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Unsympathetic main characters :(

grmltr

grmltr

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,748
How do you feel about unsympathetic main characters in video games?

Playing and reading about 'Life is Strange Before the Storm' I find a lot of folks really hate or disapprove of Chloe.

The way she talks to her mother... how she treats her peers... how she deals with her mother's boyfriend...

It is hard to like characters who react to tragedy with anger and bare their feelings.

I find it is very easy to emphasize with characters who are selfless, yet hide/bury their feelings.

I find Chloe very compelling, but how do you relate to your characters?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=avmna98z6Fc&list=RDavmna98z6Fc
 
TC McQueen

TC McQueen

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,592
Kratos is the one I hear about the most, but I never played those games, I can't comment further beyond that.
 
3bdelilah

3bdelilah

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
1,615
Inb4 Aiden Pierce from the first Watch Dogs.

But I don't think that's what you meant. In that case Kratos has my vote.
 
Abstrusity

Abstrusity

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,656
srhltmr said:
FFVIII Squall thread?
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Unsympathetic to the literal definition of teenage angst while you yourself go through said teenage angst and watching him justify his problems within his own apathetic frame of mind, little by little coming out of his shell and learning to trust, if not like, the people around him, even though the only memories he's still hung onto from his childhood are those of abandonment?

Really? Unsympathetic? Did we play the same game or are you one of those *FF7* types of people? :P
 
Dr. Caroll

Dr. Caroll

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
8,111
I think some folks project themselves way too much onto videogame characters. There's nothing wrong with a game protagonist being "unlikeable". You don't need to like the protagonist. You don't need to relate to them on a personal level. I feel like publishers/devs have spent years stroking player's egos with these witty quipsters and as a result a fair number of players are alienated by the notion of a protagonist that is an unlikeable sack of shit with no redeeming values.

Kinvara said:
Cole Phelps from LA Noire. I liked him less and less as the game went on. Maybe that was the point.
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Cole is a coward and a morally bankrupt human being. His failings as a human being set most of the game's plot in motion. Unfortunately, this kinda jarred players who saw Cole -- their proxy of sorts -- as a good guy.
 
Ayirek

Ayirek

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,252
carlosrox said:
Inb4 Joel from TLOU which is a popular opinion I strongly disagree with.
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Joel is sympathetic AF, he just made some questionable choices that he thought were right. Which is why he's such a well-written character. So I'm with you, carlosrox, that is an opinion Just can't get down with.

I'd say most GTA protags are pretty unsympathetic. I can't feel bad for Claude in GTA III or Tommy in Vice City. CJ gets some sympathy, as he's genuinely trying to do right. Same with Niko, though to a more shades of grey level. I can't speak for V, since I've only played like the first fifteen minutes. :P
 
signal

signal

Member
Oct 28, 2017
40,197
fuEFowb.jpg
 
Grapezard

Grapezard

Member
Nov 16, 2017
7,787
I find this works very well for the Doom franchise. DOOM 2016 goes out of its way to show that the doom marine only cares about his goals.
 
sredgrin

sredgrin

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
12,276
I am fine with them, though I'd say a good 80 percent of the time it is a misapplied label. Most of the time you're meant to have sympathy for empathy for the average main character even if they can be an ass, though some long form games can make the wait hard to bear.
 
OP
OP
grmltr

grmltr

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,748
Dr. Caroll said:
I think some folks project themselves way too much onto videogame characters. There's nothing wrong with a game protagonist being "unlikeable". You don't need to like the protagonist. You don't need to relate to them on a personal level. I feel like publishers/devs have spent years stroking player's egos with these witty quipsters and as a result a fair number of players are alienated by the notion of a protagonist that is an unlikeable sack of shit with no redeeming values.

Cole is a coward and a morally bankrupt human being. His failings as a human being set most of the game's plot in motion. Unfortunately, this kinda jarred players who saw Cole -- their proxy of sorts -- as a good guy.
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I agree, some players roleplay characters whereas others play characters as themselves. I see this playing into the whole pre-defined character vs. create-a-character debate.
 
Demolition_Human

Demolition_Human

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,458
NC
Trevor goddamn Philips. Only reason I did do the
C ending where they all live
was because it was what I wanted. But if put in Franklin and Michael's position and thought of who Trevor really was...yeah...it would be something sensible indeed to
put him out of his misery. I mean he is a psychopathic cannibalistic bastard for crying out loud.
 
Juraash

Juraash

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,349
srhltmr said:
FFVIII Squall thread?
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To each their own of course, but Squall is easily the best Final Fantasy MC in my eyes. He struggles with issues stemming from his early childhood and grows to overcome them, and his self imposed isolation, by the end of the game. He's riddled with uncertainty and self doubt and pushes people away. But he doesn't stay that way. As someone who was going through similar (though far less dramatic) things in my own life, Squall is easily one of the most relatable characters I've ever engaged with. I find Squall extremely sympathetic, so I hope this isn't Squall the thread. Not knocking your opinion, just offering a counter.

To answer the OP, Kratos is the easy answer, but one I have to pick. His personality and how he goes about things is so vulgar and ridiculous that I never made it beyond the first game. He's insufferable and completely turned me off to anything redeeming about him or his games.

I found Trevor in GTAV to be similar. He killed that game for me the first time and I wrote off GTAV completely. I forced myself to give it another go and found things to enjoy, but I still hated everything I was forced to do with him.

Main characters who are cruel or assholes or that I simply can't relate to or empathize with are usually deal breakers. A counter example would be Joel from TLoU, he's not a very nice guy but I understood him. I empathized with his pain and how he felt. Character don't have to be goody goods for me to like them, they just need a nugget of redeemable qualities.
 
TheMango55

TheMango55

Banned
Nov 1, 2017
5,788
Trevor from GTA V

I mean obviously any main character from a GTA game is pretty unsympathetic, but Trevor is #1.
 
Chamaeleonx

Chamaeleonx

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,348
Wasn't a big fan of the Scalebound guy. The dragon was cool but I didn't like the design and I generally find most of the generic male characters to be pretty boring. I understand that some games have the concept of self insertion but it still rubs me the wrong way. There was a very early concept of a young girl character, which I would have appreciated more. May sound dumb, but she could have a father/daughter relationship with the dragon because she has no parents anymore and you could let her grow over the course of the game while they grow closer, their souls getting closer and unlocking more power until you can fuse at the end (maybe). She could ride on his head, clean his big teeth with a toothbrush, play in the grass after sliding down his tail and generally having fun outside the fighting. Also would have opened up different play styles between her and the dragon, her being more fragile maybe range or magic oriented and him being more brutal, tanky and melee oriented as a dragon.
Scalebound guy always felt like a marketing sheet to me. =/

There are probably more but I can't think of more at the moment.
 
Unaha-Closp

Unaha-Closp

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,727
Scotland
I agreed with Joel in TLOU so me?

Trevor from GTAV is a monster. Straight up monster. The others are just huge arseholes in comparison.
 
OP
OP
grmltr

grmltr

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,748
Grapezard said:
I find this works very well for the Doom franchise. DOOM 2016 goes out of its way to show that the doom marine only cares about his goals.
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I'd say the Doom Marine is very sympathetic. The way he is talked down to.. how he lashes out against the system... I'm waiting for the Wolfenstein-ification of doom marine, do it Bethesda !!!
 
Alastor3

Alastor3

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Oct 28, 2017
8,297
What about jerk person but you still find cool?

Kalas from Baten Kaitos come to mind
 
MechanicalWall

MechanicalWall

Member
Oct 27, 2017
936
Kratos is such a massive piece of shit that he'd be the final boss in any other game. I'm extremely iffy on the new game trying to 'redeem' him, he's just too much of a fucking monster for me to ever actually sympathize with
 
signal

signal

Member
Oct 28, 2017
40,197
Cid said:
No
The context is key there
At that exact moment she still has all your materia that she has stolen from the party
I would say the same to her
The party really needs that materia back and fast
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It's just funny phrasing :(

Alternatively there is that scene where Jessie is dying on the Sector 7 pillar and she's like "Cloud I'm glad I could talk to you one last time....." and one of the two reply options is "Is that so......" lol
 
sredgrin

sredgrin

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Oct 27, 2017
12,276
SageShinigami said:
Is she? I'm like 5 hours in and she seems to have an understandable goal.
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Yeah I'd disagree with that poster. Velvet is for the most part very tame despite her stupid outfit and all her speeches about her goals or being "evil." The game goes out of its way to provide context time and time again as to why Velvet is not nearly as bad as the forces she's fighting against.
 
Cid

Cid

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
395
signal said:
It's just funny phrasing :(

Alternatively there is that scene where Jessie is dying on the Sector 7 pillar and she's like "Cloud I'm glad I could talk to you one last time....." and one of the two reply options is "Is that so......" lol
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A big part of the game Cloud sure is what you can call very unsympathetic yes. He turns around later.
 
OP
OP
grmltr

grmltr

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,748
TheMechanicalWall said:
Kratos is such a massive piece of shit that he'd be the final boss in any other game. I'm extremely iffy on the new game trying to 'redeem' him, he's just too much of a fucking monster for me to ever actually sympathize with
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This is also true... some characters are fucking awful, I guess it depends on whether the players can square with it.
 
SatoAilDarko

SatoAilDarko

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,824
Shion Uzuki

shion.jpg


Acts irrationally quite a bit and treats several characters while not getting over a bunch of stuff.

It was like this weird attempt at a strong female character but she instead just does dumb things while putting some men on high pedestals.

I liked 95% of the other characters in Xenosaga more than her.
 
ctcatsby

ctcatsby

Member
Oct 27, 2017
569
USA
As others have said, Trevor from GTA V. Early in the game I was quite excited by the idea he'd turn into the main villain. That doesn't happen, of course, though I've long wondered if that was at some point the developers' plan.

Would have made a far more interesting narrative, anyway. I can't even remember who the villains were.
 
Z-Beat

Z-Beat

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
31,847
Kratos is a big one, but he's not really looking for sympathy. He doesn't really try to justify his actions as right. He knows his revenge spree is destroying the world. He just doesn't care. He tries to pay for that at the end of the third game, and sorta walk it back in 4 from what I can tell.
 
BossAttack

BossAttack

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Oct 27, 2017
42,987
TheMechanicalWall said:
Kratos is such a massive piece of shit that he'd be the final boss in any other game. I'm extremely iffy on the new game trying to 'redeem' him, he's just too much of a fucking monster for me to ever actually sympathize with
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Fo' real. I wish no harm to that kid we've seen in the trailers but Kratos can die a thousand, horrible, painful deaths.
 
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