UK PoliticsERA |OT1| - Strong and Stable Government? No. Coalition Of Chaos! PART 2

PJV3

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,476
London
="PJV3, post: 18070332, member: 1009"]don't know anything about Hatton except he flogs property in the Med, I'm half expecting him to be kicked out by Wednesday.
Lol, I need to stop giving people the benefit of the doubt, but we all have blindspots I suppose.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,387
The Ocean
A Welsh Conservative MP has been charged in connection with allegations over fraudulent expenses claims.

Christopher Davies, MP for Brecon and Radnorshire, is accused of two offences of making a false instrument and one of providing false or misleading information for allowance claims.

The CPS said he was due to appeared before Westminster Magistrates' Court in March.

It said the charges followed a review of evidence submitted by police.
He won’t get deselected. He’ll be fine and have the full confidence of the party

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-47320171
 
OP
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Dan

Dan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,841
Chris Williamson really is a colossal shithouse.

I suspect he'll be eased back into the party in a few weeks.
 

Zastava

Member
Feb 19, 2018
930
London
Eh, I'm going to wait for details on this one before passing judgment. Tweets from a Telegraph journalist with only one side of the story aren't worth very much.

She says "forced" as the headline but then says he quit later on. Which doesn't mean he wasn't bullied out, but could be pretty misleading.
 

CampFreddie

Member
Oct 25, 2017
904
The "right to rent" story should have more publicity. Anyone could see that making landlords do the work of the immigration police (with big penalties for renting to an 'illegal') would lead to discrimination again foreign-looking (i.e. brown) people.
 

AzorAhai

Member
Oct 29, 2017
698
This « anti-semitism » bullshit with Corbyn is the same we get in France with Melenchon and the same Sanders gets in the US.

This is getting ridiculous and... obvious.
 

Tygre

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,392
Chesire, UK
Are you trying to say there isn't a problem and it's some sort of conspiracy?
Antisemetism is a real problem.

The focus on antisemetism/bigotry on the Left and ignoring of antisemetism/bigotry on the Right is part of the wider problem of having a rabidly right wing press driving the political conversation in this country and around the world.

It's not a conspiracy, any more than the vast majority of the press backing the Tories at General Elections is a conspiracy.
 

Ichthyosaurus

Member
Dec 26, 2018
5,652
Antisemetism is a real problem.

The focus on antisemetism/bigotry on the Left and ignoring of antisemetism/bigotry on the Right is part of the wider problem of having a rabidly right wing press driving the political conversation in this country and around the world.

It's not a conspiracy, any more than the vast majority of the press backing the Tories at General Elections is a conspiracy.
Everyone knows the right are racists and anti-semites. There no discussion to be had because nobody on the left is disagreeing. That's not ignoring it, it's a "water is wet" situation.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,984
Everyone knows the right are racists and anti-semites. There no discussion to be had because nobody on the left is disagreeing. That's not ignoring it, it's a "water is wet" situation.
Well it is ignoring it because the people who are anti-semitic or islamaphobic on the right are being ignored in favour of a singular focus on issues on the left.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/mar/02/tories-islamophobia-bigotry

The Conservative MP Bob Blackman retweeted an anti-Muslim post from Tommy Robinson, yet he did not even get a slap on the wrist from the party. In fact, depite having subsequently hosted anti-Muslim extremist in parliament (Tapan Ghosh), shared an Islamophobic story on Facebook, and been found as a member of a number of Islamophobic social-media groups, the party seems to have no real concern and the prime minister even chose to campaign with him.
He’s not alone. Conservative MP Nadine Dorries shared a tweet from Tommy Robinson before using far-right tropes against Sadiq Khan, Yasmine Alibhai-Brown and Muslims more generally and – despite being personally against same-sex marriage – weaponised gay rights to attack Muslims. Unlike Blackman, she didn’t even apologise once she was found out.
And I could go on – whether it is Conservative MP Andrew Rosindell’s Facebook account being found to have joined a “Free Tommy” group, or Conservative MPs Jacob Rees-Mogg, Michael Gove and Boris Johnson meeting Steve Bannon, who famously praised Tommy Robinson as representing the working class. Johnson’s burqa comments have led to many claiming that he is using Islamophobia as part of a populist, Trump-like appeal to anti-Muslims in the party.
Yet the party remains silent and believes it can get away with ignoring allthose who say that action must be taken, whether it is senior Conservatives, Muslim representative groups, hundreds of mosques across the country, secular groups, women’s groups or national newspapers.
 

Ichthyosaurus

Member
Dec 26, 2018
5,652
Well it is ignoring it because the people who are anti-semitic or islamaphobic on the right are being ignored in favour of a singular focus on issues on the left.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/mar/02/tories-islamophobia-bigotry
That's probably more to do with the media being owned by conservatives like Rupert Murdock than people not caring. People care about a lot of things, but the media ignoring them will make them less inclined to speak up because it's not the topic of conversation at the water cooler.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,984
That's probably more to do with the media being owned by conservatives like Rupert Murdock than people not caring. People care about a lot of things, but the media ignoring them will make them less inclined to speak up because it's not the topic of conversation at the water cooler.
That's exactly my point - the media are ignoring it while hyper-focusing on issues in Labour, and therefore the general perception is that Labour is an institutionally racist party and Teresa May can get away with saying things like this knowing the extensive issues with racism in her own party go unreported.
 

AzorAhai

Member
Oct 29, 2017
698
Are you trying to say there isn't a problem and it's some sort of conspiracy?
Anti-semitism is obviously a real problem, just like every other kind of discrimination.

I’m just saying that the allegations against these 3 specific persons are probably bullshit. Nothing in their personal history or actions supports this. The primary source (before every other copy/paste quality journalism) is often some bilionaire-owned newspapers (and before you ask, no I’m not against freedom of press and obviously there are some honest ones). Ideology is not conspiracy.

There are a million things you could criticize about these 3 political figures though.


Edit : Wow, Tygre said it all.
 
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Oct 25, 2017
3,387
The Ocean
That's probably more to do with the media being owned by conservatives like Rupert Murdock than people not caring. People care about a lot of things, but the media ignoring them will make them less inclined to speak up because it's not the topic of conversation at the water cooler.
I can’t wait until the day Murdoch kicks the bucket. He’s the biggest piece of shit in U.K. media. I know his family will carry on the name but iirc his sons aren't as massive pieces of shit
 

Ichthyosaurus

Member
Dec 26, 2018
5,652
I disagree with the statement "There no discussion to be had". There absolutely is, and it isn't happening.
The discussion being "the right aren't racists," there is a conversation to be had, but that isn't it.

Everyone doesn't know that, that's the problem with with the media have.
That's fair.

I can’t wait until the day Murdoch kicks the bucket. He’s the biggest piece of shit in U.K. media. I know his family will carry on the name but iirc his sons aren't as massive pieces of shit
Yeah, the world will be in a slightly better place when he goes.
 
OP
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Dan

Dan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,841
The discussion being "the right aren't racists," there is a conversation to be had, but that isn't it..
You have a point. However the "but they're racists too!" position isn't exactly a great look, is it?

The fact is the Labour anti-semitism issue is so deep, so numerous, and has such little action done that it dominates the wider discussion. And it does any focus any allegation to any other party a shameful betrayal. Any and all acts like this in all parties need to be addressed, without fail.

Everyone can hold the media to account, but when you have your own party members leaving because of this issue, it goes way beyond that.

And this shit keeps happening, virtually every hour, in every day, even after what has gone on.
 

null

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,219
You have a point. However the "but they're racists too!" position isn't exactly a great look, is it?
what's not a good look is when the BBC political editor decides there's a sliding scale of racism worth reporting.

We can focus on more than one thing at a time but the fact people don't actually give a shit about a conservative peer, almost daily now, having to publicly shame the party into action or half their members thinking there's no-go zones run by Muslims in this country and the media completely ignoring it it's fair to call that out. It doesn't excuse or downplay Labour's own issues.
 

*Splinter

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,523
You'll have to provide the stats to make me actually say those words :p
When Labour have antisemitic policies and antisemitic campaigns we can consider the two equivalent

Edit: just want to add I don't want to excuse or downplay the cases of antisemitism that have happened in the Labour party, and I wish the party would be quicker to deal with these cases when they arise.
 
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Dan

Dan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,841
You think there's less racism in the Tory party? And that they take more action on it?
I don't know. That's why I'd like to find out. Clearly if it's as big as anti-semitism in the Labour party we'd have heard about it from avenues beyond our main media.

And I'm sure you have stats for what you did say.
I don't, sorry. But given that there's plenty of talk about it, I'd assume people here did have given it's a key counter argument to the big issue at hand.
 

*Splinter

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,523
I don't know. That's why I'd like to find out. Clearly if it's as big as anti-semitism in the Labour party we'd have heard about it from avenues beyond our main media.



I don't, sorry. But given that there's plenty of talk about it, I'd assume people here did have given it's a key counter argument to the big issue at hand.
Don't "sorry" me you fucking weasel.
 

IpKaiFung

Member
Oct 27, 2017
224
Wales
The Conservative Party totally doesn't have a problem with Islamaphobia. /s



The conservatives are a bigoted party, if its not Muslims, it's "the gays", the "irish", the "blacks", the disabled, the benefit claimants, the unemployed, the immigrants, the refugees etc.
They are a totally nasty party that play divide and rule and are backed up by the most cynical media you could ever find.

Goldsmith lost that election you could say because of his nasty campaign but he still is an MP and still a member of the Conservative party even after that disgraceful campaign.

As for antisemitism the conservative party have questions to answer after their MEPs support Viktor Orban in the European Parliament.
 
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null

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,219
I don't know. That's why I'd like to find out. Clearly if it's as big as anti-semitism in the Labour party we'd have heard about it from avenues beyond our main media.
"people aren't really talking about racism or islamophobia"
"if it was a problem people would talk about it"

some galaxy brain shit right here
 
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Tygre

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,392
Chesire, UK

Remember Count Dankula? Me neither, but he was that wazzock who "was convicted of the “grossly offensive” antisemitic hate crime and fined £800 after teaching his girlfriend’s pet pug dog to do a Nazi salute in response to him shouting the deeply antisemitic phrase, “gas the Jews“, and then uploading a video of the act."

Well the BBC have decided to employ him.

I'm sure this will turn out to be Corbyn's fault somehow.
 

Zastava

Member
Feb 19, 2018
930
London
I don't know. That's why I'd like to find out. Clearly if it's as big as anti-semitism in the Labour party we'd have heard about it from avenues beyond our main media.



I don't, sorry. But given that there's plenty of talk about it, I'd assume people here did have given it's a key counter argument to the big issue at hand.
You've been dunked on by a fair number of people on this page, mostly for the rampant Islamophobia in the Tory party, and I don't really want to pile on, but I think it needs to be noted that on the same page I post about how the "right to rent" has been ruled racially discriminatory and unlawful - a key part of the hostile environment that was the brainchild of Theresa May and enacted under the Cameron government, and one that overwhelmingly effected people of colour, it takes some fucking gall to make the post you did. Black people who have every right to be here have been made homeless, denied their right to medical care, and even deported to countries they've never been to or haven't been to since they were a child 40+ years ago, and you fucking say this shit.

WINDRUSH. W-I-N-D-R-U-S-H. Have you forgotten so quickly, or did it just not register because the fucking shitty right wing media don't care about racism if it comes from the Tory party?

Fucking call me when the Labour party has done any of the above to a member of the Jewish community or anyone else. "we'd have heard about it about blah blah blah". Fuck outta here.
 

Ravensmash

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,769

Remember Count Dankula? Me neither, but he was that wazzock who "was convicted of the “grossly offensive” antisemitic hate crime and fined £800 after teaching his girlfriend’s pet pug dog to do a Nazi salute in response to him shouting the deeply antisemitic phrase, “gas the Jews“, and then uploading a video of the act."

Well the BBC have decided to employ him.

I'm sure this will turn out to be Corbyn's fault somehow.
He’s been dropped already. Surprised that article wasn’t updated tbh


https://www.scotsman.com/news/bbc-scotland-cancels-show-with-nazi-pug-criminal-after-furious-backlash-1-4882522