Ubisoft & Denuvo treating paying customers like pirates.

[MMaRsu]

Hi everyone! I'll try to make this post as non ranty as I can, but this really grinds my gears to the point of its been grinded into dust.

So a little while ago Assassins Creed Origins came out. A lot of people who play AC games are obviously excited, myself included. Since Black Flag I haven't been into AC as much as I used to be, but I was really looking forward to playing this new game. Especially since I love Egypt and really wanted to explore the open world.

The minimum requirements for the game are as follows:

OS: Windows 7 SP1, Windows 8.1, Windows 10 (64-bit versions only)
PROCESSOR: Intel Core i5-2400s @ 2.5 GHz or AMD FX-6350 @ 3.9 GHz or equivalent
VIDEO CARD: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660 or AMD R9 270 (2048 MB VRAM with Shader Model 5.0 or better)
SYSTEM RAM: 6GB
Resolution: 720p
Video Preset: Lowest

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Now these are the same requirements as let's say Assassins Creed Syndicate. Now let's get to the real issue here.

People with AMD Phenom CPU's are unable to boot the game up, because DENUVO requires SSE 4.1 and SSE 4.2. Which are unsupported by the PHENOM CPU's. And because of this, the game will just not launch for anyone on a CPU which does not support these instruction sets needed for DENUVO ( not needed for AC:O mind you ).

On the official forums of the game, plenty of people have created threads on this very subject but this is the biggest.

https://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/1773782-Crash-when-start-the-game

45 pages of people asking for support, asking if this will be patched, asking for ANYTHING from Ubisoft to let them know.. "Hey I paid for your product, either make it work or give me a refund". Except Ubisoft doesn't give refunds for products on the Uplay store. So far no word from Ubisoft despite this being the biggest thread on their forums.

You might say hey maybe it's time to upgrade. But why would I when I can run the newest games above 30fps or around 50/60fps on High settings? Ghost Recon Wildlands, Watch Dogs 2, Wolfenstein II, Forza Horizon 3. Just name a game and it works on my pc. I have a Phenom x6 1090t black edition running at 3.6ghz. A 1060 3gb as well and I have no issues running any new games.

So instead of giving out a word to the actual paying consumers and customers, they are treating us like pirates and will share no word. Ofcourse they will not just remove DENUVO untill it gets cracked. But the fact that the SSE requirement is listed nowhere, not only gives a false indication of the product you need to run this game but also doesn't gel with the AC:Syndicate requirements. Ofcourse that game doesn't use DENUVO so therefore it runs like a dream on my pc.

I know I am not alone in this. Sadly when Destiny 2 had this exact same requirement, it was patched quickly so that Phenom CPU users could still enjoy that game. Ofcourse you also had coverage from major news sites so the word got out quick. See:

https://venturebeat.com/2017/10/24/destiny-2-doesnt-work-with-old-amd-phenom-ii-cpus/

Sadly no such coverage for Assassins Creed Origins, and plenty of people sitting on Uplay with this game but cannot run it. Please get the word out, if you care for us Phenom users.

 

[R.T Straker]

Yup.

Dishonored 2 and MGS V shiped with the same exact problem and it got patched in no time. No excuse.

 

[ssnick37]

So scummy.

If they dont want to support it fine, that is their choice, but at least give a refund.

 

[Deleted member 2840]

It's absurd that publishers are still using things like Denuvo like it has any effect but inconveniencing paying customers.

 

[HMS_Pinafore]

Ubisoft is just preparing us all for when Skull and Bones comes out next year.

 

[Shuri]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AMD_Phenom

Produced 2007

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[danmaku]

Someone needs to call EU and tell them there's another shop that needs to be dragged kicking and screaming in the wonderful world of refunds.

 

[Yurikerr]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AMD_Phenom

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So what?

 

[Deleted member 11093]

It's amazing how this one hasn't gotten cracked yet. What kind of DRM are they using? Is it a new Denuvo?

 

[Deleted member 1003]

Pretty disgusting that a game won't run unless you meet the DRMs minimum specs. I mean, what?

 

[Dinobot]

It's just viral marketing for Skull & Bones in 2018.

 

[MMaRsu]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AMD_Phenom

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And yet it still runs all new games without any problems. In fact, the Phenom CPU's are in some cases better than the FX series I've been told.

Pretty disgusting that a game won't run unless you meet the DRMs minimum specs. I mean, what?

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This is pretty much exactly the problem. The game's specs are fine, it's the DRM specs that are below minimum requirements. And yes it is REAL scummy.

 

[B4mv]

That's insanely frustrating, I hope something gets done soon.

 

[Executive Taxi]

Here we go. Is this one of those threads that comveniently exaggerate an aspect of an uncracked DRM in an attempt to pressure the developer to remove it?

 

[MMaRsu]

Here we go. Is this one of those threads that comveniently exaggerate an aspect of an uncracked DRM in an attempt to pressure the developer to remove it?

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Sure bud.

 

[LazyPanda]

If there is no way to make the game run on Phenom CPUS, Ubisoft should refund the purchases and put a disclaimer on the game's store page that clearly states the game won't run on those processors.

 

[Luchashaq]

DRM issues and Steam turning into a dumping ground make me so bummed that my recently upgraded gaming PC gets used more for work than anything else nowadays.

I just hope mount and blade 2 doesn't have any sort of nonsense going on.

 

[Shuri]

edit: my bad, it seems that the OP's cpu came out in 2010. So only 7 years old

So what?

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http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey

AMD has a 8% share of users according to team stats. Out of this, 1.61% of those users are in the ghz range described by the OP. Maybe the OP's cpu still performs OK for some games, but it simply does not support newer instruction sets.

I just did a quick google around, and it seems that lots of games simply won't work for him, whetever or not the game is using that specific copy protection. Mafia3, Resident Evil 7, any VR headsets, no man sky, and quite a few others.

Is this refusal to upgrade really worth all this aggravation? Upgrade and get back access to your game and get vastly increased framerates

 

[Leafhopper]

Here we go. Is this one of those threads that comveniently exaggerate an aspect of an uncracked DRM in an attempt to pressure the developer to remove it?

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Lol okay.

 

[Airbar]

I just hope mount and blade 2 doesn't have any sort of nonsense going on.

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Same here bud. But since they released every other game & addon on GoG as well makes me hopeful there will be a DRM free version of Bannerlord.

 

[Dogui]

Wait, so games on Uplay store doesn't offer refunds, but Steam should offer it's 2 hours/2 weeks refund to all the games in the store.

So, assuming you buy the Uplay game via Steam (Like 99% of people probably does), and want a refund, you can't?

I mean, what?

 

[jonjonaug]

Here we go. Is this one of those threads that comveniently exaggerate an aspect of an uncracked DRM in an attempt to pressure the developer to remove it?

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For once, no. This is a "the DRM makes it impossible to play on my PC" thread", not a "the DRM slightly inconveniences me or I think it impacts performance without proof" thread.

 

[whiskas_fanatic]

Yep, always felt this way. You bought game, but in case you want steal it after that - there is Denuvo. No, they don't think you are pirate, but just in case, there is Denuvo. And real pirates? They will play comfortably without any shitty DRM after game will be cracked. But for you there still will be Denuvo - just deal with it!

 

[MMaRsu]

edit: my bad, it seems that the OP's cpu came out in 2010. So only 7 years old


http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey

AMD has a 8% share of users according to team stats. Out of this, 1.61% of those users are in the ghz range described by the OP. Maybe the OP's cpu still performs OK for some games, but it simply does not support newer instruction sets.

Is this refusal to upgrade really worth all this aggravation?

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Shuri, bro. Why would I upgrade to a FX series CPU when the games don't perform that much better with a chipset like that?

If any other game runs fine, why would I upgrade for one title? For which the publisher obfuscates that the DRM minspecs are actually the thing that is holding me and many others from playing it?

 

[~Fake]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AMD_Phenom

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And?

 

[Dick Justice]

Fuck companies that treat paying customers like criminals. GTAV will sometimes, due to Rockstar's shitty servers, prevent me from playing the single player. Meanwhile pirates encounter no such issues due to not having to deal with the pile of horse faeces known as the Rockstar Social Club.

 

[Yurikerr]

Here we go. Is this one of those threads that comveniently exaggerate an aspect of an uncracked DRM in an attempt to pressure the developer to remove it?

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Jesus, an DRM apologist.

edit: my bad, it seems that the OP's cpu came out in 2010. So only 7 years old


http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey

AMD has a 8% share of users according to team stats. Out of this, 1.61% of those users are in the ghz range described by the OP. Maybe the OP's cpu still performs OK for some games, but it simply does not support newer instruction sets.

I just did a quick google around, and it seems that lots of games simply won't work for him, whetever or not the game is using that specific copy protection. Mafia3, Resident Evil 7, any VR headsets, no man sky, and quite a few others.

Is this refusal to upgrade really worth all this aggravation? Upgrade and get back access to your game and get vastly increased framerates

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This is the first time that I see a game actively block someone from running a game because they don't meet the minimum requirements.

And even if Ubisoft choose to not support OPs configuration, they should give him (and others on the same situation) a refund, as they don't state anywhere that not meeting the requirements will block you from running the game.

I imagine that you read the whole OP, where's clearly written:

Ubisoft doesn't give refunds for products on the Uplay store.

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[texhnolyze]

Sorry OP, but I'm afraid that Shuri is right. The game is simply not supporting CPUs below SSE 4.1. I was a long-running Phenom II user (2010 - 2017) and I posted the similar issue in the old site a lot. Some games that didn't have Denuvo protection also didn't work, so it's not the DRM's vault. The evidence is leaning towards that possibility.

 

[Shuri]

Shuri, bro. Why would I upgrade to a FX series CPU when the games don't perform that much better with a chipset like that?

If any other game runs fine, why would I upgrade for one title? For which the publisher obfuscates that the DRM minspecs are actually the thing that is holding me and many others from playing it?

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Oh I know, I know that it sucks incredibly, and I don't blame you for complaining, but.. all this could be avoidable :P

 

[Yurikerr]

Sorry OP, but I'm afraid that Shuri is right. The game is simply not supporting CPUs below SSE 4.1. I was a long-running Phenom II user and I posted the similar issue in the old site a lot. Some games that didn't have Denuvo protection also didn't work, so it's not the DRM's vault. The evidence is leaning towards that possibility.

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But then Ubi should clearly state that in the game's store description. And offer refunds for those that bought it without knowing.

Simply saying "This is the minimium" without giving more details let's people assume that even below it they will be able to run it.

The same way that normally graphics card descriptions state the DirectX version required in addition to putting a VGA model, they could say that SSE 4.1 is a must.

 

[MMaRsu]

Sorry OP, but I'm afraid that Shuri is right. The game is simply not supporting CPUs below SSE 4.1. I was a long-running Phenom II user and I posted the similar issue in the old site a lot. Some games that didn't have Denuvo protection also didn't work, so it's not the DRM's vault. The evidence is leaning towards that possibility.

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I'm sorry but this is just untrue. Mostly all games that didn't work because of the SSE instruction set requirement were patched after the fact. Because the DENUVO got removed.

https://www.slowdown.vg/2017/09/25/list-of-games-that-no-longer-run-on-amd-phenom/

Below, I have compiled a list of PC ports that did not outright run on AMD Phenom CPUs. I've compiled information of current with patch notes and developer responses. The current list includes the following games:

• Agents of Mayhem ( NOW WORKS )
• Dead Rising 4 ( I don't know )
• Destiny 2 ( NOW WORKS )
• Dishonored 2 ( NOW WORKS )
• Mafia 3 ( NOW WORKS )
• Nex Machina ( I don't know )
• Earth Defense Force ( I don't know )
• METAL GEAR SOLID V: THE PHANTOM PAIN ( NOW WORKS )
• No Man's Sky ( I don't know )
• PREY ( NOW WORKS )
• Resident Evil 7 ( NOW WORKS )

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So as you can see, almost all games work just fine on Phenom CPU's now after they got patched. Most of them also had Denuvo DRM. Games like Ghost Recon Wildlands, Nier Automata, Forza Horizon 3, PUBG and many other new games have zero problems.

 

[low-G]

1). Ubistore should get with the times and allow refunds.
2). All DRM that significantly impacts performance should be removed (not the first time for Denuvo).
3). You should buy a new CPU (eventually), because there are games which also require those newer instruction sets. The fact is when devs do workarounds to not use that instruction set, it's less optimized. Probably not a performance killer.

 

[texhnolyze]

But then Ubi should clearly state that in the game's store description. And offer refunds for those that bought it without knowing.

Simply saying "This is the minimium" without giving more details let's people assume that even below it they will be able to run it.

The same way that normally graphics card descriptions state the DirectX version required in addition to putting a VGA model, they could say that SSE 4.1 is a must.

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Sure, I'm totally not against that. So I presume the OP bought the game from uPlay instead of Steam? If it's on Steam, it'll be easier to ask for a refund.

I'm sorry but this is just untrue. Mostly all games that didn't work because of the SSE instruction set requirement were patched after the fact. Because the DENUVO got removed.

https://www.slowdown.vg/2017/09/25/list-of-games-that-no-longer-run-on-amd-phenom/

So as you can see, almost all games work just fine on Phenom CPU's now after they got patched. Most of them also had Denuvo DRM. Games like Ghost Recon Wildlands, Nier Automata, Forza Horizon 3, PUBG and many other new games have zero problems.

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I played MGSV at launch and it worked just fine. When did it got patched?

 

[ezodagrom]

And?

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It's a 7~8 years old CPU series, can't expect devs to support such old hardware forever. Graphics cards released when Phenom II CPUs were first released (2009) aren't supported by most games nowadays (DX10/10.1 GPUs, most games nowadays require DX11), should people be complaining about that as well? ._.

According to Steam's Hardware Survey, only 3.33% of surveyed Windows users have CPUs that don't support SSE4.1, and only 4.13% of users have CPUs that don't support SSE4.2, can't really blame them for not supporting outdated hardware that only a small fraction of users have.
Plus, these CPUs are below minimum requirements, devs are not under obligation to support components that are below minimum requirements.

 

[MMaRsu]

But other CPU's that do have the SSE 4.1 and 4.2 support but are lower than required specs wise, can still boot and run the game. Not with great performance, but the game boots.

The game doesn't even boot for Phenom users regardless of clocks. You can have a 4.0ghz oc'd six core Phenom with a 1080 or whathaveyou and the game will still not boot because of the Denuvo SSE requirement.

So...it's not the game it's the DRM.

 

[Al3x1s]

They do say i5/FX as lowest so... I don't think that "or equivalent" is meant to mean CPUs from last decade. They aren't equivalent in featureset after all, even if otherwise performance is passable. Maybe this time it's the DRM that needs it, in another case it might be the actual game, I recall I think Doom getting patched for that, but still, I don't think playtesting on not only the vast range of current CPUs but also ancient models is viable so they cover it with their minimum specs not including those. Maybe they'll patch it, maybe they won't, but their minimum specs have it covered, your CPU is actually not equivalent to that if only by the featureset supported. It would be nice if it worked, it's nice that it works for so many games, but you probably shouldn't just assume that it works before purchasing.

 

[ezodagrom]

But other CPU's that do have the SSE 4.1 and 4.2 support but are lower than required specs wise, can still boot and run the game. Not with great performance, but the game boots.

The game doesn't even boot for Phenom users regardless of clocks. You can have a 4.0ghz oc'd six core Phenom with a 1080 or whathaveyou and the game will still not boot because of the Denuvo SSE requirement.

So...it's not the game it's the DRM.

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And how do you know it's because of the drm? Maybe it isn't? Maybe it's the game itself that requires those instruction sets?

Either way, these CPUs are old enough for it to be time to upgrade. Even if it didn't have the SSE4.2 requirement (Core 2 users which support SSE4.1 can't run the game either) I really don't believe Phenom II CPUs could run the game even at 30fps. These are CPUs that go below 30fps on Watch Dogs 2, and Origins seems to be even heavier on the CPU.

 

[MMaRsu]

I'll agree but why if the game has the exact same minspecs as Assassins Creed Syndicate and that runs like a charm, why would you not expect the game to run? Perhaps with less than great performance, but it doesnt even boot up.

How do you explain that?

I'll provide video footage:




These CPU's stood the test of time and can run the newest games just fine. Mind you I have a 1060 3gb card which gives an even better performance than the 670 in the video above.

 

[SnakeyHips]

I really want AC:Origins but won't until the horrible CPU destroying (slight exaggeration) DRM is removed. Once it is, it's an instant buy for me :D

 

[Deleted member 1777]

Earth Defense Force 4.1 had this issue as well and it got patched. If Sandlot, a developer who makes budget titles and had EDF 4.1 as their first PC game can patch it, so can fucking Ubisoft.

 

[ezodagrom]

I'll agree but why if the game has the exact same minspecs as Assassins Creed Syndicate and that runs like a charm, why would you not expect the game to run? Perhaps with less than great performance, but it doesnt even boot up.

How do you explain that?

I'll provide video footage:

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Same requirements or not, it's always a gamble to purchase a game for a below specs PC.
I believe that Syndicate and Origins have the same minimum requirements because those were possibly the weakest PCs they had available to test the games, the weakest PCs they could confirm that run both games.

 

[MMaRsu]

Same requirements or not, it's always a gamble to purchase a game for a below specs PC.
I believe that Syndicate and Origins have the same minimum requirements because those were possibly the weakest PCs they had available to test the games, the weakest PCs they could confirm that run both games.

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But why assume it's the game when there all these titles that had the SSE requirements for Denuvo and got patched to run on Phenom CPU's after the DRM was removed? Or just patched in to support it? Like say Destiny 2?

And yeah as you can see in those videos I posted, this CPU holds it's own very well.

Earth Defense Force 4.1 had this issue as well and it got patched. If Sandlot, a developer who makes budget titles and had EDF 4.1 as their first PC game can patch it, so can fucking Ubisoft.

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Exactly.

 

[SunhiLegend]

Damn, still getting this crap. Same issue happened with the Resident Evil 7 which got patched within a few days and it was the same with MGSV but again that got patched, within a few hours even. I still have a CPU from 2009, AMD 955 and even though it's old it's still more powerful than a PS4 or Xbox One and with most games I've had no problem out performing the consoles, even with a GTX 760. Hopefully they patch the game as with the other games mentioned it was quick simple fix, was really looking forward to buying the game but if I can't play even though my system is more than capable that's a shame.

 

[ezodagrom]

But why assume it's the game when there all these titles that had the SSE requirements for Denuvo and got patched to run on Phenom CPU's after the DRM was removed? Or just patched in to support it? Like say Destiny 2?

And yeah as you can see in those videos I posted, this CPU holds it's own very well.

Exactly.

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It's not even the same issue between different games. Destiny 2 required SSSE3 before being patched, AC Origins requires SSE4.2, Sonic Forces boots but crashes mid first stage for CPUs that don't support SSE4.1, no idea about EDF (didn't search about it), but if it was because of Denuvo, wouldn't they all have the same requirement?

 

[MMaRsu]

It's not even the same issue between different games. Destiny 2 required SSSE3 before being patched, AC Origins requires SSE4.2, Sonic Forces boots but crashes mid first stage for CPUs that don't support SSE4.1, no idea about EDF (didn't search about it), but if it was because of Denuvo, wouldn't they all have the same requirement?

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Like I said some games just got patched for the instruction set calls. But most games in the list that I posted earlier in this thread did have Denuvo and got patched afterwards. Say for instance Agents of Mayhem which I know for a fact got patched after they removed the Denuvo DRM. Then wow magically it works on Phenom CPU's.

But if it's not the DRM, then it could easily be patched looking at say Destiny 2. Then there would be no issue for Ubisoft. They can just come out and say hey it's the SSE requirement. But that's nowhere to be found.

They could say we will patch it or we will not patch it. Except they say nothing to their paying customers who have a 45 page thread on their official forums.

 

[Deleted member 15395]

Scummy as fuck, they just don't learn. And that's not even the worst of it, since this bullshit actually did prevent the game from being cracked they have 0 incentive to not do it again...

 

[Wowfunhappy]

ISo as you can see, almost all games work just fine on Phenom CPU's now after they got patched. Most of them also had Denuvo DRM. Games like Ghost Recon Wildlands, Nier Automata, Forza Horizon 3, PUBG and many other new games have zero problems.

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Nier still has Denuvo though, it was never patched out of the game. So are you sure this has anything to do with Denuvo?

 

[nihilence]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AMD_Phenom

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The way you posted this is inflammatory. But it does raise a point about support, the headache of technology upgrading. The op also has a point with similar games working fine, and I can understand their frustration.

If games, particularly digital, don't work, they should be refundable. Especially at a time where each launcher is probably aware of the system specs. Heck, if the store or launcher does know your specs it should warn you.

More so, Ubisoft appears to be based in our near the EU. I thought they had stronger consumer protection laws over there. Being unaware of requirements sounds low a reason to take care of the consumer.

 

[ezodagrom]

Like I said some games just got patched for the instruction set calls. But most games in the list that I posted earlier in this thread did have Denuvo and got patched afterwards. Say for instance Agents of Mayhem which I know for a fact got patched after they removed the Denuvo DRM. Then wow magically it works on Phenom CPU's.

But if it's not the DRM, then it could easily be patched looking at say Destiny 2. Then there would be no issue for Ubisoft. They can just come out and say hey it's the SSE requirement. But that's nowhere to be found.

They could say we will patch it or we will not patch it. Except they say nothing to their paying customers who have a 45 page thread on their official forums.

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Did you know it's possible to fix different issues in a single patch? :|
Just because they removed Denuvo and added support for old CPUs in the same patch doesn't mean they were related. >Agents of Mayhem

 

[Bjones]

Even beyond that horribleness if it ever gets proved that denuvo is the cause for high cpu usage in the game then I for one will never buy a pc game with that drm in it ever again.