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US PoliEra 2019 |OT3| YOU WERE AT MY WEDDING, DENISE

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RustyNails

Member
Oct 26, 2017
10,052
yep all us fuckin kikes should just shut the fuck up any time someone accidentally invokes antisemitic tropes and not try to guide them in the right direction

everything's fine for jewish people after all

(And that goes for any ethic group. If someone on my side was invoking anti-Muslim tropes you'd bet I'd be on their ass too)
I'm sorry - I don't mean to upset you. I feel we could have handled the situation by talking about AIPAC and it's -yes- monetary influence in American politics instead of shooting the messenger.
 

Doof

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,202
Kentucky
Hold up, "harassment of women"?
Is your argument that this is misogyny related somehow?
I don't want to be accused of misrepresenting what your saying, so maybe clarify that shit a bit.

p.s.
"NO ONE DESERVES TO BE HARASSED AND BULLIED IN PUBLIC, ESPECIALLY SOMEONE WHO DIDN'T FUCKING DO ANYTHING WRONG"
So like the person who tossed an egg at the racist motherfucker in Australia is in the wrong?
Also, surely you realize that she think she did something wrong here, I mean, she fucking told her what it is.

p.p.s.
She's not bullied, people without power cannot bully people with power. Someone was mean to her, and that someone is gonna get punished for that. That's all that happened.
I don't know if there's misogyny from the harasser's end, but yeah, there's plenty of misogyny from people defending it.

There's a difference between being a racist piece of shit and asking someone to maybe not invoke antisemitic tropes.

She's being bullied. I have been bullied my entire life, and what I'm seeing there is bullying. Justify it however you want, because I know you will, but it's bullying. Full fucking stop.
 

BigWinnie1

Member
Feb 19, 2018
2,684
I think as long as you continue to ignore the race, privilege and wealth of the people we're talking about you are going to continue missing the point.
Talking shit about rich powerful people is not nearly the same as talking shit about marginalized people.
Chelsea Clinton or white women are not harmed in any shape or form by the fact that this woman was mean to her, in fact, the only person who faced any negative consequence from any of that stuff is her, and that was the obvious outcome from the second that video surfaced.

And yet everyone that always looks the other way when Muslims are getting attacked in ways that are extremely harmful are jumping to her defense.

There was zero reason for her to be there anyway.
Are you Black Chikor cause if you are you should know your damn community and how racist our people can be sometimes. I live in Baltimore where we have a bunch of jews everywhere and I could hear the same shit Illhan said about money from some random old Black dude from my old block and then my Mama would shut his old ass up.

I'm not here to hear a black politician talk wildshit on twitter when she could have just said AIPAC aint shit and been right all along and not stir peoples feelings up. But she talked the way she did so she gets her licks and knows the deal now. She aint some fragile flower to be protected. She is a politician and if she ever wants more than a house seat she is going to have to realize that saying this wild shit is not gonna help her move up when the democratic party is a big hodgepodge of minority groups banded together in protection and don't take kindly to people talking shit about the groups make up for the most part.

I don't really care if she is black muslim Immigrant, that doesn't bequeath her some status to be protected from rightful blockback.

Now rightwing bullshit is always there. It's like being the only black person a house party, You should expect someone to slip up and say the N-word or call you the good one because some racist is always there in the crowd looking for a chance.
 

Autodidact

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,683
How are Jews marginalized in the US?
Seriously, can you answer me that?
We are over-represented in any place of power that matter, we have better economic outcomes than average and Jews have better public opinion about them than any religious group in the US.
Jesus Christ, what is wrong with you?

How can you make this post after the rise of the alt-right and anti-Semitic hate crimes? After last year's synagogue shooting? After Nazis marching through the street chanting, "Jews will not replace us"?

You are a horrible person.
 

ak1287

Member
Oct 28, 2017
942
I'm sorry - I don't mean to upset you. I feel we could have handled the situation by talking about AIPAC and it's -yes- monetary influence in American politics instead of shooting the messenger.
And your way of doing that is to diminish the fact that there are at least some Jews who felt that what Omar said was anti-Semitic, by implying that the reason for that concern as being influenced by blind, MONETARY support from AIPAC.

Got it.
 

Doof

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,202
Kentucky
I'm sorry - I don't mean to upset you. I feel we could have handled the situation by talking about AIPAC and it's -yes- monetary influence in American politics instead of shooting the messenger.
It's OK, I know you're a Muslim and I know that this whole thing is frustrating as hell for you. For what it's worth, I really like Omar and I appreciate her drawing attention to how absolutely vile AIPAC is. She doesn't deserve even half of the shit that's thrown her way. No hard feelings.
 

BigWinnie1

Member
Feb 19, 2018
2,684
How are Jews marginalized in the US?
Seriously, can you answer me that?
We are over-represented in any place of power that matter, we have better economic outcomes than average and Jews have better public opinion about them than any religious group in the US.
oh wow we going there? Now? Really? Get the fuck out of here man. Go take a fucking shower and calm your ass down. You talking mad shit and your gonna act like white people aint gonna just turn on Jews the second they get the chance? When we have all the historical evidence that its goes okay for the jews until it doesn't and they are occasionally culled because they felt like it.

Its pretty much darker skinned folks and jews as histories punching bags so we should look out for each other but you obviously dont care about that or else you wouldn't be saying this wild shit.
 

Chikor

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,345
Jesus Christ, what is wrong with you?

How can you make this post after the rise of the alt-right and anti-Semitic hate crimes? After last year's synagogue shooting? After Nazis marching through the street chanting, "Jews will not replace us"?

You are a horrible person.
oh wow we going there? Now? Really? Get the fuck out of here man. Go take a fucking shower and calm your ass down. You talking mad shit and your gonna act like white people aint gonna just turn on Jews the second they get the chance? When we have all the historical evidence that its goes okay for the jews until it doesn't and they are occasionally culled because they felt like it.

Its pretty much darker skinned folks and jews as histories punching bags so we should look out for each other but you obviously dont care about that or else you wouldn't be saying this wild shit.
Can you answer me that question?
Every time I ask that people call me names, but no one is willing to engage this question.

p.s.
For the record, I'm a Jew of eastern European descent who lost 95% of my extended family in the Holocaust. I grew up with an uncle (well, uncle*, when most of your family tree go up in smoke, anyone that sort of related is an uncle) who survived Treblinka mostly by extracting gold teeth from dead bodies. He dealt with what must have been 10 different kinds of PTSDs mostly by telling my young self what I should do if I ever see Nazis marching down the street (spoiler: it wasn't by respectfully listening to what they have to say)..

I am not telling you that so you'd think my opinion has more weight to it, it doesn't, I'm telling you that so you can maybe understand how fucking mad I get that in every fucking single one of these threads people come in and either accuse me of being an antisemite or being someone who downplay or handwave that shit.
Ya'll need to serious fuck off with that shit. Argue about what I'm saying instead of guessing how I feel.
 

BigWinnie1

Member
Feb 19, 2018
2,684
Jesus Christ, what is wrong with you?

How can you make this post after the rise of the alt-right and anti-Semitic hate crimes? After last year's synagogue shooting? After Nazis marching through the street chanting, "Jews will not replace us"?

You are a horrible person.
No he out here trying to lose his account is what he is doing.
 

RustyNails

Member
Oct 26, 2017
10,052
And your way of doing that is to diminish the fact that there are at least some Jews who felt that what Omar said was anti-Semitic, by implying that the reason for that concern as being influenced by blind, MONETARY support from AIPAC.

Got it.
Yeah right. Did you even understand what Ilhan was talking about? Which by the way she is absolutely right?
 

metalslimer

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
4,728
Can you answer me that question?
Every time I ask that people call me names, but no one is willing to engage this question.

p.s.
For the record, I'm a Jew of eastern European descent who lost 95% of my extended family in the Holocaust. I grew up with an uncle (well, uncle*, when most of your family tree go up in smoke, anyone that sort of related is an uncle) who survived Treblinka mostly by extracting gold teeth from dead bodies. He dealt with what must have been 10 different kinds of PTSDs mostly by telling my young self what I should do if I ever see Nazis marching down the street (spoiler: it wasn't by respectfully listening to what they have to say)..

I am not telling you that so you'd think my opinion has more weight to it, it doesn't, I'm telling you that so you can maybe understand how fucking mad I get that in every fucking single one of these threads people come in and either accuse me of being an antisemite or being someone who downplay or handwave that hit.
Ya'll need to serious fuck off with that shit. Argue about what I'm saying instead of guessing how I feel.
None of that validates things when you actually hand wave shit
 

metalslimer

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
4,728
At least I can back up my position.
You can only make really fucking disgusting insinuations about my motives.
I mean you seriously asked the question how are Jewish people marginalized in todays climate. What are people supposed to think?

You also basically said that harassment isnt bullying as long as the person has more money than you.

Regardless of what's in your heart or your background reading these things is going diminish peoples perception of what you are arguing
 

ak1287

Member
Oct 28, 2017
942
Yeah right. Did you even understand what Ilhan was talking about? Which by the way she is absolutely right?
I did. I'm not arguing that she's wrong.
I'm arguing that her words, despite her intent, made a group of people feel lesser, and we need to not diminish that.

What about Muslims who don't appreciate Chelsea's comments toward Ilhan? And feel like she is actually a problem in the issue of Israeli influence in US politics?
Also valid?

I'm not trying to argue that Chelsea is right or wrong, or that Ilhan shouldn't go after AIPAC.
 

RustyNails

Member
Oct 26, 2017
10,052
Jesus Christ, what is wrong with you?

How can you make this post after the rise of the alt-right and anti-Semitic hate crimes? After last year's synagogue shooting? After Nazis marching through the street chanting, "Jews will not replace us"?

You are a horrible person.
Why are you making it personal? I do think Jewish Americans have good political representation. I don't know if that means as a whole the community is not marginalized. Just look at how quickly Ilhan was dragged through the mud versus Steve King lamenting the rise of Muslim babies for over a decade.
 

Autodidact

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,683
Why are you making it personal? I do think Jewish Americans have good political representation. I don't know if that means as a whole the community is not marginalized. Just look at how quickly Ilhan was dragged through the mud versus Steve King lamenting the rise of Muslim babies for over a decade.
I think the way she was treated was horrible; even though she chose her words badly the first time, it was overblown for exactly the reason you state. Muslims in America face an incredible amount of discrimination and hatred, and the way she's been treated - the anger and suspicion she receives just for existing - reflects that prejudice. No argument.

I mean, you're right about the double standard vs. someone like Steve King. I'm just not sure how that negates anything I said about the rise of anti-Semitism and anti-Semitic hate crimes over the past few years.

I can believe that and believe that Jewish people still face an incredible amount of hatred despite their "good political representation."

I got personal because he expressed what seem to be some repugnant personal sentiments.
 

RustyNails

Member
Oct 26, 2017
10,052
I did. I'm not arguing that she's wrong.
I'm arguing that her words, despite her intent, made a group of people feel lesser, and we need to not diminish that.


Also valid?

I'm not trying to argue that Chelsea is right or wrong, or that Ilhan shouldn't go after AIPAC.
Okay fine. I can agree that Ilhan Omar can word her criticism better lest she inadvertently offend a marginalized group.
 

Dude Abides

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,023
Okay fine. I can agree that Ilhan Omar can word her criticism better lest she inadvertently offend a marginalized group.
It doesn’t matter how she words it. A trope is a concept, not a specific series of words. The goal with the Ilhan Omar two minutes hate was to make perfectly clear that suggestions that Israel has undue influence, or that there’s something unusual about American politicians making the interests of a foreign state such a high priority, are off-limits. And mission well accomplished on that one.

And dipshits like Chelsea Clinton, the Gwyneth Paltrow of Democratic politics (except without any actual achievements or accomplishments), played right into it.
 

Doof

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,202
Kentucky
It doesn’t matter how she words it. A trope is a concept, not a specific series of words. The goal with the Ilhan Omar two minutes hate was to make perfectly clear that suggestions that Israel has undue influence, or that there’s something unusual about American politicians making the interests of a foreign state such a high priority, are off-limits. And mission well accomplished on that one.

And dipshits like Chelsea Clinton, the Gwyneth Paltrow of Democratic politics (except without any actual achievements or accomplishments), played right into it.
Maybe we just want her to do better. You have no room to talk over Jewish people, dickhead.

Edited, because there's no place for pointless hostility.
 

Doof

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,202
Kentucky
Okay fine. I can agree that Ilhan Omar can word her criticism better lest she inadvertently offend a marginalized group.
Yeah, that's all I really want. I think her contribution on that end is super valuable (she's one of the only ones to make her criticisms that explicit, which is both indicative of her bravery and of the cowardice of others) but she's gotta be careful, because it's a real minefield.
 
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Ogodei

Ogodei

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
8,168
Coruscant
Y'all arguing this are falling for the alt-right's trap. It is so completely insubstantial to be arguing about Chelsea Clinton, one way or another.

Like of this response were about, say, Engel's response to Omar, you *might* have something, but Clinton's response was fine, but a white supremacist just massacred 49 people and we have folks getting banned over a mildly-controversial thing someone said to someone else who had no involvement in any of that.

The right wing wins because we keep tearing each other down and hot damn are some of the premises for those arguments taking place flimsy.
 

RustyNails

Member
Oct 26, 2017
10,052
It doesn’t matter how she words it. A trope is a concept, not a specific series of words. The goal with the Ilhan Omar two minutes hate was to make perfectly clear that suggestions that Israel has undue influence, or that there’s something unusual about American politicians making the interests of a foreign state such a high priority, are off-limits. And mission well accomplished on that one.

And dipshits like Chelsea Clinton, the Gwyneth Paltrow of Democratic politics (except without any actual achievements or accomplishments), played right into it.
For me - someone who voted for Hillary during the primary and the general - I think overall Ilhan's comments made me realize there is still a lot of work to be done. And that work is not gonna be done by Hillary, Chelsea or even AoC for that matter. It needs to be done by people like Ilhan and it's sadly a Herculean effort. Maybe Bernie too but dude is wrong is so many other areas (Gun rights, PoC issues etc). Palestinian issue is near and dear to me and for too long we have sat on the sidelines while Palestinians are slow ethnically erased from their homes. I was just recently talking to my friend from work who's father lived in his generational home in Jerusalem, and one day IDF kicked him out and settled in a Jewish family inside his home. Home with his own sofa, TV, furniture and a history of lives lived in it just taken over within minutes. Instant refugee. Anyways I digress.
 

Doof

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,202
Kentucky
You don’t know me, child. I don’t give a shit about your performative wokeness.
as someone who doesn't subsist on podcasts, youtube videos, and rose twitter, I'm pretty sure that this means that I'm just pretending to be upset

perhaps I could show you the picture of the time that a kid took a chair to my face because I was jewish, but I doubt that would change your mind, so instead I'm going to ignore you

now scurry along back to your cute little chapo den. perhaps their brand of irony will be a fitting substitute for your complete lack of empathy
 

Brock Reiher

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
33,780
Y'all arguing this are falling for the alt-right's trap. It is so completely insubstantial to be arguing about Chelsea Clinton, one way or another.

Like of this response were about, say, Engel's response to Omar, you *might* have something, but Clinton's response was fine, but a white supremacist just massacred 49 people and we have folks getting banned over a mildly-controversial thing someone said to someone else who had no involvement in any of that.

The right wing wins because we keep tearing each other down and hot damn are some of the premises for those arguments taking place flimsy.
I get that, but it's all indicative of the same thing. Saying "this is what the right wants" isn't very comforting when they're asking you to instead just deal with ingrained Islamophobia and not rock the boat too much.

Especially when the criticism of Clinton is met with a million Twitter weirdos declaring that they'd defend her to the death or whatever.
 
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Ogodei

Ogodei

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
8,168
Coruscant
So Pete's of Norwegian descent? Would explain the odd pronunciation of his last name.

There are very few Norwegian-Americans in federal politics. I think Chellie Pingree (ME-1 representative) is Norwegian?
 

RustyNails

Member
Oct 26, 2017
10,052
Yeah, that's all I really want. I think her contribution on that end is super valuable (she's one of the only ones to make her criticisms that explicit, which is both indicative of her bravery and of the cowardice of others) but she's gotta be careful, because it's a real minefield.
Aye.
 

BigWinnie1

Member
Feb 19, 2018
2,684
I get that, but it's all indicative of the same thing. Saying "this is what the right wants" isn't very comforting when they're asking you to instead just deal with ingrained Islamophobia and not rock the boat too much.

Especially when the criticism of Clinton is met with a million Twitter weirdos declaring that they'd defend her to the death or whatever.
You act like Chelsea wanted the twitter weirdo's. She don't give a fuck about them
 

AnotherNils

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,665

Ahhahahahahahaha

You gotta be fucking kidding me. He thinks this is a good look?

Amazing.
Hard not read subtext if "Does't matter, because Bob Barr assured me it won't become public!"

Here's the secret: This tweet isn't about the Mueller report. It's Trump trying to reassert the image of being in control after having to veto a bill senate GOP defected on, and now getting rinsed by House GOP on his witch hunt.
 
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