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OmegaDL50

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,653
Philadelphia, PA
Are PSUs something I should "upgrade" with time even if I don't need the extra power?

I've been using a Corsair TX750 since my i5-750 days, and never had a PSU-related issue. I'm now running a 2500k with a 970, and am planning to upgrade before September to a Ryzen 5 or 7 (either the current 2000 ones or the new 3000 - depends on the pricing here in Brazil), and maybe a new GPU (didn't really decide which one, but nothing too fancy as I'm still going with 1080p).

Should I start looking for PSUs as well? A modular one feels is tempting for cable management, but I'd rather spend the money somewhere else.

A lot of people undervalue the importance of a quality power supply. Keep in mind this is the sole component that provides electricity to your entire system. Also in the inverse a cheap power supply can lead to potentially catastrophic failure.

A failed video card or ram cannot take out the rest of your equipment. A failed PSU however can kill your motherboard, ram, gpu, and anything else plugged into.

Highly rated power supplies typically are built to last (check out anything manufactured by SeaSonic or Superflower for quality units). A good quality PSU can last for many years, but like all things they eventually deteriorate and the capacitors on them can fail after prolonged use.

Your Corsair TX750 is a Seasonic manufactured unit if you aren't aware. I typically don't keep a PSU any longer than 5 years. 7 years is pushing it a bit. I would definitely consider looking into a replacement rather than the alternative of just waiting for it die on it's own and the potential ramifications that entails.
 

xtwo

Member
Oct 26, 2017
42
so i already have gtx 1080ti and can get rtx 2080(gigabyte oc gaming for $500 new. should i buy it or not?
 

MMBosstones86

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,174
My second M.2 drive came yesterday so I can finally remove my HD cage from the case! whew, so much more space. the "last" upgrade I'll do is replace the case but really am in no rush until I can find something that checks all the boxes.

Really excited to no longer have a mechanical HD.
 

Serpens007

Well, Tosca isn't for everyone
Moderator
Oct 31, 2017
8,124
Chile
Currently I have a 1060 6gb, playing on a 1080p60 LED and considering a new monitor to last a while (with future possible upgrades in mind). Considering this, would it be better a 1080/144hz (freesync) or a 4K/60 monitor? I mean I know that the card isn't really for either of them, but the idea is to have a good enough experience now and that the monitor will be kept in use as the PC improves.
 

Skai

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,172
Are there any new high end monitors releasing soonish? I have had this Acer Predator X34 for almost 4 years now and would like something better.
 

Wraith

Member
Jun 28, 2018
8,892
Currently I have a 1060 6gb, playing on a 1080p60 LED and considering a new monitor to last a while (with future possible upgrades in mind). Considering this, would it be better a 1080/144hz (freesync) or a 4K/60 monitor? I mean I know that the card isn't really for either of them, but the idea is to have a good enough experience now and that the monitor will be kept in use as the PC improves.
I don't know what you're planning for your next card (what you could expect out of it at 4K). But even the 1060 6GB you have now can benefit from higher framerates at 1080p (even if most games won't be hitting 144fps on Ultra).
 

Serpens007

Well, Tosca isn't for everyone
Moderator
Oct 31, 2017
8,124
Chile
I don't know what you're planning for your next card (what you could expect out of it at 4K). But even the 1060 6GB you have now can benefit from higher framerates at 1080p (even if most games won't be hitting 144fps on Ultra).

I mean here's the thing, I'm playing stuff from last gen up to newer titles like Battlefield V. So I play and downsample from 4K and at 1080p depending on the title. But I guess I could downsample and also get higher framerates too
 
Oct 29, 2017
13,478
Anyone have experience on "Open Box" parts on Newegg?

I am not talking about used or refurbished, but just parts labeled as "Open Box"

I've read some open testimonials over at Overclockers.net on a few open box motherboards. I can get an Gigabyte Aorus Master for $160, which normally costs $300.

One point it sounds too good to be true and in another point I'm worried about missing accessories, most importantly the I/O shield. I'm sure I could probably get replacements but the biggest thing is this stuff is supposed to be tested and guaranteed to work. So I'm not too entirely concerned about receiving a dud.
I would risk it with other parts, but with a Mobo I am worried someone bent some pins, and then returned it. So even if it posts I can't use all ram slots or something.
It's probably Okay, but check those pins right away just in case.
 

RatskyWatsky

Are we human or are we dancer?
Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,931
Depends on the case and cooler. I can see why doing some low profile coolers with the mobo outside of the case may be necessary for small for factor cases, but in most situations coolers will be on the way and you may not be able to screw the motherboard into the case, same for GPUs, plus the added weight complicates the operation.

I may put first the PSU and some fans in the case to help me plan the cable routes, but I only put the small components like the CPU, M.2 ssds, and RAM on the motherboard before installing it in the case. If your cooler requires you to install a back plate then that's also easier done while the mobo is not on the case, but do not install the cooler (air or AIO) unless it is a small air cooler, and for sure not the GPU.

It's usually easier to install the cpu, cpu cooler, and ram outside of the case. The graphics card is usually the last thing I install after the motherboard and everything else is installed into the case, since it is easiest to install but can also block sata ports and other connectors that you need to get to. Plug in the cpu fan before installing the motherboard inside the case, as well as the 4 or 8 pin cpu power cable. It can be really hard to plug the cpu fan and cpu power cables once the motherboard is installed.

My process:

CPU + Heatsink, RAM installed to motherboard outside the case. Sit it on motherboard box, using provided foam if possible.

Install Video card, hook up power supply still outside case. Boot it, run tests (observe HW Monitor in BIOS, boot Memtest86 and let it run for hours).

Remove video card.

If Power supply is modular, unplug from the PSU end and leave main power cables connected to motherboard. If not, disconnect power cables. Power cables are a pain in the ass to connect to motherboard once it's in the case, especially the top corner one(s). The cables will have to be disconnected at one end or the other if you want any sort of neat routing, so plan / execute that now.

Fit board in case, screw it down. Attach case front panel connectors, case fans etc.

Reinstall video card, + any other things like disk drives.

Power it up again, run tests again! you're done congrats! proceed to Windows or whatever.

Thanks for the perspectives y'all!
 

Wraith

Member
Jun 28, 2018
8,892
Walmart has some Ryzen deals at the moment:
  • Ryzen 3 2200G - $80 (same on Amazon)
  • Ryzen 5 2400G - $120
  • Ryzen 5 2600 - $145
  • Ryzen 5 2600x - $160 (EDIT - Amazon how has this price as well)
  • Ryzen 7 2700 - $190
  • Ryzen 7 2700x - $280 (same on Amazon)
Also (maybe?) includes codes for Division 2 Gold Edition and World War Z (except with the 2200G).
EDIT - Not 100% sure Walmart gets the codes. They're advertised in the listing, but some reviews mention not getting codes for other promotions, and Walmart isn't listed here.
 
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RatskyWatsky

Are we human or are we dancer?
Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,931
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DigitalTravis

Member
Oct 28, 2017
290
I just made one of the biggest PC upgrades ever without realizing it would be so huge. I went from an OG Logitech MX518 (not new but circa 2009) to a Logitech G903. I almost went for a G Pro for weight but I don't play enough twitch shooters to lose the desktop niceties the 903 has. Plus I have huge hands so I don't mind the size and weight.

I am sure it's honeymoon phase but it's a freaking revelation. Now I want a new keyboard. I am looking at some options and the Corsair K63 TKL wireless is catching my eye. I have a Logitech G15 which is equally old. Maybe older. For $50-100 what do you guys think?
 

RatskyWatsky

Are we human or are we dancer?
Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,931
Z370 is still a 2018 release, any of Intel's 8th and 9th series CPUs will work, but seem's like the price isn't very competitive even compared to MSI's newer model.
Or some of Gigabyte's models like the Z390 UD and Z390 Gaming X.

Gotcha. And are MSI's newer model and the two Gigabyte models that you mentioned all more or less the same? And would they work with Ryzen or are they primarily geared towards Intel?
 
Oct 29, 2017
13,478
Gotcha. And are MSI's newer model and the two Gigabyte models that you mentioned all more or less the same? And would they work with Ryzen or are they primarily geared towards Intel?
They are comparable, except that The Gaming X is a bit better than the other. They are intel 8th gen and 9th gen only.

For Ryzen you are looking into B450 or X470 boards.
For around that same price, the MSI B450 Gaming Pro Carbon AC, X470 GAMING PLUS
 

Aztechnology

Community Resettler
Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
14,134
Walmart has some Ryzen deals at the moment:
  • Ryzen 3 2200G - $80 (same on Amazon)
  • Ryzen 5 2400G - $120
  • Ryzen 5 2600 - $145
  • Ryzen 5 2600x - $160
  • Ryzen 7 2700 - $190
  • Ryzen 7 2700x - $280 (same on Amazon)
Also includes codes for Division 2 Gold Edition and World War Z (except with the 2200G).
EDIT - Not 100% sure Walmart gets the codes. They're advertised in the listing, but some reviews mention not getting codes for other promotions, and Walmart isn't listed here.
Pinging this. Great prices especially with the games.
 

inner-G

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
14,473
PNW
Putting together a system for someone tonight. It booted up, no video. Caps lock lights worked on PS2 keyboard. I tried RAM slot by slot, reseated the cooler, checked all the pins, tried a different GPU, unhooked all the SATA devices, pulled the CMOS, still nothing.


... the fucking HDMI cable wasn't plugged in on the TV end. It was fine the whole time. FML I'm going to bed lol
 

Bishop89

What Are Ya' Selling?
Member
Oct 25, 2017
34,535
Melbourne, Australia
https://www.jbhifi.com.au/computers...vilion-15-bc419tx-15-gaming-laptop-i5/342563/

https://www.jbhifi.com.au/computers...lion-15-bc440tx-15-6-gaming-laptop-i7/342572/

Which laptop should I get?

From what I can tell they are exactly the same, the only differences is one is i5 + 8gb, the other i7 + 16gb.

Dunno if the differences are worth $300 or not.

I probably won't be using it much for gaming despite it being a "gaming" laptop, but for the price range they seem beefier than the regular hp laptops.

I will use it for general browsing, youtube, probably some light gaming, but I want to get into photoshop and animation, photography, and might eventually get into indie type game development and 3d modeling.
 

Deleted member 16136

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,196
Damn this 9700K is a toasty beast, my Noctua NH-U9S was able to cool my 3770K brilliantly and keep temps well even in Prime95, but the 9700K in Prime95 starts reaching 100c a few seconds in (although I think its running some new things, as I saw more options on the list, might have updated since I did it on the 3770K). Seems to reach 80-85c in gaming, but the fan certainly is working harder than it used to.

Guess that's what I get going mini ITX with the case I currently have. Nice seeing the grassy areas in Crysis 3 being laughed at with 60+ FPS easily now. Far Cry New Dawn still stutters (if only slightly less noticeable), but runs around 100 FPS (cant believe they have the cheek to blame peoples systems for the stutter).

Am I right in thinking the advertised Turbo Clock (4.9Ghz) is only for when 1 core is used, and 4.6Ghz when all cores are in use? Not sure how accurate windows task manager is, but when running some stuff in the background I see it clearly sticks around 4.6Ghz.

Also learning about Multi Core Enhancement in the bios, which can allow all cores to go full turbo boost, but with me having a mini ITX system I dont want to cook this up any further, so turned it off (was on auto before), wise move?
 

Gaming_Groove

Member
Apr 4, 2018
2,813
Damn this 9700K is a toasty beast, my Noctua NH-U9S was able to cool my 3770K brilliantly and keep temps well even in Prime95, but the 9700K in Prime95 starts reaching 100c a few seconds in (although I think its running some new things, as I saw more options on the list, might have updated since I did it on the 3770K). Seems to reach 80-85c in gaming, but the fan certainly is working harder than it used to.

Guess that's what I get going mini ITX with the case I currently have. Nice seeing the grassy areas in Crysis 3 being laughed at with 60+ FPS easily now. Far Cry New Dawn still stutters (if only slightly less noticeable), but runs around 100 FPS (cant believe they have the cheek to blame peoples systems for the stutter).

Am I right in thinking the advertised Turbo Clock (4.9Ghz) is only for when 1 core is used, and 4.6Ghz when all cores are in use? Not sure how accurate windows task manager is, but when running some stuff in the background I see it clearly sticks around 4.6Ghz.

Also learning about Multi Core Enhancement in the bios, which can allow all cores to go full turbo boost, but with me having a mini ITX system I dont want to cook this up any further, so turned it off (was on auto before), wise move?

You understand it correctly.

https://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/3077-explaining-coffee-lake-turbo-8700k-8600k

Also, the 3770k is rated at a 77W TDP while the 9700k is rated at 95W, and Intel has been engaging in some funny business with their TDP ratings lately as well, so I'm not surprised to hear that your cooler is struggling with it. MCE off is probably best practice in an ITX system with that particular cooler.
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,531
15-35 more business days for my GPU to be repaired/replaced (hopefully the former, it's already on day 11). Goddamn computer part warranties are fucking *abysmal*
 

apathetic

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,722
I just made one of the biggest PC upgrades ever without realizing it would be so huge. I went from an OG Logitech MX518 (not new but circa 2009) to a Logitech G903.

I've been stuck on my g700 for lifetimes now. Would like a new good optical mouse but have gotten so use to all the buttons/feel of the g700 that it's hard to change to anything else.
 

CreepingFear

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
16,766
Putting together a system for someone tonight. It booted up, no video. Caps lock lights worked on PS2 keyboard. I tried RAM slot by slot, reseated the cooler, checked all the pins, tried a different GPU, unhooked all the SATA devices, pulled the CMOS, still nothing.


... the fucking HDMI cable wasn't plugged in on the TV end. It was fine the whole time. FML I'm going to bed lol
If it makes you feel any better, I had a situation where I couldn't use my credit card to purchase Blizzard products, but I could use pay pal. I got off a Blizzard support chat last night and basically bailed out without saying good bye. Turns out, it was a combination of my third party cookies being blocked and my Private Internet Access VPN browser extension. I had already cleared out the cache and everything else. Sorry, Blizzard GM!
 

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
56,887
Walmart has some Ryzen deals at the moment:
  • Ryzen 3 2200G - $80 (same on Amazon)
  • Ryzen 5 2400G - $120
  • Ryzen 5 2600 - $145
  • Ryzen 5 2600x - $160
  • Ryzen 7 2700 - $190
  • Ryzen 7 2700x - $280 (same on Amazon)
Also includes codes for Division 2 Gold Edition and World War Z (except with the 2200G).
EDIT - Not 100% sure Walmart gets the codes. They're advertised in the listing, but some reviews mention not getting codes for other promotions, and Walmart isn't listed here.
Damn, that 2700x is a great deal with the two games.
 

Wraith

Member
Jun 28, 2018
8,892
Damn, that 2700x is a great deal with the two games.
I should note what I said in my edit - while the listing mentions the two games, Walmart isn't listed as one of the sellers on AMD's promotion page, and some reviews mention not getting codes in the past. So... I don't know if buyers get the games and some people had problems, or if nobody buying from Walmart gets them.
 

Deleted member 16136

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,196
You understand it correctly.

https://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/3077-explaining-coffee-lake-turbo-8700k-8600k

Also, the 3770k is rated at a 77W TDP while the 9700k is rated at 95W, and Intel has been engaging in some funny business with their TDP ratings lately as well, so I'm not surprised to hear that your cooler is struggling with it. MCE off is probably best practice in an ITX system with that particular cooler.

Yeah, looking around the web I can see people saying the TDP gets a bit nutty with turbo boost going on. Not really sure what else I can do without changing to a bigger case and sticking a big ass cooler on it. Case I currently have doesn't actually have a front panel fan (nowhere to put one) so I guess the 9700K ain't to be for this case. Might go back to a BitFenix prodigy, lots of room but bigger than i'd like.
 

TheMink

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,908
Connecticut
I got my 2080ti Water-cooled which has a separate fan and I have not one idea how to mount this thing hahaha, do I buy something?

Also do I need to get a vertical mount for this graphics card? It doesn't looks too heavy. Probably because the fan is separated?

Edit:

I did it!
 
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TheMink

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,908
Connecticut
DP: I got my brother a 2080ti as well for his wedding, and I thought my brothers case was the same as mine but it turns out there is no way I can install the 2080ti in his cause of the way its formatted. Any recommendations for a new case?
 

OmegaDL50

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,653
Philadelphia, PA
I would risk it with other parts, but with a Mobo I am worried someone bent some pins, and then returned it. So even if it posts I can't use all ram slots or something.
It's probably Okay, but check those pins right away just in case.

Well Newegg does have a disclaimer that open box parts are tested work. So I would assume that would mean it's working before they sell it.

Thankfully that particular motherboard I/O shield is built into the motherboard itself.

I am still undecided if I want a 9900k or a 9700k. I mean sure the hyperthreading is nice, but I don't think I'll run into any cases in which 16 threads will be necessary even for video editing or streaming.

The very last part I'm going to get is the GPU. I do want to get the CPU and PSU as soon as possible to test the motherboard within that 30 day return window. So I do have a grace period in the case something goes south.

PSU acquired, and my updated build so far - https://pcpartpicker.com/list/N6VQr6
 
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Oct 29, 2017
13,478
DP: I got my brother a 2080ti as well for his wedding, and I thought my brothers case was the same as mine but it turns out there is no way I can install the 2080ti in his cause of the way its formatted. Any recommendations for a new case?
Everyone that has them seem to really like their Lian li PC-O11 Dynamic. But that won't work unless he has a AIO cooler for the CPU because the heigh clearance is tight.

In term of practical cases that may work for most people and fit plenty, Phanteks p600s, Fractal Design Define/Meshify S2 series ( mesh front, glass front, etc the internals are the same), Cooler Master H500p mesh.

Less expensive cases; Cooler Master H500, the regular Fractal Design meshify (not as long so can be conflict between long GPU and radiator in front), the trusty Corsair Air 540.
 

RatskyWatsky

Are we human or are we dancer?
Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,931
They are comparable, except that The Gaming X is a bit better than the other. They are intel 8th gen and 9th gen only.

For Ryzen you are looking into B450 or X470 boards.
For around that same price, the MSI B450 Gaming Pro Carbon AC, X470 GAMING PLUS

This https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07F7W5KJS/ref=psdc_1048424_rv_t1_B07BYY16V7?th=1

seems like a better value than

this https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07F85YKLJ/ref=psdc_1048424_rv_t1_B07BYY16V7?th=1

no? Like the latter has "DDR4 Boost with Steel Armor", whatever that is, but apart from that they seem pretty much identical? (there's also rgb which I don't really want)

And what about this one https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07F85YW8R/ref=psdc_1048424_rv_t1_B07BYY16V7?th=1 ?
 

Chronite

Member
Oct 25, 2017
30
All my components arrived today. Can't wait to start assembling everything. Going to be carrying over my EVGA 1080ti SC2 from my current build. I also saw a deal for the 2TB Intel 660p m.2 NVMe drive for $185 on Newegg so I placed an order for one. Should make a good Steam drive.

VhjxvOO.jpg


Final build: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/v6mHCb
 
Oct 29, 2017
13,478
This https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07F7W5KJS/ref=psdc_1048424_rv_t1_B07BYY16V7?th=1

seems like a better value than

this https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07F85YKLJ/ref=psdc_1048424_rv_t1_B07BYY16V7?th=1

no? Like the latter has "DDR4 Boost with Steel Armor", whatever that is, but apart from that they seem pretty much identical? (there's also rgb which I don't really want)

And what about this one https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07F85YW8R/ref=psdc_1048424_rv_t1_B07BYY16V7?th=1 ?

The Gaming Pro Carbon has a few extra features that the Tomahawk lacks, like integrated wifi, an audio AMP with a better sound chip (Realtek ALC1220 on the Pro Carbon vs Realtek ALC892 on the Tomahawk), an aditional M.2 port (but I would suspect some part of the price difference may be the RGB). Physically it is closer to the X470 Gaming Plus, but without the X470 features( SLI) and with and added wifi module. (edit the X470 Gaming Plus seems to also have the Realtek ALC892).

The Tomahawk is perfectly fine though. VRM seems to be just as good.
The A-Pro seems to be the same as the Tomhawk just with different ports, lighting and aesthetics.
 
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sandboxgod

Attempting to circumvent a ban with an alt
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,919
Austin, Texas
What the heck I watched that Linus Tech Tips video and apparently a really good Cooler is better than an AIO? I'll keep that in mind in the future.

Decided to take a chance on that open box motherboard. Worst case some of the accessories are missing like a few sata cables, I can replace those. As long as the I/O shield isn't missing I should be okay.

Here is what my build looks like so far.

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/2DCvXP

That's a top end motherboard too. I can see a mobo being a little less risky since apparently they mostly either work or they dont from what I've been reading.

All my components arrived today. Can't wait to start assembling everything. Going to be carrying over my EVGA 1080ti SC2 from my current build. I also saw a deal for the 2TB Intel 660p m.2 NVMe drive for $185 on Newegg so I placed an order for one. Should make a good Steam drive.

VhjxvOO.jpg


Final build: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/v6mHCb

good luck opening that i9-9900k cube it took me over 30 mins the first time lmao. Looks good though. Wheres the case?
 

Chronite

Member
Oct 25, 2017
30
What the heck I watched that Linus Tech Tips video and apparently a really good Cooler is better than an AIO? I'll keep that in mind in the future.



That's a top end motherboard too. I can see a mobo being a little less risky since apparently they mostly either work or they dont from what I've been reading.



good luck opening that i9-9900k cube it took me over 30 mins the first time lmao. Looks good though. Wheres the case?
You weren't kidding. Why the hell couldn't they have just used a normal box?? I'm going to use the Fractal Design Meshify S2 as my new case (big box behind other parts).
 

sandboxgod

Attempting to circumvent a ban with an alt
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,919
Austin, Texas
You weren't kidding. Why the hell couldn't they have just used a normal box?? I'm going to use the Fractal Design Meshify S2 as my new case (big box behind other parts).
not sure if you are being sarcastic or something. Not sure what you mean

edit- LMAO Now I know what you mean!!!!! Yep its like a little theft proof vault.
edit 2 - post a pic of your build when it's done I want to see! Try to quote me too so I can get an alert or something
 
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Bishop89

What Are Ya' Selling?
Member
Oct 25, 2017
34,535
Melbourne, Australia
https://www.jbhifi.com.au/computers...vilion-15-bc419tx-15-gaming-laptop-i5/342563/

https://www.jbhifi.com.au/computers...lion-15-bc440tx-15-6-gaming-laptop-i7/342572/

Which laptop should I get?

From what I can tell they are exactly the same, the only differences is one is i5 + 8gb, the other i7 + 16gb.

Dunno if the differences are worth $300 or not.

I probably won't be using it much for gaming despite it being a "gaming" laptop, but for the price range they seem beefier than the regular hp laptops.

I will use it for general browsing, youtube, probably some light gaming, but I want to get into photoshop and animation, photography, and might eventually get into indie type game development and 3d modeling.
Anyone?
 

Bishop89

What Are Ya' Selling?
Member
Oct 25, 2017
34,535
Melbourne, Australia
Here's a comparison of those two processors.
https://www.notebookcheck.net/8750H-vs-8300H_9576_9570.247596.0.html
Doesn't seem that big of a difference. You can still open it and upgrade the HDD for a 1TB SSD and RAM to 16GB, that's probably a better sweet spot for around the same price in the end.
Thanks. I was reading the link you sent me and wasn't sure if this is something to worry about. Are these considered "big" laptops?


Intel specifies the TDP with 45 watts and therefore the i5 is only suited for big laptops with good cooling solutions.
 

Theiea

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,574
I feel like an idiot, and I need help.

Upgraded to a MSI Tomahawk B450/Ryzen 5 2600x. I have everything working fine, except my front and rear case fans. I can't find a place to plug them in on the motherboard. All the plugs on the mobo are 4 pins, and the case fan plugs only have 3 holes.
 
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