This is rich from the dude confusing Lithuania with Russia lmao
I mean, that's the thing. People need to be taught on the topic versus just getting jumped on.
It's not a problem of which country we should "go by". The very thought of the whole world should "go by" a certain country's tradition and custom is extremely imperialism and racist in itself. We are not talking about a broad universal concept like "equal right" here. We are talking about one specific custom, one social taboo that strictly exists in one country that accounts for 4% of the world's population. How many Chinese or Indian or Indonesian or Brazilian social taboos do you know?
It's an issue with russians and easter european cosplayers, they are infamous for it. I bet they pat themselves in the back and tell and encourage eachother bc it's okay ,they aren't americas.There's no way you don't know better by now. I refuse to believe someone is completely oblivious, especially as a cosplayer at this point
You know American is anyone that lives in this continent? From Canada to Chile.It's an issue with russians and easter european cosplayers, they are infamous for it. I bet they pat themselves in the back and tell and encourage eachother bc it's okay ,they aren't americas.
Nah I just read she was Russian in the original twitter thread that was going around and didn't feel the need to read a second article about it. A flub for sure, but much less embarrassing than defending blackfaceThis is rich from the dude confusing Lithuania with Russia lmao
This is kind of a tangent, but again in another country (Japan) this is actually totally normal. Right near my apartment is a skin whitening booth that takes your picture and makes you look more like a white person in skin tone. It even advertises on the side with a caucasion model, and shows the Japanese face becoming more like that model.Ask yourself this, how come you only see white people paint themselves dark but not the other way for costumes? The skin color isn't the character, need to stop treating it as such.
Saying that a random ass person from Lithuania doesn't know what blackface is isn't defending blackface. I already said more than once that the ban is fair.Nah I just read she was Russian in the original twitter thread that was going around and didn't feel the need to read a second article about it. A flub for sure, but much less embarrassing than defending blackface
ITT: lots of Europeans who somehow miss our Zwarte Piet threads every year. Blackface is not OK.
Well, that's disappointing. I was hoping she at least learned something from this experience.
I know because I'm south american but mostly of people in this thread are using it to refer to USA so I do it, I'm pretty sure people know what I mean. Encuentro bien sospechoso que solo me cuestiones a mi cuando varios usuarios en este tema han utilizado America=USA. Blackface is not okay from Canada to Chile, like I said I'm from South america and I know it's wrong, not because it's wrong in USA but because you can't cosplay a race.You know American is anyone that lives in this continent? From Canada to Chile.
But of course, gringos can't understand that.
American can mean anyone on both continents or exclusively people/thing from U.S in the English language.You know American is anyone that lives in this continent? From Canada to Chile.
But of course, gringos can't understand that.
Sorry, in a bad mood today. Thought you were a gringo too.I know because I'm south american but mostly of people in this thread are using it to refer to USA so I do it, I'm pretty sure people know what I mean. Encuentro bien sospechoso que solo me cuestiones a mi cuando varios usuarios en este tema han utilizado America=USA. Blackface is not okay from Canada to Chile, like I said I'm from South america and I know it's wrong, not because it's wrong in USA but because you can't cosplay a race.
"American" is generally associated with citizens of the U.S. because we don't have our own "-an" to use (like Canadian, Mexican, Chilean, etc.) United Statesian never caught on for some reason.Sorry, in a bad mood today. Thought you were a gringo too.
I'll just drop it and leave this thread. If I continue like this, I'll probably get a ban.
"American" is generally associated with citizens of the U.S. because we don't have our own "-an" to use (like Canadian, Mexican, Chilean, etc.) United Statesian never caught on for some reason.
This is kind of a tangent, but again in another country (Japan) this is actually totally normal. Right near my apartment is a skin whitening booth that takes your picture and makes you look more like a white person in skin tone. It even advertises on the side with a caucasion model, and shows the Japanese face becoming more like that model.
To be honest, I didn't know about blackface before I read about it on NeoGaf. And I don't mean just that it is offensive, I did not know that people actually did it at all. So I don't find it hard to believe that others don't know about it either.
pretty sure they know that they're just trying to reclaim the term american to mean anyone from north, south or central america. why they would want to reclaim it with all its baggage is beyond me as an estadounidense
This is kind of a tangent, but again in another country (Japan) this is actually totally normal. Right near my apartment is a skin whitening booth that takes your picture and makes you look more like a white person in skin tone. It even advertises on the side with a caucasion model, and shows the Japanese face becoming more like that model.
I'm not defending blackface (or what I just mentioned) by any means, but the cultural context outside of America and the UK can be largely ignorant to how offensive it is. In this case it seems like she wanted to look more like the character without the proper knowledge of what blackface is. I don't know jack about Lithuania but it's an eastern European country so she may very well have been lacking the proper cultural context.
Either way, I doubt she'll do it again.
This is such a thorny issue; blackface means different things in the US / UK than it means in the rest of the world. It may be unfortunate but it is what it is; without the context of minstrel shows, the practice itself isn't taboo to most European cultures.
That said, Internet has gone a long way towards universalizing values (for better or worse, which is another discussion). In Spain, a lot of people will still look at you as if you were utterly insane if you suggested that King Baltasar tradition is remotely racist, but a couple decades ago that percentage would be pretty much 100%. Nowadays you at least have some hope of getting the point across, especially among younger generations.
It is beyond you why someone from America but not the US might possibly take issue with the term "American" excluding them?
Like, really?
It always helps to know and understand why something is wrong vs just being told that it's wrong. In this case, painting your skin a different colour would not be inherently wrong in and of itself, it's the historical background that makes it wrong, the fact, that it was traditionally used to make fun of black people and perpetuate negative, racist stereotypes, etc. If that had not happened, there'd be nothing racist about it which then makes it easier to understand why, in parts of the world that haven't had as systematic a history with blackface and black suppression as the US does (or countries where that history isn't really common knowledge - a lot of black suppression at the hands of European countries happened in their former colonies where most ordinary citizens back home wouldn't have seen it and it thus had a harder time entering into the public conscience), some people have a harder time grasping why it's so problematic.There's no teachable moment beyond that's racist so stop. If people start bringing up white tradition in response they're always going to be racist because you can't teach somebody to value the perspectives of minorities over tradition.
She didn't. Obviously. She got punished. Hopefully she learned.
Edit: Americans "refusing to believe" how things are in the other parts of the globe is about as ignorant as what she did. Blackface is pretty much never discussed or learned in many parts of the world (like mine). This is not super unlikely, guys.
.In The Netherlands we are having this debate. Painting your face black is wrong, but there isn't always malicious intent. If people aren't aware of the negative aspects of blackface, because they've never heard about it.. how should they know it's wrong?
I've been talking with many people in my village about this. Their standard response is: ''I'm not a racist, but black pete is black pete and he should stay black. It's tradition.''
Calling them racists in their face hasn't worked well.
That "joke" (being generous here) only works if you start with the assumption that "American" already means "US resident", so...
It's an issue with russians and easter european cosplayers, they are infamous for it. I bet they pat themselves in the back and tell and encourage eachother bc it's okay ,they aren't americas.
you mean the assumption that started that entire conversation?
What? If your face was like one side black and one side red then that's not black face.Black face is fucking horrifying. I remember when I was 16 my friend's neighborhood was throwing like a Halloween block party. He found a bunch of face paint and I did like half black half red. I remember his dad came up to me and was like "hey, I know you didn't mean to do black face but that's kinda what you did and it's not cool" so I took it off.
That was when I was 16 and dumb. We should know by now that painting your skin black is not cool and has a dark and shitty history.
Which is a silly point of contention since we don't really have a better word than "American" to describe such people.Yeah, I mean that exactly. For your joke to land you have to concede that you consider "Americans" to mean "US residents", which is precisely the point of contention.
Edit: Americans "refusing to believe" how things are in the other parts of the globe is about as ignorant as what she did. Blackface is pretty much never discussed or learned in many parts of the world (like mine). This is not super unlikely, guys.
US people assuming the rest of the world is like them by default, disbelieving foreigners when they tell them otherwise, and generally being unable to even conceive of any other country being different, is the most US thing ever. It's provincian and almost kind of endearing, but also understandable; unlike the rest of the world, they aren't continuously exposed to a foreing country's mass media to let them compare and contrast like everyone else does (because, of course, the omnipresent mass media that the rest of the world is exposed to are the US' very own).
Which is a silly point of contention since we don't have a better word than "American" to describe such people.
i'm sorry they said "Americans" how did you parse that he meant "US people"?
Americans: 9 letters, 4 syllabes.
US people: 8 letters (9 with the space), 4 syllabes.
The point of contention is not that "Americans" cannot be discerned to mean "US people" by context (like in this case); it's that it erases other American countries and people.
Makes you feel good when folks put you in the same box as Namekins, Dark Elves, Orcs, etc.It's always interesting how it's always white people doing blackface in the spirit of authentically playing a character but there isn't this huge swath of black people painting themselves white to play a character. Despite you know, there being way more fucking white characters than black ones to choose from. Makes you wonder why that is.
This is a very "non US person" idea.Americans: 9 letters, 4 syllabes.
US people: 8 letters (9 with the space), 4 syllabes.