Turkish strikes on Kurdish areas in Syria have already begun.

Dr.Phibes

Avenger
Maybe we could ponder the potential consequences of the EU stepping into Syria with a proper military force.

Just maybe.

Specially with the situation in Cyprus still unresolved.
My old wing has a few Recce Tornados stationed in Jordan. I'd like to see them fly sorties a long the Turkish-Syrian border. Just for fun. Maybe missing a few HARMs when they return to base...
 
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Euler

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,482
Ok, so in your Fable world, after Trump sold Siria to Turkey, Turkey should stop themselves, with no intervention.

Ok. Let's ignore every war in the world, they should stop themselves and behave. Let's ignore the fact that war next to Europe is an issue Europe should take care of.

But no, writing outraged comments on ResetEra is enough, they should understand alone that peace is better

You just solved world problems, are you suffering or causing sufferance? Just don't.
You're holding EU to higher moral standards than Turkey by giving him kudos for gloating about starting a war.
 
Aug 16, 2019
701
UK
You're holding EU to higher moral standards than Turkey by giving him kudos for gloating about starting a war.
You just accused me of sidesing and now you do the same.

Yes, I fucking am holding EU to a higher moral of standards, for obvious fucking reasons. The fuck that we are dumb does not preclude us no do some good, if not in the world, at least with our neighbours
 

Serpens007

Member
Oct 31, 2017
2,722
As much as I respect what the SDF did against ISIS in Raqqa, it was only in the Syrian north and Iraqi Kurdish territories, defeating ISIS is not a Kurdish feat alone, the bloodiest battle against ISIS was won by the Iraqi army and the IRGC in Mosul, Tikrit, Fallujah, people forget those battles even tho they were the most decisive battles that depleted ISIS from its manpower.

Assad and Russia also beat ISIS from Palmyra to Deir Ez Zor.

Attributing the defeat of ISIS to SDF alone doesn't do justice to the thousands of Iraqis who died fighting them, and even the Syrian regime army regardless of the regime's action against the opposition.
Yep. Attributing the ISIS defeat to them is US propaganda since they were allies. It was a joint effort of common enemies
 

KingSnake

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,305
Who said it was funny?

Europe will do fuck all, as usual and as usual they will simply condemn things for afar.

Not as bad as Trump or Erdogan, still no good at all.


That would be vetoes by half of the members
EU can't do anything militarily because it has no joint army and no UN mandate to intervene and because the aggressor in this war is a NATO member who has the blessing of US. Also it can't do anything politically because of the millions of extreme right voters that jumped out of the bushes in the last years and some of them have also voted fascist governments who can veto any decent proposal.

You give kudos to a piece of shit who uses the lives of 3.6 million people as a bargaining chip. This says a lot about you, applauding this awful blackmail.
 

Tahnit

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,879
I hope the US will let the kurds into the base for protection. Trump didnt say anything about that.
 

JaseC64

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,328
Strong Island NY
Just curious, why are republicans upset about this? Are they upset on a human level or is there other reason I'm not getting? Just odd coming from them.
 

Tahnit

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,879
i bet a whistleblower comes out and says that turkey threatened Trump towers. Maybe that will be enough for republicans to turn on him.
 

Christian

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,603
Predictably, in every thread in which one of these dictatorial psychopaths stumbles upon one modicum of wisdom during their usual regurgitation of lies and hate, someone on Era jumps on the chance to proclaim, “they’re right, you know!” Every. Fucking. Time.
 

nu_faust

Member
Oct 27, 2017
124
Philly <=> İstanbul
Bruh, you really gonna call it the Kurdish question? Just leaving aside the debate about the YPG and PKK being the same, or invalidating the Kurdish pursuit of an autonomous nation, that is... something. Particularly when your takeaway is "I think the minority group without any power should lay down arms in the face of the giant group with a huge military."
I'm not invalidating the pursuit of an autonomous nation. I mean personally I think all ethnic minority nationalism from Catalan to Scotish to Kosovan etc are prime examples of romantic yet destructive idealism but they wanna pursue it go ahead, just don't use terrorism, just don't kill people to achieve that goal. The days of armed marxist revolutions should have been long gone but then came the clash of civilizations, greater middle east projects and never ending proxy wars to control resources in the ME.

All im going to say is that the Kurds have every right to live in northern Syria. They have lived there for more then 900 years in large numbers.
of course they do and believe me they will continue to do so after this operation. I can't stand this "Kurds this, Kurds that" general use like they are some kind of monolithic entity represented only by YPG which this operation is directly against. Why is it so hard for people to differentiate between fighting an armed marxist ethnic nationalist revolutionary Kurdish group who filled the power vacuum after ISIS and you know just regular Kurds living there?

As I posted Turkey already had millions of Kurds living in turkey, Istanbul has more Kurds than any other city in the world. Did it wronged its Kurdish population in the past (or even to a much lesser degree now)? Yes. Does it have right to fight and destroy armed terrorist groups that are openly at war with its government? Also yes. Most people don't realize once you justify use of violence and terrorism, there is no high moral ground.

Are we back to this anti-imperialist tripe.

Always love when westerners become authoritative voices on what really happened in Syria ground zero.
I didn't say westerners started this, I mentioned a coalition including the West please stop trying to misrepresent what I'm saying. Assad definitely has blood in his hands and shit was definitely politically explosive thanks to him & legacy that his father left him but believe me those dudes that started blowing up building with C4s, using manpads were trained, supplied and directed by outsiders.
 

Razgriz417

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,143
It's really insane to me that it's legal for anyone with major foreign investments to become president. It's so goddamn easy to get trump to do what you want.
every other president before this had to relinquish their holdings and put them in a blind trust I believe. It was only this fucker that defied that and the GOP controlled congress let him get away with it.

 

KyrieEleison

Avenger
Dec 31, 2017
509
EU should answer that Turkey will be kicked out of the customs union, all aid will be freezed and sanctions will be put on turkey.

Turk economy will crash and burn without EU support.
You don’t wanna give that scumbag an excuse to invade Cyprus, because he already has eyes on Cypriot gas fields and when the Turkish economy starts to tank and with an election defeat becomes probable, nothing will give Turkish voters a hard-on than the thought of annexing the entire island.
 
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Xando

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,662
You don’t wanna give that scumbag an excuse to invade Cyprus, because he already has eyes on Cypriot gas fields and when the Turkish economy starts to tank and with an election defeat becomes probable, nothing will give Turkish voters a hard-on than the though of annexing the entire island.
Cyprus is a EU member and invading them will draw germany, france, Italy and others into a war.
EU warships are already patrolling the area and turkey won’t do shit.
 

KyrieEleison

Avenger
Dec 31, 2017
509
Cyprus is a EU member and invading them will draw germany, france, Italy and others into a war.
EU warships are already patrolling the area and turkey won’t do shit.
Cyprus is also a member of the Commonwealth and there were British troops there last time the Turks invaded and they literally did nothing.

Nobody in Cyprus actually believes any EU country, apart from Greece (who has a joint military with Cyprus) will aid them if Turkey invades.
 

Funyarinpa

User requested ban
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
8,690
Why is it so hard for people to differentiate between fighting an armed marxist ethnic nationalist revolutionary Kurdish group who filled the power vacuum after ISIS and you know just regular Kurds living there?
Because, among other reasons, Erdoğan is conducting this invasion directly to settle Syrian refugees into the region, thereby significantly changing its demographic. That can be seen as a form of ethnic cleansing, and this fucker announced it on twitter
 

Xando

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,662
Cyprus is also a member of the Commonwealth and there were British troops there last time the Turks invaded and they literally did nothing.

Nobody in Cyprus actually believes any EU country, apart from Greece (who has a joint military with Cyprus) will aid them if Turkey invades.
That’s not even close to comparable as EU countries are far more intertwined and have way deeper commitments to each other than commonwealth nations.
 

KyrieEleison

Avenger
Dec 31, 2017
509
That’s not even close to comparable as EU countries are far more intertwined and have way deeper commitments to each other than commonwealth nations.
I say again- nobody in Cyprus believes any EU country (apart from Greece) will defend them against Turkey. That’s why they are trying to form allegiances with other non-EU countries in the region.
 

Steel

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
8,402
Just curious, why are republicans upset about this? Are they upset on a human level or is there other reason I'm not getting? Just odd coming from them.
Neocons. If they ruin their reputation by abandoning an ally that we basically used as a ground army like this it makes it so nobody wants to be your fodder in the future.
 

serdarkny

Member
Nov 10, 2018
173
Rampant apologia for civilian killings done by PKK in this thread is disgusting and heart-wrenching to read.
 

holygeesus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,200
I don't know how many of you listen to Sam Seder's show, but he had an anonymous caller ring in, who came across as incredibly articulate and credible, almost to the point of being an insider, who claims that there is no way ISIS prisoners will be released by the Kurds, and will simply be executed. I mean, it makes perfect sense from a tactical viewpoint to do that, and even if you accept them as the scourge they are, that is a terrifying number of deaths already.

 

Funyarinpa

User requested ban
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
8,690
I don't know how many of you listen to Sam Seder's show, but he had an anonymous caller ring in, who came across as incredibly articulate and credible, almost to the point of being an insider, who claims that there is no way ISIS prisoners will be released by the Kurds, and will simply be executed. I mean, it makes perfect sense from a tactical viewpoint to do that, and even if you accept them as the scourge they are, that is a terrifying number of deaths already.

ISIS dying is the least of my fucking concerns honestly
 

Hucast

alt account
Banned
Mar 25, 2019
3,598
Turkey has like 4 million syrian refugees. If they are getting rid of terrorist groups like PKK or YPK then I like the idea of rebuiling syria bit by bit so refugees can turn baco and live a safe life. It is something that no one ever does. Usually they bomb shit to hell. Destabilize and people never turn back to their countries. We'll see how this goes.
 

Funyarinpa

User requested ban
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
8,690
Turkey has like 4 million syrian refugees. If they are getting rid of terrorist groups like PKK or YPK then I like the idea of rebuiling syria bit by bit so refugees can turn baco and live a safe life. It is something that no one ever does. Usually they bomb shit to hell. Destabilize and people never turn back to their countries. We'll see how this goes.
Settling them into a region with a historically Kurdish demographic constitutes ethnic cleansing.
 

Steeven

Member
Oct 26, 2017
56
Turkey has like 4 million syrian refugees. If they are getting rid of terrorist groups like PKK or YPK then I like the idea of rebuiling syria bit by bit so refugees can turn baco and live a safe life. It is something that no one ever does. Usually they bomb shit to hell. Destabilize and people never turn back to their countries. We'll see how this goes.
This is the weakest excuse for ethnic cleansing yet.
 

KingSnake

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,305
Turkey has like 4 million syrian refugees. If they are getting rid of terrorist groups like PKK or YPK then I like the idea of rebuiling syria bit by bit so refugees can turn baco and live a safe life. It is something that no one ever does. Usually they bomb shit to hell. Destabilize and people never turn back to their countries. We'll see how this goes.
Supporting ethnic cleansing without any shame, wow.
 

Hucast

alt account
Banned
Mar 25, 2019
3,598
Settling them into a region with a historically Kurdish demographic constitutes ethnic cleansing.
This is the weakest excuse for ethnic cleansing yet.
I thought they were just getting rid of opportunisitc terrorists? Syria was a country for syrian people so syrians should be allowed there as long civilian kurds are left alone but I didnt know there was an ethnic cleansing. Do you guys have source for this?
 

KyrieEleison

Avenger
Dec 31, 2017
509
Turkey has like 4 million syrian refugees. If they are getting rid of terrorist groups like PKK or YPK then I like the idea of rebuiling syria bit by bit so refugees can turn baco and live a safe life. It is something that no one ever does. Usually they bomb shit to hell. Destabilize and people never turn back to their countries. We'll see how this goes.
Only a person of substandard intelligence (i.e. your average AKP voter) believes there is a connection between a Kurdish presence in Syria and the repatriation of Syrian refugees.
 

Steeven

Member
Oct 26, 2017
56
I thought they were just getting rid of opportunisitc terrorists? Syria was a country for syrian people so syrians should be allowed there as long civilian kurds are left alone but I didnt know there was an ethnic cleansing. Do you guys have source for this?
What do you think will happen when you order millions of Arab refugees into an area that has historically been inhabited by another population?

Also, you may want to take a look what happened when Turkey and its jihadi proxies invaded Afrin.

You may want to read this as well: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/07/opinion/Turkey-Syria-Operation.html
 

Funyarinpa

User requested ban
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
8,690
I thought they were just getting rid of opportunisitc terrorists? Syria was a country for syrian people so syrians should be allowed there as long civilian kurds are left alone but I didnt know there was an ethnic cleansing. Do you guys have source for this?
Turkey is attacking (Syrian) Kurdish regions on the pretext of creating a "safe zone" into which they will move Syrian refugees. This conveniently only involves fighting against terrorist forces. Erdoğan's own words constitute an intent to forcibly alter the demographics of a region, which is ethnic cleansing.

(Not to mention, Turkey has always oppressed its Kurdish population and there's little reason to trust them to not harm Kurdish people/forces at large, especially civilians.)
 

KingSnake

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,305
I thought they were just getting rid of opportunisitc terrorists? Syria was a country for syrian people so syrians should be allowed there as long civilian kurds are left alone but I didnt know there was an ethnic cleansing. Do you guys have source for this?
"Ethnic cleansing is the systematic forced removal of ethnic, racial and/or religious groups from a given territory by a more powerful ethnic group, often with the intent of making it ethnically homogeneous.[1][page needed] The forces applied may be various forms of forced migration (deportation, population transfer), intimidation, as well as genocide and genocidal rape."

The area is inhabited by Kurds since centuries. Moving 3.6 million people in that are would totally change the ethnic composition of that area even assuming that genocide won't happen.

Not even disscusing the huge potential for conflict for the land there. It would be a new Israel-Palestina type of issue in an already high risk area.

Plus nobody asked the 3.6 million people if they want to live in an area they never were.