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Trump Calls For Ban On all Flavored Vapes and e-cigarettes

Goldenroad

Member
Nov 2, 2017
3,231
I think if even one person picks up smoking or switches from vaping to smoking as a result of this policy change, it will be an immense failure as a public health policy...and I guarantee you at least one person will.
 

shira

Community Resetter
Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,411
Cigarettes killing for years, no action. Guns killing for years, no action. One report on vaping having negative health effects, BAN IT!!

Screw Trump.
US Food and Drug Administration would be putting out "some very strong recommendations" regarding the use of flavored e-cigarettes in "a couple of weeks."

I think the thought process is he wants the flavors banned so kids are less likely to use it.
I don't think that's a ban on vaping.
 

Space Madness

Member
Oct 27, 2017
242
US Food and Drug Administration would be putting out "some very strong recommendations" regarding the use of flavored e-cigarettes in "a couple of weeks."

I think the thought process is he wants the flavors banned so kids are less likely to use it.
I don't think that's a ban on vaping.
Kids have smoked tobacco flavored cigarettes for decades. This won't keep kids from smoking. This isn't about keeping kids from smoking.

The ban on flavored juice will kill a large portion of the juice industry that competes by offering different flavors. The FDA regulations as initially proposed in 2016 were so onerous that they'll put most e cigarette companies out of business if enforced. This will very likely kill the parts of the vaping industry that aren't owned by big tobacco. It will also drive all of those adults who quit smoking for vaping, back to smoking. So much for harm reduction, right?
 
OP
OP
Border

Border

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,611
People still don't understand that the tobacco industry is heavily and deeply invested in vaping now. Trump isn't doing this as a favor to them. This will almost assuredly hurt them.
 

caliph95

Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,253
US Food and Drug Administration would be putting out "some very strong recommendations" regarding the use of flavored e-cigarettes in "a couple of weeks."

I think the thought process is he wants the flavors banned so kids are less likely to use it.
I don't think that's a ban on vaping.
Banning flavors that adults also use isn't going to stop people from smoking

Kids smoke cigarettes and those taste like shit

We might as well ban alcohol if that was the reason and you crackdown on the sale to kids if its what you care about
 
OP
OP
Border

Border

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,611
Couldn't you presumably just sell plain juice that contains nicotine, and then "on the side" sell flavor juice that can be added to the nicotine juice?
 

Joeschmo

Member
Jul 11, 2018
15
Unreal that some people here agree with this. There always has been and always will be so much misinformation spread about vaping and lots of people just lap it up.
 

jfkgoblue

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,319
Kids have smoked tobacco flavored cigarettes for decades. This won't keep kids from smoking. This isn't about keeping kids from smoking.

The ban on flavored juice will kill a large portion of the juice industry that competes by offering different flavors. The FDA regulations as initially proposed in 2016 were so onerous that they'll put most e cigarette companies out of business if enforced. This will very likely kill the parts of the vaping industry that aren't owned by big tobacco. It will also drive all of those adults who quit smoking for vaping, back to smoking. So much for harm reduction, right?
Smoking by kids plummeted in the 90’s and 2000’s, vaping has pretty much undone all that work to stop kids from smoking in less than 5 years.

Flavored cigarettes got banned for the same reason.

Also I thought that people vape because it’s “healthier” than smoking? Why would just banning the flavors make them go back to smoking?
 

shira

Community Resetter
Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,411
Kids have smoked tobacco flavored cigarettes for decades. This won't keep kids from smoking. This isn't about keeping kids from smoking.

The ban on flavored juice will kill a large portion of the juice industry that competes by offering different flavors. The FDA regulations as initially proposed in 2016 were so onerous that they'll put most e cigarette companies out of business if enforced. This will very likely kill the parts of the vaping industry that aren't owned by big tobacco. It will also drive all of those adults who quit smoking for vaping, back to smoking. So much for harm reduction, right?
Ahh this makes more sense now.
Line the pockets of Big Tobacco.
 

Ehoavash

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,848
it's gona be interesting.. so many people i know vape now
i wonder how it'll affect some of them. cause I know few who never smoked a cigarette but vape....hmm will they turn to actual cigarettes ?

Vaping is especially rampant on snapchat for me so many people be doing their juuls while in their car seat and using it as their latest snap
 

Beefy

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,288
So flavours are only getting banned, not a outright vaping ban.

Why does this smell of tobacco trying to stop competition?
 

Dyle

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
8,500
Wisconsin
I don't think this is a tobacco industry thing, it's just an authoritarian germaphobe acting out his personal desires through national policy
 

Pandaman

Member
Oct 26, 2017
713
Vaping is 2% of the global tobacco industry.
There are other ways to make money when vapers become smokers.

The study, led by Professor David Hammond of the University of Waterloo, found that among those 16-19 years old, vaping increased by a stunning 74% from 2017 to 2018, from 8.4% to 14.6%. The study was conducted in August/September 2017 and again in August/September 2018.

The study presents the first data since the major tobacco companies launched and heavily advertised their own e-cigarette brands in Canada following the May 2018 adoption of Bill S-5 which legalized e-cigarettes with nicotine. The study results are consistent with indications from across Canada of high schools struggling to respond to a rapid increase in youth vaping.

Evidence indicates that youth who use e-cigarettes with nicotine may become addicted and are at increased risk of becoming smokers.

The study also found that cigarette smoking among 16-19 year-olds in the same 2017 to 2018 time period increased by 45%, from 10.7% to 15.5%. Prior surveys up to and including 2017 had shown a continuing decline in youth smoking. However, these concerning results indicate that youth smoking may now be increasing.
 

Nif

Member
Oct 25, 2017
248
It's a slippery slope, and criminals will just find ways to get their vapes on anyway. It's too soon after these deaths to be talking about politics. Banning them will do absolutely nothing, so why try?

ლ༼ ▀̿ Ĺ̯ ▀̿ ლ༽
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,051
So flavours are only getting banned, not a outright vaping ban.

Why does this smell of tobacco trying to stop competition?
Because people love conspiracies that there's zero evidence for and even if it were true, which, again, there is no evidence for, it has nothing to do with whether or not such moves nonetheless have merit and are worth taking all the same due to the effects of e-cigs (particularly on youth smoking rates). Even if you want to sllege some conspiracy there's no actual evidence for, that's not reason this shouldn't happen all the sane if the neruts are there. Tobacco can be evil and vile at the same time there can be other evils as well, and valid reasons steps like this should be taken all the same so it's really neither here nor there even if that were to be true because either way, either those other reasons steps themselves valid, or they aren't and that's what people should be focusing on, IMO.
 

remiri

Member
Nov 1, 2017
398
Someday, we will have this ban to thank when it stops yet another school vaping from taking place.

ty trump for your bravery

/s
 

viskod

Member
Nov 9, 2017
1,117
There are other ways to make money when vapers become smokers.


I was reading an article about the proposed merger between Altria and Phillip Morris where it was mentioned that the Juul saw a sales increase of something like 780% within one year.

Altria bought a 35% stake in Juul for 12.8 billion. Merged together Altria and Phillip Morris would be worth about 200 billion more than British American.

The skyrocketing rise is because of the ease of use of the cartridge system vs maintaining a tank and a mod and buying e liquids separately. I would go so far as to categorize vaping completely separately from e cigarette use. Tanks, Mods, liquids is such a vast industry with near infinite forms of customization and personalization.

Blaming "Vaping" for dumb kids buying the easiest thing they can get and hide from gas stations or just people on the street is missing the entire problem. Blaming "flavors" for it is even dumber.
 

Kreed

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,650
I'm waiting for the news report that this is all because JUUL refused to cater an event at Mar-a-Lago or something.
 

jfkgoblue

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,319
Are you seriously asking, "Why would taking the flavor out of something make people not want it anymore?"
Because I have been told countless times that people switched because it isn’t “as bad as cigarettes”. How does this change without the flavors?

But you bring up a great point in that getting rid of flavors would be great as it would make kids less likely to start.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,033
He’s probably in deep with the tobacco industry. He seems to be all for recreating life as it was in the 80’s. This danger of vaping shit is a scam.
 

killdatninja

Member
Oct 26, 2017
488
I'm not sure what this is really solving tbh. Most people I know make their own juices anyway, the only thing they buy is the nicotine...
 

Grym

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,258
...
Are you seriously asking, "Why would taking the flavor out of something make people not want it anymore?"
If you remove the child friendly flavors and leave the shitty tobacco tasting ones, why would people who switched to vaping for the health benefits or to quit smoking go back to cigarettes instead of continue with vaping?
 

Allforce

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,704
Couldn't you presumably just sell plain juice that contains nicotine, and then "on the side" sell flavor juice that can be added to the nicotine juice?
Yes. And this is how vape shops will adapt. You'll buy a "Ratio" bottle for example, with your preferred PG/VG ratio and nicotine percentage in it that is 100% off-the-shelf legal, and then another bottle with a mix of your "flavor". Put the two together and shake.
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,384
Norman, OK
Because I have been told countless times that people switched because it isn’t “as bad as cigarettes”. How does this change without the flavors?

But you bring up a great point in that getting rid of flavors would be great as it would make kids less likely to start.
Reposting from a couple pages back:


Flavor matters a lot- and not just to teenagers. The availability of so many flavors is absolutely one of the main things that vapers think of as being 'better than cigarettes.'

And, yes- I'm sure neutering ecigs to the point of being nothing but joyless nicotine delivery devices would force teenagers (and everyone else) to adapt in one of three ways:

- black market/street solutions, as we're seeing with THC-based vape products right now, which is disproportionately impacting young people's health.
- good ole' cigarettes. Sure, they stink and cause cancer, but at least I can still purchase them legally.
- give up nicotine altogether, take up yoga and get on a vegan-based keto diet. Do nothing that isn't fantastic for my health.

I'm guessing options 1 and 2 are probably going to be the most popular.

If you remove the child friendly flavors and leave the shitty tobacco tasting ones, why would people who switched to vaping for the health benefits or to quit smoking go back to cigarettes instead of continue with vaping?
See the above chart. Look at what flavors are most popular among adults who used ecigs to stop smoking cigarettes.
 
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Ensorcell

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,385
...


If you remove the child friendly flavors and leave the shitty tobacco tasting ones, why would people who switched to vaping for the health benefits or to quit smoking go back to cigarettes instead of continue with vaping?
They wouldn't, but now tell us what to do with the kids who get sick from trying to flavor their own juice because they don't know what they are doing?
 
Apr 14, 2018
2,613
Broken clock right twice a day etc. etc.

fuck these cotton candy apple pie assholes. flavored poison. let it taste like what it is
 

Grym

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,258
They wouldn't, but now tell us what to do with the kids who get sick from trying to flavor their own juice because they don't know what they are doing?
over the long-term overall vaping will become less "cool" instead of skyrocketing in use among teens as it has for the last decade

short-term yeah that is a legitimate problem that I don't have an answer to. So was how easily cigarettes used to be to get when I was a kid and smoked non-stop for over decade. I got past it and hopefully many today will as well. Doing nothing though and ignoring the problem is helping no one.

See the above chart. Look at what flavors are most popular among adults who used ecigs to stop smoking cigarettes.
I understand that. But I don't care what is popular. If you want to quit smoking you will use what is available to you. I did. Otherwise you are just switching to an alternative nicotine delivery system and a different crutch because you like it. And honestly, the public health problem it causes by becoming cool with kids and teens will be a bigger problem than the good it is supposedly doing those that are "trying to quit" but who are really just vaping instead of actually quitting.
 
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Starmud

Member
Oct 27, 2017
698
I live in a politically republican area and boy would this make so many trump voters I know absolutely rage.

After years of hearing pelosi wants to ban your right to vape, I can’t help but laugh a bit....
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,384
Norman, OK
Broken clock right twice a day etc. etc.

fuck these cotton candy apple pie assholes. flavored poison. let it taste like what it is
Let's apply the same logic to fast food and I'm all in. No more artificial flavors, added fat, sugar, salt or seasoning. And no soda pop. We're just getting kids hooked on toxic waste food and sending them down a life long path of obesity and health problems. Fast food should just be joyless, flavorless sustenance. That way we can herd people towards healthier options.

I mean- I'm trying to be sarcastic here- but obesity is about to overtake smoking as the #1 cause of preventable death in the US, and teen obesity is most certainly on the rise, so....if it's all just about taking care of the kiddos, we probably need to be looking to take the flavor out of everything that's bad for you, not just ecigs.
 

Ensorcell

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,385
over the long-term overall vaping will become less "cool" instead of skyrocketing in use among teens as it has for the last decade

short-term yeah that is a legitimate problem that I don't have an answer to. So was how easily cigarettes used to be to get when I was a kid and smoked non-stop for over decade. I got past it and hopefully many today will as well. Doing nothing though and ignoring the problem is helping no one.
You're making an "uncool" assumption. Smoking went down in popularity across ALL groups, not just kids, because of the millions killed by combustible cigarettes. Vaping is not seen that way and that will not change based on not being able to pick up custard flavored vape juice.