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The New Zealand shooter’s manifesto shows how white nationalist rhetoric spreads

Oct 26, 2017
2,366
#1
Via Vox:
There is a lot we don’t yet know about what motivated the 28-year-old man charged with murder in a shooting that killed 49 people and injured at least 48 others in two mosques in Christchurch, New Zealand.

But his writings suggest that the white nationalist ideas behind violence and attempted violence in the United States and elsewhere influenced him deeply.
The shooter reportedly left behind a 74-page manifesto. It’s the kind of document instigators of mass violence often write to inspire copycat attackers (which is why I chose not to link to it).

Still, the document is worth understanding in context. There are throughlines in the manifesto that are similar to the ideas described by other shooters or those who have attempted shootings in recent cases in the United States and around the world.
The reason it’s important to both understand the Christchurch shooter’s manifesto and refuse to spread its contents without context is that a manifesto is a published and public declaration of intent or belief — and the critical term to remember is “public.” The Christchurch shooter wrote his manifesto with the clear intention of it being shared widely after he committed an act of mass murder.

That means that historically, terrorist manifestos have never been accurate documentation of either their belief system or the planning that went into their attacks. The main intention of terrorist manifestos is not to help everyday people understand how they became terrorists — it is to create new terrorists.
In this particular manifesto, the author is not attempting to provide a fully factual history of himself or his reasoning behind his actions. Much of the first 10 pages of the manifesto are the shooter responding to questions he’s posing to himself about who he is (“just an ordinary White man” and why he decided to kill (“to show the invaders that our lands will never be their lands, our homelands are our own and that, as long as a white man still lives, they will NEVER conquer our lands”). The manifesto intersperses details about why the shooter targeted New Zealand with self-aggrandizing rhetoric about the shooter’s own personal bravery.

And it’s also worth mentioning that a lot of the document is akin to what’s known as “shitposting” — intentionally throwing out red-meat content to readers to distract them or draw them deeper into the same online pits where he himself was radicalized.
While “shitposting” is a common thread in far-right online culture — meme-ing racism and anti-Semitism is how white supremacists hope to spread their ideology — jokey characteristics of the manifesto are in line with similar language used in older far-right groups as well.

In short, everything in the Christchurch shooter’s manifesto is what the Christchurch shooter wants us to know about him. Like Ted Kaczynski, the Unabomber who killed three people and injured 23 others in a nationwide bombing campaign from the 1970s to the 1990s, or even Adolf Hitler’s Mein Kampf, published in 1925, the point of these manifestos is not to be factual or realistic about the inner worlds of their authors. In Mein Kampf, Hitler portrays himself as a talented artist and lover of architecture. In Kaczynski’s manifesto, he portrays himself as a man profoundly concerned about the material problems of industrial society. Manifestos aren’t honest. Manifestos are for mass consumption.

But that doesn’t mean they aren’t useful for people who study terrorist movements, particularly white nationalism. Rather, connections between manifestos and the terrorists who write them — what they say, how they say it, and who they mention — tell us about the international flow of white nationalist ideology.

There's more at the link above. It's all fun and games. Until it's fucking not. We either deal with this before it gets worse and actually stop these shit heads from gathering and propagating their idiocy or we are all fucked. Lock if old.
 

ZiZ

Member
Oct 27, 2017
511
#3
why he decided to kill (“to show the invaders that our lands will never be their lands, our homelands are our own and that, as long as a white man still lives, they will NEVER conquer our lands”).
They aren't your lands, New Zealand was literally invaded and conquered by force.
 
Oct 30, 2017
451
#8
User Banned (3 Days): Inflammatory drive-by posting; multiple prior infractions
Breaking News: Man involved in act of poltical terrorism writes manifesto which is more or less an alright approximation of his movement's beliefs I guess

Join us later for our Pulitzer Prize winning segment on how water is wet and how we piss what we drink
 
Oct 26, 2017
2,221
#15
How sickening that Trump somehow managed to reignite the dormant? racism in the US after he became president and now it's becoming a worldwide thing. How I loath that orange toad and all of his followers.
 
Oct 26, 2017
3,700
Miami
#16


“Oh he’s just an ironic racist lol triggered Libs?”
I can still remember the threads where folks kept trying to argue that the whole upside-down OK sign was nothing but a figment of overactive imaginations.
How sickening that Trump somehow managed to reignite the dormant? racism in the US after he became president and now it's becoming a worldwide thing. How I loath that orange toad and all of his followers.
It wasn't dormant, just socially unacceptable. Trump has given people the cover to take their masks off.
 
Jul 11, 2018
1,137
Canada
#17
I can still remember the threads where folks kept trying to argue that the whole upside-down OK sign was nothing but a figment of overactive imaginations.

It wasn't dormant, just socially unacceptable. Trump has given people the cover to take their masks off.
I can also tell that the far right is growing in Canada, too.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,645
#18
Racism will never die as long as the rich elites keep telling poor whites that all their problems lie at the feet of PoCs and immigrants.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,347
#20
There's a very good point here I haven't seen in other takes: Even ignoring the shitposting elements, the goal of a manifesto is to inspire copycats. People need to stop acting like it's an accurate self-evaluation of his beliefs. That's not to say a murderer's manifesto isn't revealing, but we need to stop assuming we can use it for psyche evaluation.
 
Oct 27, 2017
531
#21
There's a very good point here I haven't seen in other takes: Even ignoring the shitposting elements, the goal of a manifesto is to inspire copycats. People need to stop acting like it's an accurate self-evaluation of his beliefs. That's not to say a murderer's manifesto isn't revealing, but we need to stop assuming we can use it for psyche evaluation.
Even if it was an accurate tool for understanding his psyche, what good does that do us?

The man is part of a movement that continues to be ignored and not seen as the threat that it is. Can you imagine a politician running on a platform that includes stomping out white supremacy? Not just as an implied goal but fully stated in the same way that all candidates must talk about islamic terrorism?

White supremacy is a global threat that needs to be handled and it is currently not being taken seriously. Yall better fucking believe ISIS will use this man's manifesto and shooting video as a recruiting tool. I seriously wont even be shocked if in the next 72 hours something happens. ISIS much like white supremacists rely on a 'self defense' narrative. This man is literally and unambiguously saying he is attacking Islam, directly justifying the existence of terrorist groups who claim they are protecting muslims by acting violently.
 
Jul 14, 2018
3,171
#22


“Oh he’s just an ironic racist lol triggered Libs?”
Look, he uses alt-right memes, hanged out on neo-nazi forums and spread white supremacist propaganda in his manifesto, but clearly that doesn't mean that it was a result of that culture. Because what kind of ridiculous person would think that normalizing hateful, violent speech under the excuse of memes could cause this.
 
May 30, 2018
324
#23
People are way too dismissive of Right wingers in general

These guys aren't memeing, this is their legit beliefs. Believe them when they say this is what they want

Anybody who dismissed the entire manifesto because he trolls occasionally in it is an example of how well their messaging game is

These guys will get the word out to anyone who sympathizes with them, while wording it in a way that makes it seem like they are just "owning the Libs"

See the OK sign as another example
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,741
#24
This dude is a logical result of this tactic. His manifesto and livestream were written and executed with the intent to inspire others to follow in his footsteps.
 
Oct 29, 2017
3,519
#25
People are way too dismissive of Right wingers in general

These guys aren't memeing, this is their legit beliefs. Believe them when they say this is what they want

Anybody who dismissed the entire manifesto because he trolls occasionally in it is an example of how well their messaging game is

These guys will get the word out to anyone who sympathizes with them, while wording it in a way that makes it seem like they are just "owning the Libs"

See the OK sign as another example
It' comes from the strange pollyanna way that many modern Americans view our country. "We beat bigotry, oppression and white supremacy long ago so these alt-righters have no real sway over our culture" "They're a dying breed and it's not worth getting up in a dander about them" "He/She is just some guy from YT or some Twitter celebrity or some flash in the pan. You really expect me to take guys like that seriously lol"

Many Americans particularly those in privilege are desperate to pretend their apathy and dismissal of the fears and concerns of minorities has zero impact on the rise of this culture. As long as the alt-right are just "trolls" and the violent ones are "lone wolves" who've mysteriously manifested their mindsets out of nowhere :/ then they can continue to be self satisfied in their privilege and ignorance and inaction. Those people who doubt the danger and potential of alt-right movements are also the same who like to shut down, silence and ignore the efforts of minorities to wake them out of their stupor. By not acknowledging the tangible threat of this current movement, they build and environment where they can sit self satisfied that they're the only "rational" people in the world. From their privilege they can pretend there's an equivalence between an unapologetic and loud fight for civil rights and the inherently violent, genocidal and destructive rhetoric preached by white nationalists. "LOL everybody is yelling at each other and I'm just here wondering why and how we could have possibly sunk so low as a country on both sides :("

So many of the US's problems are tied up in white supremacist politics yet they want to keep it at arms length because they know deep down that to peel away at what produces these people, it starts to become apparent how much their own apathy, inaction, ignorance and flippancy contributes to the real life consequences that marginalized people have to deal with.
 
Oct 27, 2017
103
#26
They aren't your lands, New Zealand was literally invaded and conquered by force.
Read about the Treaty of Waitangi and how it was abused if you want accurate information on the history of NZ.

I know it wasn't your intent, but your post implies that Maori were defeated by the crown in battle.
 
Nov 1, 2017
3,254
Boise
#27
The thread continues with examples from Wyndham Lewis which provides such a clear window into the soul of the racist and their almost compulsive need to troll and belittle (or trigger and meme in alt-right parlance) oppressed people.

They love to revel in the anger and sadness they bring out of people with lazy jokes about murder, rape, stereotypes etc while presenting themselves as unshakable and often scoff at attempts to get a rise out of them. But at the same time they obscure and mix their true beliefs and principals with these jokes. And what are their true beliefs? Ridiculous conspiracy mongering about how Jews and women and blacks and LGTBQ+ and Muslims are working to destroy straight white men and their superior western culture. Of course these conspiracies are more subterfuge to mask (even from themselves) the real issue driving their hatred - they are offended by different types people merely existing and daring to ask for anything more than subjugation. They hate other whites who don’t see the obvious (to them) cancer eating away their society. They of course were never above offense and disgust, they were driven by it from the start.

A single black person with a voice has more power to offend than every racist meme, every lib triggered YouTube compilation and the entirety of busy buzzing in fascist hives like 4/8chan, gab, Stormfront, right wing YouTube, Reddit etc etc.

So I take comfort that, I guess.


“Oh he’s just an ironic racist lol triggered Libs?”
Look at them tiny Drumpf-sized hands.
 
Last edited:
Nov 29, 2017
1,170
Chile
#28
I repeat, Chan culture needs to die. Get eradicated and burn the remnants.

Take down the chans, take down the deep web chan sites (since authorities can do that), and all strongly associated sites to chans must be eliminated.
 
Nov 16, 2017
305
#29
I’ll read as I usually do. (As I read serial killers interview, books about narcos , religions , politics etc..)
I try to understand how one individual can do something like this.
I see a lot of sub forum/ groups everywhere that were dark humour places where I had fun.
I think it’s possible to make a joke about everything if it’s not a propaganda of hidden awful ideas.
I can joke about everything even the real nasty stuffs that happened to me during my childhood.
But those groups have changed a lot during the last couples of years.
More racists jokes about colour people, Jews, Muslims...
Slowly but surely you can see the agenda behind all this.
I’m all for freedom of speech and all but sometimes I read stuffs posted by normal people online and I am shocked.
You can’t have a debate, everything is black or white, for or against.
I think we all have a responsibility to have let internet become the monster it is today .
 
Dec 10, 2017
1,624
#30
I’ll read as I usually do. (As I read serial killers interview, books about narcos , religions , politics etc..)
I try to understand how one individual can do something like this.
I see a lot of sub forum/ groups everywhere that were dark humour places where I had fun.
I think it’s possible to make a joke about everything if it’s not a propaganda of hidden awful ideas.
I can joke about everything even the real nasty stuffs that happened to me during my childhood.
But those groups have changed a lot during the last couples of years.
More racists jokes about colour people, Jews, Muslims...
Slowly but surely you can see the agenda behind all this.
I’m all for freedom of speech and all but sometimes I read stuffs posted by normal people online and I am shocked.
You can’t have a debate, everything is black or white, for or against.
I think we all have a responsibility to have let internet become the monster it is today .
A lot of us have been wanting to see all the vile places on the internet get shut down for a long time. None of us have the power to make that happen, so how are we all responsible?
 
Nov 16, 2017
305
#31
A lot of us have been wanting to see all the vile places on the internet get shut down for a long time. None of us have the power to make that happen, so how are we all responsible?
I want to be rich but I made nothing become rich.
It’s good to want a thing, it’s better to act.
Complaining doesn’t help.
Organise a petition to close a website, expose them.
Personally i’m An anti-religion activist.
Every day I fight proselytism everywhere I find it.
I fight for equal treatment of women at work.
For a race equality too. (No Asian or black people in 65 employees)
I confront my ennemies .
I’ve been banned from a lot of nationalist/religious forum for exposing the flaws in their beliefs. (Religious, racist and political)
I am all for debate even with the most stubborn case (I talked to imams, priests, rabbins, left, right, neo nazis, antifa, feminist etc...every extreme I could find)
I’m writing a book about the destruction of humanity by extremism and mostly religions.
It should be finished fist quarter of 2020.
I’ve seen and heard things that are sometimes funny, sometimes despicable.
Complaining in a forum doesn’t help.
Do something, even small but act!
Don’t simply reject but understand and fight!
(Not the violent way of course)
I hope my views on society could inspire more people to think as human beings than as Gay/straight/ black/white/left/right etc...
I’m some kind of utopist, I guess.
I finished reading the manifesto of NZ mass shooter.
It was interesting, he had strong beliefs, forged by biased experiences (you see what you want to see) and some lack of education.
I’m really interested about his view of Europe and particularly France (i’m French), how is vision is deformed from reality.
On a closing note, people should see the video and other from the other side.
To see the reality and be afraid and shocked.
Maybe it will help moving things in the gun control area.
I hope you understand what I meant.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,742
#32
I’ve seen people here say they visit 4chan for the memes. This is exactly how they rope you in. There are no “good parts” of these kinds of sites. Stop using that bullshit and call it what it is.
 
Nov 16, 2017
6,197
#34
I want to be rich but I made nothing become rich.
It’s good to want a thing, it’s better to act.
Complaining doesn’t help.
Organise a petition to close a website, expose them.
Personally i’m An anti-religion activist.
Every day I fight proselytism everywhere I find it.
I fight for equal treatment of women at work.
For a race equality too. (No Asian or black people in 65 employees)
I confront my ennemies .
I’ve been banned from a lot of nationalist/religious forum for exposing the flaws in their beliefs. (Religious, racist and political)
I am all for debate even with the most stubborn case (I talked to imams, priests, rabbins, left, right, neo nazis, antifa, feminist etc...every extreme I could find)
I’m writing a book about the destruction of humanity by extremism and mostly religions.
It should be finished fist quarter of 2020.
I’ve seen and heard things that are sometimes funny, sometimes despicable.
Complaining in a forum doesn’t help.
Do something, even small but act!
Don’t simply reject but understand and fight!
(Not the violent way of course)
I hope my views on society could inspire more people to think as human beings than as Gay/straight/ black/white/left/right etc...
I’m some kind of utopist, I guess.
I finished reading the manifesto of NZ mass shooter.
It was interesting, he had strong beliefs, forged by biased experiences (you see what you want to see) and some lack of education.
I’m really interested about his view of Europe and particularly France (i’m French), how is vision is deformed from reality.
On a closing note, people should see the video and other from the other side.
To see the reality and be afraid and shocked.
Maybe it will help moving things in the gun control area.
I hope you understand what I meant.
You write posts like a damn serial killer.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,347
#35
I want to be rich but I made nothing become rich.
It’s good to want a thing, it’s better to act.
Complaining doesn’t help.
Organise a petition to close a website, expose them.
Personally i’m An anti-religion activist.
Every day I fight proselytism everywhere I find it.
I fight for equal treatment of women at work.
For a race equality too. (No Asian or black people in 65 employees)
I confront my ennemies .
I’ve been banned from a lot of nationalist/religious forum for exposing the flaws in their beliefs. (Religious, racist and political)
I am all for debate even with the most stubborn case (I talked to imams, priests, rabbins, left, right, neo nazis, antifa, feminist etc...every extreme I could find)
I’m writing a book about the destruction of humanity by extremism and mostly religions.
It should be finished fist quarter of 2020.
I’ve seen and heard things that are sometimes funny, sometimes despicable.
Complaining in a forum doesn’t help.
Do something, even small but act!
Don’t simply reject but understand and fight!
(Not the violent way of course)
I hope my views on society could inspire more people to think as human beings than as Gay/straight/ black/white/left/right etc...
I’m some kind of utopist, I guess.
I finished reading the manifesto of NZ mass shooter.
It was interesting, he had strong beliefs, forged by biased experiences (you see what you want to see) and some lack of education.
I’m really interested about his view of Europe and particularly France (i’m French), how is vision is deformed from reality.
On a closing note, people should see the video and other from the other side.
To see the reality and be afraid and shocked.
Maybe it will help moving things in the gun control area.
I hope you understand what I meant.
I feel like I'm staring into a fractal when I read this post. Also fuck off with telling people to watch a video of kids being killed.
 
Nov 16, 2017
305
#36
I feel like I'm staring into a fractal when I read this post. Also fuck off with telling people to watch a video of kids being killed.
This is the reality, the news will cover it until the next political scandal or another tweet from trump and then it will be vague memory.
Don’t you think it will help to shock people to make things move?
I remember when the medias tried to destroy the poor teenagers who tried to change things after the mass shooting at their school in Florida.
When the nra said guns don’t Kill people.
For me it’s more disgusting than any video.
The world is hard , apathy is too common.
Believe me, if parents saw this , it will change a lot of minds.
And I don’t want children to die because people are forgetting and moving.
And when I said videos, I don’t talk only about mass shooting, I talk also about military bombing hospitals etc.
Violence has been well too hidden in the last decade.
It’s not cool in real life.
How can people understand if they don’t know what they are talking about.
And every law makers should see this first.
My opinion is strong but i’m On your side.
I don’t want this to happen anymore, anywhere for any reason.
 
Sep 9, 2018
118
#37
They aren't your lands, New Zealand was literally invaded and conquered by force.
Yeah that part lol. Is there any country on earth that hasn't been invaded and conquered multiple times since first settled? These "our rightful land" arguments are so weird.
 

Hey

Member
Feb 19, 2018
1,536
#39
I want to be rich but I made nothing become rich.
It’s good to want a thing, it’s better to act.
Complaining doesn’t help.
Organise a petition to close a website, expose them.
Personally i’m An anti-religion activist.
Every day I fight proselytism everywhere I find it.
I fight for equal treatment of women at work.
For a race equality too. (No Asian or black people in 65 employees)
I confront my ennemies .
I’ve been banned from a lot of nationalist/religious forum for exposing the flaws in their beliefs. (Religious, racist and political)
I am all for debate even with the most stubborn case (I talked to imams, priests, rabbins, left, right, neo nazis, antifa, feminist etc...every extreme I could find)
I’m writing a book about the destruction of humanity by extremism and mostly religions.
It should be finished fist quarter of 2020.
I’ve seen and heard things that are sometimes funny, sometimes despicable.
Complaining in a forum doesn’t help.
Do something, even small but act!
Don’t simply reject but understand and fight!
(Not the violent way of course)
I hope my views on society could inspire more people to think as human beings than as Gay/straight/ black/white/left/right etc...
I’m some kind of utopist, I guess.
I finished reading the manifesto of NZ mass shooter.
It was interesting, he had strong beliefs, forged by biased experiences (you see what you want to see) and some lack of education.
I’m really interested about his view of Europe and particularly France (i’m French), how is vision is deformed from reality.
On a closing note, people should see the video and other from the other side.
To see the reality and be afraid and shocked.
Maybe it will help moving things in the gun control area.
I hope you understand what I meant.
How is religion destruction for humanity ?
You see the thing is when bad people have religion believes the act they do always sticks with the religion and people almost always blame the whole religion for few people terrorism That's why people like you think they figured out "HuMAn dEsTRucTioN" code and can "InSPire tTH NeXt geNeRATion".
 
Oct 26, 2017
2,365
#41
I think the issue is when people like this find a “base” of operations where they can go and fester these memes or ideas.

Years and years ago I frequented a social forum where the focus was basically on life experiences and there was a guy there who would attempt to blame his issues on minorities through light mention and humor.

The modding was not heavy there but most of the regulars laughed at him, not with him, which sort of slowly discoraged him from visiting the site. By the time I left, I think he had been gone for a while. I think it would have turned out differently if they entertained his ideas, making excuses for them, rather than completely mock them.
 
Last edited:
Oct 26, 2017
3,062
Dunedin, New Zealand
#42
I can still remember the threads where folks kept trying to argue that the whole upside-down OK sign was nothing but a figment of overactive imaginations.
Lemme start with saying that it's very clear what that symbol means and has meant for at least a few years; white-nationalist shit. No arguing that. With that said, that symbol meant something very different when I was a kid decades ago and was a part of a stupid schoolyard "game" kids would play - so when I first saw a single use-case of a white-nationalist using it, I didn't understand that it had taken a new meaning. It took a couple of uses and seeing it in photos/news stories before it clicked with me that it had been co-opted. The point of my post being, I'm not surprised that some people thought that symbol meant something different before it became obvious that it was co-opted by the alt-right and white supremacists - it wasn't (at least in my case) in anyway trying to defend white nationalists, but not understanding that the symbol's meaning had changed drastically.
 
Oct 25, 2017
670
SoCal, US
#43
This is the reality, the news will cover it until the next political scandal or another tweet from trump and then it will be vague memory.
Don’t you think it will help to shock people to make things move?
I remember when the medias tried to destroy the poor teenagers who tried to change things after the mass shooting at their school in Florida.
When the nra said guns don’t Kill people.
For me it’s more disgusting than any video.
The world is hard , apathy is too common.
Believe me, if parents saw this , it will change a lot of minds.
And I don’t want children to die because people are forgetting and moving.
And when I said videos, I don’t talk only about mass shooting, I talk also about military bombing hospitals etc.
Violence has been well too hidden in the last decade.
It’s not cool in real life.
How can people understand if they don’t know what they are talking about.
And every law makers should see this first.
My opinion is strong but i’m On your side.
I don’t want this to happen anymore, anywhere for any reason.
I'm going to risk a shitpost/ban. But dude, can you type/post normally?
 
Oct 29, 2017
516
Japan
#45
I want to be rich but I made nothing become rich.
It’s good to want a thing, it’s better to act.
Complaining doesn’t help.
Organise a petition to close a website, expose them.
Personally i’m An anti-religion activist.
Every day I fight proselytism everywhere I find it.
I fight for equal treatment of women at work.
For a race equality too. (No Asian or black people in 65 employees)
I confront my ennemies .
I’ve been banned from a lot of nationalist/religious forum for exposing the flaws in their beliefs. (Religious, racist and political)
I am all for debate even with the most stubborn case (I talked to imams, priests, rabbins, left, right, neo nazis, antifa, feminist etc...every extreme I could find)
I’m writing a book about the destruction of humanity by extremism and mostly religions.
It should be finished fist quarter of 2020.
I’ve seen and heard things that are sometimes funny, sometimes despicable.
Complaining in a forum doesn’t help.
Do something, even small but act!
Don’t simply reject but understand and fight!
(Not the violent way of course)
I hope my views on society could inspire more people to think as human beings than as Gay/straight/ black/white/left/right etc...
I’m some kind of utopist, I guess.
I finished reading the manifesto of NZ mass shooter.
It was interesting, he had strong beliefs, forged by biased experiences (you see what you want to see) and some lack of education.
I’m really interested about his view of Europe and particularly France (i’m French), how is vision is deformed from reality.
On a closing note, people should see the video and other from the other side.
To see the reality and be afraid and shocked.
Maybe it will help moving things in the gun control area.
I hope you understand what I meant.
Uhhh yikes
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,815
Québec City
#46


“Oh he’s just an ironic racist lol triggered Libs?”
It's the first time I see this picture....this is the shooter I assume. And that fucking sign????????

The same you see all these alt right motherfuckers doing, this is starting to get dangerous. People pulling this shit should have police called on them.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,224
Chile
#47
I think that when reading these analyses and columns about how the terrorist's manifesto used trolling tactics and shitposting language isn't to think "well, he's just joking bro, he doesn't really believe in that!"

Because that's, IMO, the shallow, easy reading of these things. The point is about how these terrorists use such language to obscure their intentions and how they like to get "meta" to get different reactions from different people: to others like them, it's an exercise in amusement but also a signifier of kinship. They get off (and I wouldn't be surprised if literally in some cases) on getting a rise out of the people they consider inferior, in seeing them confused/searching for an explanation they know they won't get/incensed. They revel in causing such reactions from their enemies, in doing so, they're exactly like bullies - they laugh because the "other" doesn't get the joke and they never will. In a related reading, it's also definite "baiting", meant for people they consider to be sanctimonious hypocrites to be offended by, meant for the "SJW" and "PC" press to obsess about and derive meaning from when it's actually something they say to precisely incite those reactions. Again, they get off from that feeling of knowing their "enemy" will fall for such an "obvious trolling/baiting" because they see themselves as pranksters and the others don't get the joke.
Essentially, they think they're some sort of real life Heath Ledger-Joker.

But the meta thing comes to play because despite their intention to frustrate and get a rise of out people they hate, it's also meant to reveal, through careful examination, that they do believe a lot of these things they post about. They coat it in smugness and dark humor so they have plausible deniablity when cornered ("it's just a prank bro, don't take it seriously, it's obviously exaggerated and only a SJW cuck like you would think it's serious") but they have more than just a single grain of truth so that people who think alike feel like they're part of a community of similar minded people. It's a coded language that sets them apart.

That's what's insidious about it, and how it can both lead to dead ends from a certain perspective (the "SJW/PC" press) but also a horribly deep rabbit (hell)hole from other (the potential channer-bro who can get radicalized from spending time in such a community)
 
Jun 10, 2018
1,120
#48
Lemme start with saying that it's very clear what that symbol means and has meant for at least a few years; white-nationalist shit. No arguing that. With that said, that symbol meant something very different when I was a kid decades ago and was a part of a stupid schoolyard "game" kids would play - so when I first saw a single use-case of a white-nationalist using it, I didn't understand that it had taken a new meaning. It took a couple of uses and seeing it in photos/news stories before it clicked with me that it had been co-opted. The point of my post being, I'm not surprised that some people thought that symbol meant something different before it became obvious that it was co-opted by the alt-right and white supremacists - it wasn't (at least in my case) in anyway trying to defend white nationalists, but not understanding that the symbol's meaning had changed drastically.
Yeah it's also part of some dumb "made you look" game/meme that can be funny sometimes.

But in the context of neo-Nazis doing it, they're emulating Trump's dumb gestures and gaslighting anyone who calls them out.
 
Oct 30, 2017
447
#49
Ugh... I hate to even add to this thread but i hate the attention we keep giving these people. Allow the FBI to analyze all of his hateful rhetoric.

I literally cant escape seeing his picture and i cant escape hearing his thoughts. I wish the mods would lock all these threads about him or condense everything into a single one.

Let's celebrate the victims.
 

plagiarize

Yearning to breathe free
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
6,152
Cape Cod, MA
#50
They aren't your lands, New Zealand was literally invaded and conquered by force.
I think that's one of the parts that offends me the most. An Australian racist talks about New Zealand as if it's 'his' land, of course what he means by that, is that it's a land that belongs to white people. And that's a whole other offensive suggestion to unpick.

I'm glad to see more people taking notice of these festering communities, and I'm unsurprised, yet saddened, to see people on the right trying to shut down any discussion about *how* this stuff is festering and *what* is feeding it.

For people that genuinely aren't comfortable with these discussions, and trust me, I understand why this stuff is beyond distasteful for some, please, step away, take care of your own mental health.

But we these discussions need to take place if we want to have any hope of defending ourselves from what's happening in the darkest corners of the internet. We can't pretend they don't exist, and the more harsh light shone into them, the more will be done about them.