I guess you missed this news last year.
https://www.kitguru.net/gaming/matthew-wilson/valve-announces-changes-to-steams-revenue-cut/
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The Division 2 Is Ditching Steam For The Epic Games Store On PC [See Threadmarks]
- Thread starter Kenzodielocke
- Start date
I guess you missed this news last year.
Yeah, a few years of consistent anti-Valve propaganda have prepared some gamers to act against their self-interest.
Luckily not so much PC gamers, at least judging from the reactions in more PC-focused communities.
Looks like I did miss the news last month - thanks for the link.
Those cuts - 30% up to $10m, 25% up to $50m, and 20% beyond that - are still pretty far out from what Epic store are offering.
Ubisoft maybe have it worked out that they would still turn a greater profit from shifting from Steam.
Yeah what is that like $7M less money for you when your game has made $50M. Pretty sure the bean counters would think that's significant.
Now this is just plain childish.
Again, I've said it before, but if anyone said something like this on Sony, MS or Nintendo they'd be shot down quick.
I feared for different reactions even on PC-focused site, guess ERA has warped my perception after all despite knowing what to expect here, but so far it's been rather negative everywhere else I went and especially on the sites I regularly visit that have a majority of PC folks posting. And in the end those are the ones Epic needs to convince.
I can definitely see this point of view... And while you can always "Add a non-steam game", you still don't have time tracking or library functionality with it (Achievements, screenshots, etc).
To be fair stat tracking is crazy detailed on the uplay app so that's not a big deal but having it launcher wide needs to happen.
Have you even used Uplay? Because it does all of these things.I'm someone who pays more for Ubisoft's games just to have them on Steam, especially if they have achievements! I'm really quite displeased about this news!
The Division is my #1 most played game on Steam by hour count, and now with the sequel I'll have to play it on a service that probably doesn't even track played time and let me easily view that in comparison with my other games!! Why not release it on both Epic Store and Steam and let people decide whichever they like best? I can't say it makes me think very highly of Tim Sweeney and the way he and his colleagues at Epic are choosing to draw attention to their new store. Money is more important than the user experience, which I might add is a lot more than just clicking an icon and booting up the game which I see some people trying to boil this down to. I'm not one bit happy about it whatsoever.
I find it sad that Tom Clancy's The Divsion 2 won't even have the chance to even appear on this list because of an unsavory business dealing!
Happy to help your understanding.
lol so you conveniently left out the part where devs get to make less on steam, especially less-successful devs?
or how about the perspective of devs on steam where they see games that are heavily-advertised and theirs being on page #35 of some genre or filter?
Erm, both of those things are featured prominently in the table. In the "developer" square on the Epic store side 88:12 is the only bold text in the entire image, and "Empty Shelves" is a major point.
Is that 20% for every dollar after the 50 millionth? And it says per game, I could see per publisher, but how many games even hit 50 million in cash sales? And that won't count people activating retail or other store keys, like from GMG.
That's true, but steam also lets developers generate keys for free to give away or sell elsewhere which steam will service without charge. Those are sales that valve does all the same stuff to support, but without getting paid. Steam keys sold elsewhere account for a significant portion of games registered on steam, and reduces the effective steam cut. For games successful enough to go far beyond the $50m threshold, it may be reducing the steam cut to below 12%. I suspect that it may be untenable for valve to both continue to offer and support free key generation and match the storefront cut of EGS, Discord, and certainly Itch.
This steam key argument comes up frequently, it might be have been relevant years ago mostly for indie games, but its not salient anymore. Games are a service now, especially stuff like the Division, nobody wants to continue paying Valve 30% of all service generated revenue like season passes, microtransactions etc
I would've bet money that Square not Ubi would've been the first big publisher to defect to Epic.
Edit: Forgot Tencent angle, it all makes sense now.
Edit: Forgot Tencent angle, it all makes sense now.
The reduction is marginal though right? The cut is better on sales past 50mil.
Imagine if Epic, unlike steam, lets Ubi process mtx through uplay for the Epic store version (as return for being the 3rd party exclusive store for one of 2019's biggest game) then Ubi makes 100% on all mtx for a service based game that entirely relies on mtx to support itself.
the devs over at Ubisoft are really struggling with all of their games on page #35 with little to no advertising. Epic is sticking up for the little guy.
That's probably the biggest part of it. They're like Apple at this point right? Like, you have to completely separate your ecosystem out into Steam/nonsteam variants and only get to sell shit through steam if someone buys the steam version of your game.
Yep. I have both steam and uplay version of Siege. If I try to process an ingame mtx through uplay version the transaction process is started on uplay itself and I am given the option to choose my payment method. If I boot up the steam version and try to process an mtx in that, the point where I originally got the option to input payment method I only get one option and that option is to redirect me to steam which is where I have to put in my payment method.
I have the uplay version of AC Origins and steam version of AC Odyssey, it's the same exact story there. If I try to make a transaction in Odyssey then despite the "steam version" of the game running on uplay and the game itself being built around uplay and its store....it wont let me process the transaction on uplay.
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People here are always saying competition in the gaming industry is a good thing, except when a game isn't launching on Steam.
People also endlessly complain about Uplay, and now that Ubisoft is giving us another option it's more of an issue?
People also endlessly complain about Uplay, and now that Ubisoft is giving us another option it's more of an issue?
Uplay is mandatory regardless of what the other option is. Also most people do like uplay because it gives 20% store discounts to its users and has managed to consolidate players regardless of where they bought the game (steam, uplay, origin) into one system i.e. uplay due to it being mandatory for Ubi games.
Are they giving another option? In a way I guess, while removing another option from consumer.
How their games sold on Steam wasn't already another option to purchasing from uPlay?
People very rarely, especially now days, get riled up over uPlay or Origin as they are now good and competitive platforms in their own right. If you have done any variety PC gaming over past 8 or so years you do know that, those platforms matured nicely. Without paying off publishers and dev houses to joink games from Steam after they were already listed and sold on Steam.
If you have been paying attention to discussion you do know that most of peoples issues with Epic Store are with how Epic is operating their store and how they have openly said that they have next to no interest in improving it, not so much with PC landscape getting 28th launcher and storefront. We are used to those.
Epic's refund policy was changed to match Steam's (as of 1/9/2019).
https://epicgames.com/site/en-US/store-refund-policy
It is kinda funny how everyone says Epic is good for competition because that will fix Steam, but it seems like Steam is fixing Epic.
https://epicgames.com/site/en-US/store-refund-policy
It is kinda funny how everyone says Epic is good for competition because that will fix Steam, but it seems like Steam is fixing Epic.
Eh if you bold that first sentence and don't read what I was actually saying it's childish sure. But that's a nice hot take you have there.
Their refund policy on the website never mentioned the refund limit they only clarified on twitter, so I assume it's still in place.
People want to buy and play their games in their ecosystem of choice. How hard is this to understand?
Also, while Ubisoft is giving us another option, they also took a very popular option away. No one would complain if Ubisoft sold their games on both steam and Epic's store.
I just wrote my opinion on why Ubi games on Epic's Game Store are a special kind of stupid on another thread, and I think the post is more relevant here so I'll copy paste it.
Steam versions of Ubi games made sense because some people just "like" to have their games on Steam. They accept having a Steam version that comes with Uplay bundled in, and prefer that to the standalone Uplay version, because it integrates with Steam. So they accept Uplay, but they still want to have Steam features given the option.
But people who have the equivalent feeling of "wanting the game on Epic's store" don't exist. The EGS version of The Division 2 makes no sense. Previously, these people who prefer having their games on Steam could choose between having the game on a store they like bundled with a store they don't care about, or just having the game on the store they don't care about period. Now they can choose between have the game on one store they don't care about or... having the game on a store they don't care about bundled with another store they don't care about. Double DRM just like Steam + Uplay except with no advantages...
yeah... lol.
I don't understand who is gonna buy Ubi games on EGS. Who is this aimed for. It makes no sense no matter how you look at it. It would make more sense for them to just drop Steam and stick to Uplay period lmao
Steam versions of Ubi games made sense because some people just "like" to have their games on Steam. They accept having a Steam version that comes with Uplay bundled in, and prefer that to the standalone Uplay version, because it integrates with Steam. So they accept Uplay, but they still want to have Steam features given the option.
But people who have the equivalent feeling of "wanting the game on Epic's store" don't exist. The EGS version of The Division 2 makes no sense. Previously, these people who prefer having their games on Steam could choose between having the game on a store they like bundled with a store they don't care about, or just having the game on the store they don't care about period. Now they can choose between have the game on one store they don't care about or... having the game on a store they don't care about bundled with another store they don't care about. Double DRM just like Steam + Uplay except with no advantages...
yeah... lol.
I don't understand who is gonna buy Ubi games on EGS. Who is this aimed for. It makes no sense no matter how you look at it. It would make more sense for them to just drop Steam and stick to Uplay period lmao
If I had to guess it's a marketing deal for Epic. This thread and everyone complaining/talking about it is free marketing for epics game store.
I see it as free hatred. Every piece of news about the EGS generates a terrible response because they are just taking away things from us, they have offered exactly ZERO good things for any consumer ever. Sure we are talking about EGS but these kind of news that generate such a "oh fuck you" response aren't gonna make people spend money on the store.
Everyone hated steam when it came out now look at this thread. No such thing as bad publicity for a new marketplace. Awareness is far more important.
They do have a support page that mentions it, which has since been updated to say that it's outdated. Also, now when you purchase a game on the store, a window pops up telling you about its refund policy. I imagine if the "only two refunds" thing was still in place, it would be mentioned.
Less-sucessful devs don't make less on Steam. In fact, they make exactly zero dollars on the Epic store.
Mind you, Durante didn't leave it out of the image at all. Get some glasses.
What about stop shitposting and actually think for a minute.
Ubisoft isn't "giving us another option". At all. In fact, they pulled The Division 2 from both Origin and Steam. Surely you know enough math to realize that yes, this is less options, and this isn't competition.
If you guys want Steam to remain competitive, maybe direct your questions at Valve and why they aren't willing to budge on the cut they give pubs. It's that simple. This isn't equivilent to real life retail, it's not hard for someone to download another launcher, and a huge percentage of gamers already have said launcher.
It's really that basic. It's only going to keep happening with big pubs as long as steam doesn't represent an attractive option to them.
They already budged on the cut. Why do people keep on coming into these threads with uninformed bullshit
I think TheYanger knows that they just mean meet or beat EGS's 12%. Which is kind of a shit deal for them. They do way more and offer free off site key generation. If EGS manages to bully them into that position they'll be the store doing vastly more than any other for a lot less money.
Even that may not be enough though, so long as Epic remains happy to bankroll exclusives and Valve remains ideologically opposed to it.
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Steam goes way beyond just a cut difference, they also take a huge 30% cut on every microtransaction any steam version of a game sells. Ubisoft forces you to use Uplay even if you buy a steam game, but you STILL have to pay valve just to buy a dlc item. In games based almost entirely around DLC this is huge.
It's basically the exact same problem companies like Spotify and Netflix have with Apple and the app store, except that since this is a PC all they have to do is...not sell it through a completely optional ecosystem and still have effectively the same market.
Steam is basically in a position where they are acting the same as MS/Sony/Apple, except that they're not in a closed market and thus the market is responding. That's what this is. This shift has been happening for several years now and it's not likely to stop - at this point if you're attached to Steam as a marketplace, you cannot ALSO extol the virtues of a PC without being willing to budge on that front. You're no longer able to buy a reasonably large percentage of the largest games on the platform if you do so, and it's only going to grow not shrink. Again, if you think Steam is what you'd rather play games on, you have two options: Don't buy products not on steam, or Tell valve that hey maybe you should work a bit better with pubs so their stuff comes here because I want to support you. The first one is far less likely to actually work, seeing as these companies already have factored in the number of people their marketing departments think give THAT much of a shit about Steam as their only source of gaming and considered it unimportant enough to go ahead regardless.
Steam's share changes are going to do jack shit for titles that already made up their mind (or paid to) to not be on Steam. It's still a worse deal that you need to first earn $X (in however long it will take you) to get. Compared to 88% from the very first sale. The Steam change might cause devs who were toying with the idea to re-consider and not sign exclusive deals with Epic.
Well - it still will have unilauncher. Weird stuff but I see why - steam % cut is way too high I think.
If it was about the steam cut, it wouldnt be a "partnership with selected titles".
unless this is just testing the waters, them seeing what a better split on Epic and Uplay is like compared to the ol Steam and Uplay combo.