Do actual Indians like Apu? i was under the impression that they didn't.
On the other hand, We mexicans fucking love speedy gonzalez, so that's a pretty big difference.
"The Simpsons" hits back at Hari Kondabolu's "The Problem With Apu"
- Thread starter Richiek
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On the other hand, We mexicans fucking love speedy gonzalez, so that's a pretty big difference.
No thank you. Apu is a great character and literally everyone in the Simpsons is a charicature. Also, it's The Simpsons, it's like asking South Park to give meaningful political commentary, if you take your opinion of minorities from The Simpsons, you've got bigger problems.
Haha no. Thanks for the good laugh. I appreciate millennials (I am one technically) but you are no more special than any other generation. Gen Z is already reported as leaning right, probably to try and disassociate themselves from these types of opinions.
Ah come onApu died when they married him off and gave him 30 kids.
He was a bumbling, slapstick TV character within a cartoon universe. I think a better comparison would be this bitch:
Consuela from Family Guy. She is quoted to make fun of Mexican kids. Here, this lady is your only representation, and therefore represents your mother. "No, I clean." and "Lemon Pledge" are the "Thank you, come again!" equivalent.
She is funny
Just like Herbert the pervert. Any mexicans here that are offended by her?
Also a lot of dudes refusing to watch the documentary and just spewing hot takes instead.
"They made the Indian guy a 7-Eleven Clerk played by a white guy doing the Peter Sellers brownface routine. What's offensive about that?"
Master of None Season 1 Episode 4 - Indians on Tv Watch it. It actually shows a lot of what happens with asian roles with a focus on indians.
I got an idea, dont phase Apu, instead, give him a more normal cousin and make him his sidekick for a while, make it so that his influence changes APU. Good comedy bits can involve people being weirded out at how a more normal indian man sounds and stuff like that and the differences between them. Change it slowly and eventually phase out the cousin, done.
No, it is not a real accent. It's Hank Azaria imitating Peter Sellers doing his take on an Indian.
That's on netflix, right? gonna remember to give it a watch during my lunch break.
Man in watching the documentary and that clip it just seems like the Simpsons writers, even when attempting to address this issue with this 2016 episode, are still in their Harvard bubbles where it's all still for the sake of a joke (and not even a great one at that). The way Dana Gould breaks down the differences (or lack thereof) between how they write Mr. Burns as funny vs Apu as funny is... weirdly, disappointingly hollow.
Secondly, holy fuck "criticizing Apu = 2nd Trump term" is a hell of a leap.
First, because society tends to move forward (even while racist shitbags and their bots tweet tweet tweet), minority representation matters, media evolves, our world is diverse, and with more open digital platforms now, people are going to use these platforms to offer clear and concise criticism on old and dated stereotypes, especially if those stereotypes undermine someone's identity like Kondabolu feels.
Secondly, holy fuck "criticizing Apu = 2nd Trump term" is a hell of a leap.
Apparently you get a pass because of this, but no one else is allowed to be OK with it...
I have literally spoken to people from India with the accent.
I'm halfway through, i just OOOF'D at the fact that he's a comedian
Don't be obtuse. You're absolutely allowed to be OK with it. What's not OK is downplaying every criticism of the character with lazy whataboutisms and wild leaps in logic.
What you’ve heard is people speaking in an accent that your brain approximated to be similar to that of Apu’s.
We are also coming for your guns and the rest of all your ethnic stereotypes. It's going to get scary for people who don't understand the change coming but hey it's been pretty scary for the rest of us too, time to get used to it.
Same. I worked with a guy for a year who had a close approximation of that accent. American Indian (from India, went back home for a month during that time).
They don't get a "pass", but i think you should understand why an actual Indian's insight would be more important than any non-indian person.
The fact that people can have different stances on this demonstrates why representation is a complex issue.
For example, on gaming side one time i saw another mexican dude who thought Luchadores in fighting games were a racist stereotype, while i personally think otherwise because i love luchadores in fighting games and fighting games always go with these national archetypes for characters (Boxer from america, karateka from japan, kung fu fighter from china, Tae kwon do guy from Korea, etc), it's entirely possible for the people who are directly affected by the stereotype to have opposing opinions about it.
What's the solution? Be OK with it, or don't. He can either exist, or he can't. It's a character that has existed for 25-30 years. What do you propose? Sitting around wringing hands about it does nothing and is a waste of energy.
This is no different than certain Americans thinking that a horrible attempt at a British accent by an American “sounds like the real thing to me!”
There are plenty of people that were just happy to see a brown face on TV and were willing to overlook everything else. The same way that a lot of offensive shit used to be overlooked in the past, bad representation was better than no representation to a lot of people.
Horse shit.
When that guy is on one of the biggest shows on TV and was the only time most people even saw a brown guy on TV then yes, it's something that has a real negative effect. To use an extreme example, you wouldn't say "If someone is getting their news from Breitbart they've got bigger problems, so we shouldn't complain about the alt-right"
It shouldn't be someone's only exposure to minorities, but the fact of the matter is that Apu was the only exposure millions of Americans had to South Asians for a long time.
Things dont need to be black and white look at my previous post for an example of a way you can fix it painlessly.
the controversy with speedy gonzales never had anything to do with the character of speedy gonzales
it has to do with the way all the other mexican mice are portrayed, which is usually sleepy, lazy, slow talking, dirt poor, alcoholic, and gullible. Speedy Gonzales is like the super hero version of all of them that have none of their faults, so yeah of course that specific character rules. It's the implications about everyone else, who are supposed to represent normal mexicans who aren't the fastest mice in all of mexico, that is racist as shit.
i.e. this:
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I think you're misinterpreting what I posted.
What I mean is that audiences "having endeared to Apu" means nothing. It has zero value in the discussion, and frankly isn't worth considering when weighted against the shittiness of everything else surrounding his character's conception.
I would recast Apu with an Indian actor and hire a writer of Indian descent to help make him less ridiculous. Also, we're not wringing hands, we're having a discussion. I'd recommend watching the documentary in question to get some perspective from Indian people on this issue.
One guy in my home town changed the name of his convenience store to Kwik E Mart.
They love him.
Being a POC, I really like the character Apu. He's one of my favorite characters in the show because while he is a stereotype, he isn't there JUST to be the "Kwik-E-Mart guy." I'd assume if he was to be an in-your-face offensive joke he would have absolutely no development in the shows lifespan, only appearing when other characters enter the Kwik-E-Mart or in relation to it.
I'm 80% German. I don't get upset when people call me an "Aryan race" or play games where Germans are shown as Nazis. It's not an identical comparison, but quick and dirty - and fully negative. If all Mexicans were portrayed as El Chapo, I can see that being an obvious bad thing. It's hard to say what should be pushed back on - I just don't think that Apu is a terrible character. Then again, I'm not Indian - so I defer to Indians.
Australians and British do American accents all the time. Look at Walking Dead. Tons.
So you'd create a new character that's not Apu. This is the Simpsons, not Non-Fiction.
Slowpoke Rodriguez was a boss, sorry.
The accents are so bad lol
The accents are so bad lol
I'm just saying it's a more apt comparison. She's "funny" because of the accent, because she talks slow, and because she doesn't understand english. And, because of that, she's quotable to young people who are going to turn around and use it on their hispanic peers. There is no hesitation to use the stereotypical accent. And it becomes a representation of their parents. And she's voiced by an old white dude.
This thread has skyrocketed my ignore list
Why the fuck would it matter that a caricature not aimed at you doesn't bother you? What a truly idiotic reply
That horrible attempt at a "British" accent we usually hear from Americans isn't far off. Watch one of the early Guy Ritchie movies.
People have different accents. This isn't a bad thing, it should be something to be celebrated. The general, stereotypical Indian accent is a real accent. It's no different to the stereotypical Scottish, English Cockney, Welsh, French, American deep South, German, Australian, Japanese or Caribbean accents, to name a few more. Apu's accent exists, the problem with the Apu portrayal is it's excessively exaggerated for comedic effect and it's poor taste in 2018.
And? If an American tells me that a non American’s attempt at an exaggerated American accent doesn’t actually match any real accents in their country, I’m not going to tell them, “hey it sounds that way to me!”
And I take issue with this part of the documentary. If you own one successful store, you're a success. You don't need to open more stores. He does very well, is hard working, owns a house, supports a family (later in the show). Why would he stretch himself thinner for some illusion of more success? more stores does not necessarily mean more successful. The way he's depicted (especially early) is WILDLY successful.
Hmm. But has anybody "moved forward" in their career on that show, 30 years on?
I agree that a recasting would be nice -- Hank Azaria has plenty of other characters to handle, it wouldn't be a big deal, they can afford to do it, and it would show some good faith on the part of the show.
The thing is, the very reason Apu exists is because Azaria played off a racist stereotype at the initial script reading - and worse, everyone in the room loved that racial stereotype. They thought it was funny.
That's... unsettling.
That's... unsettling.
You specified one guy you know locally in response to a vague question of "does this group actually like this character" you used the term "they".
And then he built that into a heartfelt, rounded, hardworking vegan Hindu with a successful business.
Like, I get the origins are bad, and its not cast in a politically correct manner, but the character is very good.
To be fair he's also depicted early on as having less than sanitary store conditions purely to cut corners or do less work so that's not super flattering. Not sure if that's a stereotype though or just how the specific character was written regardless of race/origin.
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