I notice this with how easy white people say 'black people' but when you say 'white people' to a white person (whether you are white or black), they often look noticeably moved by the idea. This I think is because their totally dominant world view has been slightly deconstructed and that their preconceived image of 'normal' has been challenged. I sympathise that people cannot always relate to others (whether white or black), but overall I don't think most white people realise how different life, experiences and interactions are as a non-white person. Simply highlighting that difference is trauma to white people's 'universal' notion of the world, white people then react to that trauma in many ways, crying about it is a particularly undeveloped way of handling the situation, outwardly being hostile as a result of uncovering that the world isn't really how it seems to them is even more immature and demonstrates how society has failed to civilise people in their interactions in the world (I'm politely saying they're inherently dumb racist idiots).
The Guardian: "How white women use strategic tears to avoid accountability"
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Those of us who are white do receive benefits from living in a racist society. We do not have to actively seek those benefits out per say, but they can be passively given to us.
Appearing to be, to me, infers I'm intentionally misleading and attempting to put up a facade that hides the realities of who I am. "whiteness" used in the way it is here is the bullshit facade that others are putting up to invalidate the things that I say.
There is no discussion to be had if it constantly stops at "yeah, but white". That's bullshit and reductive. Regardless the notions of "whiteness" here is completely USA-centric and from the perspective of someone born in Europe on the figurative doorstep of many different cultures... it's dumb and stupid.
"How do you like it?" is the chant of someone who isn't interested in anything progressive.
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I have shaved head and people sometimes want to touch it, pretty weird but it has lead to getting laid a few times so I don't mind.
When white people are lumped into a group it's to their benefit.
The key difference being that it never comes bundled with Jim Crow laws for white people.
I get that it sucks, but it's an abstract inconvenience for white people who could really just take it on the chin and keep on enjoying their whiteness.
Someone saying "white people are shit"(whether that was used or not) or using terms like "white people tears" is actively living out their racial biases by stereotyping, negatively generalizing and insulting people by their skin color. It does not get any less offensive and racist by then shouting "LMAO, look at the white fragility!" or emitting similar hot air whenever somone dares to criticize it. These specific agitators do not want constructive discussions and they will not get it. You are putting people under general conspicion and acting as if there is some sort of "debt" because of skin color, the result being that in the real world and outside your close social bubble absolutely nobody is going to take you seriously. Talk to me like I am a human being and I will also talk to you like you are a human being. If you come with an attitude of "you suck and I enjoy the tears of your kind" I'm going to tell you to fuck off. And now I guess cue the "ah he doesn't see color! lmao" or tonepolicing claims.
Lmao white people, she got called out on her shit abd cried asap because she couldn't deflect anymore and then double down and basically joined the group full stop
K
I guess it’s ok to talk shit and make generalizations about a certain group of people as long as they’re white.
That's garbage ... Sorry, if someone calls a whole race out as shit, then people have the right to stand up and question that statement -- making the white woman in the article correct.
That depends on the context. To believe that, you'd have to never read or listen to identity politics. When was the last time you heard someone on the left refer to "white people" in a way that benefited them?
The fact that you're exercising your privilege to complain about it in itself means you're feeding into the system.
Yeah it's definitely normal to be curious, hell when my friend first got dreads I asked if I could see how they felt simply because I had never felt any before. It's not a thing mutually exclusive to any group of people it's just natural curiosity.
Yeah, being white is being in a car rolling down the highway, and that car is the systematic racism in our society. Of course there's a difference between those of us in the car who want it to stop and those who want the pedal to the metal, but ultimately I'll always be in the car (at least in my lifetime).
What we (white people) can do is try to slow it down. Trick the racists into pulling over, break the knob on the AC, etc... But every one of us won't see the car stop in our lifetimes, and that means we'll all benefit as it carries us forward.
Give me one real world example of white people as a group being disadvantaged on account of their race
A tweet calling a white person mayo with 100k RTs doesn't count, obviously
Have you ever considered that maybe you don't have the answers? That maybe the people by which your privilege affects and marginalizes have better idea of what that entails?
Yes. I’m white. I’m a participant in the system. I don’t want to be, but to deny that I am minimizes the scope and severity of institutional racism. It’s a fact of life in this country.
Knew a lady who tried to use the crying technique to get herself out of a jam. Tried to flip the tables on me. Had another lady back me up and called out her bullshit. “Crying” lady’s next tactic was to play the “I’m just a fragile little old grandma” card. It’s not a technique some white women only deploy against POC, but one they learned from childhood and deploy against anyone when they know they’ve been caught.
Roll of Thunder, Hear My Cry captured this phenomenon really well.
Roll of Thunder, Hear My Cry captured this phenomenon really well.
I mean doesn't "Black people" or "White people" need something appended to it to give it context. Blanket statements. Stereotyping and generalizing is usually just kind of a shitty thing to do regardless when it's revolving around something boarding ad-hominem no?
Saying a person's skin color, followed by people, means and I imagine doesn't anger most rational people without some body language, intonation, or other communication piece behind it. As we all well know from Trump for instance explaining away as his words being misunderstood when the intent is clear. I think that context matters.
We were talking about the labeling of others. If you want to move the goalposts and talk about how race affects policy, then obviously whites benefit more. But that isn't what the post chain you quoted was talking about.
Sorry, how is this thread not about white people? Specifically, white women?
Not necessarily. Saying black people face systematic oppression and racism doesn't really need much context.
The backlash against "identity politics" by racist "leftists" after the election definitely benefited them. They collectively threw black people under the bus and blamed "identity politics" despite Hillary running a campaign painfully devoid of an actual conversation when our nation has a problem of our police force killing unarmed black citizens.
Crying about "identity politics" basically is the white people tears articles like this talk about.
Wait... so any socially conscious circle/group of people is going to assume someone is racist because they are white?
I don't think many people would disagree. At least sane people. There's also nothing offensive about that.
Not everything needs to be "crying about" you know. Sometimes it's fine to just disagree about something. And I don't even disagree that identity politics are necessary - I think they are. But it does come with issues, and trying to obfuscate that "whiteness" when used in the context of leftist discussion is a negative thing...it's obvious. And unnecessary.
The labeling of white people is to their real world benefit. People reacting to that in a way that hurts you is not a disadvantage.
My girlfriend is white does this all the time. I'm black and she grew up in a wealthy new England town that's 99% white so she sometimes says and does things that are offensive. Not that it makes it ok but I get she wasnt around black people most of her life. She cries everytime I correct her and says that I'm mean or mad. Doesn't seem like she ever really listens to what Im trying to say just immediately turns into a victom. Of what I don't know lol.
This thread is about white women in general not about specific posters in this thread that are suddenly feeling offended. Every time white people are called out as racist there seems to be someone saying not all white people. Its just like the not all men phenomenon. It does not add to the discussion. Sure its great if you as a white person does not do these things but you also have to be aware that you still benefit as a white person.
"White people are shit" isn't going to go over well, not because it's offensive, but because it calls the speakers intelligence into question.
It's a disadvantage to conversation, which is the only thing anyone has besides violence. I'm not here to say white people are oppressed like minorities, and I think the slow slide into bringing actual disadvantage into this topic is a deflection tactic. It's okay to posit that turning whiteness into a negative thing is a problem for interracial discussion. It does not mean we can't discuss systemic racism.
By the way, we're not talking about a Coates essay here. We're talking about someone who said "white people are shit." That's the context.
Apparently you since you start crying when racism is brought up
If you make it about all people of a certain classification, people are going to take it as about all people of that classification. The whole "when I mean ___ people I mean" deflection is nonsense, and this op-ed is a perfect example of how there's no argument against their logic because any response is fitting into their script for dismissal. You cannot object to their argument, because then you're making it about yourself. You cannot feel any anger or sadness about it, because then you're trying to curry sympathy. You cannot participate at all, because then you're silencing other voices.
At the very least, the sentiment in this thread that people should be treated equally but relishing in white tears shows a level of cognitive dissonance or at least a tacit understanding that they like shitting on people for their intrinsic characteristics as long as its not them being shit upon. In the world we live in, I get the feeling. Them being shitty doesn't invalidate the continued problems of racism and prejudice they are disproportionately more likely to face. It still doesn't make them any less shitty for thinking it.
I won't argue against the idea that some people, consciously or not, use expressions of grief to deflect or garner sympathy—babies cry for a reason, on some level it's an instinctual response. And regardless of that response being genuine, it doesn't change the merits or lack thereof of their argument, or if it is derailing the point. But the entire framing of the incident in the OP as "woman got upset for no reason at all" is a highly selective reading of said event.
Ehhh. White people benefiting from racism is one thing (that's white privilege), but saying "to be white is to be racist" is just... no.
Why the LOL then?
Being white in Japan ;)
Perk literally activates at birth and runs in the background for the duration of the user's life and death. Look at how the media treats White Identity Extremists. They're always labeled as misunderstood, depressed, lone wolf, mentally ill "folks" that always, ALWAYS deserve the benefit of the doubt. Also see how the opioid crisis is addressed in the U.S. versus the crack epidemic. Fucking WAL-MART stepped in to help with the issue. You can be a white person at rock bottom and there are still safety nets in place that can catch you and even propel you to the top.
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Of course it's offensive. Any other group or race or whatever would be pissed if a white panelist said xxx type of people are shit. And even if you don't think white people should be offended or don't care that they are, trying to make some argument that an individual doesn't have the right to feel how they feel is lame.
Regarding the whole "white women's tears" things... I'm pretty sure white women aren't the only group of females who use crying as a form of emotional manipulation at times...
This new found push by white people for their own diversity is just coded nationalism and separatist yearning. Everyone else gets to stay "Asian" "Black" "Hispanic".
And it ain't just white women that cry crocodile tears when they get their backs up either. Shit happens all the time with white males too.
Please. The POC such as myself always happen to get treated like shit on a daily basis.
Put yourself in our shoes.
To clarify my point, there needs to be a contextualization of what being "racist" entails. It's not a binary state, but a very complicated spectrum. I do not presume every white person I meet are hood wearing, cross burning assholes. We've associated "racist" with the most vicious and despicable people so to see the label applied more liberally offends our sensibilities. In the same way a woman has to be cautious of a man, LGB people have to be conscious of hetero people, and trans folk have to be conscious of cis people, as a person of color (but more specifically a black man), I have to be cautious of white people. That doesn't mean that I physically avoid yall. It means that I enter new situations with reservation and caution because I have to be. Thats the system by which whiteness has created. I have to watch what I say, mind my body language, because until you really know a white person (and even then), you never know when they might finally decide to use that whiteness against you (or against other people). It's the subtleties of interactions and relationships, not me literally crossing the street at night or refusing to touch yall.
Now, "that sounds awfully like you're stereotyping white people like white people do black people". But imagine this. By even making that comparison, you give a smidge of validity to stereotypes that are verifiably untrue. Because I don't attribute the source of my caution to the inherent pathology of white people (as in, the color of your skin), but the system of white supremacy. And I don't know how unplugged you are from that system when I first meet you. So I have to be on guard. That doesn't mean you are a bad person inherently, but rather figuring out just how conscious are you of your own privileges.
Speaking as a white dude, I’ve seen white women’s tears weaponized in a variety of situations. It’s particularly effective on the type of person who’d vote for Trump and thinks respect for women means holding doors and not equal pay.
In my experience the women who do this are usually emotionally ignorant and immature. And yes, they’re exactly the type dumb enough to touch someone else’s hair and then wonder why they’re getting yelled at. They really don’t have a lot of empathy for basically anyone else.
It's almost as if white people feel addressed when someone talks about white people
umm humm.
I'm sorry, while people are starting to pull up straight white men up for sexism, racism and overall bigotry, straight white women are still treated like a protected class while getting away with alot of the same thing.
I'm sorry, while people are starting to pull up straight white men up for sexism, racism and overall bigotry, straight white women are still treated like a protected class while getting away with alot of the same thing.
There is no statement that is critical of white people that is going to go over well, no matter how carefully worded. It's not really the words that matter. We've seen white people get offended for far less inflammatory shit. There's a double standard at work when there's no net benefit to being racially sensitive towards white people when they're routinely allowed to be apathetic in the other direction. That's why I find it hard to begrudge a person of color who cuts to the chase and uses a shorthand.
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