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Jun 17, 2019
397
I posted about this on the last page, but as a Jew as well, it's so incredibly, infuriatingly revealing that leading American Jewish orgs aren't willing to call it antisemitic when Trump explicitly accuses the large majority of American Jews of disloyalty - there is literally no other way to read his remarks - yet have no such hesitations using that word when a black Muslim woman with heterodox views on Israel criticizes the Israel lobby in a way that, if you kinda squint at it from the right angle, might possibly be construed as resembling one of the dreaded Tropes. Israel apologia, antiblackness, and Islamophobia run deep in our community.
Yeah exactly this. This is stuff that literally always matters and isn't just something that you can say "this isn't the time for it". It's inherently tied into this issue.

Of course certain Jewish organizations who are very pro Netanyahu won't want to say anything to rock the boat on the guy who otherwise is doing everything they could dream of in regards to his policies on Israel, just as they haven't the many other times he's said or done abhorrent antisemitic shit like this.
 
Jun 17, 2019
397
I don't give a fuck what you are. Go take your trolling somewhere else.
Oh so if I present an opinion that you happen to not like even though it concerns my ass way more than it does yours, it's trolling?

I'm gonna end my response here because I don't want to be banned for "incivility" again. Just take my word for it my opinion of you is about as low as it possibly can be.
 

Deleted member 8561

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
11,284
Gotcha.

Dems bashing their own for antisemitism when none exists is something that we should never, ever criticize.

Dems bashing trump for antisemitism is something we should not expect and NEVER question them about.

Thank you for once again showing me the light.

No problem, I'm glad you're making it very clear and blatant for everyone to see where your priorities are at
 

DrForester

Mod of the Year 2006
Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,684
No problem, I'm glad you're making it very clear and blatant for everyone to see where your priorities are at

Democrats happily throwing their own under the bus by joining Republicans to lie about a Muslim congresswoman, while looking the other way when trump does worse, really should be something they get called out for.
 

Deleted member 8561

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
11,284


Bernie Sanders @BernieSanders

Let me say this to the president: I am a proud Jewish person and I have no concerns about voting Democratic. And in fact, I intend to vote for a Jewish man to become the next president of the United States. https://twitter.com/nbcnews/status/1163905031806050310 …

8:52 PM - Aug 20, 2019


That's a... pretty odd tweet given the rather dangerous rhetoric that Trump was effectively advocating for lol
 

Quixzlizx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,591
Voting for the people who throw principled women of color under the bus to own the uh.......not actually sure who this is supposed to own in this scenario.

"Libs could've said to Omar in a friendly way "hey, you've got to be careful talking about Jews and money even if you're making a good point." But they went with the bad faith "anti-Semitic" and they're to blame for everything shitty that's happened since then."

Anyone who believes that some liberals criticizing Omar are to blame for "everything shitty that's happened since then," like that caused Trump and millions of deplorables to become dangerously anti-semitic, doesn't care about Jewish people or anti-semitism other than as a prop to further their political agenda. It reminds me of conservative evangelical Zionists, actually.
 

Deleted member 8561

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
11,284
Criticizing people here while generally sniping at them in community threads is petty shit.

Good signs of a health community when Trump doing his thing and inciting violence in his 19 year old white nationalist gun toting fans causes drama, cross thread complaining and shit posting.

That's why I keep my sniping up close and personal and don't back down from the random internet people who annoy me!
 
Jun 17, 2019
397
"Libs could've said to Omar in a friendly way "hey, you've got to be careful talking about Jews and money even if you're making a good point." But they went with the bad faith "anti-Semitic" and they're to blame for everything shitty that's happened since then."

Anyone who believes that some liberals criticizing Omar are to blame for "everything shitty that's happened since then," like that caused Trump and millions of deplorables to become dangerously anti-semitic, doesn't care about Jewish people or anti-semitism other than as a prop to further their political agenda. It reminds me of conservative evangelical Zionists, actually.
Well you're wrong, because hey guess what, the "adults in the room" legitimized that talking point. They didn't cause people to become anti-semitic, but they did embolden a lot of very shitty arguments.
 

Quixzlizx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,591
Well you're wrong, because hey guess what, the "adults in the room" legitimized that talking point. They didn't cause people to become anti-semitic, but they did embolden a lot of very shitty arguments.
It's funny that you're doing what leftists always accuse liberals of doing, which is valuing optics over actions. So I'm going to value actions over optics this time and go "nuh uh, you're wrong."
 

maxxpower

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,950
California
We common folk don't have the power right now to do anything about this orange fuck. The House Democrats do have the power to publicly call this out as what it is, antisemitism. We're just asking for them to be as swift on calling Trump out like they were with Ilhan Omar even though she didn't say anything wrong.
 

Deleted member 24149

Oct 29, 2017
2,150
"Libs could've said to Omar in a friendly way "hey, you've got to be careful talking about Jews and money even if you're making a good point." But they went with the bad faith "anti-Semitic" and they're to blame for everything shitty that's happened since then."

Anyone who believes that some liberals criticizing Omar are to blame for "everything shitty that's happened since then," like that caused Trump and millions of deplorables to become dangerously anti-semitic, doesn't care about Jewish people or anti-semitism other than as a prop to further their political agenda. It reminds me of conservative evangelical Zionists, actually.
Perhaps I'm misreading but no one's arguing that liberal who criticized Omar are solely to blame. Its just an assumption that republicans don't give a shit of the climate so its not worth arguing that republicans should do anything (Because they won't and will not) so we're reliant on house democrats to do something. Otherwise nothing else is going to even attempt to keep Trump in check as he spews more nonsense.
 
Nov 14, 2017
2,329
Not sure why some are acting as though the response to/allegations of anti-semitism by Dems isn't relevant here. Trump isn't randomly calling Jewish people disloyal. He's trying to position Omar and Tlaib as representative of Democrats, and therefore conclude that Democrats are anti-Israel/anti-semitic, ergo Jews who support them are ignorant or disloyal.
 

Deleted member 8561

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
11,284
Democrats happily throwing their own under the bus by joining Republicans to lie about a Muslim congresswoman, while looking the other way when trump does worse, really should be something they get called out for.

You don't seem to understand what I actually said, so let me just make it clear.

You're just using Trump as a vehicle to complain and attack people you don't like. This topic can be anything, it just happens to be Trump spouting and likely inspiring violence, which is why it makes you and some of the other posters who are doing similar things all the more transparent in what you actually care about.

Was gonna not try and further derail, but it seems like you've basically done an effective job with couple other posters in completely launching this thread off a cliff, so congrats.
 

Quixzlizx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,591
Perhaps I'm misreading but no one's arguing that liberal who criticized Omar are solely to blame. Its just an assumption that republicans don't give a shit of the climate so its not worth arguing that republicans should do anything (Because they won't and will not) so we're reliant on house democrats to do something. Otherwise nothing else is going to even attempt to keep Trump in check as he spews more nonsense.
The quote does argue that. I even bolded the relevant part of the sentence
 

DrForester

Mod of the Year 2006
Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,684
You don't seem to understand what I actually said, so let me just make it clear.

You're just using Trump as a vehicle to complain and attack people you don't like. This topic can be anything, it just happens to be Trump spouting and likely inspiring violence, which is why it makes you and some of the other posters who are doing similar things all the more transparent in what you actually care about.

You do realize that people can dislike multiple things at the same time, right?
 
Jun 17, 2019
397
It's funny that you're doing what leftists always accuse liberals of doing, which is valuing optics over actions. So I'm going to value actions over optics this time and go "nuh uh, you're wrong."
This isn't optics. Disingenuously criticizing a Muslim woman for rightfully attacking Israel is an action, and it's one that implicitly supports Palestinian apartheid.
 

Quixzlizx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,591
This isn't optics. Disingenuously criticizing a Muslim woman for rightfully attacking Israel is an action, and it's one that implicitly supports Palestinian apartheid.
It's trying to use optics to say "someone criticized this person, and that gave a bunch of already antisemitic people cover to say antisemitic things in completely unrelated situations." Like they weren't doing that anyway.
 

kittens

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,237
It won't be long before he calls all Democratic voters traitors, probably right after he loses the election next year.
I could see fascists in the United States eventually carrying out mass targeted slaughter against leftists, intellectuals, and journalists. Many conservatives are already frothing at the thought of it, and more and more are already committing violence. Fascism sees enemies everywhere.
 

Netherscourge

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,919


Bernie Sanders @BernieSanders

Let me say this to the president: I am a proud Jewish person and I have no concerns about voting Democratic. And in fact, I intend to vote for a Jewish man to become the next president of the United States. https://twitter.com/nbcnews/status/1163905031806050310 …

8:52 PM - Aug 20, 2019


And in fact, I intend to vote for a Jewish man to become the next president of the United States.

Fox News Breaking Alert: Donald Trump converts to Judaism.
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,123
Brooklyn, NY
Not sure why some are acting as though the response to/allegations of anti-semitism by Dems isn't relevant here. Trump isn't randomly calling Jewish people disloyal. He's trying to position Omar and Tlaib as representative of Democrats, and therefore conclude that Democrats are anti-Israel/anti-semitic, ergo Jews who support them are ignorant or disloyal.

yup, which would be far easier to combat if Democrats hadn't already legitimized the notion that Omar (and to a lesser extent Tlaib) was an antisemite with their own actions

but some people get very, very angry when you suggest that not being a Republican doesn't immunize you from complicity in bigotry, I guess
 

Bronx-Man

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
15,351
User Banned (3 Weeks): Inflammatory commentary against other members. Consistent history of bans for hostility.
but some people get very, very angry when you suggest that not being a Republican doesn't immunize you from complicity in bigotry, I guess
Fuck them. There's a lot of people here that need to learn that their complicity with bad faith arguments being spewed towards Ilhan and other WoC in congress led to this moment.
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,123
Brooklyn, NY
Fuck them. There's a lot of people here that need to learn that their complicity with bad faith arguments being spewed towards Ilhan and other WoC in congress led to this moment.

I've argued this at much greater length before, but they aren't all "bad faith" per se - a lot of Jews sincerely believed that Omar was guilty of Tropes, unfortunately - but that part doesn't matter nearly as much as the harm those accusations did
 

Quixzlizx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,591
I'm Jewish and I second all of this.

Ilhan Omar is not anti-semitic and the Republicans do not care about Jews.
So you believe that some people criticizing Ilhan Omar are "to blame for everything shitty that's happened since then"?

As a Jewish person, it seems strange to me to blame all antisemitism in America on that.
 

Quixzlizx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,591
Fuck them. There's a lot of people here that need to learn that their complicity with bad faith arguments being spewed towards Ilhan and other WoC in congress led to this moment.
If you believe that antisemitism in America wasn't a problem until Ilhan Omar came along, and that people criticizing her are "to blame for everything shitty that's happened since then," then I personally think you couldn't care less about antisemitism except where it intersects with your defense of PoC.

Not exactly the most humanitarian application of intersectionality.
 

Bronx-Man

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
15,351
If you believe that antisemitism in America wasn't a problem until Ilhan Omar came along, and that people criticizing her are "to blame for everything shitty that's happened since then," then I personally think you couldn't care less about antisemitism except where it intersects with your defense of PoC.
No one legitimately thinks anti-semitism isn't a problem still. High ranking dems giving Trump ammo to sling his crap is what we're upset about.
 

Quixzlizx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,591
No one legitimately thinks anti-semitism isn't a problem still. High ranking dems giving Trump ammo to sling his crap is what we're upset about.
Do you think he wouldn't be slinging this crap anyway? That's my point, I don't think anyone needed to enable the person whose political career was launched from racism and bigotry.

I mean, he started getting hype through Obama birtherism and calling all Mexicans rapists.
 

Deleted member 12224

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
6,113
Do you think he wouldn't be slinging this crap anyway? That's my point, I don't think anyone needed to enable the person whose political career was launched from racism and bigotry.

I mean, he started getting hype through Obama birtherism and calling all Mexicans rapists.
He saw it in the news, amplified tremendously by all sides coming for her, and has since jumped on it relentlessly.

The connecting line between then and now is clear as day. The spike in this rhetoric after the incident where Dems went after Omar is clear as day.

I was wrong to not see what would come. It was so fucking obvious.
 

julian

Member
Oct 27, 2017
16,773
Do you think he wouldn't be slinging this crap anyway? That's my point, I don't think anyone needed to enable the person whose political career was launched from racism and bigotry.

I mean, he started getting hype through Obama birtherism and calling all Mexicans rapists.

You forgot about his antisemitic tweets about Hillary being funded by Jews or when called neo-nazis very fine people. People blaming this on Dems are delusional.
 
Oct 28, 2017
2,725
There's only so much his brain can hold. Mostly just dumbass dog whistle stuff at this point from Fox News and Breitbart and other garbage. Part of me knows he is a racist asshole but a lot of it is just idiotic fuckery like this (there isn't much of a difference). Like I don't know if he's truly antisemitic but he simply uses word associations now. Truly a fool.
 

DrForester

Mod of the Year 2006
Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,684
This is going to have a pretty bad fallout.
AYsfuZ2.gif
 

Bramblebutt

Banned
Jan 11, 2018
1,858
I can't properly assemble the words I need to express how disgusted, ashamed, and afraid I am of the fact that the political discourse in my country will now most likely include whether or not it's okay for the President of the United States to question the loyalty of a majority of American Jews because they vote Democrat.
 

Blader

Member
Oct 27, 2017
26,620
Gentle reminder that one of Trump's closing TV spots of the 2016 campaign was about Jewish globalists buying the election/country for Hillary. Antisemitism has been in this man's DNA from the beginning.

So he's definitely assuming that Jews do have dual loyalties then isn't he?

He literally referred to Bibi as "your prime minister" at the last AIPAC.