle of friends call her "Dani" , many times we joked about how her real friends call her Dani and not so close friends call her Daniella, so when that scene came up in this movie where her dad says just that, I burst out laughing in the theater, and I think I was the only one... I want to send that scene to her on Facebook for a little laugh, cheer her up buut.. for the life of me, I couldn't find the entire sequence on Youtube... there is only the set up of the "joke" if you will, the "punchline" is cut, and never shown in the trailer...

If anyone can find the entire scene, that would be amazing and much appreciated. And by that I mean, the dad answering to the Baddie Terminator with "That's funny, her friends call her Dani" after the Terminator says "I am looking for Daniella, I'm one of her friends"

here is the scene in the trailer, without the dad's response.. ugh ! https://youtu.be/B3CXtYSshzs?t=458
 
Oct 25, 2017
799
Remember how horrifying this scene was?

Yea, this kinda Terminator movie is DEAD

Jesus Christ! I just got back from seeing Dark Fate tonight, After re watching this scene again, I feel like I just got out of driving a Hyndai Accent all day and stepped into a Classic, powerful, air cooled, turbo Porsche, with all the right sounds and controls and feels. They don't make them like they use to huh?
 
Oct 29, 2017
422
Can they please just try and make another horror slasher Terminator film. Go low budget and don't worry about it making a billion dollars.
That's the only way forward for this franchise. I'd prefer if they just stopped making these but if they absolutely have to they need to go back to the basics.

Set it in the eighthies, have cops chase the "phone book killer", have the Terminator be someone other than Arnold, have the twist be that there is no one from the future to warn them or explain what the Terminator is or what he wants - the audience knows anyway and extra tension can be created by having the main characters not know what they are up against.

Trying to follow up Terminator 2, which is explicitly designed to not allow follow ups, has been a huge mistake.
 
Dec 22, 2018
303
No. Skynet sent several Terminators at the same time. I guess Skynet sent them to other locations just in case.
The Pitch Meeting parody for this movie actually mocks this plot point quite a bit and it's hilarious:


They're absolutely right. It doesn't make any sense whatsoever . . . It's just something you need to turn your brain off for.
 
Mar 26, 2018
628
This movie felt awful to me. Awful. Whatever visual effects these are feel up close, two dark or just unrealistic like usual.

The story, scene selection and almost everything. Just bad....

The only thing that would save this film would be a compelelty different story and main cast.

I actually was looking forward to seeing it and was optimistic after seeing and liking Gemini Man more than I thought I wouod.

I felt like I wanted to get up and leave Dark Fate though and I just couldn't find anything interesting beyond the first 10 minutes. Even my Chinese wife felt the main villain was a terrible choice and she isn't exactly caring since she enjoys the rock and other actors I don't like.

Don't waste your time with this movie, it's so so bland .
 

TheRealCanadianBros

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
915
SkyNet "sent Terminators back to various times before it was destroyed, they just happened to arrive after. Time travel! "

It was pretty self explanatory from watching the movie but there it is.
 
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fundogmo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
433
article said:
So did Dani consciously send Grace to die?

Yes, in a way, but Miller isn’t happy about it.

“I always have a little bit of a problem with Dani sending Grace to die,” he said. “We set up this whole [story] where Grace is kind of Dani’s surrogate child and a mother sending her child to die for her is just...yeah, I had a different scene in mind.”
James Cameron mentioned how there were some huge creative battles between him and Tim Miller during the editing process. I'm guessing this and the playground ending were one of the many contentions.
 
Oct 31, 2017
1,516
How did they go from a cool name like "Skynet" to a generic sounding sci-fi name like "Legion"? The movie deserved to flop for that kind of fail alone.

Terrible terrible writing.
 

Anustart

9 Million Scovilles
Banned
Nov 12, 2017
2,958
Going to see this tomorrow and I'm pumped. I don't hold t1 or 2 as some unreachable goal so I'm sure I'll like this well enough.
 

digitalrelic

Weight Loss Champion 2018: Biggest Change
Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,292
This is pretty clearly the end of this franchise. There’s just zero interest from general audiences. At least it went out on a decent note.
 

SENPAIatLARGE

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
2,267
According to this movie, would every terminator sent back in time naturally grow a conscience and hate Skynet if they were successful? Like would the T-1000 become a charity worker if enough time passed after killing John? Would the O.G T-800 join the fire brigade if he was successful in killing Reese and Connor?
 

ChristopherDX

Member
May 8, 2018
593
Saw it today......didn't like it.

Movie feels lifeless. Too fast, without proper character development, you don't give a shit about the characters at all, also the blonde girl and Dani are terrible actresses.

It didn't helped that this movie shits on T2 in the first 5 minutes for no reason at all. Legion? WTF is that? At least try to do something new dude, fucking boring shit.

James Cameron needs to stop fucking around and write & direct a Terminator movie or just leave the franchise alone. I don't know how he allowed the franchise and universe he created go to shit like this.
Amen.

Literally no character development AT ALL the storylines in terminator one and two were amazing and I thought seeing Linda back they would continue the actual story....what in the fuck did i watch?

Awful. The only time I ever got that vibe is when I saw her and John...why do that? What was the point?

Ugh
 

sirap

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,762
South East Asia
According to this movie, would every terminator sent back in time naturally grow a conscience and hate Skynet if they were successful? Like would the T-1000 become a charity worker if enough time passed after killing John? Would the O.G T-800 join the fire brigade if he was successful in killing Reese and Connor?
It can go either way I think. The OG T-800 seemed to have developed a psychopathic personality as the movie progressed while the T-1000 was sadistic right out of the gate (even Skynet was shook, hence the limited production run of this model)
 

lazybones18

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,672
Saw it tonight and I've come to the realization that, to me at least, Terminator just doesn't work with too much CGI. It just looks unsatisfying and awful, especially when it comes to physical combat. Combine that with how fast the combat is made to look, there's no real weight to what's happening in the movie.

And the skull crush scene near the beginning....yuck. Obvious T2 callback that doesn't even look remotely menacing or cool. The Terminator's movement just doesn't work for me in that scene. I know the movement is supposed to look natural, but the CGI just kills it for me. The practical, slow movement from T2 is much better.

As for what I liked, Grace was the best character in the movie. I liked that she didn't put up with Sarah's shit. Death scene could have been better though. Wasn't all that emotional.

Overall, it's better than the recent Terminator movies, but that's not really saying much. Just kill off the franchise already. It had its time in the sun nearly over 25 years ago.
 
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