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MilkBeard

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,778
I still think Tool's music can be called complex. It's just not outwardly facing in the melodic component. A lot of the complexity is in the rhythm patterns and how the instruments come together. Oh yeah. And next time a popular band bases their rhythm and lyrics on the Fibonacci sequence, let me know.
 

RDreamer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,102
I still think Tool's music can be called complex. It's just not outwardly facing in the melodic component. A lot of the complexity is in the rhythm patterns and how the instruments come together. Oh yeah. And next time a popular band bases their rhythm and lyrics on the Fibonacci sequence, let me know.
You don't become a popular band by just making complex things. They made complex things digestible to a lot of people. Complex often doesn't sound good. Experimental often doesn't sound good. They dulled it just enough and infused it with some other qualities, which is a big talent. That's also been Radiohead's big thing. They balance experimentalism and pop sensibilities to make them digestible to more people.

I think both bands are highly overrated because of fanbases largely comparing to popular bands but at the same time both bands are still very good. They get a lot of angry detractors and ardent supporters though because of that.
 

MilkBeard

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,778
You don't become a popular band by just making complex things. They made complex things digestible to a lot of people. Complex often doesn't sound good. Experimental often doesn't sound good. They dulled it just enough and infused it with some other qualities, which is a big talent. That's also been Radiohead's big thing. They balance experimentalism and pop sensibilities to make them digestible to more people.

I think both bands are highly overrated because of fanbases largely comparing to popular bands but at the same time both bands are still very good. They get a lot of angry detractors and ardent supporters though because of that.
I think that's fair, and I agree. Complexity comes in different ways, which is why I think limiting complexity of music only to note composition is a pretty narrow view, or at least a single-minded view, when in fact there are a lot of parts at play.

But yeah, I won't disagree with you if people call Tool or Radiohead overrated. I mean, I like both of them, but it's the very definition of popularity. Some bands become popular because of reasons, while other, perhaps even more talented, bands languish. It's just how it works.

But I've been following that producer I posted a while ago. He used to be a teacher of classical and jazz composition. After some time he just "fell in love" with rock music after not really paying attention to it. Basically, making something simple and digestible is actually difficult, and can be considered a talent.

It's why the simplest pop songs have like 5-10 writers and producers.

But anyway. Yeah diehard fans who worship their choice in question look like fools. It's good to broaden your horizons.
 

mentalfloss

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
282
I feel like this first track isn't necessarily representative of the album in terms of 'hardness'.

Feels like it's more of a pleasant introduction but there's going to be some meaner riffs to come.
 

Poimandres

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,855
I'm sorry to report that I've heard from someone I trust in a band that there's plenty of smoke swirling around Maynard doing questionable things with groupies and such. This is from people she knows her were involved with an APC tour. I don't have anything specific, and I don't know the extent of it.

But... It's utterly depressing that a lot of art I enjoy is almost certainly tainted in some form or another. The music industry in particular positively normalised a life of excess for decades, so what the hell do you think was going on? I guarantee that plenty of bad people were involved with many things you enjoy. Whether this is enough to stop you from listening to music, or watching a movie etc is up to you.
 

SinkFla

Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,431
Pensacola, Fl
I'm sorry to report that I've heard from someone I trust in a band that there's plenty of smoke swirling around Maynard doing questionable things with groupies and such. This is from people she knows her were involved with an APC tour. I don't have anything specific, and I don't know the extent of it.

But... It's utterly depressing that a lot of art I enjoy is almost certainly tainted in some form or another. The music industry in particular positively normalised a life of excess for decades, so what the hell do you think was going on? I guarantee that plenty of bad people were involved with many things you enjoy. Whether this is enough to stop you from listening to music, or watching a movie etc is up to you.

Wasn't this something someone brought up on Reddit about a year ago and was shot down by Maynard, and dwindled into obscurity?
 
Oct 27, 2017
7,885
e26.jpg
 

LGHT_TRSN

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,123
Lmao we exist in a culture where buying a new smartphone every year is normalized and people up in here getting pissed off about a limited edition CD after 13 years.
 

deafmedal

Member
Oct 25, 2017
546
I like when TOOL songs come on when working out, helps me judge time without looking at the clock plus I get to zen out listening 😎
3-5 TOOL songs makes a great elliptical run!
 

astroturfing

Member
Nov 1, 2017
6,446
Suomi Finland
Lmao we exist in a culture where buying a new smartphone every year is normalized and people up in here getting pissed off about a limited edition CD after 13 years.
yeah no kidding lol. i dont think the math adds up to justify outrage.. how much extra carbon emissions exactly did this limited edition cause? its limited, so it might be less problematic than investing the same amount of money to produce regular editions (which would be much higher in numbers, increasing shipping related pollution etc). who knows? i don't.
 

Praxis

Sausage Tycoon
Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,230
UK
I fucking hate superhero crap that is shit out on a regular bases, yet I'm not a big enough asshole to go into those threads to say.

Some people
 

Toreal

Member
Nov 5, 2017
91
I am totally in love with this new song, I must have listened to it over a hundred times already.


Next friday cant come soon enough!!
I think only games and music can make me feel like a kid at Christmas.
First listen will be at a friends place with a good hifi system, but I also bought new headphones for this album.
13 years... The thirst is real!
 
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MilkBeard

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,778
I am totally in love with this new song, I must have listened to it over a hundred times already.
It even inspired me to make a fan video haha.


Next friday cant come soon enough!!
I think only games and music can make me feel like a kid at Christmas.
First listen will be at a friends place with a good hifi system, but I also bought new headphones for this album.
13 years... The thirst is real!

Yeah, I've probably listened to this song like 30-40 times by now. It's such a good track to chill to, to sit and listen to, to work to, etc. so I just put it on in my mixes a lot when I'm working. Can't wait for the full album. I'm going to just turn it on and play from start to finish, and blast it.
 

Garble Slew

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,349
Atlanta, Georgia
Long story short, I didn't pre-order. Anyone know if it will be possible for me to show up to a Target or Walmart at opening and grab a copy on release day? Any retail working folks who can confirm it'll be in stores?
 

deafmedal

Member
Oct 25, 2017
546
Next friday cant come soon enough!!
I think only games and music can make me feel like a kid at Christmas.
First listen will be at a friends place with a good hifi system, but I also bought new headphones for this album.
Right.
I'm torn as I am currently out of town but planning to be home for the holiday weekend on Friday... Do I wait and listen to the CD first once I'm home? Do I listen to the Apple Music version as soon as it's available? Do I listen to the download version that comes with the extra tracks first? Then there is the question of which way will I listen if I'm at home- HomePods, theater system, nice sound bar in the bedroom, monitors in my music room (new set came in earlier this week, won't be burned in and old set has an issue with one tweeter), or decent headphones?!? Too many choices heh.

Still haven't heard the new track, I'll be going in clean assfuck :) Didn't look at that 'unboxing' either, thanks for not spoiling!
 

Deleted member 1659

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,191
Long story short, I didn't pre-order. Anyone know if it will be possible for me to show up to a Target or Walmart at opening and grab a copy on release day? Any retail working folks who can confirm it'll be in stores?

Based on what the prices on ebay are going for the limited edition album, I'm assuming it's sold out.
 

rusty chrome

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,640
Isn't Maynard literally a rapist?
Uh that was a random Twitter post and the guy who posted that got doxxed. Turns out he was doing the same thing to Trent Reznor. He was pretending to be a young girl and it turned out to be a guy who looked like mid-30's. These Twitter trolls have no life, so if you follow that site religiously, you should probably take a very long break.
 

Gouty

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,658
I don't know why this album hasn't leaked yet but I do know that I blame millennials.
 

Miles Davis

Alt account
Banned
Jun 22, 2019
802
Good post. So yeah, don't get me wrong. I love "simple" music, I often find more complexity in minimalism if done right. It's not a competition to have the most complicated or challenging music, I just find it weird when people call Tool "complex", because it's really not. And that's not a bad thing either.
I would call certain parts of it complex. Danny's drums are certainly very complex in parts. Their overall sound is pretty riffy, but the bass has definitely been getting more complex and intertwined over the years. But I do think people tend to go overboard. I've honestly seen no fanbase as rabid as Tool.

Now King Crimson or something of that nature is definitely a lot more complex in many passages, and I think a lot of people tend to think Tool is complex because they are younger.

yeah no kidding lol. i dont think the math adds up to justify outrage.. how much extra carbon emissions exactly did this limited edition cause? its limited, so it might be less problematic than investing the same amount of money to produce regular editions (which would be much higher in numbers, increasing shipping related pollution etc). who knows? i don't.
I am someone that buys King Crimson's lavish boxsets, I don't think I can shell out for some rando shit for this deluxe. I mean for like 140 KC gives you blurays, all kinds of booklets, pictures, and about 25 discs in total for a lot of the boxsets.

This is just some random LCD shit with almost nothing of consequence. I would agree it's a waste, but it's a good idea to sell your album for a lot more money without providing much substance at all. As for waste well yeah this is a little weird. I for one am not interested in the slightest bit with this deluxe. I will pick up the main album as I do for all their albums. This is not really a deluxe to me. There is almost no extra material or anything that matters. Not a huge fan of the cover art either.

Blame King Crimson, Yes, etc.
King Crimson is a vastly superior band to most bands, and no blame should ever be placed on them for anything. They have one of the most solid discographies in all of music with some of the most talented musicians in the entire industry playing for them.

Also, the rape thing is pretty suspect, but you never know. Without more evidence it's impossible to logically verify anything. Maynard has been known to be with groupies and what not from the old days, and he is known to have done some slightly weird shit with girl press conferences or whatever at shows. But that doesn't equate to rape.
 
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gabdeg

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,956
🐝
Man, I'm glad that at the end of all that bullshit i just scrolled through there was some actual news in the new posts in this thread.

Yesterday I relistened to the title track and I think it clicked for me, which is good timing shortly before the release of the album.
 
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MilkBeard

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,778
People are saying the Descending and Invincible album versions are amazing. Can't wait to hear it
 

Scarface

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,076
Canada
I am also very glad I waited to listen to any tracks prior to getting the whole album. I really love FI as a track. The intro is so damn good.
 

MilkBeard

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,778
My god do the drums sound amazing in later songs. And Adam's riffage has stepped up to a new level. And the new effects... and the.... whew