And? It's still just a script, why don't you guys just wait out and SEE if it's trash before making assumptionsThe guy who leaked this is credible and was the first person way back who leaked that BvS was hot garbage.
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Agreed with this 100%Joker being Batman's brother is beyond stupid.
Honestly though, him killing a woman for that reason isn't surprising as the Joker is a vile person who does vile things. If they try to use it to make him a tragic figure or some sort of fallen hero, then yeah, it has issues
A lot of it will be down to execution and how the previous scenes build up to that moment. Considering the director it's up in the air.
Because Todd Phillips is a fucking hack director lmaoAnd? It's still just a script, why don't you guys just wait out and SEE if it's trash before making assumptions
I don't have to play trailer detective because the broad strokes are apparent. Obviously the movie won't completely exonerate him from any wrong doing since I suspect that WB still knows they are making a movie about a villain, but if they are presenting the world wholly through his lens and perspective, complete with how his life is a tragedy (his words in the trailer) with potentially a sick mother who he has to take care of and he gets beat up in the street for seemingly no reason, they aren't just making you feel some sympathy for a character, they are making you feel sorry for a character who we know what he becomes and what he represents beyond this movie. We are getting an origin story for a serial killer and just like Joker said in The Killing Joke that he was pushed over the edge, we have mass shooters that want to play the victim of their circumstances and believe that others are responsible for pushing them over the edge. It was the "cool kids" fault for mocking them and not accepting them. It was societies fault for making it hard to find a job. It was a woman's fault for rejecting them. It was because they were bullied and beat up that they are justified in taking it out on the world.I'm saying he's a bad dude that you can feel sorry for and that doesn't mean you're endorsing him murdering people. Also I gave you evidence that he's already a shitheel since we're playing trailer detective.
It's clear you have some weird axe to grind.
Honestly though, him killing a woman for that reason isn't surprising as the Joker is a vile person who does vile things. If they try to use it to make him a tragic figure or some sort of fallen hero, then yeah, it has issues
There are ways you can do it and make it work. The problem is I'm very sure this movie will not do any of those.A lot of it will be down to execution and how the previous scenes build up to that moment. Considering the director it's up in the air.
This is like those times when on-set photos leak of superhero movies, and everyone thinks the movie is going to be shit because the costumes look ridiculous.
That's fair. I do think there would be less scrutiny if this wasn't saddled with the weight of who the character is, but maybe that's also part of the appeal. i don't know.I don't have to play trailer detective because the broad strokes are apparent. Obviously the movie won't completely exonerate him from any wrong doing since I suspect that WB still knows they are making a movie about a villain, but if they are presenting the world wholly through his lens and perspective, complete with who his life is a tragedy (his words in the trailer) with potentially a sick mother who he has to take care of and he gets beat up in the street for seemingly no reason, they aren't just making you feel some sympathy for a character, they are making you feel sorry for a character who we know what he becomes and what he represents beyond this movie. We are getting an origin story for a serial killer and just like Joker said in The Killing Joke that he was pushed over the edge, we have mass shooters that want to play the victim of their circumstances and believe that others are responsible for pushing them over the edge. It was the "cool kids" fault for mocking them and not accepting them. It was societies fault for making it hard to find a job. It was a woman's fault for rejecting them. It was because they were bullied and beat up that they are justified in taking it out on the world.
Maybe people just want to have their cool Joker movie, but it rubs me the wrong way, and the trailer doesn't make me feel like the filmmakers realize the weight of the themes they are playing with or that they will be handled with care. It just makes me think they want to make a cool Joker movie, but it's not like they are unaware of what surrounds the iconography of the Joker if they are leaning into it and making decisions like the spoiler in the tweets. Maybe it's handled in a way I don't expect, but from people that have read a version of the script, it doesn't sound that way, and it's totally fair to criticize poor handling of such material.
Honestly, I was getting that vibe from the trailer. And if its true then jeezus we don't need this right now. This is why you don't stick an origin on the Joker. He's just plain evil thats it.I think the issue seems to be they are probably going too far in trying to make Joker a sympathetic creature so shitheads will fall over themselves to view joker as the hero who is standing up to all the bullshit
You're saying you don't see this often on this site?🙄
How about you point out exactly, who in here is saying that.
With Marty involved?I'm sure Todd Phillips, more than anyone else in the industry, will be able to salvage gold out of the script and turn it into something special.
If they are trying to make Joker sympathic (when he shouldn't) and they are pulling an incel angle then there is no hope for this movie.
I did but I never expected the whole incel angle.Did you even watch the trailer? That's exactly the story the trailer is selling, they are obviously going for a Fight Club, 'Robert Paulson' vibe.
Joker has done worseIt's in ROT13 cipher.
It translates to:Joker kills a woman for turning down his romantic advances, seemingly the only major woman in the story too.
It's a problem because—why should he care about that? To me he seems mostly asexual. He shouldn't be flipping out for getting rejected. Shits awful.I mean, I don't think Joker being that kind of piece of shit is a problem so much as it is the worship around his character that's hilariously stupid.
Let's see how the rest of the movie treats this. If it's as mediocre as they're implying it is then at least we have the dumb memes to fallback on lol
Scorsese hasn't been involved for a minute.
I got it. Thanks. Don't know why I had to jump through that hoop though.
Yep. It's a minefield no matter how you try to lay it.Also (about that tweeted spoiler):
Shame on anyone who doesn't think that spoiler is a problem.That's probably Zazie Beetz's character. So you have a white dude killing a woman of color for rejecting him. It's bad no matter what, but this is even more tone deaf considering the times we're living in.
I prefer my scripts to be multiple choiceDidnt they say that they were changing the script during shooting almost daily?
Amazing approach, would you like some choppy subtext along with that?
sure its a joke...