Thinking back on it... Was Tomb Raider III's Difficulty unusually harsh?

[Deleted member 5334]

So I haven't touched Tomb Raider III in quite some time, but out of all the Tomb Raider games I've played on the PS1 generation, even comparing it to Tomb Raider: The Last Revalation (IV), which admittedly was fairly obtuse in terms of progression, I remember Tomb Raider III giving me some of the biggest issues out of all them combined.

I've been wanting to revisit all the older Tomb Raider games that I played during my adolescence one of these days (did recently mess with 1 and 2 a bit not that long ago), and while I'm not particularly scared to revisit most of them, Tomb Raider III is the one I dread the most, mostly because I think I've only ever successfully beaten the game twice (if that), where the other games I've largely beaten multiple times. I seem to remember some of the level areas that gave me a lot of trouble, notably the car mechanics in the Jungle levels, some of the way the progression in some of the levels (London is specifically the one that drives me up a wall right off the bat, but the Aldwych level (subway station) took me fucking hours to beat, and I always dread having the idea to try and play through that again, making me wish the All Hallows level would've been accessible here still so I could've just bypassed this area altogether).

I know I remember having a lot of fun with it, but I also remember being absolutely frustrated in so many different levels because of progression issues, level designs, some enemy and bosses, and so-on and so-forth. Oddly, I didn't really get too bothered by the Save Crystal system too much, but I know the PC version replaces this (and arguably makes it easier as a result).

And no, I never had an issue with the Tank Controls that Tomb Raider had, even though arguably I understand for anyone who hadn't played these originally back then, probably would have a harder time adjusting to them now. Tomb Raider oddly is a platformer that largely works with it, though I'm not gonna say I'm not glad we moved away from it in the newer games.

Having said that, am I just misremembering Tomb Raider III's difficulty being too high, or was it legit a really difficult game, especially compared to the other entries?

Feel free to refresh my memory on this.

 

[DixieDean82]

Those games controlled like ass. I'm not surprised people found them difficult.

 

[Deleted member 2809]

I managed to *almost* beat it when I was like 12 but it took me some time and it was on PC. Controls were annoying. Rage quit on the final boss because I couldn't deal with the circular arena and it was intimidating.
I remember area 51 being a piece of shit taking all your weapons away, if you did that area last you were boned (unless you could get all your shit back but I didn't find it)

I remember completely giving up on TR2 which was much worse imo. But I was a bit younger for this one so maybe I just didn't have the patience.

 

[Deleted member 5334]

Those games controlled like ass. I'm not surprised people found them difficult.

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Honest to god, the only time I ever ran into ANY issues with controls was the damn Car mechanics in Tomb Raider 3. I seem to recall they changed it from Tomb Raider II and that threw me for an absolute loop, especially during the Jungle levels, which is required to progress through the level.

I managed to *almost* beat it when I was like 12 but it took me some time and it was on PC. Controls were annoying. Rage quit on the final boss because I couldn't deal with the circular arena and it was intimidating.

Click to shrink...

That was absolutely infuriating to get the timing right, and I really wonder if I'd be able to do that now, given my reaction time had gotten really bad over the years. It also sucks because the moment he hits you, Lara lights up like a light and it drains your HP immediately, faster than traditional being set on fire. Practically a reset at that point. Even if you have access to the health keys (which you don't on PS1), I doubt spamming it would get you through the rest of the area.

I remember area 51 being a piece of shit taking all your weapons away, if you did that area last you were boned (unless you could get all your shit back but I didn't find it)

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God, since I was aware of that level, I went for it more or less immediately. Tomb Raider during the PS1 era had a running gag where you'd lose your weapons in some shape or fashion, so while you'd encounter this in a linear fashion, you could easily re-get your equipment, but because the game opens up how you progress, that could potentially screw you over, especially if you don't know where all the weapons are located.

I don't think Last Revelation did this, but Tomb Raider 5 did this technically twice, with the latter instance more tied with progression, with the former being kid Lara, who has no weapon experience.

 

[SirKai]

Yes, TR3 is a nightmare and has not aged well at all. The traps and hazards are cruel, the difficulty curve is fucked up no matter the order you play the areas, and the safe crystal system can blow me.

 

[Bamboo]

I agree somewhat. Playes TR 1-3 back to back a few years ago. Had the most troubles with 3, and enjoyed it less than the other two. The levels are often just too long.

 

[Deleted member 16876]

Tomb Raider 3 is a game I need to replay sometime. I remember it being brutal however so you are right when you say this.

 

[Phantom88]

Those games controlled like ass. I'm not surprised people found them difficult.

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Yeah, except they dont. They're very precise and exact. Everything in the game is tailored made for those specific controls. Its just different than the standard schemes of today. Its not ass

 

[Catshade]

I quit early on because of the goddamn save crystals.

I think I spent way more time on Lara's Mansion instead of the adventure portion.

 

[Deleted member 543]

Yeah, it was a huge ramp up in difficulty from the first two. I remember having a much better time with TLR.

 

[Gelf]

If I play it again it'll be the PC version with unlimited save anywhere functionality. The
consumable save crystals are what really make it extra difficult in comparison to 2. I can't think of a save system more anxiety inducing. Resident Evil has ink ribbons but they are available in much higher quantity and those games have way less surprise death traps.

Tank controls in general are fine and that's not the issue. I think TR1 is perfectly balanced difficulty wise by comparison.

 

[Gloam]

I remember Area 51 being a particularly hard level. Those Mp5 guys were a major pain in the ass.

 

[Deleted member 5334]

Yeah, it was a huge ramp up in difficulty from the first two. I remember having a much better time with TLR.

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Same on The Last Revelation. Difficulty was fair and progression of said difficulty made a lot of logical sense, as it natually got harder as you went on. Now, as to whether or not "progression" was logical, that's debatable (definitely had a couple "huh" moments on some of the later levels, particularly when you had to keep moving back and forth between areas), but really I never got blocked in that game due to difficulty of traps, enemies, or level design, like I did in TR3.

 

[monmagman]

Looking back I remember bailing on this game after loving the first two(one more than two).....perhaps that's why,can't actually remember.
I purchased my PS1 with a copy of Tomb Raider after seeing it on a TV programme......those 3D graphics blew my mind at the time,lol.

 

[Tokyo_Funk]

3 was a doozy, it ramped up the fuckery and the levels were somewhat confusing at times. It also felt like you had to have played 2 to grasp what was going on at the time. If you skipped the tutorial, the game basically says "Fuck you here is a slide, learn to jump and avoid shit" immediately. Kind of odd.

 

[WyLD iNk]

I didn't find the game to be any harder than TR2, but the save system is what completely dampens the experience. In the original, the crystals were set at certain places, and so you'd simply play until you came across one. If you died, you'd just refine your game up to the point you died and learn to make it through. The TR3 crystals have to be found, so you (at least I did) feel compelled to save them for those points where you suspect a difficult section is coming up, and consequently, a slip up means LOTS of replaying huge sections to return to that point. It isn't so much difficulty, but the slog of replaying giant sections because you had one damn crystal and didn't know when you'd come across another.

I know everyone felt that the TR2 save anywhere method made it too easy, but it really didn't. It let you explore and experiment without fear of potentially wasting a resource or damning yourself to replaying massive chunks.

People that still complain about the controls in classic Tomb Raider at this point will probably never understand.

EDIT: I see my thoughts have already been pointed out by others. I wish I had the PC version. I've never finished the PS1 version, but would like to. It sits in my infinite backlog waiting for "someday".

 

[terminaljeremy]

As has already been pointed out, any game that starts you on an instadeath slide where the jump point is hidden until the last moment by a layer of foliage and the ground is covered in spikes is not promising you an easy time. I play all of them pretty regularly, except III, just because it's bullshit.

 

[Look! The Pie!]

Easily my least favourite of the original games. The levels seemed twice as long for no real reason, navigation/level design was often ridiculously obtuse, the save crystal mechanic was poorly implemented, and the environments themselves weren't all that interesting to me. Probably one of my biggest gaming disappointments ever, considering I was so hyped after loving 2 so much. Thankfully TLR was a real return to form.

 

[Dead Man Typing]

3 had a reputation at the time for being buggy and overly difficult compared to 1 and 2.

I've never played more than the first level. They've tried to add graphical detail but ended up making the environments harder to understand. Don't know if it gets better later on.

 

[Deleted member 2254]

III was pretty damn difficult. The final boss required pixel perfect controls with almost literally no margin for error. A lot of exploration parts were very hard to find the way (see Nevada). A lot of puzzles were pretty damn hardcore. And the game did a great job making you waste your save crystals on console by putting them in places where danger seemed to be coming up (in the jungle, you find one just as you see this giant statue that has the looks of wanting to come alive at any second). It was definitely hardcore, 4 and 5 in comparison felt like cakewalks. I and II were pretty difficult though.

 

[Phantom88]

Going by the fact that every post complains about the save system it seems there are no pc gamers here.

 

[Thera]

III was pretty damn difficult. The final boss required pixel perfect controls with almost literally no margin for error. A lot of exploration parts were very hard to find the way (see Nevada). A lot of puzzles were pretty damn hardcore. And the game did a great job making you waste your save crystals on console by putting them in places where danger seemed to be coming up (in the jungle, you find one just as you see this giant statue that has the looks of wanting to come alive at any second). It was definitely hardcore, 4 and 5 in comparison felt like cakewalks. I and II were pretty difficult though.

Click to shrink...

I remembered quiting after the Neveda level.

 

[Mr_Zombie]

I had tried to beat the game once but stopped at Area 51 - I couldn't escape from the prison. :/

 

[Treasure Silvergun]

I experienced only the first level of TR3 but I always read about it being brutal.
I replayed 2 a couple years ago and it was already brutal though, with tons of trial and error. I just can't understand how we endured these games on console with the constant deaths and increasingly long loading times the further you progressed into each game. Basically instant save and reload on PC these days is a blessing. The limited saves on console were also first-grade bullshit.
I've had the whole classic series on Steam for years and I often think of playing through TR3.

 

[Fastidioso]

Yeah some traps were really bastards. Jesus I missed so much the old TR. What time to be alive.

 

[Fastidioso]

3 had a reputation at the time for being buggy and overly difficult compared to 1 and 2.

I've never played more than the first level. They've tried to add graphical detail but ended up making the environments harder to understand. Don't know if it gets better later on.

Click to shrink...

I understood the criticisms around it. But I ended to love it. The variety of the scenarios was wonderful.

 

[Deleted member 13155]

Lets just say I beat TR1 and 2 back in the day, which I rate among the hardest PS1 games. I fired up 3 when it was released and never played it beyond the second world. Tomb Raider III is an undeniably tough game, and the most brutal in the franchise.

On top of that I didn't like it. On PS1 the graphics were too ambitious, I thought it looked cluttered and I couldn't see shit. The save crystal system I loathed in TR1 was back here? gtfo.

TLR was better. I played that on Dreamcast and didn't really have a hard time with it I think. Chronicles ultimately wasn't that hard either but it was a useless release.

Yeah I think TLR is one of my faves of the classic lot actually. 3 can suck it.

The old controls kind of work by the way. For example jumping a gap, there is a reason walking blocks you from falling off a ledge, its there to walk towards the very edge and then you will never fail the jump. If its a huge gap, then you are supposed to walk towards the edge, tap backwards for a backstep and press forward + jump. This will make a pixel perfect jump you will NEVER fail so far I remember at least. Now, in the updated games I lost count how many jumps I failed due to whatever reasons or the script let me die because I wasn't supposed to go there.

 

[Gelf]

Going by the fact that every post complains about the save system it seems there are no pc gamers here.

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Back then while I did play some stuff on a PC, games like Tomb Raider I always played on console because of joypad support and fears if my PC would even run it. I was aware of the save system difference though.

Funnily enough at the time after TR2 I wanted save crystals back as I felt it turned the game into a quicksave spam situation but the way they implemented them in 3 didnt really help as it makes you want to hoard saves rather than use them at logical locations. These days though, I'd just play the PC version and save when I feel like without spamming too much.

 

[Semfry]

Yes, TR3 is brutally difficult for first time players, with a bunch of nasty traps and generally treacherous levels, on top of being fucking massive (such that it's still one of the biggest "linear" games I can think of). That's without the save system of the Playstation Version, which the game just blatantly isn't designed for. Also, for some reason, the second level is one of the most brutal in the game, to the point the difficulty actually drops off somewhat for most of the midgame outside of the occasional spike.

It's my favourite in the series (and the genre) for how it pulls off such complexity and variety as a whole, in a way I've found few games to even come close to, but it's also much more flawed than the first two, and straight up unfair at times. In particular there's no reason to play the PS version (emulator aside) when the PC version's save anywhere fits the nature of the game far more.

 

[flatearthpandas]

Weird. I played the first three games a bunch as a kid and I'm pretty sure 3 is the only one I've actually beaten. Always thought the first two were more difficult

 

[Bamboo]

Going by the fact that every post complains about the save system it seems there are no pc gamers here.

Click to shrink...

I played it on PC, still didn't enjoy it as much as TR I or II, because of the length/scale of the levels.

 

[MikePT]

I haven't gonna back to it, but as a kid I remember being more difficult than 1 and 2. I've played it on playstation so the save system didn't help either

 

[Deleted member 5334]

It's weird. Tomb Raider I and II, while difficult, I never particularly found myself bashing my head against the wall like I recall on Tomb Raider III constantly. The biggest issue I had was Tomb Raider I in a couple levels, regarding the puzzle solving (the Midas hand bit in particular threw me off and I didn't realize you could open the menu to change the bars on it. In hindsight, the hand and Lara turning to Gold if you jumped onto it, should've been a clue, but eh. My cousin figured this one out for me), and really the only level that drove me up a wall really was the Floating Islands level in Tomb Raider II (I don't like this level just from the music to begin with, since it was incredibly unsettling, but sometimes I feel like the way the level is laid out, feels really freaking weird).

In fact, during my first attempt at the game, it was the only level I outright skipped, and then re-visited the level and figured out how it progressed. It's not nearly as bad nowadays, but I still think the layout of the level is really obtuse.

As for Nevada in Tomb Raider III, isn't there a section on the first level, where you have to scale a mountain area, but it's absolutely not clear how you're supposed to? Because I vaguely remember this, and being really the ONLY area that gave me trouble because of this in this entire section. The Prison and Area 51 were arguably easier in comparison for me, but my god.

London I think remains the worst section for me, though, since every level just made me feel like absolute misery. Seriously, if I do another playthrough, I feel like wanting to just 100% skip the DAMN Subway and Underground sections of that level, because it was absolute suffering for me.

In fact, I remember talking with a speedrunner fairly recently about the Subway section, and yeah, he was honestly in agreement with me on that part.

South Pacific I think I was largely okay, but there's some really weird things that goes on here, especially for multiple pathways and how traps and progression works in this.

 

[Phellps]

I don't find it too difficult, though it's my favorite in the series, so maybe I'm just used to it from all the replays.

 

[demi]

You should watch a Tomb Raider speedrun, they're so nutty.

Here is a TR3 one

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9n4LzsRvSk

 

[IsThatHP]

As a kid, I was never able to get far in TR3, I'd resort to cheats and just skip to antartica so I could play the fun mine cart levels.


I never had a problem with the final boss, surprised to hear so many had struggled against it. It was everything else in the game that easily grinded me into dust.