Tim Sweeney (Epic Games): Companies should divorce from politics, Android is a fake open system, iOS is worse, "respect Gamer rights and freedoms"

eyeball_kid

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,468
I respect Sweeney and Carmack for their development chops and their huge contributions to gaming, but both have revealed themselves over time to be such socially regressive asshats.
 

EdibleKnife

Member
Oct 29, 2017
4,853
I don't get people not wanting to support diversity because it's "shoehorned" and coming from a greedy positioning, but still supports non-diverse casts which clearly comes from the same greedy positioning of appealing to a supposedly larger demographic of uneducated people lol
It's all about straightness and whiteness and maleness being cast as normal/default in the minds of so many people and mainstream culture on the whole. In the mind of people like Sweeny, there is a distinction between "normal" art and "political" art. "Normal" art is about men like himself, always pure of ill-intention and generated by nothing but un-compromized artistic expression; while "political" art is about those who in his mind are not default. "Normal" art can be created for a profit and "political" art is suddenly impure, wrong or gross if it is made for a profit as well or considered in a business sense at all. His 'To Kill A Mockingbird' tweet says it all. To him, diversity and money making are supposed to be mutually distinct and there's no concept of wanting to create a valuable and diverse work of art while also making money off of it. To him only "normal" art gets to be uncritically made and consumed and only "normal" people get to matriculate into jobs and positions of influence without being scrutinized as greedy "diversity hires" and always solely about pure "merit".
 

massoluk

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,014
Gamers scream they want other industries to treat video games like a legitimate medium, but dont want it to take on legitimate issues, while crowing about the amount of revenue of the industry. And damn anyone that want to move the game industry forward to the social responsibility level of other mediums.
 
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EdibleKnife

Member
Oct 29, 2017
4,853
Gamers scream they want other industries to treat video games like a legitimate medium, but dont want it to be take on legitimate issues, while crowing about the amount of revenue of the industry. And damn anyone that want to move the game industry forward to the social responsibility level of other mediums.
In that sense, gaming has learned a lot from film media's history and culture and the gatekeepers therin. "Take us seriously and take our creative work seriously while on the side and behind closed doors, we spend decades excluding, silencing and desperately ignoring the voices and efforts of the marginalized and disenfranchised who love the medium as much as anyone else."
 

Vilam

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,054
Racing games imply that it's OK to burn fuel and release toxic chemicals into the atmosphere for fun.
Rolling my eyes. Forza isn't making any political commentary on the pros or cons of fossil fuels... It's simply a fun racing game to play. This is what people mean when they want to separate politics from games. Not concocting some silly narrative by examining a game through your political lens that the developers never intended. Can games be political? Sure. Should games be political? Some of them, absolutely. Is every game political? Of course not.
 

Catshade

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
776
There are arguments to be had about 'shoehorned inclusion' (e.g. Rise of Skywalker's 2-second lesbian kiss, Dumbledore is gay, etc.) and their motives, but it's still better than no inclusion at all. We should strive for better and representative inclusion, but 'shoehorned inclusion' is still baby steps in that long, grueling process.
 

Ars Arcanum

Member
Feb 3, 2019
239
Rolling my eyes. Forza isn't making any political commentary on the pros or cons of fossil fuels... It's simply a fun racing game to play. This is what people mean when they want to separate politics from games. Not concocting some silly narrative by examining a game through your political lens that the developers never intended. Can games be political? Sure. Should games be political? Some of them, absolutely. Is every game political? Of course not.
The person you quoted was being serious?
 

L Thammy

Spacenoid
Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,446
Gamers scream they want other industries to treat video games like a legitimate medium, but dont want it to take on legitimate issues, while crowing about the amount of revenue of the industry. And damn anyone that want to move the game industry forward to the social responsibility level of other mediums.
Wanting to be respected as big boys but still wanting their diapers changed when they shit themselves.
 

Zok310

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,020
Yeah, take the business/salesman advice about politic impacting the business and products she/he sells....
 

Chandler

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,327
Man, Tim is really trying to get the r/fuckepic Gamer crowd on his side, huh

Gamers scream they want other industries to treat video games like a legitimate medium, but dont want it to take on legitimate issues, while crowing about the amount of revenue of the industry. And damn anyone that want to move the game industry forward to the social responsibility level of other mediums.
"Games are art and they should be treated like it!"

games get subjected to criticism and make political statements visible enough for even gators to understand

"Wait not like that, RESPECT MY NICHE NERD CULTURE!"
 

EdibleKnife

Member
Oct 29, 2017
4,853
Man, Tim is really trying to get the r/fuckepic Gamer crowd on his side, huh


"Games are art and they should be treated like it!"

games gets subjected to criticism and make political statements visible enough for even gators to understand

"Wait not like that, RESPECT MY NICHE NERD CULTURE!"
More gems include:
"Why are you taking games so seriously?! It's just entertainment!"

So often I see nerds who idealize media as influential and powerful and praise works that were formative for them but balk at, insult and deride marginalized people who also recognize that and want to make it so works are more inclusive. It's a strange incongruity to see some straight white guy talk about how a game or film or book or album changed his life/made him the man he is one moment and the next will roast "feminists" or "SJWs" who want to have critical discussion of things that are "just disposable, unimportant entertainment". "I actually have a life so I have no time to worry about seeing myself represented in a dumb video game/show/movie! Why is this a thing black people/women/LGBTQ+ people are focused on? Aren't there some 'actual' issues that should be addressed?" is a condescending refrain I've heard way too often on message boards focused on media whenever the subject of diversity comes up. I hear it about as much as "they obviously will and should just hire the best people for the job".
 

Igniz12

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,568
glowing endorsement:

This is funny because Tim was supposed to be on this dirt's channel for an interview but ended up not doing it after twitter made him aware of what the Quatering was all about. Turns out they both share the same ideals. I wonder if he will do that interview now.
 

timedesk

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,047
Wow Tim just went all out trying to court the Gamergate crowd huh? What a cowardly statement.
 
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HiImNewGuy

Banned
Jan 17, 2020
14
User Banned (Permanent): Troll Account
I like what Sweeney is saying to be honest. The industry should be accepting of both conservative viewpoints and liberal viewpoints. No need to polarize the space
 

AJ_Wings

Member
Oct 31, 2017
1,070
“GAMERS RIGHTS!”

That shit is straight from r/fuckepic! LOL

Has he been hate-reading that sub in his spare time? Hey Timmy don’t you have a multi billion corporation to run ? Fuckin LOL
 

Hours Left

Member
Oct 26, 2017
10,036
It's always straight white men that don't want politics in media, despite all media being infested with their viewpoint.
 

RoninStrife

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,947
The more you live, the more you learn, most tech/game studios, publishers founders are going to be Libertarian with right leanings time and again. I wonder why that is?
 

btags

Member
Oct 26, 2017
798
Rochester NY
This man is stupid. I don't care how much money he has, or what he has contributed to the industry in terms of engine tech, he is just stupid.
 

Scottoest

Member
Feb 4, 2020
242
I respect Sweeney and Carmack for their development chops and their huge contributions to gaming, but both have revealed themselves over time to be such socially regressive asshats.
Carmack? I follow him on Twitter, and as far as I can tell, he pretty much exclusively talks about random nerdy programming stuff.
 

Armaros

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,998
Carmack? I follow him on Twitter, and as far as I can tell, he pretty much exclusively talks about random nerdy programming stuff.
Every so often he espouses his hardcore libertarian ideals. Like how workers dont need protections from being crunched and overworked etc.
 
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sirap

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,323
South East Asia
It really is hilarious that this is the guy video game journalists and indie developers champion.

I wonder if Sweeney’s biggest supporters will call him out on this? I realise it’s not as abhorrent as Valve giving their employees vacations to Hawaii, but still...
 

Armaros

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,998
Has Sweeny always been a POS or did the Fortnite money go to his head?
He was always pretty hardcore libertarian(like most hardcore tech folks of his generation) , he just didnt have as big of a public plateform as he does now to spout all this stuff, and back then social media wasnt that big.
 
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texhnolyze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,711
Indonesia
He would have to keep going pretty deep for that to ever happen there are alot of rich assholes that say similar stuff. I think if he ever starts quoting race bait shit then ERA will.
But that's basically just handwaving the current issue, and this is not the first time he said something like this. Yes, there are other rich assholes that share the same view as Tim, but he's not a regular figure in the video game industry. Many people, from users, developers, publishers, and journalists look up to him. If he's getting away with this kind of view, what would the future of gaming look like?
 

Amauri14

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,000
Danbury, CT, USA
If a game has a story, being apolitical is impossible, as one could always extract a message from the story, even if that's not the intention of its writer.
 

J2d

Member
Oct 26, 2017
777
It's probably been beaten to death but since you can sell dota and cs items you can get something out of it.

Edit: I'm daft and just woke up.
 

Treestump

Member
Mar 28, 2018
4,487
Gamers scream they want other industries to treat video games like a legitimate medium, but dont want it to take on legitimate issues, while crowing about the amount of revenue of the industry. And damn anyone that want to move the game industry forward to the social responsibility level of other mediums.
Video games should just be fun, man. No need for that real world stuff in my games. By the way, did you know Bioshock is great.

sarcasm btw just in case.
 

Mazzle

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,285
Germany
And saying something like "Gamers Right" is apolitical?
Geez Tim, just admit you just wanna have the money, even from the scum Gamers and don't care what damage they cause
 
Reading the venture beat article yeah there are some things he said that I agree with. Platforms being open to cross play across all devices is a no brainer and I will say that I don’t think we would be where we are now if it wasn’t for fortnight and Epic pushing for cross play so hard with all the console makers.

mom the other hand the man complained that google gives warnings when people side load apps onto their device lol.Oh and theirs the entire take around companies themselves not taking a stand on politics. But allowing employees too. Which ia is something I don’t agree with much at all in the year 2020.
 
Jun 2, 2019
1,972
Jesus fuck Sweeney shut the fuck up

This guy is *this* close to do a Markus Persson, and he's going to drag Epic through the mud while doing it
 

qrac

Member
Nov 13, 2017
532
Weird.. My take on his comments are mostly regarding Tencent and Huawei. That these companies shouldn't be caught up in the politics of US vs China. That Android is fake open as in that US companies have spyware in it, regarding the whole 'Huawei is spying on consumers through their tech'.