Too many of my friends trying Destiny 2 haven’t a clue on how to start the campaigns

Agent 47

Member
Jun 24, 2018
1,441
I feel like this isn't fair. Maybe if this were the first Destiny release in the franchise history, but a lot of people played the original game and even some of Destiny 2 before coming back with this release. We all came in with certain expectations of how the game might flow with a structured narrative and guided progression, but it's not made clear that those no longer apply at all.



Because as someone who has played an online game with a hub/MMORPG, being popped into the main town and told about vendors does not scream "tutorial" to me.
If you read the pop up though it's not just about vendors.
 

Border

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,002
When Blizz gave it away for free last year I played for like 10 hours and dropped it because of how poorly matchmaking was. I couldn't figure out how to find people for the campaign. And there should have been plenty of people given it was just put out as free. There's no excuse, because I've never had trouble matchmaking with people, even with different levels in The Division 1/2 or Dying Light. Do people in Des2 just not do campaign missions once they reach end-game? Other games design themselves to incentivise people playing together more.
There isn’t match-making for the campaign. Most people at endgame will replay old missions if they are the Daily Heroic or whatever, but even then you have to find partners on your own.
 

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,303
That's fine. I disagree that the player is "to blame" for not having read a fucking pop-up text box that is very easy to dismiss. It's not even that clear. "Talk to everyone with this icon" is all it tells you and the first guy you talk to gives you a gun and tries to send you on some random strike? How is that any indication that talking to further heads with quest icons will lead you to the main story?
They are to blame if they don't read it, and it spells it out. If you read the text, you will know what to do to find the campaigns at the least...

Hkwever, as this is happening so much, Bungie need to make it so you cannot skip until you understand.
 

Zefah

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,797
If you read the pop up though it's not just about vendors.
It's clearly a pop-up welcoming you to the hub and telling yo a bit about what you can do there. That's the first paragraph.

They are to blame, it spells it out. If you read the text, you will know what to do to find the campaigns at the least...

However, because they are doing this, and many are certainly not even bothering to read it, Bubgie needs to make it so you absolutely cannot skip it without understanding it.
*IF* you make it to that very specific NPC... Why not just tell you that in the initial text box? Talking about vendors and some recommended "new light" quest line? It doesn't make a lot of sense.
 

Strakt

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,163
When Blizz gave it away for free last year I played for like 10 hours and dropped it because of how poorly matchmaking was. I couldn't figure out how to find people for the campaign. And there should have been plenty of people given it was just put out as free. There's no excuse, because I've never had trouble matchmaking with people, even with different levels in The Division 1/2 or Dying Light. Do people in Des2 just not do campaign missions once they reach end-game? Other games design themselves to incentivise people playing together more.
Why would people do campaign missions once they reach end game? While the campaigns are cool and all, its pretty much just content you rush through to get to the real game (which is grinding light levels and loot). The game also has matchmaking now for almost every activity in the game minus the raids and the really hard dungeons.
 

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,303
It's clearly a pop-up welcoming you to the hub and telling yo a bit about what you can do there. That's the first paragraph.
And if you read it all properly... it tells you what to do?

If you dismissed it without reading it properly, you are to blame for that.
 

Spacejaws

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,960
Scotland
I'm enjoying it but the first stuff I followed was the ones labeled 'Tutorial' which had me go to each planet and speak to their quest givers and suggest to accept bounties and now I've got a page full of quests and bounties. I found the main quest now but I thought it was quite easy to bog yourself down with side content without realizing you've not really started the campaign.
 

Armaros

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,509
Why would people do campaign missions once they reach end game? While the campaigns are cool and all, its pretty much just content you rush through to get to the real game (which is grinding light levels and loot). The game also has matchmaking now for almost every activity in the game minus the raids and the really hard dungeons.
Because new players might want to understand what is going on? like how every NPC talks about how you are grieving for a dead NPC that a new player has never met before?
 

Zefah

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,797
And if you read it all properly... it tells you what to do?

If you dismissed it without reading it properly, you are to blame for that.
I did read it, but I dismissed it as not being relevant to what I was looking for: the campaign missions that I left off when I first played.

The message of, "We highly recommend completing the "New Light" quest line, by following the Destiny icon, for an introduction to Destiny 2's various game modes, vendors, and systems." does nothing to indicate how I get to the story missions. I figured it was just some introduction for the f2p version that I had heard about or some basic guide of the town.
 

Strakt

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,163
Because new players might want to understand what is going on? like how every NPC talks about how you are grieving for a dead NPC that a new player has never met before?
???

So new players can do the campaigns if they want to.. you dont need matchmaking for campaign missions... they are designed to play solo (or you can invite friends). What does that have ANYTHING to do with players who are at end game content who have done the campaigns already?
 

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,303
I did read it, but I dismissed it as not being relevant to what I was looking for: the campaign missions that I left off when I first played.

The message of, "We highly recommend completing the "New Light" quest line, by following the Destiny icon, for an introduction to Destiny 2's various game modes, vendors, and systems." does nothing to indicate that I will be playing through story missions. I figured it was just some introduction for the f2p version that I had heard about.
Then you didn't read it properly if you dismissed it as not being relevant, because it spells out that it is relevant.

I don't know why you can't just say "my bad, I can see I shouldn't have dismissed it.". I've clicked through tutorials before and missed obvious stuff, that was one me then too.

It obviously needs to be clearer, though....
 

Toni

Avenger
Nov 13, 2017
1,853
Orlando, Florida
Yeah, its badly done for new players. It was weird because it started like D1 and then just throws you into a semi open world with no cleasr direction or story driving it forward.
The honest truth, is that Bungie would have to set aside developers to create extra set pieces, sequences and put more resources to New Light to properly connect the pieces and form a coherent, story line experience for new players. Which could rupture the crazy content schedule they have currently in place for Destiny 2.

It's disappointing that this is Destiny's big blow out and it's met with a very under-developed introduction to Destiny.

Bungie should have just left the entire Destiny 2 campaign in and implemented a recap cinematic video for New Light.
 

gcwy

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,227
Michigan
I had the exact same issue. Ended up uninstalling it. And I’m not someone who’s bad at video games.
 

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,303
The honest truth, is that Bungie would have to set aside developers to create extra set pieces, sequences and put more resources to New Light to properly connect the pieces and form a coherent, story line experience for new players. Which could rupture the crazy content schedule they have currently in place for Destiny 2.

It's a disappointing that this is Destiny's big blow out and it's met with a very under-developed introduction to Destiny.

Bungie should have just left the entire Destiny 2 campaign in and implemented a recap cinematic video for New Light.
Yep, this tbh. It is half-baked.
 

Proven

Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,735
Destiny’s biggest issue is that it doesn’t explain anything well.

And it’s not because Bungie is purposely being vague or anything, it’s because they have done a terrible job for the past 5 years explaining what you’re supposed to do.
 

Armaros

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,509
Destiny’s biggest issue is that it doesn’t explain anything well.

And it’s not because Bungie is purposely being vague or anything, it’s because they have done a terrible job for the past 5 years explaining what you’re supposed to do.
They are 100% relying on the community to ease new players into the game.
 

SlickShoes

Member
Oct 27, 2017
766
By the time you find or speak to Amanda you have picked up about 15 quests and 15 bounties from the other people you speak to first so it’s easy to go around that little square and think the in boarding is just that. Amanda is away in the hangar and not front a center like the others.

it’s easy to understand that some people will miss out talking to her, when I started she never even had the blue icon so I just never went along that way and I had already been bombarded by so many activities that I assumed one of them was the main story of the game.
 

SmartWaffles

Member
Nov 15, 2017
2,958
I mean, it obviously needs to be clearer due to the high amount of people failing to understand.

But I guarantee you, a large portion of those people just didn't bother to read it.
Because throwing people into the world of a fairly complex game without a well thought out guidance is a terrible thing to do period. User experience and player psychology is a legit thing that needs to be taken into account when designing experiences like this and Bungie failed big time on this one. Having a couple text to read doesn't do anything realistically. For a commercial product like this, there is a higher bar to reach.
 

Maelstorm1226

Member
Oct 31, 2017
53
I think one of the biggest issues is Destiny 1 & Destiny 2 are separate games, which makes the continuation of the story very jarring for new players. There are whole story-lines from D1 that are referenced in D2, especially with Shadowkeep. For example, my wife never played D1 and has no idea the importance of Crota. I can't blame her for that, Bungie literally just throws Crota into Shadowkeep and automatically assumes you know who he is.

I hope Bungie sees all of this feedback and puts effort into making the new player experience better for new players. There is a lot of story in Destiny, they just need to link it all together.
 

Baked Pigeon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,500
Phoenix
Luckily, someone in the Destiny thread was kind enough to tell me how to start the legacy quests. I was completely lost when I started.

My new issue now is I bought a couple weekly challenges with my in game points and i found out I can't actually do them until I beat the campaigns. So why allow me to purchase them in the first place? Everything presentation wise is super sloppy.
 
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astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,303
Because throwing people into the world of a fairly complex game without a well thought out guidance is a terrible thing to do period. User experience and player psychology is a legit thing that needs to be taken into account when designing experiences like this and Bungie failed big time on this one. Having a couple text to read doesn't do anything realistically. For a commercial product like this, there is a higher bar to reach.
I have made it clear I agree that in the new player experience is bad.
 

Flipyap

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,684
And, when you visit Amanda, she literally tells you:



-

So, I do not get how any new players missed this unless they just didn't read the text and follow the on-screen instructions.

While the game 100% needs better onboarding for it's various systems, it literally spells out how to find the campaigns....
I can't blame anyone for not realizing that a tutorial pop-up that sounds like it's teaching you how to replay old missions actually means that this is the place to find the game's story mode.
The word "replay" sure is a choice if that really pops up for brand new characters. The whole thing sounds like "You can replay campaigns here, also you can't replay campaigns."
 

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,303
I can't blame anyone for not realizing that a tutorial pop-up that sounds like it's teaching you how to replay old missions actually means that this is the place to find the game's story mode.
The word "replay" sure is a choice if that really pops up for brand new characters. The whole thing sounds like "You can replay campaigns here, also you can't replay campaigns."
I personally think this part is very clear.

It obviously needs to be both clearer and not skipable, though.
 

Lausebub

Member
Nov 4, 2017
416
Played 6 hours of Destiny 2 and thought there just weren't any story quest. Might reinstall it now.
 

Agent 47

Member
Jun 24, 2018
1,441
It's clearly a pop-up welcoming you to the hub and telling yo a bit about what you can do there. That's the first paragraph.



*IF* you make it to that very specific NPC... Why not just tell you that in the initial text box? Talking about vendors and some recommended "new light" quest line? It doesn't make a lot of sense.
Yeah it even tells you there are quest givers in the tower in that first paragraph. Also finishes with a link to a guide if you're having trouble figuring it out.

These players hammering through tutorial pop ups then blaming the game are likely the same that want matchmaking for raids hahahaha
 
Dec 11, 2018
2,368
Yeah it even tells you there are quest givers in the tower in that first paragraph. Also finishes with a link to a guide if you're having trouble figuring it out.

These players hammering through tutorial pop ups then blaming the game are likely the same that want matchmaking for raids hahahaha
You think people that never made it to the raids are the ones asking for matchmaking in raids?
 

Nostremitus

Member
Nov 15, 2017
3,942
New Light is legit terrible though. You can’t treat new players as if they’ve been playing the game for five years.
But if they filled the quest log with everything to do off the bat this thread would be about how you are given so much to do up front that it's completely overwhelming. Better to just explore and find things to do. I started playing during Forsaken and the initial onslaught of icons and quests was crazy. This game has way too much for a person to do to throw it all at you.
 

Zefah

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,797
Yeah it even tells you there are quest givers in the tower in that first paragraph. Also finishes with a link to a guide if you're having trouble figuring it out.

These players hammering through tutorial pop ups then blaming the game are likely the same that want matchmaking for raids hahahaha
The tutorial section immediately before it is very guided and teaches you how to play and what to do through gameplay and voiced segments. You don’t think it’s jarring that it immediately switches to poorly-worded text pop-ups to explain things after you get your ship? The presentation is awful.
 

Zefah

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,797
Not really, it's a snide comments about the general intelligence level on display in most of these current Destiny threads.
Wow, insulting people’s intelligence for not immediately getting the inconsistent and obtuse presentation. You seem to lack the perspective that this all makes sense to you because you’ve been playing the game for a long time and are fully tuned in.

People could probably figure out what’s going on by carefully reading and talking to everyone in the citadel or reading forums/Googling shit. It’s not like people are too dumb to do that. It’s that the game makes such a poor effort onboarding players that it makes people just say, “fuck it,” which is very easy when you’re not invested and only decided to check out the game because of the big new re-release. This is Bungie’s big push for a new start of sorts on a new platform, free from Activision, and it’s just a huge blunder.
 

Dr.Acula

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,432
There isn’t match-making for the campaign. Most people at endgame will replay old missions if they are the Daily Heroic or whatever, but even then you have to find partners on your own.
That's disappointing, I like co-op games, and playing through a co-op campaign solo for 20 hours is unappealing to me. I'm playing Gears 5, and at least having an NPC tag along reduces the loneliness a bit, lol. I think the first time I played a bullet-sponge giant boss in Des2 that launched missiles or whatever and had trash mods all around it made me think, "this is really designed for multiple people drawing agro, because kiting this thing solo is just tedious."

Why would people do campaign missions once they reach end game? While the campaigns are cool and all, its pretty much just content you rush through to get to the real game (which is grinding light levels and loot). The game also has matchmaking now for almost every activity in the game minus the raids and the really hard dungeons.
So Div2 has level scaling and drops tuned by level individually, weekly missions involving replaying story missions, certain story missions being keyed to types of drops (submachine guns, sniper rifles, chest armour etc.) a special ranking system for people who "shepherd" newer players. Ubi has spent a lot of time designing the game so that even the story content has replayability and that people of different levels can play together and still have an enjoyable and easy experience. This means that even in the beginning of the game when I was sub level-30, I was matching with people who had max gearscore easily.
 

Strakt

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,163
That's disappointing, I like co-op games, and playing through a co-op campaign solo for 20 hours is unappealing to me. I'm playing Gears 5, and at least having an NPC tag along reduces the loneliness a bit, lol. I think the first time I played a bullet-sponge giant boss in Des2 that launched missiles or whatever and had trash mods all around it made me think, "this is really designed for multiple people drawing agro, because kiting this thing solo is just tedious."



So Div2 has level scaling and drops tuned by level individually, weekly missions involving replaying story missions, certain story missions being keyed to types of drops (submachine guns, sniper rifles, chest armour etc.) a special ranking system for people who "shepherd" newer players. Ubi has spent a lot of time designing the game so that even the story content has replayability and that people of different levels can play together and still have an enjoyable and easy experience. This means that even in the beginning of the game when I was sub level-30, I was matching with people who had max gearscore easily.
The point of Destiny isn't to replay story missions. If you think Destiny's main focus is story content then I got bad news for you.

Destiny has matchmaking for:

Crucible
Strikes
Gambit
Gambit Prime
Menagerie
Nightfall Ordeal
Vex Offensive
Black Armory
Reckoning
Nightmare Hunts
It also has matchmaking for raids called Guided Games but I don't think many people use that due to how hard raids are.
 
Dec 21, 2017
9,885
Can someone here please give me a a clear cut path to raising light level at this point of Destiny 2's life cycle? I'm a returning player, played the hell out of Destiny 1 and its expansions, played the hell out of Destiny 2 at launch but never bought into any of this games expansions. I downloaded the free steam version and was confused as hell how the game even operates now. It took reading the forum to figure out where to get my bearings. However the story quests quite frankly feel worthless. It's honestly been a pretty frustrating experience trying to jump back into it and I'm not prepared to drop money into the game again quite yet. But is there anything for a f2p player to do right now who wants to power up and collect loot? I'm not interested in the pvp. I'm thinking unless I buy that $25 expansion or the newest one for even more money there's no point of me even bothering with it.
 

Donos

Member
Nov 15, 2017
2,797
Good to know with the campaign. Played it for 2 hours and was confused (never played D1 but watched a few longer vids).

Going to reinstall it again since some people in an older thread said that it's fine playing alone (don't want to play with anyone).
 

Darknight34

Member
Apr 29, 2018
147
Even if blame is cast on the players... Bungie should strive for better. This is kinda like an mmo in how obtuse it is, but it's worse than many I've played.
 

Border

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,002
That's disappointing, I like co-op games, and playing through a co-op campaign solo for 20 hours is unappealing to me. I'm playing Gears 5, and at least having an NPC tag along reduces the loneliness a bit, lol. I think the first time I played a bullet-sponge giant boss in Des2 that launched missiles or whatever and had trash mods all around it made me think, "this is really designed for multiple people drawing agro, because kiting this thing solo is just tedious."
My recollection isn't perfect, but I think the Destiny 2 campaign only has one boss fight at the very end. Most all of the missions are designed to be played solo. I do think the final mission can get kinda nasty without partners though.
 
Nov 14, 2017
2,182
So, I do not get how any new players missed this unless they just didn't read the text and follow the on-screen instructions.
So what you're saying is, you totally get how new players managed to miss the campaigns.

Seriously though, there should be a permanent marker on Amanda until all the stories are done. That way players know that she has stuff for them to do.
 

Bold One

Member
Oct 30, 2017
7,637
Honestly, if you want people to understand your systems, properly gate them through each of them. They shouldn't throw you to Zaldana which some exposition talk you barely can make sense of it and several other NPC. The first thing they should do is mark Amanda and only Amanda, make them understand what is a main quest in the game, force them do one and the explain how do you progress throught the game, why do I care about strikes anyway? Explain that shit later, explain dailies challenges later, explain all that stuff those 4 different NPC says and the stuff they give you sequentially.

The rundown to all the different systems in the game is hapzardly done and that's not the players fault. There's several years of content, you should slowly introduce players to them. Trying to make new players to do content with veterans in the game after the first hour was clearly a mistake.



Then I got nothing.
Who the hell Zaldana?
 

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,303
So what you're saying is, you totally get how new players managed to miss the campaigns.

Seriously though, there should be a permanent marker on Amanda until all the stories are done. That way players know that she has stuff for them to do.
I get it overall, people skip and don't pay attention to text pop ups. And it's obvious it needs to be much clearer and not skipable.
 

Charismagik

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,658
Add me to the confused pile. i played D2, but am fuzzy on the details. The systems have changed so much that I have no idea what half of it means anymore. Now I get dumped into this and I'm like uhhhhhhh. Feels like adventure mode in D3 where you can kind of go wherever. In a way I kinda like that, but not if I wanted to follow a story. The funny part was a video I watched from the devs explaining how they were making it geared toward new players and not to overwhelm them lol
 

Sargerus

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
7,897
Story was never a priority for Bungie when it comes to Destiny. This re-release plus Shadowkeep's ending just proves it.
 

Xater

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,181
Germany
By the time you find or speak to Amanda you have picked up about 15 quests and 15 bounties from the other people you speak to first so it’s easy to go around that little square and think the in boarding is just that. Amanda is away in the hangar and not front a center like the others.

it’s easy to understand that some people will miss out talking to her, when I started she never even had the blue icon so I just never went along that way and I had already been bombarded by so many activities that I assumed one of them was the main story of the game.
That was also my experience. I had a bunch of quests and no blue market that would lead me to her. So I thought Ihad to do these tutorial quest. So I was off to the EDZ doing a adventure. Following these quests didn't lead me to the story of course.
 
Yeah, the new player experience is...not great, beyond the first mission. They should have made early progression much more focused, directing players to all the important things one by one, rather than just opening everything up early on.
 

shuno

Member
Oct 28, 2017
404
Well, it's terrible overall.

I started a new char with a friend at steam release and we're doing quests. 15 hours in we found out we can play the legacy campaigns through some random NPC.

I told him the whole time I don't understand whats going on, since the last time I played the tower was destroyed or something (played beta and some hours on bnet). We did the introduction quests and now are trapped with only fetch quests (kill 100 of that, kill 200 with this, bla). Story until now basically non existent. Meh.

And then all of these other shortcomings on top. You have to claim your archievements/triumphs to show up. No way to see what strike you already did then having your mate checking the triumphs while you stay in the map overview. The map (Destinations) still feels like a straight D1 port. No zoom, no infos, no nothing. Snapping back to the center if your mouse leaves the border. Like yeah, this is a bad console port, we get it... but why so terri-bad? Then there are a shitload of icons on the destination map beside the planets and no tooltip or anything. I don't understand what they are trying to tell me.

Same with the quest log. No explanations at all. Tracking doesn't do shit. ...

I remember back then with D1 you had to read the web to understand the lore at all, but now you need a wiki to get the basics figured out? Meh. Gunplay is fun, no doubt, but the other 80% of the game are not.

And why are there so many MTX when you have to buy the current expansions for more then 50€?

Why kill 80% of the content by boosting and leaving you with some dull hours of fetch-quests until the point where you need to buy the expansions? Eh.
 
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