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SolarPowered

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,211
It doesn't change the numbers unless we have some kind of killer majority where moderate votes don't matter.
The problem with passing progressive legislation isn't with the leadership, it's with the Manchins and Sinemas and Blue Dogs on the hill.
The senate will be a pain, but it'll be a stubborn itch compared to the cancer that is a senate lead by Mitch McConnell. Dear God would it be a relief not having him in charge anymore. That said... is Sinema really going to try being a Manchin for a state with two democrat senators (this is assuming they win control of the senate)? If that's the case then they've clearly learned nothing from Obama's presidency. Wet blanket blue dogs that only drag their presidents down just ruin democrat enthusiasm. I blame them more for midterm losses than Obama.
 

bluexy

Comics Enabler & Freelance Games Journalist
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
14,517
She lied and said Bloomberg had multiple heart attacks. He didn't. He had a stress test, showed some blockage 20 years ago, and had stents put in. It's what's supposed to happen to prevent a heart attack. In an attempt to deflect criticism from her candidate, she made up shit about another one. That's not okay. She's even gone on twitter and said she "misspoke." (She didn't. She lied. There's a difference.)
Ahh, right. Agreed.
 

lmcfigs

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
12,091
She lied and said Bloomberg had multiple heart attacks. He didn't. He had a stress test, showed some blockage 20 years ago, and had stents put in. It's what's supposed to happen to prevent a heart attack. In an attempt to deflect criticism from her candidate, she made up shit about another one. That's not okay. She's even gone on twitter and said she "misspoke." (She didn't. She lied. There's a difference.)
yes that was not a good look
 

SolarPowered

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,211
Arizona+Colorado+Maine+North Carolina...

A long shot win in Georgia shouldn't be impossible in that case. Alabama is probably gone no matter what we do, though.
Huh, I would have thought Sanders would be cutting it closer against Trump in NC.

On the other hand, NC can get fucked for preferring Trump to Elizabeth Warren.
That Warren flip is unfortunate. Makes sense that women would have more trouble against Trump in purple states, though. :/
 

adam387

Member
Nov 27, 2017
5,215
Ok, but what specifically isn't satisfactory from the letters of 3 physicians? Bernie said he was going to release records after his heart attack sometime in October. He released them right before 2020.

Let's stop pretending what he released isn't enough, that wanting more is irrational, and that he fulfilled what he initially stated. Anything more is just demanding something that isn't needed (which means it doesn't matter), and that he's a layperson who doesn't know what is satisfactory or not. What he released is satisfactory.

I'm sorry, but I'm going to continue to respond like this when you guys are being ridiculous. It's so obvious what you guys are doing. You guys are trying to turn this into a bigger deal because it makes your position of not liking him look more rational in your eyes. Not all of us want to entertain these kind of irrational little fights.
Again, things that may not matter to you or I doesn't mean they don't matter to a subset of the electorate. Again, a voter asked this question. Bernie's campaign actually said he didn't have a heart attack at first, and then reversed that 3 days after the fact. There is reason to be suspicious of what the campaign is doing regarding this issue. What is being asked of Bernie is not some ridiculous thing never before in the history of politics asked of another candidate. Hillary went through this, and, ya, they should have been more transparent. Trump's doctor's letter was ridiculed six ways to Sunday, and the media did report on it.

Like I said, I don't particularly care one way or the other about the letters from his doctor. Because, at the end of the day, he's still pressing 80 and just had a heart attack. It's not a great thing, but it's hardly disqualifying. (I don't like that any of the 3 most likely candidates were all over 70 for what it's worth.) But the thing is, his campaign has done a shit poor job of making this not be a thing by the way his press secretary handled it. If they do not want to release additional information, and that is 100% up to Bernie and I give zero shits one way or the other, you need to have a better answer than "Whataboutism" and fabricating a heart attack on one of your opponents. Like, this is literally her job! You could totally spin this thing back to your core message on healthcare being a human right. But what worries me, and a lot of other folks, is they never do that. They always double or triple down and try to paint someone else in the same light. It's maddening.

And, like, maybe I'm missing something, but I think 99% of the people who have an issue with any of this is solely on the way in which she handled the question. If someone is saying something different, call them out on it, I guess. I just hate this "you guys" and "this thread" arguments because it's so hard to discuss that. It's as silly as "Bernie Bros" or whatever term we're supposed to be using at the moment.

And I hate to break it to you, if you hate irrational little fights, you might want to sleep through the general election. There's going to be a million of them.
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,877
All I know if that polling is going to consistently show Sanders up by amounts like that in battleground states, I'm voting for him next month even though he's easily my distant-second choice in the field.

I hope that we get Ernst the fuck outta IA on top of getting Tillis out of NC. I'd love more IA polling vs. Trump.

Wait Obama won NC in 2008? Holy shit

President Obama winning IN in 2008 will always be the staggering one to me. NC at least has the Research Triangle to explain its move toward purpleness. That IN victory was the epitome of unrepeatable.
 

KidAAlbum

Member
Nov 18, 2017
3,177
And I hate to break it to you, if you hate irrational little fights, you might want to sleep through the general election. There's going to be a million of them.
They probably won't be against others on this forum though, a progressive website. Unless I'm going to spend my time arguing against Trump supporting resetera posters. Or maybe I hold this forum to a higher standard than I should.
 

Deleted member 31817

Nov 7, 2017
30,876
All I know if that polling is going to consistently show Sanders up by amounts like that in battleground states, I'm voting for him next month even though he's easily my distant-second choice in the field.

I hope that we get Ernst the fuck outta IA on top of getting Tillis out of NC. I'd love more IA polling vs. Trump.



President Obama winning IN in 2008 will always be the staggering one to me. NC at least has the Research Triangle to explain its move toward purpleness. That IN victory was the epitome of unrepeatable.
Yeah Indiana is more impressive but I figured NC has been trending from red to blue for a while but hadn't gone red in a presidential year in decades.
 

Dahbomb

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,622
Just gonna throw this bomb out there, but do any Sanders supporters think he's in better health than Bloomberg?
They both have stents in their heart yet Sanders is that dude doing multiples rallies a day and constantly traveling around states. I am an actual physician and I can't tell you just from looking who is healthier on the surface.
 
Oct 25, 2017
13,128
www.dailykos.com

For Democrats, this is 2020's most important — and most flippable — district in the country

Between the special election result in Texas, Republicans in the Senate shredding the Constitution to empower a corrupt racist with a melting brain, and now the Iowa Caucus disaster, the past two weeks haven’t exactly been great for Democrats. And yet,...

This is my parents' district and I'm super excited about them possibly flipping it. I'd love to get Crenshaw outta here too but that's a tall order.
 

SolarPowered

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,211
North Carolina in 2008 is the reason why I've always considered NC more obtainable than Georgia in my own electoral daydreams. Brian Kemp is going to make winning Georgia a hellish Florida 2000 affair anyway.
Don't forget the GOP having to spend money in KS.
Forgot about that one. I can't believe they're seriously gonna let Kris Kobach ruin things for them again. Clearly Kansas doesn't like the guy.

sheesh
Wait Obama won NC in 2008? Holy shit
That and Indiana. Too this day I don't understand how he won the latter.
NC can also make WI completely irrelevant.
NC and AZ are the cherry on top. Always go back to the basics. Keep a solid blue wall and work out from there. Obama would probably say the same.
 

Aaron

I’m seeing double here!
Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,077
Minneapolis
CO/AZ/ME/NC is the path. I can't imagine us doing that well in the Senate contests but losing the presidency.
 
Dec 31, 2017
7,097
Guy who previously pledged to be a Dem and didn't follow through to ease complaints about his campaign later says he'll release his medical records in the aftermath of a heart attack and then backtracks. Two instances aren't a pattern but I can perceive it as a red-flag.

They're self-serving promises at worst or bad politics at best. I understand that releasing his medical records wouldn't improve his position in the polls, but if you make a dumb promise of transparency and then don't follow through you don't get to gripe about criticism on it.

I can agree it's a dumb promise from the onset but one that's easily forgivable in my opinion. Especially because the terminology used by him was "comprehensive medical records," and I consider what he released pretty damn comprehensive.
 
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Kaitos

Tens across the board!
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
14,707
OKay. Maybe we do win the Senate. Also Bernie at 50% in NC is... good.

Was Ross a weak candidate? I kinda forget about her race a good amount.
Ross was fine, maybe a bit too left for the state, but the real problem was that Burr was pretty strong. tbh I think it would've been a tossup without the Comey letter.
 

adam387

Member
Nov 27, 2017
5,215
I haven't had a chance to look, but I assume why Bernie is doing better than Warren (besides sexism) is bernie running stronger with the Latinx population?
 

Slim Action

Member
Jul 4, 2018
5,573
SurveyUSA in North Carolina, in 2016:

February: Trump +2
August: Trump +4
mid-October: Clinton +2
late October: Trump +7

Actual: Trump +3.6
 

Vector

Member
Feb 28, 2018
6,656
Bernie's popularity with Latinos/Hispanics probably means he can help downballot in the Sun Belt states with high % of latinos. What I'm really curious about is a Bernie v Trump h2h poll in Florida - I'm not sure it's entirely lost just yet.
 

fragamemnon

Member
Nov 30, 2017
6,843
Indiana in 2008 is what happens when the economy goes so bad under GOP management that white people can't luxury vote racism anymore. It can happen again, stuff like that is really just margins gettin' bigly.

NC tails Virginia because of widely distributed exurbs (heavily GOP) due to the diffuse nature of the cities. As the cities continue to consolidate/grow and the former exurbs become outer ring suburbs and the inner ring suburbs become legit parts of the city, things will only improve for us.

Inner-ring suburb conversion so that the identity changes from in the burbs to in the city dramatically changes the way individuals in the city perceive their shared cultural values.
 

GoldenEye 007

Roll Tide, Y'all!
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,833
Texas
I haven't had a chance to look, but I assume why Bernie is doing better than Warren (besides sexism) is bernie running stronger with the Latinx population?
I'd imagine so. If Bernie truly has been putting in work with the Latinx community all this time, that will pay off massively if they like what he's selling. If Dems in general ever can get higher Latinx voter support (and not take advantage of it like they've arguably done with black support), it's damn near game over for the GOP. This support has been lacking more than you'd expect.
 

Kaitos

Tens across the board!
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
14,707
I haven't had a chance to look, but I assume why Bernie is doing better than Warren (besides sexism) is bernie running stronger with the Latinx population?
Yup.

He wins them 60-37. She's at 49-36. She also does a much worse job holding on to the Clinton vote than Bernie does. Bernie is at 91-3 with Clinton voters. She's at 84-7.
 
Oct 25, 2017
13,128
Maggie Hassan fucking getting it done against Kelly Ayotte was the 2016 silver lining.

All I hope is that we get at least one shock win to get back at the GOP for 2018 FL.

I'd imagine so. If Bernie truly has been putting in work with the Latinx community all this time, that will pay off massively if they like what he's selling. If Dems in general ever can get higher Latinx voter support (and not take advantage of it like they've arguably done with black support), it's damn near game over for the GOP. This support has been lacking more than you'd expect.
Feels like the 2012 Latino voter blowout was so long ago. I was hoping Trump would be the catalyst for Latino voters to trend more blue but maybe Bernie's the one to do it.
 

Autodidact

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,729
Bernie's popularity with Latinos/Hispanics probably means he can help downballot in the Sun Belt states with high % of latinos. What I'm really curious about is a Bernie v Trump h2h poll in Florida - I'm not sure it's entirely lost just yet.
After seeing his support with Hispanics, I wonder if he actually can beat Hillary's numbers in Miami. My instinct is to say no because a lot of Hispanics in Miami are Cuban, who are different and vote differently from, say, Mexican Americans or Puerto Ricans.
SurveyUSA in North Carolina, in 2016:

February: Trump +2
August: Trump +4
mid-October: Clinton +2
late October: Trump +7

Actual: Trump +3.6
So they got fairly close and actually overestimated Trump near the very end. That Clinton +2 in mid-October was completely believable after the Access Hollywood tape.
 

Vector

Member
Feb 28, 2018
6,656
After seeing his support with Hispanics, I wonder if he actually can beat Hillary's numbers in Miami. My instinct is to say no because a lot of Hispanics in Miami are Cuban, who are different and vote differently from, say, Mexican Americans or Puerto Ricans.
Yeah, Cuban Americans tend to fall for red scare tactics. This is why I'm super worried FL is a lost cause for Sanders (he's also doing badly in the primary polls we have now) but we don't have statewide races there this time around and we would be insane to base our electoral math on winning FL.
 

metalslimer

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
9,565
Good to see Bernie cracking 50 in that poll. The 45-43 polls always have me thinking undecideds will break republican
 

Autodidact

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,729
Maggie Hassan fucking getting it done against Kelly Ayotte was the 2016 silver lining.

All I hope is that we get at least one shock win to get back at the GOP for 2018 FL.


Feels like the 2012 Latino voter blowout was so long ago. I was hoping Trump would be the catalyst for Latino voters to trend more blue but maybe Bernie's the one to do it.
Barbara Bollier is rested and ready.
 
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