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Tesla is now worth more than GM and Ford combined


Oct 28, 2017
I can't recall, is today the big day for you Octodad? I'm trying to remember your delivery date.

To chime into some prior posts. Someone mentioned being a car person. I myself am one as well. My last 5 vehicles have been 4 different BMW's (f30 platforms) and a Stingray mixed in there. Going to Tesla was a positive from the environmental aspect sure, but when I had the choice of going with a M4 or a Performance Model 3, there was no category that stood out where the M4 was a better value proposition when looking at performance.

Tesla isn't just converting people on the environmental aspect but they are bringing in a whole bunch of us performance orientated folk that want the best vehicle for the value.
This is basically me, Tesla is currently the only EV I'd consider because they're the only real performance EV at a price I can afford.


Oct 26, 2017
I’m just one example, but I’ll chime in.

I can afford a Tesla Model 3 and I’m getting one. That said, I would have never bought an Audi, BMW, Mercedes, etc.I have a 2006 Corolla with 200,000 miles on it and my wife drives a Crosstrek.

I went with Tesla because of features + environmental responsibility. I can afford an ev, so I feel like I should buy one. There are many that can’t yet and that’s totally understandable, but I can.

So I don’t know what target market I fit into. I certainly wasn’t going to be a luxury car purchaser. If anything Subaru or Toyota lost a purchase.


Oct 25, 2017
Mesa, AZ
Luxury brands making things that aren't luxury cheapens the brand. You aren't gonna see someone wearing a Gucci hardhat or an Apple flip phone.

Just look at what happened to Cadillac after GM basically took an existing Chevy model and slapped a Cadillac logo on it. People got pissed and didn't buy it and it hurt Cadillac for years.
Well, if you're talking about the cadillac cimarron, then sure, but that was already a bad car to begin with, just like everything else GM, and other American companies were making at the time.

Which competing EVs do you prefer to Tesla, subjectively, and why?
It mostly comes down to me not liking Tesla's styling, mostly the interior. I hate how the model 3 has everything on the center tablet. I've always disliked when cars had center mounted gauges because its annoying to read. The model 3 does this, while also making every control on a touch screen, another thing I don't like. I want physical buttons so I can use them without having to look at them. This problem isn't exclusive to Tesla, its just they happen to also do it and its one thing that would ever keep my from owning one. None of the other benefits matter to me because I don't like the interior. At least the model S and I think the model X has a cluster in front of the driver, but I still don't want all the controls on a touch screen.

As for what I prefer, at the high end I'd get a Jaguar I-Pace over a model S or X because I think the interior is a nice place to be. But that's the only rival I've actually had a chance to experience. As for a model 3 rival, I've only been in a leaf, but wouldn't get one because of battery cooling. I've been in a regular golf, so I know what the egolf is like, but it also has the same battery cooling problem that leaf's have. I do like the fiat 500e because I like the normal fiat 500, but they don't make it anymore. So really, none of the cheaper electric cars interest me at all. I like the look of the Honda E, but they're not selling it in the US.


Nov 28, 2017
your joking right? Audi BMW and Mercedes are all direct competitors in the luxury market.
No I'm not joking. They're competitors but Audi is a competitor in the same way Lexus is in the luxury market.

Audi have half the sales of both BMW and Mercedes, both have far more brand loyalty than Audi. Audi has significantly improved over the last few years in their packages and are catching up, they have arguably the better interiors and electronics these days but mechanically they can't compete with Mercedes and BMW given their platform is largely the VW base with candy.

Audi deservedly has a reputation for being soulless. You don't get too many people going from owning a Mercedes or BMW then going to an Audi. Audi simply doesn't have the passionate customer base that those brands have, Tesla has that over Audi as well.