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Oct 25, 2017
5,573
Racoon City
So why did previous generations not fall prey to the KKK or other fanatical organizations? Oh, ya...there was accountability. Parents- omg, hold onto your hats. Parenting!

Will some kids slip through the cracks, yes. But society as a whole, at least in America - is in crisis due to the fact that our youth isn't being taught the right things. Where should that teaching come from? Laws? Politicians? Hate groups? Religion?

I say it should come from history, and it's a parents responsibility to provide that education.

Previous generations didn't "fall" to KKK and other hate groups? Are you seriously trying to suggest life was peachy and previous generations lived in racial harmony??
 

RobFox64tm

Member
Oct 30, 2017
305
I can't believe how stupid the folks running Wal-Mart are being with this. I mean, I should believe it, but this is like a joke you'd see on the Simpsons or Family Guy. It's that absurd.
 

Dark Knight

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,270
I feel like old man yells at cloud, but if these are the only non violent games, it's upsetting for a different reason.
I can only imagine they took them out based on rating and not based on Walmart-subjective opinions on what constitutes violence.

Like, FFXIV has "fantasy violence" so they probably removed that for example even though you're just using swords against goblins with zero gore involved. So what you're seeing here is probably not just missing games with arguably problematic violence but any and all games with the word "violence" in the ESRB rating.
 

Rendering...

Member
Oct 30, 2017
19,089
Next Wal-Mart should help combat police brutality by locking R-rated movies in glass cases and removing all advertisements.

They could also put a dent in HOMOSEXUAL CONVERSION by covering up the hot guys on their underwear packages.

Let's brainstorm some other ways that Wal-Mart, leading advocate for social change, can fix society's ills by reorganizing their inventory like an overbearing church mom with a mullet and a head filled with Fox News.
 

Rockstar

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
1,850
US
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Koppai

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,416
I was bullied as a kid and not even once did I think about getting a gun and shooting up a school. Video games did not turn me violent anymore than it did these people shooting up others.

I think you have to be psychotic to go shoot up innocent people.
 

Judge

Vault-Tec Seal of Approval
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
5,138
I don't think it's reasonable to expect a for profit corporation to listen to calls to stop selling something the market clearly wants and pays billions for every year. As long as it's legal to sell guns, companies are going to continue to do it regardless of public pressure when the sales outweigh those voices. What that leaves left is to either change the constitution of the United States (which, imo, I don't believe will ever happen) or continue to demand changes to how guns are sold and to whom they are sold.
People paid billions per year in cigarettes and CVS stopped selling them to make a statement. Walmart could for sure do the same thing. Removing signs on video games is doing jack all
 

Polioliolio

Member
Nov 6, 2017
5,396
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Edit: Was probably some customer who grabbed a back to school sign for the photo. But It's still pretty fucked up that you can go get your back to school supplies and a gun in the same place.

That's a riot. Obviously that's intended to be social commentary, and it's very effective. I hope everyone sees that and questions why guns need to be sold at fucking walmart in the first place.
 

DaveB

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,513
New Hampshire, USA
Somewhere Joseph Lieberman is touching himself at this tidbit of news. His life's work realized...

I checked my local Walmart (NH) and everything is normal there. No empty game racks.
 

Bruticis

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
53
People paid billions per year in cigarettes and CVS stopped selling them to make a statement. Walmart could for sure do the same thing. Removing signs on video games is doing jack all
Cigarette usage was on the decline dramatically so it was a safe choice for them. Maybe it's time to sin tax gun sales. Again, I don't think Wal-Mart is doing this to stop anything apart from apart from appearing to be sympathetic.
 

pixelpatron

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
1,542
Seattle
i really think you should look up some articles about how the alt-right is preying on younger people's psyche when they feel depressed, alone, or dealing with real mental illness. In fact, that is how a lot of white supremacists were brought in. You can be the most perfect parent in the world, and have every morals and values presented to you throughout your life. If your mental state is doing through a tough time, and you're looking for acceptance, all that goes out the window. Good parenting isn't some kind of shield from all of the bad influences that can come into a person's life.

If parenting is done correctly wouldn't that kid feel loved and accepted and not have a need to find acceptance outside the home?

We'll have to agree to disagree completely; as I'd argue a good family that loves and supports one another - IS a shield, or safety net from the negative influences that come into a person's life. Knowing that you can just "come home" regardless of age, or wrong turns is more powerful than any government, social group, or gang/party. We've lost this fundamental understanding of providing forgiveness when others have wronged us. Forgive but don't forget.

I'm not saying accept someone's rights to harm others and it's okay because it's "family". I'm not talking about the mob. I'm talking about a mother and father providing an environment for a child that cultivates a well adjusted human being. Unconditional love. Education, compassion, understanding, guidance, a moral compass, accountability, discipline, goals, self reliance, proper hygiene, love others as self and general acceptance of those that differ from you if they mean you or your loved ones no harm.These characteristics should be the foundation for society. Yet mostly they are not.

Instead we have children raised by daycare's, television, movies and games. Parents have become either too lazy or too stretched to have the effort or time required to meet needs that society is obviously lacking. We've let corporations into our schools, we don't value honesty anymore, we live in a world of participation awards, and telling every single kid their special, and not preparing them for the reality of life if they discover their not. It's okay. Not everyone is going to be Michael Jordan or Einstein. Can they be if they try, maybe. But will these kids know that they are loved and accepted if they don't achieve those levels of success or does that frustration of not measuring up turn into a justification to kill?
 

Khanimus

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
40,172
Greater Vancouver
So why did previous generations not fall prey to the KKK or other fanatical organizations? Oh, ya...there was accountability. Parents- omg, hold onto your hats. Parenting!

Will some kids slip through the cracks, yes. But society as a whole, at least in America - is in crisis due to the fact that our youth isn't being taught the right things. Where should that teaching come from? Laws? Politicians? Hate groups? Religion?

I say it should come from history, and it's a parents responsibility to provide that education.
Is this a joke?

Nobody "fell prey" to the KKK because racism was the norm. Who the fuck needs a hood when the culture says on its own that POC don't matter? That LGBT+ don't matter? That immigrants don't matter? You didn't hear about this shit because nobody was giving these voices any attention while they screamed for help. Cops didn't just start beating and killing black people. Lawmakers didn't just start ignoring gay rights.

Do you seriously think previous generations had their shit figured out? How many LGBT+ were ostracized from their families? How many white kids were taught by their parents not to associate with black kids? How many people grew up watching media that reinforced notions that white people mattered, while anyone else didn't?

Give me a fucking break and learn some fucking history. This shit has been baked into the fucking core of America's identity.
 
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Eumi

Member
Nov 3, 2017
3,518
Sure, but it is what it is and there are plenty of legal reasons to own a gun, especially the hunting rifles and shotguns sold by Walmart.
Legality and morality are two separate things.

Personally, the US government being okay with something is the last reason to also be okay with it.
 

Inquisitive_Ghost

Cranky Ghost Pokemon
Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,120
If parenting is done correctly wouldn't that kid feel loved and accepted and not have a need to find acceptance outside the home?

We'll have to agree to disagree completely; as I'd argue a good family that loves and supports one another - IS a shield, or safety net from the negative influences that come into a person's life. Knowing that you can just "come home" regardless of age, or wrong turns is more powerful than any government, social group, or gang/party. We've lost this fundamental understanding of providing forgiveness when others have wronged us. Forgive but don't forget.

I'm not saying accept someone's rights to harm others and it's okay because it's "family". I'm not talking about the mob. I'm talking about a mother and father providing an environment for a child that cultivates a well adjusted human being. Unconditional love. Education, compassion, understanding, guidance, a moral compass, accountability, discipline, goals, self reliance, proper hygiene, love others as self and general acceptance of those that differ from you if they mean you or your loved ones no harm.These characteristics should be the foundation for society. Yet mostly they are not.

Instead we have children raised by daycare's, television, movies and games. Parents have become either too lazy or too stretched to have the effort or time required to meet needs that society is obviously lacking. We've let corporations into our schools, we don't value honesty anymore, we live in a world of participation awards, and telling every single kid their special, and not preparing them for the reality of life if they discover their not. It's okay. Not everyone is going to be Michael Jordan or Einstein. Can they be if they try, maybe. But will these kids know that they are loved and accepted if they don't achieve those levels of success or does that frustration of not measuring up turn into a justification to kill?
I am having difficulty resisting the temptation to ask how old you are, because your posts in this thread are coming off as unbelievably naive.

You keep making allusions to how society today is failing morally, and you keep couching it in phrasing that suggests we've "lost" better qualities and therefore were better at these things in the past.

Which is completely and totally false, as known by anyone who actually cares to look up statistics on world progress.

We don't have children raised via proxy. Parents are more involved with their children than ever in history. It was only a few years ago you constantly heard about "helicopter parenting."

The amount of time parents spend with their children continues to go up. Fathers have nearly tripled their time with children since 1965. Mothers' time with children has also increased, and today's mothers spend more time with their children than mothers did in the 1960s. There is still a large gender gap in time spent with children: Mothers spend about twice as much time with their children as fathers do (13.5 hours per week for mothers in 2011, compared with 7.3 hours for fathers).


Have you ever actually raised children? Or been heavily involved with doing so, such as working in a daycare? Because your discussion about environment is astronomically heavily weighted on the parents, while completely ignoring the things parents can't control, e.g. genetics and cultural environment. People can be depressed and looking elsewhere for support in even the happiest family, and then fall victim to radicalization. Kids can end up fighting with their parents in even the happiest family. Psychopathy and sadism can exist in children. Kids run away over frivolous shit because their life experience is so limited that they have no perspective. That lack of perspective is literally what makes them so easy to radicalize.

A loving and supportive family absolutely is a shield against radicalization, but there are an infinite number of variables that keep it from being immune to failure. Arguing that that's all it takes to avoid radicalization is incredibly rose-tinted.

I'd argue that a lot of the qualities in your list--education, guidance, morals, accountability, value of human life--literally are the foundation of most societies, given that similar lists are written into most democratic nations' constitutions and their justice systems. Regardless of how frustratingly often they screw it up, justice systems do attempt to represent these things (with miscarriages of justice sometimes coming down to conflicting definitions of what those qualities actually mean in practice, and being interpreted through biases). Violence of nearly every kind is vastly more common in stateless societies.

Also, here's some more parenting data from Pew Research:

ST_2015-12-17_parenting-39.png



So yes, actually, people do value moral qualities and try to instill them in their children.

But will these kids know that they are loved and accepted if they don't achieve those levels of success or does that frustration of not measuring up turn into a justification to kill?

I'm going to draw your attention to how much lower "ambitious" is than "honest and ethical" in that graph. So no, the "frustration of not measuring up" doesn't seem to be the problem either, or at least it's not a problem that the parents are instilling en masse.

Finally, I need to state that nearly every single thing people learn via cultural osmosis about the current state of the world versus how it was in the past is complete and total bullshit. Which I am bringing up because your posts are very, very clearly informed by that same vague cultural osmosis that's based on feelings and nostalgia and not actual data. If you want to blame radicalization on society's current moral failures, you should really find out what those actually are first. Because they are, frustratingly, not anything you've been blaming or listing.
 

Jarhab

Alt account
Banned
Jul 26, 2019
189
Legality and morality are two separate things.

Personally, the US government being okay with something is the last reason to also be okay with it.

I agree with the first sentence. The second sentence is a bit silly. The US government is okay with a lot of things that make perfect sense and benefit everyone. Traffic lights, for example. I don't know why you'd make such a broad, sweeping statement.
 

pixelpatron

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
1,542
Seattle
The shock and awe of yet another tragedy has died down. Some have already forgotten. This is in part of the problem.

A lot of you question what I'm saying. While I agree statistics can most likely support any of your arguments; I agree on a lot of the statements and facts presented....yes modern society has started to embrace and include minorities once ostracized. Yet what I'm trying to illustrate are the few that slip through the cracks, the .00001% of society completely neglected, unwanted, and unloved. This is the key factor in a lot of these shootings, yet no one seems to acknowledge or want to admit because it puts responsibility on ourselves.

Are we not responsible for every name call, laugh, or bullying society finds acceptable? It's not our responsibility to seek out those who cry for help, yet we ignore? We as parents are responsible for teaching our children what is desired behavior. Parents and our "system" are responsible for creating an environment that shows unconditional love, support, and understanding for a developing human being. As a requirement for basic needs beyond food, water, and shelter I'd argue it's just as vital to meeting basic needs - knowing what it means to feel loved and accepted.

I understand this isn't always possible. I'm not going to say there are not factors inhibiting relationships for our society. We can easily see parents who themselves were neglected, unable to parent without having ever been taught; love, compassion, friendship, forgiveness, humility, sacrifice, giving - instead some are raised in an environment of anger, lying, drug use, divorce, poverty, alcohol, verbal abuse, or worse physical abuse.

It is my opinion it is our moral responsibility to be the "friend" in this story. Yet not everyone would agree.