The background history was mostly fact based and not contested. The book's account of Sheehan killing Hoffa is. Apparently he's one of 14 people to claim responsibility.
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The Irishman |OT| The Goodfellas are Back in Town (Open Spoilers )
- Thread starter Naijaboy
- Start date
The background history was mostly fact based and not contested. The book's account of Sheehan killing Hoffa is. Apparently he's one of 14 people to claim responsibility.
Why?
It's a book based on one really unreliable source, and I don't think there was ever a serious attempt to fact check it by the writer or publisher.
There are way more serious attempts to cover Bufalino, Hoffa et al I think.
Yeah, his claims were corroborated after he made them by investigating the Detroit house, in 2004. Other people claimed to have killed Hoffa but Sheeran was the only one of the FBI's suspects who came forward and talked about it, and he was considered a prime suspect when it happened. Sheeran's version of what happened to Hoffa just makes sense too. The FBI said Sheeran was "known to be in Detroit area at the time of JRH disappearance, and considered to be a close friend of JRH." We know Hoffa got in that car. Hoffa's son said Hoffa would only have gotten in that car with Frank and not the other suspects on the list. His daughter begged Sheeran to come forward about it in 1995. Sheeran perfectly descried the driving directions from the restaurant to the house, and the interior of the house. It makes sense he was killed in some random house. Blood was found in 2004 under the press-on vinyl floor that had been installed in the 80s and the blood pattern matched with Sheeran's story. It makes sense Hoffa was taken to an incinerator just a few minutes away where there would have been no trace of him, nothing grand or more attention grabbing like buried in cement or anything.
I was extremely skeptical at first but after looking into it I'm convinced Sheeran killed Hoffa like he said.
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I know the film was Hoffa-centric, but man the stuff that went down in the late 70's-80's centered around Harvey Keital's character sound insane . I noticed a lot of the mob dudes that had their fates laid out died during this period.
A little detail I noticed about Frank and Hoffa's relationship, they were so close Frank was 40 minutes late and Hoffa wasn't even mad.
What do you think Pesci was trying to say with the way he looked at deniro? I'm honestly curious.
Why is it striking? Because of all the white hands on the black mans hands?On the bolded - I did wonder what the film was saying on the subject. It certainly felt like the unions were shown as just another root of corruption run by mobsters and/or narcissists for their own personal benefit. On the other hand the film is saying this is true for all of America, including the president. Hoffa and the work he does at least gets acknowledged as being for the greater good, his dealings with the mob are justified as the bitter pill he must swallow to operate in this world. I think in some ways really, the film is suggesting the death of Hoffa was the death of organised labour as a real force in the US, which is presented to be a tragedy.
On a different note - I thought Scorsese overdid his use of slomow here (and Silence imo) but it did produce this shot which is one of the more striking images in the film:
i thought it was okay at best. 'silence' is still his best work from the last decade by a significant margin.
The shot with the black assassin shooting and all the white hands swarming him was fucking amazing.
just watched it, i liked, i think americans will love the filme because there's historical figures of the country there, so it more fun to see the plot tie to the history of their country. I had already seen that theme of the gangster that gets alone in the end before so thats nothing new, but its a well done movie. I think there's one plot hole or its not well explained, in the end he's alone, but that isnt how it works, he seemed to be high in the hierarchy, people wouldnt leave him there to die, the police tells him everyone died, but its clear by joe pesci that the mob is big with the higher ups related to the kennedy murder, so that plot point sounds weird that a powerfull mob like that everyone died and a man with that position he has is leaved to die alone.
but well, the ending works either way.
cool.
but well, the ending works either way.
cool.
He wasn't that high up, he was just a hitman as far as the mob went. Once he'd gone to jail, any of his trade union power went with it.
ok, but only by what the movie shows its not well explained, the movie even sugests otherwise with the ring scene saying he's important now and the talks after saying they are "bosses".
The scene at the end where Frank shows the nurse his photo of Jimmy Hoffa and she has no idea who he is really hit me. For better or worse the closest thing Frank has to a legacy was his role in killing of his friend, and even the impact of that has totally faded with time.
Simply incredible. There were so many little nuanced scenes that really hit me hard, the acting was great.
I wish this was a mini series it was so good and captivating. The time absolutely flew by and I will definitely re-watch this again soon.
I wish this was a mini series it was so good and captivating. The time absolutely flew by and I will definitely re-watch this again soon.
Really enjoyed the movie, but tbf, I found the fate of Frank not "that" sad. Of course, the film frames him that way but he is still living a rather comfortable life. His family might be estranged, his friends are dead and he is physically unwell - but that is also the situation of many non-criminals in his age. Also, he surely has a legacy in "his" world, I mean the whole idea is that civilians are not supposed to know about it. He surely is remembered by more people in the underworld than I will be by the general public when I go ;)
His children are also all still alive and well.
So yeah...the more I think about the Film, the more I think that Frank got a rather good ending in relation to the negative karma he must have built over the years.
His children are also all still alive and well.
So yeah...the more I think about the Film, the more I think that Frank got a rather good ending in relation to the negative karma he must have built over the years.
Def ban worthy right here, Pacino more than pulled his weight. Also, I'd take a violent early end vs. dying alone and isolated with no one around to love you like Frank did
This didn't do much for me at all. One of Scorsese's weaker efforts in my opinion. I didn't care about anything that was happening until his friendship with Hoffa developed and gets resolved. I forced myself to finish this
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I think it captures two of America's biggest issues, racism and gun violence. I don't think the film really addresses the former much but the image out of context encapsulates both those points. It also I think works as a reference to Taxi Driver and the association of that film with attempted political assassination.
It stood out to me. Especially in a 3 1/2 hour movie that is essentially minority free.
Good movie but honestly don't think i would watch it again. I didn't find the story that interesting compared to Casino or Goodfellas. And the amount of dark humor was a bit on the low side.
All 3 did a great job but Pacino was the highlight.
All 3 did a great job but Pacino was the highlight.
I loved it. Pesci was the star of the show. I loved seeing the perspective of Peggy and how she came to understand what her father did. I found it gripping for the entire 210 minutes.
The one scene that I didn't particularly care for and noticed DeNiro's age was the scene where he beats up the guy that pushed his daughter. The shot looked good up through the point where the guy crashes through the glass, but when Frank actually starts kicking him/stepping on his hand it looked straight-up bad. Most of the scenes involving violence/shootings were great, which is why that scene felt so out of place.
The one scene that I didn't particularly care for and noticed DeNiro's age was the scene where he beats up the guy that pushed his daughter. The shot looked good up through the point where the guy crashes through the glass, but when Frank actually starts kicking him/stepping on his hand it looked straight-up bad. Most of the scenes involving violence/shootings were great, which is why that scene felt so out of place.
man, this movie drags hard at moments, i mean it's nice to let a scene breathe and all, but damn.
pesci and pacino really carry the movie, deniro is great but he's the straight man here, the other two are just tearing through the whole fucking movie.
that said, the de-aging in this is super distracting, sometimes it looks fine, other times it yanked me right out, and made me wonder what the fuck was going on with deniro's face, some of the scenes his eyes are so overly blue it just looked ridiculous.
pesci and pacino really carry the movie, deniro is great but he's the straight man here, the other two are just tearing through the whole fucking movie.
that said, the de-aging in this is super distracting, sometimes it looks fine, other times it yanked me right out, and made me wonder what the fuck was going on with deniro's face, some of the scenes his eyes are so overly blue it just looked ridiculous.
Pretty much the only thing I liked in this movie was Pacino as Hoffa and the tension that builds prior to his killing. Didn't care about anything else. And would probably never watch again. Slog of a movie. I'm just so over these actors in gangster movies.
That only represented his close friendship with Bufalino. He was kind of a nobody in the grand scheme of things. A simple loyal goon who followed orders, close to both Hoffa and Bufalino.
It really took me out of the movie. It's extremely weird that THAT was the take they went with.
I dont understand why they didnt use a younger actor to do that scene. He looked like a mummy there.
There was also a glaring editing issue when Frank was on the phone with Jo after he killed Hoffa.
But flaws aside I thought it was a great movie. Amazing to see Pesci again.
just finished it. Wasn't really a fan. Feel likes theres a tighter movie about this story that could be told. It's weird because at it's length this movie feels like it rushes through a lot.
The cast is great in this. Pesci is easily the best thing about this movie. Just an amazing performance.
The cast is great in this. Pesci is easily the best thing about this movie. Just an amazing performance.
What's funny is that they had an actor playing a young Tommy in Goodfellas, and Jimmy introduces him to Henry as a younger man.
In this film, Russell meets Frank and calls him a kid.
Robert DeNiro must have some sort of clause that he has to play his character in every scene.
In this film, Russell meets Frank and calls him a kid.
Robert DeNiro must have some sort of clause that he has to play his character in every scene.
OP
OP
First of all, this movie has such a wonderful cast at its side. Incredible that Scorsese managed to get so many alumni together for one more acting showcase. All did great, but the big three were the obvious highlights.
Second of all, I ft the movie length dragged the movie to rank it below Goodfella and even The Departed with its awful final act. It's still a great film.
Second of all, I ft the movie length dragged the movie to rank it below Goodfella and even The Departed with its awful final act. It's still a great film.
No. Angelino is seen at the award ceremony.
Also they tell you his death when you first see him. I believe it was a shotgun to the head.
