The Verge - Google Stadia hands-on: near-flawless Doom Eternal running on a Chromebook

G-DannY

Member
Oct 28, 2017
173
Rome (Italy)
Stadia = streaming "PC" games
xcloud = streaming Console (because they stream actual console version of games over console hardware) games

so they are also two different things.

on stadia for example it should be possible to play games like Tarkov, while on xcloud not.

so they are not really even competitors, just like two different platforms.

and being invested in Xbox ecosystem and owning a XOX, I'm really more interested in stadia than xcloud...
 

hikarutilmitt

Member
Dec 16, 2017
2,375
Ah, thought it read was using a Pixelbook as a hub and hooked into a Samsung TV which I figured would be a 4k display at a demo station.

Regardless, pixelbooks should have 4k displays...they are pricey enough.
It was, but that doesn't mean the TV wasn't 1080p or they weren't, say, using the 1080p stream because of likely dicey internet at the E3 exhibition hall.
 

Stixitnu

Member
Apr 9, 2018
455
I would expect it to be near flawless in a controlled environment but it needs to be flawless for millions a people
 

b00_thegh0st

Member
Nov 6, 2017
389
I play DOOM on GeForce Now 120Hz/120+ uncapped FPS.
Mouse and keyboard.
It's sweet.

Hopefully Stadia will be similar, minus the support for 120 FPS.
I don’t know how you can manage this. My brain cannot tolerate the slightest input lag when playing m/kb. I’m not talking about performing better, just the fact you feel the lag a ton more when playing with a mouse.
 

Natels

Member
Oct 26, 2017
267
I tried PS Now yesterday for the first time. And it was not that bad really. Living in Portugal I thought I would get a bad experience but not at all.

The lag despite being noticiable was not that big of a problem. Got through the first 3 chapters of Ninja Gaiden Sigma 2 without any hiccups. Can't talk much about image quality since the resolution isn't great to begin with.

I can see streaming being good for singleplayer games.
 

dotyoureyes

Alt Account
Member
Jun 11, 2019
488
I tried PS Now yesterday for the first time. And it was not that bad really. Living in Portugal I thought I would get a bad experience but not at all.

The lag despite being noticiable was not that big of a problem. Got through the first 3 chapters of Ninja Gaiden Sigma 2 without any hiccups. Can't talk much about image quality since the resolution isn't great to begin with.

I can see streaming being good for singleplayer games.
You mean it's not a joke like the xbox gamer said? lol.
 

SuikerBrood

Member
Jan 21, 2018
10,047
Stadia = streaming "PC" games
xcloud = streaming Console (because they stream actual console version of games over console hardware) games

so they are also two different things.

on stadia for example it should be possible to play games like Tarkov, while on xcloud not.

so they are not really even competitors, just like two different platforms.

and being invested in Xbox ecosystem and owning a XOX, I'm really more interested in stadia than xcloud...
While this is true, the games do need a Vulkan Linux port.
 

ClarkusDarkus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,745
I'm out the loop, How would i get to use Stadia on my 4K oled TV? Would i have to purchase chromecast ultra or something?

Be an interesting one streaming a game in 4K/60/HDR, The cross save Destiny 2 has me intruiged but man i need that picture quality and low input lag.
 

thebishop

Member
Nov 10, 2017
1,059
Biggest thing keeping me from Stadia is buying games that are locked to their streaming service, that I have little confidence in long term. (I just found and tossed my OnLive console)

Now, if it was a purely Gamepass like situation? I just fork over $20/month to play new top tier stuff? Maybe. But their $12/month Gold/Plus like solution ain’t gonna win me over. There’s already too many subs to buy.

Which is why MS is gonna take this with xCloud and crush shit.
Personally I think applying examples of Google killing services to Stadia is overblown. Mostly they've streamlined several competing services/projects into a single one (Duo, Hangouts, Allo, Meet). Other times they've killed projects that were announced as experimental and aspirational from jump (Google Glass). Maybe the most painful Google cancellation was Fiber, but that failed precisely because they weren't able to roll it out to a lot of users.

I don't think there are many (any?) examples of Google cancelling a service that resulted in the termination of a license or loss of data on a mass scale. Something like Google Play going down and screwing you out of store purchases, or Youtube movie purchases getting wiped out.

But even with those concerns, we now know the answer: there are going to be subscriptions. Ubisoft announced the first one with Uplay+. It's pretty much inevitable that EA, Bethesda, 2K, etc will follow.

The bigger problem i see is not that games will be locked to the service, but that games will be fragmented across too many subscriptions. Am I going to be switching from EA to Ubi to 2K every 3 months? That sounds pretty tedious. And fwiw, I don't think that will be just a Stadia problem. It'll definitely be on PC, and probably on consoles too.
 

Interfectum

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,738
Some People here really need to lower the expectations about these services...
I feel like it's going to go both ways. Some people here are going to be massively disappointed when there is noticeable lag and artifacting on their new $60(ish) Stadia game purchase. And just wait for a big game to come out and the service has a few hiccups and people are getting horrible lag time on their new game purchase.

On the other hand, a lot of the naysayers are going to be surprised how well this works and how it does add a convenience factor they didn't think about.
 

fracas

Member
Oct 27, 2017
663
The project stream beta had pretty much imperceptible input lag for me, but obvious compression. Stoked to see such a great demo.
 

The Albatross

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,898
Awesome, I'm really excited for this. Just waiting for the game library to come up to snuff. This is probably a pipe dream but I'm hoping that *most* games get stadia support.

My experience with Project Stream was near enough to flawless, but my thoughts were tha Assassins Creed is a perfect game for that because it's not a precise, twitch based game, and Doom is much more precise.
 

ManNR

Member
Feb 13, 2019
134
I'm going to say 9/10 of you grandstanding over lag have not actually tried streaming. You can only detect so much latency even with your fineley tuned gamer fingers.

Edit: CloseTalker beat me to it
I don't know. I did the Google network test of AssCreed: Odyssey over a business connection and that was not a very pleasant experience.
 

NoUse4AName

Member
Feb 5, 2019
143
I feel like it's going to go both ways. Some people here are going to be massively disappointed when there is noticeable lag and artifacting on their new $60(ish) Stadia game purchase. And just wait for a big game to come out and the service has a few hiccups and people are getting horrible lag time on their new game purchase.

On the other hand, a lot of the naysayers are going to be surprised how well this works and how it does add a convenience factor they didn't think about.

Exactly streaming work for some content (at least for me), people who think that can go online with these services hitting headshots like crazy and destroying opponents in fighting games that are playing locally will be disappointed
 

BlueManifest

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,721
Everyone mentions PSNow, Stadia and what not.

Streaming has been around for free with most of your steam, uplay and battle net library if you own a shield.

NVidia Now already proved it will be feasible for most connections, I used the shield wirelessly and it worked well enough to where I was like “alright, you have my attention”
No the difference is you have to own a pc or console to do that type of streaming from your own hardware

This requires no gaming hardware
 

ImaLawy3r

Member
Jun 6, 2019
23
Personally I think applying examples of Google killing services to Stadia is overblown. Mostly they've streamlined several competing services/projects into a single one (Duo, Hangouts, Allo, Meet). Other times they've killed projects that were announced as experimental and aspirational from jump (Google Glass). Maybe the most painful Google cancellation was Fiber, but that failed precisely because they weren't able to roll it out to a lot of users.

I don't think there are many (any?) examples of Google cancelling a service that resulted in the termination of a license or loss of data on a mass scale. Something like Google Play going down and screwing you out of store purchases, or Youtube movie purchases getting wiped out.

But even with those concerns, we now know the answer: there are going to be subscriptions. Ubisoft announced the first one with Uplay+. It's pretty much inevitable that EA, Bethesda, 2K, etc will follow.

The bigger problem i see is not that games will be locked to the service, but that games will be fragmented across too many subscriptions. Am I going to be switching from EA to Ubi to 2K every 3 months? That sounds pretty tedious. And fwiw, I don't think that will be just a Stadia problem. It'll definitely be on PC, and probably on consoles too.
100% agree with your sentiments. I believe there's a lot of negative and positive influencers in social media, reddit, and maybe on this forum pushing one thing or the next. We just need to listen to what these influencers/opinion pieces and critically think for ourselves.
 

OrdinaryPrime

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,550
I don't get the negativity from some people about this.

I am always excited to try new technology and the promise of being able to truly play almost anywhere is pretty exciting to me.

If it sucks it sucks, but it sounds extremely promised and I am definitely going to give it a try on my average ass internet.
Because in this case, the new technology results in a worse experience for the consumer than just playing it natively on dedicated hardware.
 

Fredrik

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,433
Stadia will be, for the people with the internet speed and data allowance to allow it, more than serviceable. I'm confident in that.

However, there will be a TON of people who will swear up and down, no matter how good the experience is, that it's not good enough. Google will need to do blind Pepsi Taste Tests with this thing, to prove to people that they don't care about the minuscule concessions the way they think they do.
The truth.

Some figures:
16ms equals 1 frame in a 60fps game.
33ms equals 1 frame in a 30fps game.

I don't know the minimum latency in either Stadia or xCloud but I've heard them talk about less than 10ms in best case scenario. So, less than 1 frame. Nobody would notice that.

Although, I get 35ms ping time when I ping the nearest Stadia datacenter from my location. This would mean
2 frames latency in a 60fps games for Stadia, with no other latency added from TV etc. But I still doubt it would be noticeable unless you're a competing fighting game player.
 

bionic77

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,419
Because in this case, the new technology results in a worse experience for the consumer than just playing it natively on dedicated hardware.
What are you basing that on?

I am holding off making any strong opinions until I actually try it out.

Also there are some advantages to streaming that give you options to date you could not get on consoles. Now that everything is going digital if they can get it close enough to native hardware I would be tempted by a streaming future IF they can actually deliver.
 

ArtemisLunar

The Fallen
Jun 13, 2018
65
As a Cloud as a alternative believer, I think both Stadia and xCloud will deliver on their premises, I'm really interested on Stadia and I really want to try it, but like other said, there's still a lot to improve on the cloud service, mostly on the response time and latency.
For the record, I'm using Geforce Now on a unsupported country (Mexico) @200 MB/s and 50 MB/s and it works flawlessly on both cases
 

The Albatross

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,898
The only major publisher not listed so far is Activision/Blizzard.
Yeah and I don't even care about Activision/BLizzard. I think listijng publishers doesn't really mean all their titles will be on their or released at the same time. I'm also hoping for a lot of indie/small studios to be up there.

There's also a lot of games that have traditionally been absent on PC and I wonder whether publishers will treat this as a PC-like platform, as as a console-like platform. For instance, EA releases most of their major IPs on PCs, but yearly annual releases like Madden, NHL, Fifa, etc., had ignored PC for about ~15 years. Madden recently launched on PC last year, and it'll be interesting if they're consistent with that going forward. Madden is like the exact type of game I want on Stadia, because it's a game I can play on my TV, but also do things like roster management, franchise mode, and other small things from my phone or work computer. (As much as Madden sucks these days, I still usually enjoy good franchise sims)
 

OrdinaryPrime

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,550
What are you basing that on?

I am holding off making any strong opinions until I actually try it out.

Also there are some advantages to streaming that give you options to date you could not get on consoles. Now that everything is going digital if they can get it close enough to native hardware I would be tempted by a streaming future IF they can actually deliver.
1. Any application of this audience is going to be severely limited until Internet infrastructure is expanded, at least here in the United States, where I assume you live and I live.
2. Related to 1, bandwidth caps will curtail this as well, perhaps it's a good thing that more of these services are popping up because it puts pressure on the FCC to be less of a corporate arm of these ISPs.
3. The bitrate/compression will be present in these streams of games, it will be unavoidable.
4. Then the latency, which will be dependent on how close you are to these data centers.

Or I can play games without any of these things and I can also own the games to boot. I get people being enamored with the potential convenience of this tech, but I am definitely wary of a company like Google entering into it. At least Microsoft has a history in games.
 

AM_LIGHT

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,287
On a separate note i am quite surprised how many people in the US have data caps being exploited by corporate America.
I pay 70$ a month ( kinda expensive where I live ) for a 50mb unlimited internet , I use an average of 500 gb a month and I live in a fucking rural area in the Middle East .
 

zerocalories

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,169
Crazy how most people here don’t realize that these streaming products aren’t targeting toward them, and in turn take a shit on it
 

bionic77

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,419
1. Any application of this audience is going to be severely limited until Internet infrastructure is expanded, at least here in the United States, where I assume you live and I live.
2. Related to 1, bandwidth caps will curtail this as well, perhaps it's a good thing that more of these services are popping up because it puts pressure on the FCC to be less of a corporate arm of these ISPs.
3. The bitrate/compression will be present in these streams of games, it will be unavoidable.
4. Then the latency, which will be dependent on how close you are to these data centers.

Or I can play games without any of these things and I can also own the games to boot. I get people being enamored with the potential convenience of this tech, but I am definitely wary of a company like Google entering into it. At least Microsoft has a history in games.
Those are legitimate concerns but I am still going to try and see what it is actually like before I dismiss it.

It’s not like I am throwing my PS4 in the garbage based on their announcements, but if they can actually pull it off there are also some cool tings that come with the tech. Not the least of which is the freedom to play on a lot of different devices.
 

OrdinaryPrime

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,550
Those are legitimate concerns but I am still going to try and see what it is actually like before I dismiss it.

It’s not like I am throwing my PS4 in the garbage based on their announcements, but if they can actually pull it off there are also some cool tings that come with the tech. Not the least of which is the freedom to play on a lot of different devices.
I'm not telling anyone not to try it. I'm just pushing back on the narrative that some in this thread are pushing that anyone criticizing it is just an old man yelling at a cloud.

The device freedom is definitely a plus!
 
OP
OP
snacknuts

snacknuts

The Fallen
Nov 1, 2017
2,127
Because in this case, the new technology results in a worse experience for the consumer than just playing it natively on dedicated hardware.
I would change this to read, "the new technology results in a worse experience for a certain subset of consumers who are going to be more aware of minor imperfections that they wouldn't have if playing it natively on dedicated hardware." I think the overwhelming majority of people won't care about a small amount of input lag or the occasional resolution hiccup.
 

thebishop

Member
Nov 10, 2017
1,059
Yeah and I don't even care about Activision/BLizzard. I think listijng publishers doesn't really mean all their titles will be on their or released at the same time. I'm also hoping for a lot of indie/small studios to be up there.

There's also a lot of games that have traditionally been absent on PC and I wonder whether publishers will treat this as a PC-like platform, as as a console-like platform. For instance, EA releases most of their major IPs on PCs, but yearly annual releases like Madden, NHL, Fifa, etc., had ignored PC for about ~15 years. Madden recently launched on PC last year, and it'll be interesting if they're consistent with that going forward. Madden is like the exact type of game I want on Stadia, because it's a game I can play on my TV, but also do things like roster management, franchise mode, and other small things from my phone or work computer. (As much as Madden sucks these days, I still usually enjoy good franchise sims)
Yeah you're right that listing publishers doesn't equal blanket support. The level of EA support in particular is unclear right now, though there was a specific "EA Sports" logo in the Stadia Connect video.

My guess is that publishers are going to treat Stadia like a console. We already heard that Assassin's Creed for Stadia was ported from the console version. Google is pushing a controller and a chromecast, clearly favoring a 4k TV livingroom experience.

That said, there's nothing specifically gamepad-centric about Stadia. I think we'll also see PC-ass-PC-games on the service as well. SEGA has been an aggressive Linux supporter, especially with their PC strategy games. No reason these couldn't come to Stadia without gamepad support.

 
Oct 27, 2017
3,366
If we're getting a 4k60 experience with next-gen graphics, beyond that of PS4 Pro / X1X, what exactly is casual about it? Are all PS4 owners casual because they're getting an experience inferior to the absolute best PC? How about Switch owners?
Roaming peasant filth

Casual= Consoles are like football clubs with a century old tradition, Stadia is a club bought by sheiks. Disgusting.
 

Belvedere

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,034
I'd like to see some updated PS Now performance stats. Around launch Eurogamer claimed input lag from as little as 4ms to as high as 60ms or so IIRC. In my experience input lag has been a non-issue. I can't sit here and it wasn't noticeable like in the article posted (Sonic generations I would say playability was impacted), but for the majority of games I've tried you simply forget you're even streaming. You don't even think about it.
 

NoUse4AName

Member
Feb 5, 2019
143
Sony needs to add Downloads to Ps NOW (5 years running service) to increase the numbers of subscriptions, that should be a pretty clear sign of how the market receive these services.


The real problem is there are so many stuff behind the streaming services that actually doesn't depend on SONY/Google/MS or even the user.

Did I enjoy Assassins Creed in project stream or God Eater in Ps Now?
Shure...even with Assassin Creed lowering the resolution constantly.

Did it play the same as a local console?
Not..hell NOT even close.

I do not even imagine myself playing using my mobile data in my Phone...LOL
 

ClarkusDarkus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,745
Sony needs to add Downloads to Ps NOW (5 years running service) to increase the numbers of subscriptions, that should be a pretty clear sign of how the market receive these services.


The real problem is there are so many stuff behind the streaming services that actually doesn't depend on SONY/Google/MS or even the user.

Did I enjoy Assassins Creed in project stream or God Eater in Ps Now?
Shure...even with Assassin Creed lowering the resolution constantly.

Did it play the same as a local console?
Not..hell NOT even close.

I do not even imagine myself playing using my mobile data in my Phone...LOL
They offer to just PS4 games i think,But yeah they need to offer the download option to all BC games.