TV Displays and Tech Thread |OT2| There Is No Perfect TV ™ (Read The OP)

OnagaTheDragon · Apr 21, 2019

lately many games are seen differently depending on whether they are played in HDR or SDR, they change drastically, example with Tomb Raider and DMC V, in SDR the games have a fairly high contrast, the grays are black and everything is quite dark.

with HDR the games change DRASTICALLY, all the blacks are now gray and they get a much more neutral image, but full of details, basically you can see everything even the slightest shadow.

at the end,, what is the correct way to play?

this in with a OLED E7

ɣGammaɣ · Apr 21, 2019

Yiorgos said:
Its still there just not as severe on all of them...

For me, it read like it was a problem with these sets and not pointing out the limitations of oled as a technology. Sorry if understood wrong.

Powerofthecloud · Apr 21, 2019

OnagaTheDragon said:
lately many games are seen differently depending on whether they are played in HDR or SDR, they change drastically, example with Tomb Raider and DMC V, in SDR the games have a fairly high contrast, the grays are black and everything is quite dark.

with HDR the games change DRASTICALLY, all the blacks are now gray and they get a much more neutral image, but full of details, basically you can see everything even the slightest shadow.

at the end,, what is the correct way to play?

this in with a OLED E7

No idea. I have the same problem. The darker end of the spectrum everything is just black on my b7, its just silly.

Yiorgos · Apr 21, 2019

GammaGoblin said:
For me, it read like it was a problem with these sets and not pointing out the limitations of oled as a technology. Sorry if understood wrong.

Its no problem man. Its not a limitation of OLED tech. Sony and LG do it to minimize the risk of burn in. When i bought the tv the dimming was not there. It was introduced as a burn in safeguard.

OnagaTheDragon · Apr 21, 2019

Powerofthecloud said:
No idea. I have the same problem. The darker end of the spectrum everything is just black on my b7, its just silly.

the thing is, i dont think is crushed black at all, the details are there(even with 1886 gamma) its just that they are very dark, the image looks very contrasty (sometimes unnatural), HDR shows a lot of more grey, even sometimes washed out.

ShaDowDaNca · Apr 21, 2019

EvilBoris said:
He showed me the calibrated game mode Q90R EOtF today and it's actually totally fine.

Then he needs to update his review...

RiZ IV · Apr 21, 2019

I bit the bullet and got a LG Oled B8. It will be arriving this week I think. It was on sale on newegg but even then it was more than I'd generally want to spend on a tv. Seeing these things on display always stops me in my tracks.

Powerofthecloud · Apr 21, 2019

Yiorgos said:
Its no problem man. Its not a limitation of OLED tech. Sony and LG do it to minimize the risk of burn in. When i bought the tv the dimming was not there. It was introduced as a burn in safeguard.

That would be a limitation of the OLED tech. =P

guitarguy316 · Apr 21, 2019

Eggiem said:
Much less tint is not enough for me. Bummer that they cant get rid of the oled tint problem.

Yeah I mean there is really isn't a tint free panel, just some are very good and others are bad. It's like banding some are good and some are really bad. What we don't know is they still can't get it right on tint, so I don't know if it's the mfg process, applying the Aar filter, or what but it's annoying. It used to be yellow but seems it's red now.

Eggiem · Apr 21, 2019

guitarguy316 said:
Yeah I mean there is really isn't a tint free panel, just some are very good and others are bad. It's like banding some are good and some are really bad. What we don't know is they still can't get it right on tint, so I don't know if it's the mfg process, applying the Aar filter, or what but it's annoying. It used to be yellow but seems it's red now.

My B7 has a very light blue tint on the right side (like 10cm). No banding. It doesn't bother me because you can barely see the tint, but I will only buy a new OLED when they have fixed the tint problem. Don't want to play the panel lottery again.

Deleted member 14649 · Apr 22, 2019

Eggiem said:
My B7 has a very light blue tint on the right side (like 10cm). No banding. It doesn't bother me because you can barely see the tint, but I will only buy a new OLED when they have fixed the tint problem. Don't want to play the panel lottery again.

Then you won't want to buy any TV as the panel lottery is as much a game in the LED market.

GeoNeo · Apr 22, 2019

I wonder how RTings will test VRR 4K @ 120Hz on new LG's considering there is no GPU's that support HDMI 2.1 output..and we won't see any till Navi hits.

Edit: Just looked at their Samsung Q90R review confirms they can't really test full range of 4K @ 120Hz VRR due to limitations of lack of output source on the market at the current time.

We could not test for HDMI 2.1 as we have no way to send a 4k @ 120Hz @ 4:4:4 signal. We will retest once an HDMI 2.1 source is available for us to buy.

Hopefully Navi is not too far away!

EvilBoris · Apr 22, 2019

GeoNeo said:
I wonder how RTings will test VRR 4K @ 120Hz on new LG's considering there is no GPU's that support HDMI 2.1 output..and we won't see any till Navi hits.

Edit: Just looked at their Samsung Q90R review confirms they can't really test full range of 4K @ 120Hz VRR due to limitations of lack of output source on the market at the current time.

Hopefully Navi is not too far away!

The Q90r doesn't support 4K 120hz VRR anyway, so they don't need to worry about it.

P40L0 · Apr 22, 2019

LG 2017 OLEDs - All Profiles Re-Calibration (April 2019):

ALL PROFILES UPDATED TO V7 ULTIMATE
Firmware 5.80.xx or above is required
Completely new re-calibration of all SDR/HDR/DV picture modes with new tools and after 4.000+ hours usage
New Dolby Vision Custom Calibration file to apply via USB patch (updated on April 2019)
HDR Game mode back to a new custom profile based on HIGH Dynamic Contrast to match the new improvements
Added new in-game HDR suggested settings

Please not that this re-calibration goes in-depth also for all White Balance + CMS values, so do not forget to also update those sections when possible (and do not forget to also update the entire DV profile using the new USB Patch!)

Give those completely fresh settings a try and let me know what you think... ;)

GeoNeo · Apr 22, 2019

EvilBoris said:
The Q90r doesn't support 4K 120hz VRR anyway, so they don't need to worry about it.

Oh wow had no idea Q90R HDMI 2.1 chipset & soc did not support 4K 120Hz VRR disappointing. LG really on to winner this year getting the one up on the better chipset & SOC.

EvilBoris · Apr 22, 2019

GeoNeo said:
Oh wow had no idea Q90R HDMI 2.1 chipset & soc did not support 4K 120Hz VRR disappointing. LG really on to winner this year getting the one up on the better chipset & SOC.

It's 40-60hz at 4K HDR Freesync

The LG is having problems at the moment, with HDR ALLM/Gane mode and VRR, people having trouble getting it to work properly.

LG France have come out and said they don't support Freesync , but some users are getting it to work in certain modes. The usual clusterfuck of information as expected

Bumrush · Apr 22, 2019

For anyone that watched the previews for next week's Thrones, the entire episode looks like it takes place at night. I'm already bracing for how shitty the stream is going to look RedlineRonin

guitarguy316 · Apr 22, 2019

Eggiem said:
My B7 has a very light blue tint on the right side (like 10cm). No banding. It doesn't bother me because you can barely see the tint, but I will only buy a new OLED when they have fixed the tint problem. Don't want to play the panel lottery again.

Yeah I wouldn't play the game then. I have yet to see a "perfect" panel...more of what's acceptable to the masses.

Bumrush · Apr 22, 2019

guitarguy316 said:
Yeah I wouldn't play the game then. I have yet to see a "perfect" panel...more of what's acceptable to the masses.

I wonder if what I consider "very little uniformity issues" on my C8 would be a complete eyesore to someone else.

Eggiem · Apr 22, 2019

guitarguy316 said:
Yeah I wouldn't play the game then. I have yet to see a "perfect" panel...more of what's acceptable to the masses.

Bumrush said:
I wonder if what I consider "very little uniformity issues" on my C8 would be a complete eyesore to someone else.

It's just that I could justify an 65inch upgrade when the next panels are flawless. Dont want to spend so much money again and still have the same little issues.

Bumrush · Apr 22, 2019

Eggiem said:
It's just that I could justify an 65inch upgrade when the next panels are flawless. Dont want to spend so much money again and still have the same little issues.

I'm not disagreeing with you at all...I was just wondering out loud!

DrFunk · Apr 22, 2019

Sony's 2019 TV lineup details: https://www.digitaltrends.com/home-theater/sony-2019-tv-lineup-prices-availability-8k-4k-oled/

Z9G:

85-inch model: $13,000. Available in June
98-inch model: $70,000. Available in June

A9G:

55-inch: $3,500. Available in May
65-inch: $4500. Available in May
77-inch: $8,000. Available in May

A8G:

55-inch: $2500. Available in May
65-inch: $3500. Available in May

X950G

55-inch: $1,400
65-inch: $2,200
75-inch: $3,500
85-inch: $5,000

Bumrush · Apr 22, 2019

The 100" Z9D started at $100K! We're making progress!

Kerotan · Apr 22, 2019

DrFunk said:
Sony's 2019 TV lineup details: https://www.digitaltrends.com/home-theater/sony-2019-tv-lineup-prices-availability-8k-4k-oled/

Z9G:

85-inch model: $13,000. Available in June

98-inch model: $70,000. Available in June

A9G:

55-inch: $3,500. Available in May

65-inch: $4500. Available in May

77-inch: $8,000. Available in May

A8G:

55-inch: $2500. Available in May

65-inch: $3500. Available in May

X950G

55-inch: $1,400

65-inch: $2,200

75-inch: $3,500

85-inch: $5,000

Is the X950G the successor to the X900F?
If so a $1400 starting price seems awfully low.

RedlineRonin · Apr 22, 2019

Bumrush said:
For anyone that watched the previews for next week's Thrones, the entire episode looks like it takes place at night. I'm already bracing for how shitty the stream is going to look RedlineRonin

Totally forgot to watch after the credits last night.

Also, did some messing around and I think the Apple TV 4K was part of the culprit. It was set to 4KHDR, but also set to (theoretically) show native frame rate and color space etc. I set it manually to 1080p and SDR and it helped some. Not sure if others are using an ATV but I've barely used mine. Overall disappointing as I thought the whole "try to convert everything to HDR" nonsense from launch was fixed.

Episodes are still dark and grainy, but that's likely just a function of how (SDR) steaming looks. It's really a shame for what is arguably one of the biggest production tv shows that they couldn't spring for HDR and/or 4K for the final season. Even the standard blu rays look so much better than the streaming on hbo now.

guitarguy316 · Apr 22, 2019

Eggiem said:
It's just that I could justify an 65inch upgrade when the next panels are flawless. Dont want to spend so much money again and still have the same little issues.

I've seen 3 C9s in person and all have tint. The first two were really bad and the latest is much less visible and along the edges rather than all across the screen.

Eggiem · Apr 22, 2019

guitarguy316 said:
I've seen 3 C9s in person and all have tint. The first two were really bad and the latest is much less visible and along the edges rather than all across the screen.

I have seen 6 B7 panels and all had tint too. Wonder why almost no reviewer mentioned that.

Bumrush · Apr 22, 2019

RedlineRonin said:
Totally forgot to watch after the credits last night.

Also, did some messing around and I think the Apple TV 4K was part of the culprit. It was set to 4KHDR, but also set to (theoretically) show native frame rate and color space etc. I set it manually to 1080p and SDR and it helped some. Not sure if others are using an ATV but I've barely used mine. Overall disappointing as I thought the whole "try to convert everything to HDR" nonsense from launch was fixed.

Episodes are still dark and grainy, but that's likely just a function of how (SDR) steaming looks. It's really a shame for what is arguably one of the biggest production tv shows that they couldn't spring for HDR and/or 4K for the final season. Even the standard blu rays look so much better than the streaming on hbo now.

Oh shit, I'll have to try that as I use my ATV to watch it

thuway · Apr 22, 2019

DrFunk said:
Sony's 2019 TV lineup details: https://www.digitaltrends.com/home-theater/sony-2019-tv-lineup-prices-availability-8k-4k-oled/

Z9G:

85-inch model: $13,000. Available in June

98-inch model: $70,000. Available in June

A9G:

55-inch: $3,500. Available in May

65-inch: $4500. Available in May

77-inch: $8,000. Available in May

A8G:

55-inch: $2500. Available in May

65-inch: $3500. Available in May

X950G

55-inch: $1,400

65-inch: $2,200

75-inch: $3,500

85-inch: $5,000

Fuck these prices. You can get a 77 inch C8 for 3999 last month from an authorized retailer with free shipping

Deleted member 49179 · Apr 22, 2019

RedlineRonin said:
Totally forgot to watch after the credits last night.

Also, did some messing around and I think the Apple TV 4K was part of the culprit. It was set to 4KHDR, but also set to (theoretically) show native frame rate and color space etc. I set it manually to 1080p and SDR and it helped some. Not sure if others are using an ATV but I've barely used mine. Overall disappointing as I thought the whole "try to convert everything to HDR" nonsense from launch was fixed.

Episodes are still dark and grainy, but that's likely just a function of how (SDR) steaming looks. It's really a shame for what is arguably one of the biggest production tv shows that they couldn't spring for HDR and/or 4K for the final season. Even the standard blu rays look so much better than the streaming on hbo now.

It was fixed, but you need to have your video output at 4K SDR, with both the "Match Dynamic Range" and "Match Frame Rate" options enabled. That way, everything that is SDR stays SDR, and all HDR feeds will switch to HDR automatically. If you set the video output to 4K HDR it will convert everything in HDR, and you don't want that.

The only thing is that the Apple TV will upscale all content to 4K, but it does a good job at it. I've been streaming the Game of Thrones episodes that way and had absolutely no problem. It's not Netflix-like streaming quality, but it looks quite good.

Deleted member 16452 · Apr 22, 2019

Watched the latest episode of GoT last night on the HBO section of Prime on a X900F and most of the dark scenes looked like hot garbage and I don't think it was buffering issues.

Deleted member 25445 · Apr 22, 2019

I'm looking to get a 65 c8 in the next two weeks, is the the best I could buy at the price?(~2k) or are there price drops expected real soon?

Secretofmateria · Apr 22, 2019

Gears of war 4 should definitely be added to the list of refference material games. It looks incredible on my oled

Deleted member 49179 · Apr 22, 2019

2Bee said:
Watched the latest episode of GoT last night on the HBO section of Prime on a X900F and most of the dark scenes looked like hot garbage and I don't think it was buffering issues.

Interesting. I guess it depends on what service is used to stream the episodes? Here in Canada we don't have access to HBO Now. To stream HBO, the only service available is called Crave TV. They have an exclusivity deal with HBO that gives access to the whole HBO platform. This is what I use to watch the episodes. The stream quality is alright. Again, it's not near Netflix-like quality, but it's still a good 1080p feed. No problem with the dark scenes. Oh, and it's using an Apple TV 4K on an X930E.

Sunbro83 · Apr 22, 2019

Blasting through the Marvel movies again before I see Avengers on Friday. Just watched the brand new Civil War UHD. Picture was great but the HDR was a little underwhelming. I preferred the 2 Avengers re-releases. Especially Assemble as I think IMAX stuff always looks great on an OLED. The 2 big fights scenes in the airport and Siberia both look ridiculous though.

Doctor Strange next. It's the only MCU film I haven't seen before. I have the choice of regular Blu Ray on my C8 or the 3D Blu Ray on my old Panasonic GT60. Any recommendations? Feels like a film that would benefit from 3D but the loss of brightness is tough to swallow after 9 months with the OLED

Kyle Cross · Apr 22, 2019

So, I've been plugging my Linker into my HDMI chain whenever I would sit down to play a console HDR game. It's definitely annoying. Is it safe to just leave it hooked up?

TheModestGun · Apr 22, 2019

In this forum's opinion, do you think it's worth it to wait a couple years on a TV purchase as an X900e owner. Seems like there are some issues that hold OLED back right now and I wonder if I can tolerate the bloom in favor of a better TV in a few years.

Someone talk me off the ledge of wasting money right now

DrFunk · Apr 22, 2019

TheModestGun said:
In this forum's opinion, do you think it's worth it to wait a couple years on a TV purchase as an X900e owner. Seems like there are some issues that hold OLED back right now and I wonder if I can tolerate the bloom in favor of a better TV in a few years.

Someone talk me off the ledge of wasting money right now

I'd say chill. The X900E is still a fantastic tv, and OLEDs are only gonna get cheaper as time moves on. Spend that money on pizza

OverHeatQc · Apr 22, 2019

Kyle Cross said:
So, I've been plugging my Linker into my HDMI chain whenever I would sit down to play a console HDR game. It's definitely annoying. Is it safe to just leave it hooked up?

My vertex is always hook up no problem here

jon bones · Apr 22, 2019

How do I tell my TV & cables are all good for 4:4:4? YCbCr?

I want to ensure my Xbox 1X & ATV4K are set up ideally.

Static_Void said:
It was fixed, but you need to have your video output at 4K SDR, with both the "Match Dynamic Range" and "Match Frame Rate" options enabled. That way, everything that is SDR stays SDR, and all HDR feeds will switch to HDR automatically. If you set the video output to 4K HDR it will convert everything in HDR, and you don't want that.

The only thing is that the Apple TV will upscale all content to 4K, but it does a good job at it. I've been streaming the Game of Thrones episodes that way and had absolutely no problem. It's not Netflix-like streaming quality, but it looks quite good.

This is how I got my ATV4K set up and it works great. Only downside is the 4K wallpapers aren't in HDR.

I've been watching GoT via HBO GO on it and it looks great.

dallow_bg · Apr 22, 2019

jon bones said:
How do I tell my TV & cables are all good for 4:4:4? YCbCr?

I want to ensure my Xbox 1X & ATV4K are set up ideally.

This is how I got my ATV4K set up and it works great. Only downside is the 4K wallpapers aren't in HDR.

I've been watching GoT via HBO GO on it and it looks great.

I don't think those backgrounds are native hdr anyway.

RedlineRonin · Apr 22, 2019

Static_Void said:
It was fixed, but you need to have your video output at 4K SDR, with both the "Match Dynamic Range" and "Match Frame Rate" options enabled. That way, everything that is SDR stays SDR, and all HDR feeds will switch to HDR automatically. If you set the video output to 4K HDR it will convert everything in HDR, and you don't want that.

Super helpful, thank you.

Extremely unintuitive considering Apple typically kills it when it comes to that area

Larsowitz · Apr 22, 2019

Kerotan said:
So the consensus seems to be Sony have the best OLED display but you'll pay a premium. This year's OLED however have excellent input lag, much better then Sony's OLED input lag. Would you expect Sony to catch up in this regard next year? Surely the game mode performance will be the priority with next gen coming up?

Panasonic is imo superior and a bit cheaper as well.

Deleted member 16452 · Apr 22, 2019

Secretofmateria said:
Gears of war 4 should definitely be added to the list of refference material games. It looks incredible on my oled

Absolutely, game looks incredible.

Sunbro83 said:
Blasting through the Marvel movies again before I see Avengers on Friday. Just watched the brand new Civil War UHD. Picture was great but the HDR was a little underwhelming. I preferred the 2 Avengers re-releases. Especially Assemble as I think IMAX stuff always looks great on an OLED. The 2 big fights scenes in the airport and Siberia both look ridiculous though.

Doctor Strange next. It's the only MCU film I haven't seen before. I have the choice of regular Blu Ray on my C8 or the 3D Blu Ray on my old Panasonic GT60. Any recommendations? Feels like a film that would benefit from 3D but the loss of brightness is tough to swallow after 9 months with the OLED

This post reminded me I need to get the winter soldier and civil war 4k uhd discs, thanks!

Deleted member 14649 · Apr 22, 2019

RedlineRonin said:
Super helpful, thank you.

Extremely unintuitive considering Apple typically kills it when it comes to that area

It's not really that unintuitive. Each option speaks for itself and turning them both on means the box auto-detects the right dynamic range and framerate it should be operating in. The definition of set and forget. Saying that, I think the 24Hz implementation is horrible, at least with my B6, so I have everything running at 60Hz here, so disable framerate matching and force everything to the higher framerate.

reKon · Apr 23, 2019

Hey all,

I have $1500 of cash to spend on a Costco card. Do I just get the Series P Quantum now at $1400?

Or do I just get some bang for buck 55 inch TV now and wait hold on for a couple of years until HDMI 2.1 and other TV tech become more prevalent with the new consoles coming out? Just not sure how much of an upgrade to expect. There's also the chance that the top TVs in the future launch at very expensive prices due to the new tech and take forever to come down in price.

RedlineRonin · Apr 23, 2019

holygeesus said:
Each option speaks for itself and turning them both on means the box auto-detects the right dynamic range and framerate it should be operating in.

This is literally not true, hence my above post. In 4K HDR, even if auto detect is on, it will still convert to HDR instead of natively displaying SDR, to the point he just made above.

dallow_bg · Apr 23, 2019

Yeah, it won't usually go from HDR to SDR if you're default output is set to HDR as most apps and menus won't trigger the SDR change. Needs to be SDR as default.

Which is fine as the home screen, app menus, wallpaper aren't really hdr anyway.

Some apps don't play well with the frame rate matching like Amazon Prime video. Switching to 24Hz creates visible lip sync issues so I have to leave it at 60Hz.

Deleted member 14649 · Apr 23, 2019

RedlineRonin said:
This is literally not true, hence my above post. In 4K HDR, even if auto detect is on, it will still convert to HDR instead of natively displaying SDR, to the point he just made above.

Yes you are right. My apologies. Apple have messed up.

As an aside does anyone else notice horrible flickering in 24hz mode on the Apple TV? I wonder if it happens a lot as people in the AF9 thread on another forum also brought it up. It even flickers when you pause. Most noticeable in dark scenes of shows like Game of Thrones. It's so noticeable here that I've had to revert to forcing to 60Hz mode which doesn't completely solve the issue as then I can't use Dolby Vision.

Psyrgery · Apr 23, 2019

Sooo I decided to replace my trusty UE49MU7005 (European model, that's the MU8005 for you american fellows!) which was a nice introduction to 4K/HDR gaming and get a 2018 QE55Q9FN, as this series has dropped in price considerably after the new 2019 series have been released.

How much I'm in for a treat? Will arrive around early next week, can't wait!

TV Displays and Tech Thread |OT2| There Is No Perfect TV ™ (Read The OP)

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