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UK General Election 12th December 2019 |OT1| Hindsight is 20/19 (Tory majority confirmed)
- Thread starter Uzzy
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The Lib Dems accepting a total fucking loser like Sam Gyimah is alway going to be funny to me.
What are the LD offering for any of those things?
What are the LD offering for any of those things?
When Railtrack was taken back into state control the shareholders had to prove misfeasance of public office, so there are protections.
Yeah that sounds like a rather different situation to what is being proposed. Taking a failing company into national ownership is very different to taking a thriving one into national ownership.
The BBC can fuck off. Constant miss-use of the word Communism over the years inching the propaganda further forward that Corbyn, let alone Labour, even have anything to do with actual Communism.
It's a disgrace.
Thankfully internally in Scotland you don't actually hear that shit much if ever. No one calls the SNP Communists and I don't even know a single Tory up here (I know a few) who calls Corbyn a communist.
It's American Republican propaganda and for whatever reason, the English establishment seems to be embracing it.
Also, the Lib Dems are just orange Tories, there, said it. Trust Jo Swinson at your own peril.
Because the American system is fucking amazing*
*if you happen to be the one profiting from it
No, as long as the public official is doing something without intent to cause harm, say building a motorway or runway that crashes the value of someones property then it's okay. which is why their case failed against the labour government. i don't see the problems with it that you do, it's fairly well established law, it has to be legal and done properly and nationalisation isn't a new concept.
Remember, everything slightly left of the centre is full-blown Communism.
We need Tony Blair back to restore balance.
Corbyn "How about we try many things differently than the current broken system that's been chugging along for over a decade?"
BBC "COMMUNISM!"
Can't they just say they're going to buy all the shares at 1/10 their current value, then as they are literal scary Communists who will kill anyone who doesn't bend to the state's will, the price will crash to 1/10 their starting value, then they can buy them for their cheap, but real, value fair and square. "Investments can decrease in value" etc. etc. etc..
Can confirm working in Tech that BT have been taking the piss for years now and a good kick up the backside is what's needed. I hope the higher ups are shitting themselves.
People who own the shares can see the opposition policy and sell now or take the risk and keep/buy them.
I'm not sure what i would do to be honest if i had any money invested, Corbyn might pull a blinder.
Really?
Seems mental that we offered - say - the water industry up to the private sector debt-free at the taxpayer's expense, only for them to put up bills above inflation, run up MORE debt than when it was nationalised (this is adjusted for inflation too), suck out billions in dividends on exploiting a natural monopoly, let the system rot with enough water for 20 million people being lost to leaks per day, and never really provide the increased investment we were promised privatisation would bring (2018 had less investment than 1990).
Not to mention the Conservatives quite literally starved the nationalised Regional Water Authorities of their ability to borrow money for capital projects to make the case for selling it off, or that they actually covered up a mass water poisoning incident in 1988 to protect privatisation (which was in turn caused by reduced staffing levels thanks to said plans).
We'll have to see what the details are in the Labour manifesto, but under no circumstances should the shareholders be given an easy ride to a fat payout, considering the profits from the water industry have routinely ended up back in their pockets at the expense of the system and the public.
privatise the profit, nationalise the risk.
If we as a country are going to put billions at these monopolies why not just own them? The German state own more of BT and our rail network than we do.
What TV news do people recommend for non-bootlicking election coverage? The "broadband communism" nonsense seems to be the straw that broke the camel's back for my mum re: the BBC (though she's hated Laura K for a long time). Channel 4?
What I always hear is what a state the nationalised industries were in in the 70s and 80s.
Conveniently avoiding the issue of underinvestment and poor management (unions usually get the blame) and that plenty of traditional state owned services in the UK, like rail and power, are run by successful foreign state owned companies.
Run the services into the ground through lack of investment and then say the only way to save them is private sector competition.
It's going to take some pretty huge steps to repair the shite this country has been subjected to in the last thirty or forty years, but yeah... it's all communism of course.
I meant more once they'd begun their reign of terror on the moneyed classes. As in, they get into power and then say, on this date in six months, we will be buying all those shares at this price, come six months time that's what the share price will be :)
If they're anything like the bankers, right now they'll be smugly laughing as it's expected constant Tory rule will prevail in the end and keep the status quo.
The companies take the piss. They believe they are untouchable.
Take from the pockets of the people, barely pay any proper taxes to support the economies they operate in, act like the Mafia if anyone comes knocking suggesting change is needed.
If the British people weren't such fucking morons they'd vote for any sort of go at proper change in this country. I'll extend that to Americans thinking Bernie fucking Sanders is a radical/Communist too. Turkeys voting for Christmas. It's always sizeable numbers of the actual working class who keep voting to hurt themselves (Ignore any actual rich people voting on the basis of fuck you, got mine. They'll never be reached. Money corrupts many for life).
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My mum's been watching C4 news for a while now and says it's better. I check out stuff on their website sometimes.
Channel 4 is probably better than anything you can get realistically on telly but their coverage will always be more limited than the other channels for obvious reasons. Dispatches has always been good too.
Only really Channel 4 nowadays that are impartial. BBC are going (gone?) down the shitter.
Yep, I know as much. I've worked for fuckers like that with that kind of mentality. It's actually shocking how many right wingers (Tories) work in Tech at all levels, in both public and private sectors, honestly. Especially in private sector, such bootlicking and laziness abound by those in high level office jobs. Such smug and self important attitudes as displayed there are sadly pretty common. BT have been dragging their heels for years now with their projects (which are badly planned, badly communicated and badly implemented).
Yep, I know as much. I've worked for fuckers like that with that kind of mentality. It's actually shocking how many right wingers (Tories) work in Tech at all levels, in both public and private sectors, honestly. Especially in private sector, such bootlicking and laziness abound by those in high level office jobs. Such smug and self important attitudes as displayed there are sadly pretty common. BT have been dragging their heels for years now with their projects (which are badly planned, badly communicated and badly implemented).
Complacency, your best friend when... there is no real need to do any better. Virgin Media initially responding by using a fucking gif on Twitter shows you all you need to know about the feeling of invincibility these companies enjoy under Tory reign.
The tech private sector is a minefield of madness.
I just discovered who owns the company, i don't know how i missed that one. i shall be fucking off from using them very shortly. I thought it was bad enough when Branson was the leech. i pray for British broadband to come true.
Yeah, Liberty Global bought them a few years back
More fat cats buying up everything and then running screaming when the bad communist man suggests any attempt at nationalisation. Vote Tory instead, keep things how they are! Thank you very much.
BT Openreach is a failing company.
They have failed to meet targets for broadband rollout. Failed to invest in their work force or infrastructure.
Bring on BROADBAND COMMUNISM
I'll be honest, the 'outrage' over the 'communist broadband' thing is fucking stupid.
People are just making shit up now.
Air quotes aren't a new thing. There's cynicism and scrutiny of a media organisation, and there's whatever has been happening lately.
feels very similar to what the right do with media that doesn't fawn over them
Here we have an interview, with a claim regarding a policy put to a politician, to which she responds and rejects it - and apparently it's evidence of bias.
What's so outrageous about this?
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Branson never owned them, like most Virgin things they just paid him to use his name. Just like trump lol
I'm pretty pissed off that i have been giving money to a Trump supporting libertarian wanker.
Has any country ever offered free broadband access, ever though? Higher taxes on rich people alone won't pay for the maintenance of the system.
To be fair on you, most people don't know. Due to the branding, most of the country will still associate anything Virgin with Branson.
Parliament already told BT to up their game or face break up. And they reccommended that Broadband become a universal service obligation.
BT have not gotten better since then
Essentially they separated but improved investment so far seems to be only empty promises.
There are different ways to do things, so even if Labours pledge got changed/watered down, it could still be done differently
2008 article - https://arstechnica.com/uncategorized/2008/05/broadband-other-countries-do-it-better-but-how/
BT has been fucking useless (so have our Governments), so even a situation like Japan could help where the Government owns a large share.
The responses to what Corbyn said Labour will do tells you everything you need to know about how the telecommunications industry views this country. Fuck them and embrace any "radical" attempt to do things differently.
I agree that the above is wrong. Unpicking the mess still needs to be done in the right way.
Yes, details matter on this kind of thing for sure. I'm just wary that some of the shareholders aren't the nasty fatcats people are thinking of. To be fair, I recently listened to the Alistair Campbell interview of McDonnell and I'm fairly sure he mentioned that he'd want to protect pension schemes when nationalising.
Estonia has free public internet.
And many other countries have not sold off their network infrastructure to private firms. Putting private profits before investment has put us in the bottom 3rd of EU countries when it comes to internet speeds
I just remember him from the merger of Telewest and virgin mobile, so he was involved at the start, i just haven't paid attention until the dark clouds of Corbyn's communist internet appeared.
People NEED to turn out and vote. The country cannot handle another 5 years of conservative government. I'd say the network infrastructure should be nationalised then private companies can buy network space from the government. Australia does it with the National Broadband Network. Rail, power and water should also be public entities.
It's a roll of the dice by Corbyn to catch the headlines and try and show Labour is going to shake a lot of things up. We live in an internet-connected world, it's a massive potential change for the future (2030).
I'm sure they knew "Communist Corbyn Broadband HD Remix 3.3 Blu Ray edition" would end up coming from Johnson/The BBC, but it's a calculated gamble that the general public will argue amongst themselves how ridiculous the Corbyn smearing is.
Time will tell if the public will yet again get swayed by the fearmongering that Communist Corbyn is going to personally shuttle in a bus of immigrant terrorists to steal your retail jobs and cause us to need to fire off a Nuke to the Middle East to finish off what Blair started. You know, incoming Daily Mail headline there for you.
Project fear, round... I've fucking lost count.
You can't run fibre to the premises if there hasn't been a fibre rollout in your area. There are still huge parts of the country who do not have a Fibre to the Cabinet.
Honestly mate I agree with you a lot of the time but sometimes you seem like you're born yesterday. Why would a headline frame the issue, regardless of punctuation. I fucking wonder.
This is that argument I had about marketing yesterday but from the reverse. As a marketing professional let me tell you HOW YOU PRESENT THINGS REALLY MATTERS.
Fuck me. I mean, I can't be the only one who remembers how, in the last few hours in this thread, support for this broadband policy literally doubles in polling depending on how you ask the question?
Yes, and despite all the bluster Openreach have languished in their FTTP rollout, and others like CityFiber are actually doing something about it and giving them the kick up the ass they need.
Because you're framing the issue. If you want to present a neutral piece headline it as such
Also on the TV news issue yeah, C4 is the best you can do probably but bootlicking wise it'll only get you so far
I'm sure there will still be ways to pay for super-duper broadband if you are determined enough.
Fair point actually - probably correct to say that the BBC could get away with not having such a tabloid-esque headline for the interview (or any headline for that matter).
I saw the tweet and then wrote that post whilst trying to catch a train, so not the most well thought out post I've ever made.
Probably evidence of me being overly generous to the wider population - I saw nothing wrong with it at first glance - but then I'm also not someone who's liable to get outraged when they see a Labour MP on their tv.
Watching people struggle with this is unreal. Imagine if they had proposed the idea of a library and people were like "wait you want to give books away for free? But I buy those on Amazon"
What's the most 'reliable' tactical vote site?
I've got friends convinced that they're voting Lib Dem in an attempt to reduce our MP's majority.
First got told that by the BfB one, and then again by another.
I'm pretty suspicious.
I've got friends convinced that they're voting Lib Dem in an attempt to reduce our MP's majority.
First got told that by the BfB one, and then again by another.
I'm pretty suspicious.
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