-
Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
The Hadouken input: Do you struggle with it? Let's help.
- Thread starter Jaded Alyx
- Start date
OP
OP
It seems so, and it's honestly the only way I can see people getting frustrated with it and not being able to do it, going by some of the more extreme comments from the Smash community lately. They simply don't understand how to do it in the first place.wait wait wait wait
Is this what people think it means?
Well just in case anyone is still confused, lurking or otherwise, you do this. And it changes depending on which side the opponent is so in this example you are standing on the right of the screen and the opponent is to the left. This is why terms like towards or forward, and away are used since just saying left/right isn't always helpful as it could be a completely different move.
Opponent ______ You
Opponent ______ You
The only time I've ever had trouble with this input, was when I had Alpha 3 for DC, and I tried my best to do Shinku Hadouken, and i'm like doing it too slow and never realized it and one day after days of attempts I sped it up and realized the issue was just not doing it fast enough. I discovered shoryuken forums soon thereafter and became obsessed with the genre from more of a casual sf2/3/mk interest.
I tried to become basically proficient with fighting game moves on the Killer Instinct trainer a year or two ago. Couldn't even get consistent with the hadouken. It's one genre I've just flat out avoided ever since I was a horny little 12 year old pausing Dead or Alive 3 to see panty flashes on my new Xbox.
But at that point you're able to speak the game's language. I think that's the biggest barrier.
OP
OP
Maybe but idk... You don't actually need special moves to win matches
Well yeah, but that's like saying you technically only need one button to win matches. It's like saying you could ignore specials in Smash but still win matches. It's true, but you're ignoring a tool that makes it much easier.
I know I used to think it was like that. I imagine a lot of people actually do.wait wait wait wait
Is this what people think it means?
I think the main issue people have with charge characters is that they're sort of built around an unintuitive concept - i.e. the idea that you need to hold back (or down) while attacking your opponent.
A lot of these kinds of input only made sense in games that were originally built for arcade sticks. I remember finding quarter circles etc awkward to do on D-pad or keyboard. Even then you have something like Virtua Fighter Akira's moves that go against all this with throws that involve back/forward + diagonals but the notation often looks similar to quarter circle type moves.
I don't know why DoA 5 even includes advanced throws like Hayate's Raijin with "half circle forward + throw, back/forward/up/down + throw, diagonal up, diagonal down, other diagonal up, other diagonal down + throw" moves when I can't see anyone being able to execute that shit with the timing required.
I don't know why DoA 5 even includes advanced throws like Hayate's Raijin with "half circle forward + throw, back/forward/up/down + throw, diagonal up, diagonal down, other diagonal up, other diagonal down + throw" moves when I can't see anyone being able to execute that shit with the timing required.
Because it does a lot of damage and is rewarding to do. I absolutely can do it. Not even that hard, tbh.
I was doing QCF on an snes pad 28 years ago when I was like 10. I don't know why people, in today's day and age, when inputs are far more lenient consistently say things like this, lol.
Last edited:
True, but there are also legitimate reasons why these inputs have become standard. One is that they avoid command-crossover with normals or other specials. Sticking a fireball on a df/db+p input would be incredibly inconvenient. The second is that these motions place restrictions on player actions which both force them to make decisions and serve balancing purposes. For instance, giving Guile the ability to throw SBs while moving forward is demonstrably broken.
wait wait wait wait
Is this what people think it means?
This is what I thought for a long time when I was a kid. I would put in each arrow as a separate input after going back to neutral and wonder why the move never happened. I gave up on fighting games other than Smash thinking they were impossible until much later when I forced myself to learn a bit for Persona 4 Arena.
I can do these sort of inputs no problem in practice mode. Just not in actual matches.
Simply because when actually fighting another player, there's just so many other things you have to think about in addition to the actual inputs, and the fast paced nature of fighting games makes it very easy to screw up. Especially when for example Ryu has a QCF, a DF, and a double QCF. All of which are very easy to mix up, and doing the wrong move by accident can be extremely punishing.
Or if you like anime fighters like I do, just simply moving around in something like Blazblue or Guilty Gear is hard enough and takes up pretty much all of my attention. There's no way can I actually pay attention to properly doing moves in those games.
I also have problems actually incorporating these moves into combos with strict timing and execution requirements. Which isn't so much a problem in Street Fighter, but is in anime fighters.
It basically brings to mind the four stages of competence. Being able to do a QCF in training mode while paying full attention to it would be conscious competence, but actually doing it on demand in stressful situations pretty much requires unconscious competence, where all of the actions are already just muscle memory. And I don't think you can get from one to the other without spending tons of time practicing these inputs until they become automatic. Time which I don't really have anymore. Certainly all of the tips I see online only seem to deal only with how to get to the conscious competence stage.
Although honestly, I think a lot of the issues I have with the inputs simply come from using a controller. Because Tekken instantly became so much easier when I tried using a keyboard to play it instead of a fightstick. Not that a keyboard/hitbox is objectively a better input method, but being primarily a PC player I just have way more familiarity with it compared to a controller or a stick. (And well, I'd argue it is optimal for Tekken specifically because it makes KBDs super easy, but not for all fighting games).
Sadly, back when I started getting into fighters with SFIV, people almost universally considered keyboards to be a terrible option and discouraged people from using them. So I spent way too much time trying to get good on them with a controller and later a fightstick when I probably would have had way more success with a keyboard.
Simply because when actually fighting another player, there's just so many other things you have to think about in addition to the actual inputs, and the fast paced nature of fighting games makes it very easy to screw up. Especially when for example Ryu has a QCF, a DF, and a double QCF. All of which are very easy to mix up, and doing the wrong move by accident can be extremely punishing.
Or if you like anime fighters like I do, just simply moving around in something like Blazblue or Guilty Gear is hard enough and takes up pretty much all of my attention. There's no way can I actually pay attention to properly doing moves in those games.
I also have problems actually incorporating these moves into combos with strict timing and execution requirements. Which isn't so much a problem in Street Fighter, but is in anime fighters.
It basically brings to mind the four stages of competence. Being able to do a QCF in training mode while paying full attention to it would be conscious competence, but actually doing it on demand in stressful situations pretty much requires unconscious competence, where all of the actions are already just muscle memory. And I don't think you can get from one to the other without spending tons of time practicing these inputs until they become automatic. Time which I don't really have anymore. Certainly all of the tips I see online only seem to deal only with how to get to the conscious competence stage.
Although honestly, I think a lot of the issues I have with the inputs simply come from using a controller. Because Tekken instantly became so much easier when I tried using a keyboard to play it instead of a fightstick. Not that a keyboard/hitbox is objectively a better input method, but being primarily a PC player I just have way more familiarity with it compared to a controller or a stick. (And well, I'd argue it is optimal for Tekken specifically because it makes KBDs super easy, but not for all fighting games).
Sadly, back when I started getting into fighters with SFIV, people almost universally considered keyboards to be a terrible option and discouraged people from using them. So I spent way too much time trying to get good on them with a controller and later a fightstick when I probably would have had way more success with a keyboard.
I think one of the big differences from when I cut my teeth in fighting games is with arcades there was an inherent social element and the vast majority of people were pretty cool swapping info. If someone beat your ass mercilessly chances are there would be some chatting afterwards about how your turtling isn't working or why throws are not actually cheap.
You can kind of still get that with community discords and whatever but it takes some effort and knowing where to go beyond just playing the game itself with randoms. I am sure there is some era discord worth advertising here, feel free to latch on to my post with it for anyone looking for that sort of thing.
You can kind of still get that with community discords and whatever but it takes some effort and knowing where to go beyond just playing the game itself with randoms. I am sure there is some era discord worth advertising here, feel free to latch on to my post with it for anyone looking for that sort of thing.
I personally grew up on PC and played all fighting games offline on a keyboard so I got pretty used to it.
But ever since I used a controller, Mortal Kombat is the only 2D fighter I can play on a keyboard largely due to the 3D-esque movement of it. All other 2D games I play on a controller using the analog stick. 3D fighters are also way more comfortable to me on a keyboard. So I can understand your pain but it is worth sticking to.
And regarding the usage of moves in actual fights, there really is just no way around it. You have to build up the muscle memory offline to the point where you can always do them reliably in training mode and once you feel comfortable that there's no issues with the actual inputs, just grind out matches to do them in the appropriate situations. It'll feel like trial by fire cause that's exactly what fighting games tend to be at the start but you do improve over time and it is noticeable.
It is. Alot of times you see movelists way back when, but its never explained that you slide from down to forward and hit the button at the end of the motion.
I can't remember when I first learn to do QCF motions but I definitely don't remember ever thinking you had to return the stick to neutral for each input.
Fascinating how different people interpret information.
Fascinating how different people interpret information.