The Promised Neverland |OT| Minerva's Den

Oct 26, 2017
3,118
Chapter released and wtf.

It's really Norman! What the fuck. Guess Posuka has trouble drawing teenagers. :P Ray was also way more mature than before in this chapter and it worked out then. Still think that Norman was experimented on and I am interested in what the demons really are. Maybe they eat human brains to evolve into humans?
 
Oct 26, 2017
254
Phew, glad I didn't have to wait until the weekend.

It'd make a much interesting and gut-wrenching story for it to be a Norman clone, but I'm glad he wasn't. The trio is united once again, gotta protect these three. I got a wee bit emotional, haha.

Judging from how Nous talks to Nouma after devouring her brain, I guess demons gained human characteristics and intelligence from eating human brains. Would explain why they wait 6 years at least before shipping out the kids for slaughter - they would have learned enough by then. The higher status a demon has, the bigger and better brain they get, the greater skills they gain. I wonder where that leaves the low-grade mass produced 'cattle' then.

They did say in Goldy Pond they're restricted to a number of kills, so they would need a constant supply to retain their abilities. Maybe they revert back to wild demons, the ones encountered in the forest, if they don't constantly feed on human brains?

Please, make Normam as a traitor :D
No need to be so cruel TTATT)
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,200
CT
Phew, glad I didn't have to wait until the weekend.

It'd make a much interesting and gut-wrenching story for it to be a Norman clone, but I'm glad he wasn't. The trio is united once again, gotta protect these three. I got a wee bit emotional, haha.

Judging from how Nous talks to Nouma after devouring her brain, I guess demons gained human characteristics and intelligence from eating human brains. Would explain why they wait 6 years at least before shipping out the kids for slaughter - they would have learned enough by then. The higher status a demon has, the bigger and better brain they get, the greater skills they gain. I wonder where that leaves the low-grade mass produced 'cattle' then.

They did say in Goldy Pond they're restricted to a number of kills, so they would need a constant supply to retain their abilities. Maybe they revert back to wild demons, the ones encountered in the forest, if they don't constantly feed on human brains?



No need to be so cruel TTATT)
That can’t be right

we met the religious demons who don’t ear (farm) meat. If you needed to keep eating brains to keep your human traits they wouldn’t work.
 
Oct 26, 2017
254
That can’t be right

we met the religious demons who don’t ear (farm) meat. If you needed to keep eating brains to keep your human traits they wouldn’t work.
Oh wow, for how much the big guy's intention disturbed me then, I completely forgot about him and Mujika. You're right, these two wouldn't be as charming if the theory was true whoops

Chapter released and wtf.

It's really Norman! What the fuck. Guess Posuka has trouble drawing teenagers. :P Ray was also way more mature than before in this chapter and it worked out then. Still think that Norman was experimented on and I am interested in what the demons really are. Maybe they eat human brains to evolve into humans?
His proportions keep changing from one panel to the next, even his face is inconsistent. I do think he did have a decent growth spurt, helped by those pills he was given each morning. The other children suffered from growth of some body parts, some head, others torso. Adam got kinda lucky that his whole body grew.
 
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Oct 25, 2017
1,593
About what's about to be dropped, my theory and what has been said by other users, really:
Demons eat humans to gain intelligence, and when a human eat demons... They gain strength but lose sanity/intelligence. And I kind of doubt it really is Norman, maybe a clone? Adam mumbled numbers that can easily be mistaken when he saw Norman
 
Oct 26, 2017
254

With the anime airing, the trio is finally getting figures. I know I wouldn't be able to resist if Nendoroid of the three ever came out
 
Oct 26, 2017
3,118
I don't know about Norman. He seems like a villain and I think he hides something. Also there will be a big conflict with Emma and him. Emma knows that there are demons that hold back on eating humans. The question is, do Mujika and Sonju eat humans that rarely or other demons so they can hold their form?
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,980
Well, this is genius. I knew we’d have a Norman vs Emma in the end, but never thought Emma would be the one that would “defend” the demons.

Genocidal Norman is kinda fucked up.
 
Oct 25, 2017
12,162
Three possibilities:
1. This is all a bullshit asspull from the author.
2. This is all a lie.
3. Musica/guy whose name I forget are liars.

Not sure which is most likely.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,980
It would be an asspull if 2 or 3 are not true. Because it would clearly contradict other shit in the series.
The Musica stuff? i don’t get it. That’s the only “contradiction” and we barely knew those characters. There must be more explanations, and that’s probably one of the points Emma will present to Norman now. It’s a bit soon to be calling anything here an “asspull”.
 
Dec 28, 2018
353
Norman confirmed to have played the genocide route of Undertale. Pretty interesting chapter overall and I’m sensing some drama starting to brew between Emma and Norman.
So either Musica is some sort of special demon or is a damn liar.
 
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Oct 25, 2017
5,201
I'm guessing this is going to result in a fracture where Emma and crew have to fight against the experimented humans along with the monsters.
 
Oct 25, 2017
36,033
The Musica stuff? i don’t get it. That’s the only “contradiction” and we barely knew those characters. There must be more explanations, and that’s probably one of the points Emma will present to Norman now. It’s a bit soon to be calling anything here an “asspull”.
Exactly.
 
Oct 26, 2017
254
Are we really going to have the same ol' 'best friend turned antagonist' storyline?

I wonder what sort of solution there can be other than eliminating the 'demons'. Emma wants make a new promise, but what sort of promise can she make when the demons need human flesh to retain their human traits? I think Project Lambda 7214 will play a part of it, since it was included in the memory chip Emma got at Goldy Pond - Emma herself wondered why James added information about the project in the files.

Synthetic meat, anyone?
 
Dec 28, 2018
353
Since Lewis demon monkey who’s name I can’t remember was shown this chapter it makes me wonder if it will ever show up again. With Lewis body being gone at the end of the Goldy Pond arc and it still being alive, I can’t help but assume that it was the one behind Lewis body disappearing. Unless Lewis was alive and walked on off but I’m doubtful that he was.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,980
Since Lewis demon monkey who’s name I can’t remember was shown this chapter it makes me wonder if it will ever show up again. With Lewis body being gone at the end of the Goldy Pond arc and it still being alive, I can’t help but assume that it was the one behind Lewis body disappearing. Unless Lewis was alive and walked on off but I’m doubtful that he was.
Theory is the monkey ate him, so maybe we have some more Lewis action lately.
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,201
Are we really going to have the same ol' 'best friend turned antagonist' storyline?

I wonder what sort of solution there can be other than eliminating the 'demons'. Emma wants make a new promise, but what sort of promise can she make when the demons need human flesh to retain their human traits? I think Project Lambda 7214 will play a part of it, since it was included in the memory chip Emma got at Goldy Pond - Emma herself wondered why James added information about the project in the files.

Synthetic meat, anyone?
I'm guessing synthetic meat won't cut it if the mass produced kids aren't cutting it.
 
Dec 28, 2018
353
Theory is the monkey ate him, so maybe we have some more Lewis action lately.
That makes the most sense but I do wonder how it was able to move his body or even eat it that quickly considering the size difference between it and Lewis. Though I guess it was never stated how long the body was gone for after Lewis died.
 
Oct 26, 2017
254
Theory is the monkey ate him, so maybe we have some more Lewis action lately.
That monkey sure has a huge appetite then to have eaten a whole body in such a short time.

Given than Lewis' memories included Mujika and SunJu protecting her, I think demon experimented on more than humans. When Mujika asks SunJu if he wants to eat humans, he says she wouldn't understand because she never had a reason to - meaning he had and still has. Maybe Mujika is a result of experiments to remove the need of continuous human consumption.

I'm guessing synthetic meat won't cut it if the mass produced kids aren't cutting it.
Regular village demons of lower status are doing just fine on mass-produced cattle children. It's more of a high vs low quality meat, so to speak.
 
Oct 28, 2017
1,797
Milan, Italy
This chapter was pure fucking hype.
I love the biology behind Demons, makes them really interesting, frightening but also easier to understand their POV.

So many possibilities now, an ideology clash between Emma and Norman? Superpowered kids? Genocide run? Vegetarian demons? Demon Lord who we know nothing about?
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,201
Regular village demons of lower status are doing just fine on mass-produced cattle children. It's more of a high vs low quality meat, so to speak.
They explained this chapter that monsters are having trouble maintaining their forms with mass produced meat, so a different type of mass produced meat probably won't fix things.
 
Oct 26, 2017
254
Rereading the chapter, my favorite part is the "CATTLE McHILDREN"


They explained this chapter that monsters are having trouble maintaining their forms with mass produced meat, so a different type of mass produced meat probably won't fix things.
Somehow, that skipped my mind. Knowing there are already successful farms producing improved mass-produced children, I wonder how many of Norman's rescued kids are 'irregulars'.

SunJoo and Mujika could be eating intelligent demons. If they love the hunt and all. Plus we know it works like that because of Nous and Nouma.
I can see SunJoo doing that whenever he tells Mujika to stay back while he goes eliminate the 'pests', but not Mujika who is dead-set against eating human meat. I think eating one of your own is way worse than eating a human, religious reasons or not.
 
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Oct 25, 2017
3,629
Well, Emma's expression says it all. We're going to have Antagonist Norman, and frankly, I would have been disappointed if they brought him back for any other reason.

About the anime, I think we can all agree that episode 3 screwed things up with the internal monologues. Just doing a double check, there shouldn't be any scenes quite that bad after this point, right? They reveal things to Don and Gilda, and then most of time, thoughts are given to the reader through conversations between characters.
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,200
CT
Yeah clearly there is an answer for demons to have intelligence without eating humans and the religious demons showed. Emma is clearly gonna be against genocide and I can’t wait to see how this plays out.
 
Oct 25, 2017
9,508
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Aw that RayNorman reunion. I teared up so much, so happy and d'awwwwwww hold me.

120

Giving up going to the human world. Questionable, what about all the magical stuff emma saw, how will that fit into this.

Assuming this continues to follow the YA dystopia route, Emma may split from norman and ray. I dont think norman idea aligns with hers.
 
Oct 26, 2017
254
Giving up going to the human world. Questionable, what about all the magical stuff emma saw, how will that fit into this.
I'm hoping Emma attempts to seal a new promise only to find there isn't a magical solution - I hate that trope the most. I'd rather have the story be about the moral dilemma of demons doing what they have to do to survive and humans rebelling against being a source of food. You'd think during those thousand years, demons and humans would have sought a new promise that'd allow both species to co-exist - especially after the issues of low status demons retaining their humanity due to low-quality meat.

I feel like the final solution will require a huge sacrifice, which is why nobody has been willing to do it.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,629
You know, I had been thinking that before the end, there would be an arc or subarc that would be a throwback to the structure of the first arc. Maybe that's what we're getting here, with Emma using subterfuge to undermine Norman while hoping he doesn't notice.
 
Dec 28, 2018
353
You know, I had been thinking that before the end, there would be an arc or subarc that would be a throwback to the structure of the first arc. Maybe that's what we're getting here, with Emma using subterfuge to undermine Norman while hoping he doesn't notice.
Man I hope it is because even though I don’t mind the direction the series has gone in since then I’ll always have a fondness for the first arc because of the psychological mind games. Still not sure how I feel about Norman being a potential antagonist but it could be interesting to see how it plays out.
 
Oct 25, 2017
9,508
Emma to die alone for her ideal Neverland that's only a dream and make believe while RayNorman outwit her and create the real Neverland with their family. Series would have the most memorable and epic conclusion ever. Just. Wow.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,980
You know, I had been thinking that before the end, there would be an arc or subarc that would be a throwback to the structure of the first arc. Maybe that's what we're getting here, with Emma using subterfuge to undermine Norman while hoping he doesn't notice.
This would be so clever, i’d love to see it happen!
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,493
I don't understand why Emma is shocked and seemingly appalled at Norman's proposal of wiping the demons out. I know demons are analogous to modern day humans but Emma c'mon...they raise you to be food and others are sadistic killers obsessed with the thrill of the hunt, a fixation of life and death on a razor's edge! Why are you tripping? They killed Yugo and Lucas (indirectly I guess) and that little girl with the bunny! Honestly I'm rooting for Norman, Emma has always been too stupid and idealistic for me. Ray the best protagonist but at least Norman knows sometimes, the best won't always happen.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,618
I don't understand why Emma is shocked and seemingly appalled at Norman's proposal of wiping the demons out.
Because she knows genocide is wrong?
Because she's already met two demons who at least claimed to not be eating human meat (and we have no reason to doubt them on that point) and clearly retained their forms, and so Norman is either deliberately lying or was given false information.

That you're not appalled at the idea of wiping out a race of equal or higher intelligence of humans is pretty messed up, not the other way around. Even if they are fictional.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,493
Because she knows genocide is wrong?
Because she's already met two demons who at least claimed to not be eating human meat (and we have no reason to doubt them on that point) and clearly retained their forms, and so Norman is either deliberately lying or was given false information.

That you're not appalled at the idea of wiping out a race of equal or higher intelligence of humans is pretty messed up, not the other way around. Even if they are fictional.
Yes genocide is wrong, but if the confines of this story, maybe not so much.

They seek to consume humans, they have no intention of living peacefully with them. Mujika had good intentions for the kids and displayed genuine concern, but Sonju definitely has ulterior motives and wants to return to an earlier era where he can freely hunt humans. Mujika is an outlier, she's the exception, not the rule. I don't share your ideology and think it's largely flawed. Everything the demons have done thus far is for the development of their species and making human consumption more beneficial for themselves. They experiment on children, mass produce and force feed them, cultivate their intelligence to further their own, and the aristocracy hunts humans for sport to feel the sensation of death or to feel powerful. And yet, I'm supposed to feel compassion for them?

If someone wanted to kill me and/or my family/friends, whether it be for survival or pleasure, I'm going to act in my best interest and wipe them out instead of attempting to reason with them. My life has no value to a demon aside from sustenance, why am I seeking to appeal to their "humanity" when history and personal experience have shown me that it's futile? I'm not arguing to kill all demons, only those who don't wish to co-exist. Demons who are willing to eat corpses or synthetic flesh are okay, but all others who see humans as prey, we're going to actively go after them. It's survival of the fittest.

This premise is reminiscent of The Matrix; Machines use humans as batteries, and hold no value for human lives beyond utilitarian purposes. They seek to kill the freed humans. Is Neo/the survivors of Zion wrong in seeking to destroy the machines to ensure their own survival and to free those enslaved by the Matrix?

Is the CCG in Tokyo Ghoul wrong for hunting ghouls that feed on living humans?
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,980
Yes genocide is wrong, but if the confines of this story, maybe not so much.

They seek to consume humans, they have no intention of living peacefully with them. Mujika had good intentions for the kids and displayed genuine concern, but Sonju definitely has ulterior motives and wants to return to an earlier era where he can freely hunt humans. Mujika is an outlier, she's the exception, not the rule. I don't share your ideology and think it's largely flawed. Everything the demons have done thus far is for the development of their species and making human consumption more beneficial for themselves. They experiment on children, mass produce and force feed them, cultivate their intelligence to further their own, and the aristocracy hunts humans for sport to feel the sensation of death or to feel powerful. And yet, I'm supposed to feel compassion for them?

If someone wanted to kill me and/or my family/friends, whether it be for survival or pleasure, I'm going to act in my best interest and wipe them out instead of attempting to reason with them. My life has no value to a demon aside from sustenance, why am I seeking to appeal to their "humanity" when history and personal experience have shown me that it's futile? I'm not arguing to kill all demons, only those who don't wish to co-exist. Demons who are willing to eat corpses or synthetic flesh are okay, but all others who see humans as prey, we're going to actively go after them. It's survival of the fittest.

This premise is reminiscent of The Matrix; Machines use humans as batteries, and hold no value for human lives beyond utilitarian purposes. They seek to kill the freed humans. Is Neo/the survivors of Zion wrong in seeking to destroy the machines to ensure their own survival and to free those enslaved by the Matrix?

Is the CCG in Tokyo Ghoul wrong for hunting ghouls that feed on living humans?
You’re missing that the demons built societies, have similar lifestyles to humans even, can communicate, have emotions and are self aware. Remember when they got infiltrated into that demon city: there were kids there too, innocent. Your reasoning equates to a scenario where aliens come to earth but only experiment the atrocities related to torture and killing and get that as their only idea of humanity, so they decide to wipe us all out.

You just don’t justify genocide, ever. It’s not a correct solution. Funny how Norman is the one actually proposing this and not the other 2 considering the later have seen far more horrible stuff.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,493
You’re missing that the demons built societies, have similar lifestyles to humans even, can communicate, have emotions and are self aware. Remember when they got infiltrated into that demon city: there were kids there too, innocent. Your reasoning equates to a scenario where aliens come to earth but only experiment the atrocities related to torture and killing and get that as their only idea of humanity, so they decide to wipe us all out.

You just don’t justify genocide, ever. It’s not a correct solution. Funny how Norman is the one actually proposing this and not the other 2 considering the later have seen far more horrible stuff.
But they just emulate their prey and take on their characteristics. We don't know how Ray feels on the matter but I hope he represents a sensible middle ground and isn't just going to follow whatever Emma wants to do. I think it's ironic that you mention the demon children and how they're innocent but the human children are innocent as well yet the demons have absolutely no qualms about killing them.
 
Oct 25, 2017
9,508
Emma's way, fleeing to the human world is the way that ensures the least demons die, but also means, that the demons will continue to do what they already do, her plan is only appealing for saving kids of the present but not the future. Normans way, destroying all farms, making a neverland there, ensures the continued squashing of the farm system and ensures humans now and in the future are saved.

Any alteration to the farm system leads to *intelligent* demons dying. Neither character has the truly altruistic peaceful solution. Emma's, running away, is actually the more selfish of the two methods from a human perspective.